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Amer Picon & Torani Amer


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163 replies to this topic

#151 FrogPrincesse

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Posted 09 October 2014 - 04:40 PM

Calisaya is on their list and I've never heard of it. If you go, remember that dell'Erborista is about 3-4x more expensive to buy than the others. Just sayin'.

 

I hear you.

 

Regarding Calisaya, see Amaro 104.


Edited by FrogPrincesse, 09 October 2014 - 04:41 PM.

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#152 FrogPrincesse

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 02:04 PM

Another nice one with Picon - End of Days by Matthew Schrage with Rittenhouse rye, Amer Picon (Picon bière), Abbott's bitters, Henri Bardouin pastis (St. George absinthe) float.

 

16152115697_e54aee9fe7_z.jpg

 



#153 tanstaafl2

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 03:03 PM

Another nice one with Picon - End of Days by Matthew Schrage with Rittenhouse rye, Amer Picon (Picon bière), Abbott's bitters, Henri Bardouin pastis (St. George absinthe) float.

 

 

 

Have you ever tried any of the suggested homemade Amer Picon substitutes to see if it is any different from using Picon Bière (in or out of the drink). Having neither the Picon Bière nor the original Amer Picon (whether it be the true original higher proof or the more recent lower proof versions) it is hard for me to tell if Amer Torani, Amere Nouvelle, Ramazotti, the Boudreau or Wondrich recipes or anything else for that matter makes a lick of difference!


If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man. ~Mark Twain

Some people are like a Slinky. They are not really good for anything, but you still can't help but smile when you shove them down the stairs...
~tanstaafl2

#154 FrogPrincesse

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 03:42 PM

In your list I have only tried Ramazotti, but it's a different flavor profile, less orange-forward.



#155 Rafa

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 05:38 PM

The closest in flavor to the real Picon that I've tried is CioCiaro, but it's more complex and less caramelly than the real deal.

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”In Demerara some of the rum producers have a unique custom of placing chunks of raw meat in the casks to assist in aging, to absorb certain impurities, and to add a certain distinctive character.” -Peter Valaer, "Foreign and Domestic Rum," 1937


#156 tanstaafl2

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 12:40 PM

I have generally stuck to the CioCiaro/Everclear/Angostura orange formula the Professor suggested in this post for the most part, which of course uses Amaro CioCiaro, but never having had the original Amer Picon I am just relying on his personal experience with the real thing. The Boudreau recipe just seems like too much work.

 

If I get really lazy I make do with the CioCiaro and a dash or two of orange bitters! As it is finding Angostura orange bitters can sometimes be a challenge in its own right.


If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man. ~Mark Twain

Some people are like a Slinky. They are not really good for anything, but you still can't help but smile when you shove them down the stairs...
~tanstaafl2

#157 KD1191

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 08:00 PM

Here's the tasting I just completed...for science. Still processing the results, and will post detail later. However, I will say that after I was done I went about trying to create a better stand-in for the real thing based on products I had around the house, and Lemon Hart 151 was involved.

 

The lineup, from right to left: 100/15/1 Mix (a la Wondrich), The Violet Hour's House Picon Mix, Picon Bière, the Original Amer.

 

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True rye and true bourbon wake delight like any great wine...dignify man as possessing a palate that responds to them and ennoble his soul as shimmering with the response.

DeVoto, The Hour

#158 KD1191

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Posted 24 January 2015 - 11:17 AM

Here are my notes:

 

100/15/1 Wondrich Mix

 

Aroma: Heat, Ethanol, Cardamom (from the Angostura), Bitter Orange Peel

Flavor: Syrupy, burnt orange. Glycerin-like artificial smoothness at first, but finishes with a sharpness from the rectified spirit. The Angostura Orange flavors (which I most associate with subcontinental spices) dominate.

 

The Violet Hour Picon Mix

 

Aroma: Dried Seville orange, marmalade-like. Reminiscent of Amaro Nonino.

Flavor: Lighter. More subtly bitter, but mouth-coating and lingering, evokes Gran Classico. No burned/cooked/caramel flavors.

 

Picon Bière

 

Aroma: Suze...gentian, gentian, gentian, burnt orange. (Here, I stopped to wonder if Crêpe Suzette might have originally been made with Suze?)

Flavor: Gentian bitterness, orange sweetness. A smooth, caramelized finish. Pretty inoffensive, not particularly interesting.

 

 
Vintage Amer Picon
 

Aroma: Brandy-soaked fruitcake? A bit musty. Clearly higher proof than the last two.

Flavor: Clean/angular, burnt bitterness. Orange only appears in the aftertaste, but the finish is ridiculously long. The orange note is more Campari-like than any of the others. There's a sweetness to it, and some hogo or something very similar...reminds me of the lower-proof Inner Circle rums (blue/red dot), though this could just be the age of the bottle and/or whatever bleached the label showing through.

 

I'm left with the impression that the original started with fruit-based distillate, likely grape, not neutral spirit. In playing around with trying to recreate the flavor, I mixed up a blend of Amaro CioCiaro, Louis Royer Force 53, and Pierre Ferrand Dry Curaçao (2:1:1)...it wasn't all that close. Swapping the Force 53 for Lemon Hart 151 and adding a couple drops of Ango Orange felt like I was getting closer. That said, I'm not sold on the integrity of my original sample. I have another sealed bottle and will have to do a side-by-side once the first starts to get low.


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True rye and true bourbon wake delight like any great wine...dignify man as possessing a palate that responds to them and ennoble his soul as shimmering with the response.

DeVoto, The Hour

#159 tanstaafl2

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Posted 26 January 2015 - 02:24 PM

Thanks for taking one for the team! I wonder if something like a high proof grappa (if such a thing exists) would give you the grape base you note over vodka or grain alcohol?


If you pick up a starving dog and make him prosperous, he will not bite you. This is the principal difference between a dog and a man. ~Mark Twain

Some people are like a Slinky. They are not really good for anything, but you still can't help but smile when you shove them down the stairs...
~tanstaafl2

#160 KD1191

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 03:11 PM

Thanks for taking one for the team! I wonder if something like a high proof grappa (if such a thing exists) would give you the grape base you note over vodka or grain alcohol?

 

Yeah, that was my thought as well, but it's not something I'd keep around. Closest thing I have is a 76 proof German vineyard peach eau de vie.


True rye and true bourbon wake delight like any great wine...dignify man as possessing a palate that responds to them and ennoble his soul as shimmering with the response.

DeVoto, The Hour

#161 FrogPrincesse

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Posted 21 July 2015 - 04:12 PM

(from the Drinks! thread)

 

 


Joking aside, my manager recently came up with a very simple, yet complex, GPtastic drink to try and use up some Amer

 

40ml Martini Dry

20ml Amer Picon

10ml Cynar

Some Bitter Truth Grapefruit Bitters.

Stirred, Up

Probably had a lemon twist.

 

Banging.  Really impressive for something with next to no alcohol in it.

 

 


On behalf of every cocktail nerd in the US, fuck you. In the nicest possible way, of course.

 

 


What he said! :cool:

 

Would love to have "real" Amer Picon to "have to get rid of"! I have used several alternatives including Torani Amer and the formula offered by Splificator as a substitute. But never had the real thing.

 

Current Picon Club and Picon Biere don't really count for me (not that I wouldn't try them if I had them!) meaning at this point it would have to be about 50 years old to be as close as possible to the real thing before the proof got slashed down from the original 78 proof.

 

I wonder if the Amer Picon "Black" available at TWE at a slightly higher 42 proof is a similar formula and would be better than the current day Amer Picon at 36 proof.

 

Hey, don't put words in other people's mouths! All I have is Picon Biere, but I am in the US and will share if asked nicely. :)

 

Here it is with Dolin dry and BDW grapefruit bitters (and a grapefruit twist).

Does it have a name and who is the creator, so I can credit him?

 

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#162 EvergreenDan

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Posted 21 July 2015 - 04:43 PM

Baller.


Kindred Cocktails | Craft + Collect + Concoct + Categorize + Community

#163 ananth

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Posted Yesterday, 02:02 AM

hello everyone,

in France, we can find lemon picon but the main version are the picon biere (generally used for beer) and picon club (generally used for cocktails).

Even though I am French (born there and live there), I am ashamed to tell you that I have never actually taste it except when I ordered a brooklyn or a creole in a bar.

Do you actually know the taste difference between the biere and the club version? Is it the beer version which is generally used in cocktail in the US? Is it due to the impossibility to get the club version?



#164 FrogPrincesse

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Posted Yesterday, 11:02 AM

Until fairly recently, Picon Biere was by far the most common in France and it was quite hard tracking down the other versions. Now Picon Club and the fairly new (2012) Picon Citron also seem to be available in most supermarkets.


Edited by FrogPrincesse, Yesterday, 11:02 AM.