Jump to content


Welcome to the eG Forums!

These forums are a service of the Society for Culinary Arts & Letters, a 501c3 nonprofit organization dedicated to advancement of the culinary arts. Anyone can read the forums, however if you would like to participate in active discussions please join the Society.

Photo

Fried Chicken--Cook-Off 5

Cookoff

  • Please log in to reply
569 replies to this topic

#61 artisan02

artisan02
  • participating member
  • 231 posts
  • Location:Albuquerque, NM

Posted 14 March 2005 - 03:56 PM

However, I have only attempted pan fried chicken twice before, both times as a teenager, early twenties a number of years ago.  Both experiences were horiffic....trust me. 

View Post


The last few times I tried to recreate the fried chicken of my youth, it wasn't the same. It was bland, among other things and didn't have that elusive 'something" that I remember.

I don't remember if my mother used bacon grease or not, but since we usually had a can of it for cooking purposes, I wouldn't be surprised. The last times I made fried chicken, I didn't use that and used regular vegetable oil. The taste wasn't the same as that fried chicken from my youth.

#62 Jake

Jake
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 1,382 posts
  • Location:Manhattan

Posted 14 March 2005 - 04:08 PM

Mine is set for tomorrow night or Thursday night I think.  Jake, when using Brooks recipe I'm going to sprinkle the spices right onto the chicken a la Dave's method instead of mixing them with the flour.  I found when I did it the other way with Brooks chicken, the spices didn't come through the way I'd hoped.

View Post


Thanks for the tip, Marlene - I'll try it that way.

Barbara Laidlaw aka "Jake"

Good friends help you move, real friends help you move bodies.


#63 torakris

torakris
  • manager
  • 11,008 posts
  • Location:Cleveland Heights, Ohio

Posted 14 March 2005 - 04:09 PM

I think I am going to shallow fry, talk to me about the oil!

I do not have access to bacon grease and the only bottle of peanut oil I have ever found here was completely flavorless....

I do have a container of crisco and I always have canola oil, what is your favorite oil for shallow frying fried chicken?
and on a related note how much do you use?
I noticed Brooks recipe called for 1 inch

Kristin Wagner, aka "torakris"
Manager, Membership
kwagner@egstaff.org


#64 Jake

Jake
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 1,382 posts
  • Location:Manhattan

Posted 14 March 2005 - 04:10 PM

However, I have only attempted pan fried chicken twice before, both times as a teenager, early twenties a number of years ago.  Both experiences were horiffic....trust me. 

View Post


The last few times I tried to recreate the fried chicken of my youth, it wasn't the same. It was bland, among other things and didn't have that elusive 'something" that I remember.

I don't remember if my mother used bacon grease or not, but since we usually had a can of it for cooking purposes, I wouldn't be surprised. The last times I made fried chicken, I didn't use that and used regular vegetable oil. The taste wasn't the same as that fried chicken from my youth.

View Post


The fried chicken of my youth was only eaten down south while on family holidays. I still love it more than almost anything. The closest thing my mother came to fried chicken was Shake 'n Bake, but even that was better than my previous attempts. Think burned and bloody all at once! However, that was many years ago before any prof. training and not too much experimenting.

Barbara Laidlaw aka "Jake"

Good friends help you move, real friends help you move bodies.


#65 Hector

Hector
  • participating member
  • 243 posts
  • Location:Lund, Sweden

Posted 14 March 2005 - 04:42 PM

As long as I known the recipe(s) for frying chicken doing the american way. I have always wondered why you put it in buttermilk? what does the buttermilk do?

Here in Sweden, we fill the fried chicken with parsely butter, and serve it with it, along with a cream sauce, and pickled but fresh cucumbers.. Along with new-potatoes. All coated with tons of parsley! aah.. delicious.

#66 Jake

Jake
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 1,382 posts
  • Location:Manhattan

Posted 14 March 2005 - 04:46 PM

Will not be serving sweet potato biscuits with the chicken. Burned the s*^t out of them 'cause I was busy playing on eGullet. :shock: SO killing himself laughing and hoping it's not a portent of things to come....may find another use for that skillet shortly....besides making cornbread to replace the biscuits. :rolleyes: :laugh:

Barbara Laidlaw aka "Jake"

Good friends help you move, real friends help you move bodies.


#67 PurpleDingo99

PurpleDingo99
  • participating member
  • 239 posts

Posted 14 March 2005 - 04:55 PM

I might have to try that little recipe i made up again. Marinading, brasing, and then frying actually works brilliantly. soy, honey, chipotle, and lime make a fantastic combination.

#68 fifi

fifi
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 7,727 posts
  • Location:Houston, TX

Posted 14 March 2005 - 05:00 PM

Hector . . . That sounds really interesting. Is the chicken breaded or floured? How on earth do you stuff a piece of chicken with parsley butter. Hmm . . . that could lead to all sorts of herby mayhem. :biggrin:

I am suspecting that the reason a lot of you don't find the same taste and texture of your youth is that you are trying to fry in oil. You can do it, it just isn't the same. And, IMHO, not nearly as good.

For the chicken of memories, the fat choices are: Crisco, Crisco with some percentage of bacon grease, or if you are lucky enough to have it, fresh lard. The other trick is temperature. Get a thermometer. You will not regret it. Most recipes have you bring the temperature up to 375 F, add in chicken one piece at a time, try to keep cooking temperature at 350F. You gain some in technique if you let the chicken get some of the chill off before flouring and frying.
Linda LaRose aka "fifi"

"Having spent most of my life searching for truth in the excitement of science, I am now in search of the perfectly seared foie gras without any sweet glop." Linda LaRose

#69 snowangel

snowangel
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 8,140 posts
  • Location:Twin Cities, MN

Posted 14 March 2005 - 05:05 PM

OK. Some questions.

Brook's recipe is soaked with water with baking soda. Other's in buttermilk. What's the difference?

And, should the chicken air dry after flouring before frying?

Finally, I can hold my head up now. I have a cast iron skillet. Can't do chicken tomorrow night, but me thinks that I don't have enough bacon grease, so perhaps we should have bacon, eggs and waffles for supper tomorrow.
Susan Fahning aka "snowangel"

#70 Marlene

Marlene
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 8,123 posts
  • Location:Alberta, Canada

Posted 14 March 2005 - 05:07 PM

Hector . . . That sounds really interesting. Is the chicken breaded or floured? How on earth do you stuff a piece of chicken with parsley butter. Hmm . . . that could lead to all sorts of herby mayhem.  :biggrin:



This sounds very much like chicken kiev!



For the chicken of memories, the fat choices are: Crisco, Crisco with some percentage of bacon grease, or if you are lucky enough to have it, fresh lard. The other trick is temperature. Get a thermometer. You will not regret it. Most recipes have you bring the temperature up to 375 F, add in chicken one piece at a time, try to keep cooking temperature at 350F. You gain some in technique if you let the chicken get some of the chill off before flouring and frying.


For the first time ever, I actually have bacon grease in the fridge. And I have crisco. I'm all set. Oh wait. Crisco shortening or crisco oil? :blink:
Marlene
cookskorner

Practice. Do it over. Get it right.
Mostly, I want people to be as happy eating my food as I am cooking it.

#71 Marlene

Marlene
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 8,123 posts
  • Location:Alberta, Canada

Posted 14 March 2005 - 05:09 PM

OK.  Some questions.

Brook's recipe is soaked with water with baking soda.  Other's in buttermilk. What's the difference?

And, should the chicken air dry after flouring before frying?

Finally, I can hold my head up now.  I have a cast iron skillet.  Can't do chicken tomorrow night, but me thinks that I don't have enough bacon grease, so perhaps we should have bacon, eggs and waffles for supper tomorrow.

View Post



Susan, we can do this together on Thursday and compare pictures!

Don't ask me what the difference is between the two methods. I just follow instructions. :blink:
Marlene
cookskorner

Practice. Do it over. Get it right.
Mostly, I want people to be as happy eating my food as I am cooking it.

#72 Toliver

Toliver
  • participating member
  • 4,590 posts
  • Location:Bakersfield, California

Posted 14 March 2005 - 05:15 PM

Previous argument...er...discussion of pan-frying versus deep frying chicken:
"The Fried Chicken Debate: Deep Fried or Pan Fried?, Consistent Quality vs. Risky Excellence" with info about pans, fat and frying (that quickly veers off-topic).
fifi did post her fried chicken recipe in it with tips added.
Another tip: use a splatter screen, if you can.

“Peter: Oh my god, Brian, there's a message in my Alphabits. It says, 'Oooooo.'
Brian: Peter, those are Cheerios.”
– From Fox TV’s “Family Guy”


#73 fifi

fifi
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 7,727 posts
  • Location:Houston, TX

Posted 14 March 2005 - 05:23 PM

Crisco shortening.

Uh oh . . . I just remembered that Crisco has a new product out that is supposed to not contain transfats. I would prefer that for health reasons but I have never tried it. Perhaps I will since I know how the old Crisco is supposed to come out and can possibly make a comparison.

I think I remember reading somewhere else here that the "new" Crisco behaves like the old. Maybe that was in Pastry and Baking.

I am off to the store to get my stuff. I will have to fry off (actually bake off) some bacon since I see that my supply of bacon grease is low. Bacon sandwiches later tonight. :biggrin:

I have never tried Brooks' method. It sounds very different. It would be interesting to compare so I am hoping one of you tries it. I am going to do the traditional buttermilk. I don't know what the buttermilk does as to tenderization. Maybe the little bit of acid does that. Most recipes say to marinate for at least 24 hours. One thing I am sure of is that it makes a fairly substantial crust. The buttermilk forms a fairly stabile film on the chicken pieces that does not easily drip off before flouring.
Linda LaRose aka "fifi"

"Having spent most of my life searching for truth in the excitement of science, I am now in search of the perfectly seared foie gras without any sweet glop." Linda LaRose

#74 Marlene

Marlene
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 8,123 posts
  • Location:Alberta, Canada

Posted 14 March 2005 - 05:31 PM

Posted Image


Brooks' pan fried on the left, Dave's deep fried on the right. The crust as I recall was definately thicker on Brooks recipe than the deep fried one, although Brooks's recipe doesn't call for a buttermilk marinade.

Now, I fried his in oil last time. On Thursday, I'll use shortening and bacon grease and see what happens.
Marlene
cookskorner

Practice. Do it over. Get it right.
Mostly, I want people to be as happy eating my food as I am cooking it.

#75 patti

patti
  • participating member
  • 616 posts
  • Location:Louisiana

Posted 14 March 2005 - 05:46 PM

Mine is set for tomorrow night or Thursday night I think.  Jake, when using Brooks recipe I'm going to sprinkle the spices right onto the chicken a la Dave's method instead of mixing them with the flour.  I found when I did it the other way with Brooks chicken, the spices didn't come through the way I'd hoped.

View Post


When I fry shrimp or crawfish, I always season both the ingredient AND the flour. That way, there's no chance anything will remain unseasoned. I'll probably do it that way when I fry the chicken, which will likely be on Wednesday night.
"I like 'em french fried pertaters." (Billy Bob Thornton as Karl, in Sling Blade.)

#76 Hector

Hector
  • participating member
  • 243 posts
  • Location:Lund, Sweden

Posted 14 March 2005 - 05:50 PM

Hector . . . That sounds really interesting. Is the chicken breaded or floured? How on earth do you stuff a piece of chicken with parsley butter. Hmm . . . that could lead to all sorts of herby mayhem.  :biggrin:

View Post


I know!
We ussually first fry the whole chicken, stuffed with the parsley butter and and all the skin at each end of the whole chicken is knit togheter with a kitchen-thread so there's no hole in it. Then we fry it and roast it in the very oven at the end. We neither flour it or bread it.
Or we use chickenbreasts which we fill like Chicken Kiev. those we bread.

#77 ldubois2

ldubois2
  • participating member
  • 54 posts

Posted 14 March 2005 - 06:38 PM

no, they aren't supposed to be links.i've posted the whole recipe.

View Post


Oh . . . Duh!

I just checked with my sister. She doesn't remember getting instructions or recipes from Aunt Minnie, Grandma or our mother. We just recalls that they added the seasoned flour from the paper sack to the more or less drained pan and added milk until it "looked right." :hmmm: She has the same experience as I do. Sometimes it is pretty good, and we don't know why. More often it is just ok. We are now suspecting that this was a ploy to keep the descendants humble.

View Post


This is alot like my great-grandmother's recipe. Milk Gravy: Pour off most of the grease from the skillet, add a chicken bouillon cube or two and pound or mash with a spoon to form a paste. Take some of the flour from the breading and add it with some milk in a mason jar and shake it until the flour dissolved. Pour into the skillet and stir like crazy with a fork, adding additional milk and water combined in the mason jar as the gravy thickened. Cook about 15-20 minutes, taste for salt and pepper. Serve over white rice with some tomatoes sliced and sprinkled with a light coating of sugar, green beans or summer squash and cornbread.

We called her Mamaw....she was 5'9" and commanding in the kitchen and at the dining room table....

#78 snowangel

snowangel
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 8,140 posts
  • Location:Twin Cities, MN

Posted 14 March 2005 - 07:14 PM

fifi, I called my local butcher, and he will have a small chicken (I said no more than 3-1/4 pounds) on Wednesday. He gets them from an Amish farmer. Sometimes I get them from a coop, and what I really love about those is that most of them have been raised by kids for 4-H projects, and we actually get the name of the raiser on the label!
Susan Fahning aka "snowangel"

#79 fifi

fifi
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 7,727 posts
  • Location:Houston, TX

Posted 14 March 2005 - 07:48 PM

BA DA BING!

I think snowangel has found the perfect chickens! I am soooooo envious. I gotta find a local butcher. I have a few leads down in Texas City but no winners yet that don't require a 40 mile trip. On my list of things to do when I get retired here is to contact the local schools that have 4-H and FFA programs and see what I can come up with. I think just the quest could be fun.

What are those really young chickens called? Poulets or something like that? I wonder how much those weigh. I also wonder if they have any flavor.
Linda LaRose aka "fifi"

"Having spent most of my life searching for truth in the excitement of science, I am now in search of the perfectly seared foie gras without any sweet glop." Linda LaRose

#80 fou de Bassan

fou de Bassan
  • participating member
  • 419 posts
  • Location:Melbourne, Australia

Posted 14 March 2005 - 08:12 PM

In Edna Lewis' 'The taste of Country Cooking' , she gives a recipe for Cream Gravy. 4-5 Tablespoons fat from the frying chicken, then add 4 Tablespoons flour and brown it quickly then add sweet cream and simmer properly. Add salt and pepper to taste.

I'm looking forward to this on Friday. Contrary to almost all of the other posters I don't soak the chicken in anything. Just coat it with seasoned flour, let it rest an hour or so then another quick dredge in the flour and straight into the pan of half lard, half oil. I learned this from my great-grandmother and it has served me well. I can't wait to see everyone's photos!
If only Jack Nicholson could have narrated my dinner, it would have been perfect.

#81 Jake

Jake
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 1,382 posts
  • Location:Manhattan

Posted 14 March 2005 - 08:38 PM

Well, 3 cheers for Brooks' fried chicken recipe -- it was delicious. Moist, flavourful and ohhh that skin. :wub:

It was virtually inhaled, there are a couple pieces in the fridge for tomorrow if they make it that long.....and I didn't burn the house down. I was pleasantly surprised at how well it came out, only one piece was slightly darker than we would like. We were frying in cast iron, using peanut oil (that's what was on hand) and no thermometer.

Barbara Laidlaw aka "Jake"

Good friends help you move, real friends help you move bodies.


#82 Marlene

Marlene
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 8,123 posts
  • Location:Alberta, Canada

Posted 14 March 2005 - 08:40 PM

Jake! No pictures?
Marlene
cookskorner

Practice. Do it over. Get it right.
Mostly, I want people to be as happy eating my food as I am cooking it.

#83 Jake

Jake
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 1,382 posts
  • Location:Manhattan

Posted 14 March 2005 - 08:45 PM

Jake!  No pictures?

View Post


I thought about it, honest. I even went looking for the camera (and almost burned the d*^n cornbread) but I believe we left it at BIL's place last weekend. Sorry!!! :sad: (Can I steal the pics from your blog and post? :raz: )

Barbara Laidlaw aka "Jake"

Good friends help you move, real friends help you move bodies.


#84 Mayhaw Man

Mayhaw Man
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 4,856 posts
  • Location:Raleigh, NC

Posted 14 March 2005 - 08:51 PM

Nice work. I am glad you enjoyed it. It's pretty easy, actually, after you do it a few times. It goes alot faster after you practice a bit. :wink: :laugh:




Well, 3 cheers for Brooks' fried chicken recipe -- it was delicious.  Moist, flavourful and ohhh that skin.  :wub:

It was virtually inhaled, there are a couple pieces in the fridge for tomorrow if they make it that long.....and I didn't burn the house down.  I was pleasantly surprised at how well it came out, only one piece was slightly darker than we would like.  We were frying in cast iron, using peanut oil (that's what was on hand) and no thermometer.

View Post


Brooks Hamaker, aka "Mayhaw Man"

There's a train everyday, leaving either way...

#85 snowangel

snowangel
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 8,140 posts
  • Location:Twin Cities, MN

Posted 14 March 2005 - 09:24 PM

fifi, the most perfect chickens were the ones of my youth. Those summers on a farm in Nebraska. When my grandmother wanted to fry chicken, we went to a farm, where the 4-H kids (or FFA kids) were raising them for A Project. My grandmother would espy the right chickens (smaller rather than larger), and she and I would chase them down, grab them, wack their heads off and do the thing. But, that was then and this is now. The then involved a party line so you could, with one call, find out just where the best chickens were, who had had a baby, and who was ailing. Now adays, it involves the yellow pages. And will be different than than a quick jaunt on gravel roads in a circa 1957 Chevy pickup to a farm where we'd also probably score some milk (we'd milk it ourselves) and whatever veg the mom didn't want to take care of that day. Was the flour or bacon grease better back then, or is it the memories?
Susan Fahning aka "snowangel"

#86 Mayhaw Man

Mayhaw Man
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 4,856 posts
  • Location:Raleigh, NC

Posted 14 March 2005 - 09:42 PM

Fifi,
I am almost betting that somewhere in Houston, given the various immigrant populations that you can find just about anything you want in the way of live poultry. You might start by checking with some ethnic butcher shops and work from there.

There is also an excellent source here. As a Texan, you are one of the lucky ones (but I am sure that, being a Texan and all, you already know that) who can get some of these birds who have lived a short, happy live home. home on the free range.

In New Orleans, we still have a live poultry market. It's a pretty bizarre place as I don't think many of those yardbirds had ever seen a yard.

Good luck in your search for the perfect pullet.
Brooks Hamaker, aka "Mayhaw Man"

There's a train everyday, leaving either way...

#87 edsel

edsel
  • participating member
  • 984 posts
  • Location:NEO (North-East Ohio), US

Posted 15 March 2005 - 05:56 AM

I don't think I have yet met a Japanese person who has even heard of buttermilk, and of course it isn't exactly something that can be easily imported. :sad:
So I make do without, I do the milk and lemon juice thing and find it works for most baked goods but you just can't use it for salad dressings, soups, etc

View Post


You might try getting some buttermilk starter so you can make your own. I ordered some of this a while back but still haven't tried it. I believe that the process is just like making yogurt.

Anyways, I'm sure that the milk-and-lemon-juice wil work fine for marinating the chicken.

#88 fifi

fifi
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 7,727 posts
  • Location:Houston, TX

Posted 15 March 2005 - 07:05 AM

Fifi,
I am almost betting that somewhere in Houston, given the various immigrant populations that you can find just about anything you want in the way of live poultry. You might start by checking with some ethnic butcher shops and work from there.

There is also an excellent source here. As a Texan, you are one of the lucky ones (but I am sure that, being a Texan and all, you already know that) who can get some of these birds who have lived a short, happy live home. home on the free range.

In New Orleans, we still have a live poultry market. It's a pretty bizarre place as I don't think many of those yardbirds had ever seen a yard.

Good luck in your search for the perfect pullet.

View Post


Thanks for the link, Brooks. One problem. They don't say where they are! This isn't the first site that I have seen like that. It is like there is something weird going on. Clandestine chicken raising operations? Anyway, the Great Pyrenees dogs are really cool. It is amazing that they don't look at their charges and think . . . lunch. :biggrin:

I may be on to something in Texas City for a Latin market. The Yellow Pages is no help. My sister and I are pretty renowned for being able to find the arcane. It took us all of 30 minutes one time to find a guy a clear plastic cane for his grandma. :wink: So, why the problems finding a real freakin' chicken???

Pullet! That is the word I was looking for. Anybody ever cook one?

Anyway, Linda Four Thighs has, guess what, four of those cold air processed thighs awaiting a swim in buttermilk. I will try to capture the strange film that buttermilk forms. Then, onward to scaled down chicken frying. Then I will have to try Brooks' method, if only because I have never heard of it. (But then, that Chicken Pie odyssey, scroll down for pictures, scroll up for the recipe, was pretty spectacular. :biggrin: )
Linda LaRose aka "fifi"

"Having spent most of my life searching for truth in the excitement of science, I am now in search of the perfectly seared foie gras without any sweet glop." Linda LaRose

#89 Marlene

Marlene
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 8,123 posts
  • Location:Alberta, Canada

Posted 15 March 2005 - 07:08 AM

As far as I can tell, the big difference between Dave and Brooks recipe is the buttermilk/egg wash thing.

In Dave's recipe, marinate in buttermilk, no egg wash before flouring required.

In Brooks' recipe, soak in cold water/baking soda, use an egg wash before flouring.



Maybe I'm missing something else though.
Marlene
cookskorner

Practice. Do it over. Get it right.
Mostly, I want people to be as happy eating my food as I am cooking it.

#90 fifi

fifi
  • eGullet Society staff emeritus
  • 7,727 posts
  • Location:Houston, TX

Posted 15 March 2005 - 07:20 AM

I think you got the differences, Marlene. What I am curious about is what the baking soda does. The buttermilk is acid, the baking soda is basic. I am wondering what's up with that?
Linda LaRose aka "fifi"

"Having spent most of my life searching for truth in the excitement of science, I am now in search of the perfectly seared foie gras without any sweet glop." Linda LaRose





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: Cookoff