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Rice


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104 replies to this topic

#31 Hassouni

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 07:39 AM

He, sir.

#32 liuzhou

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 07:47 AM

He, sir.


Noted.

#33 patrickamory

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 09:30 AM

This is how my partner makes tahdig:


I use the "Kateh" recipe ("smothered rice") from Najmieh's book. I
wash the rice 6x in warm water, simmer with water 2:1 for 20 minutes
or until all absorbed, then add lots of ghee over the top and cover,
then keep on medium with top on (with towel between top and pan) for 40 minutes.

Edited by patrickamory, 14 December 2012 - 09:31 AM.


#34 Hassouni

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 10:11 AM

I find that 2:1 for basmati yields rice that is far too soft and mushy. I don't know what my ratio is, but it's a lot less than that. I suppose if it's simmered uncovered, it might be ok.

Iraqis make rice either identically to Persian chelo, or otherwise slightly similar to kateh, but still different: fry the washed, drained rice in whatever oil or butter you want to use, then when each grain is coated and hot, add water to cover (by less than you'd think), and salt. When it reaches a boil, turn it down low and put the paper towel under the lid. Cook as long as desired. In the last 10 minutes, the heat can be raised to medium to get a better crust.

This turns out rice that is VERY similar to the chelo (parboiling then steaming) method. Maybe not quite as good, but nearly so, and very similar in appearance and much easier. I've found that kateh comes out very differently to the chelo method. Chelo is more predictably consistent though, and yields an overall superior result, so I always make that for guests.

PS for all those wondering, the towel under the lid is to absorb water as it steams - this rice is NOT supposed to be very moist, and you don't want water dripping back down on it!

PPS, let it be said that no other Arabs take rice as seriously as Iraqis...most other Arabs consider the crust a flaw!

Edited by Hassouni, 14 December 2012 - 10:13 AM.


#35 huiray

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 11:33 AM

I find that 2:1 for basmati yields rice that is far too soft and mushy.


I normally use 1 rice : 1.5 water. Ditto about the 1:2 giving mushy Basmati (contrary to what is often given as "directions" for cooking it).

#36 radtek

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 04:59 PM

The rice I remember was fluffy, distinct and perfectly steamed above the massive layer of crunchy grains nearing a golden translucency. I'm thinking the key is to carefully fry a layer of par cooked rice rice then mound the rest of the rice to steam on top. It is quite easy to scorch when trying for tadiq but even then I like it. :raz:

I just bought some Thai jasmine rice. It was only slightly more expensive than the US grown. The basmati was too expensive so I'll try for tadiq this evening.

#37 Darienne

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 05:15 PM

I just bought some Thai jasmine rice. It was only slightly more expensive than the US grown. The basmati was too expensive so I'll try for tadiq this evening.

Saw Thai jasmine rice in the local supermarket today but didn't buy it as it was 'jasmine'. Is this the Thai rice to which people refer? If so, I"ll buy it next trip and try it.
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#38 radtek

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 05:42 PM

Not sure but mine Is in a 2 pound yellow bag called 'Golden Star' prime grade Thai Hom Mali product of Thailand. Paid $2.39...

#39 Hassouni

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 09:30 PM

Jasmine rice is no substitute for basmati in Persian applications, I'm afraid.

#40 patrickamory

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 10:28 PM

Yes jasmine and basmati are miles apart. And there's huge variations in quality in jasmine rice. For jasmine, I recommend reading Kasma Loha-unchit's brand recommendations, and buy the large quantities, and note the dates harvested on the back of the bag.

The 2:1 recommendation on basmati above is with no cover. The result is NOT mushy.

#41 Hassouni

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 12:14 AM

Cool, got it

#42 Prawncrackers

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 02:15 AM

And here is a picture of some risotto just because I have it.

Risotto al porcini to be precise. As served in an Italian restaurant in deepest China.

Posted Image

That risotto looks a bit solid, did it eat ok? I prefer mine a lot looser and creamier than that. Loads of butter and Parmesan at the end. I can't imagine that would be popular in the middle of China.

As for the clay pot vs tahdig argument. The crusts on Both are delicious. The butteriness of the Persian style is amazing but let's not forget the power of the pork fat when a clay pot is cooked with loads if lap mei!

At the moment I have a 10kg bag of Green Dragon brand Thai Jasmine for everyday eating. A smaller bag of Tilda Basmati. Nishiki Japanese rice (grown in America). Spanish bomba for paella. Carnaroli for risotto. Camargue red rice from France and a little American long grain somewhere for making Jambalaya! A whole world if rice but strangely I have never seen Chinese rice for sale here let alone bought any.

#43 annachan

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 02:26 AM

Oh, I love that crusty bottom of the rice. I still prefer the older style rice cookers for that reason. Growing up in Hong Kong, when we wanted a crusty bottom, we just kept that button down, usually by way of a clothespin. Love it as is, or in some form of liquid (water, soup and even tea). Another sort after crusty bottom is that in claypot rice, especially one with cured meat, with the oil dripping down to the bottom to create a lovely, flavorful crust. :wub:

#44 liuzhou

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 02:43 AM

That risotto looks a bit solid, did it eat ok? I prefer mine a lot looser and creamier than that. Loads of butter and Parmesan at the end. I can't imagine that would be popular in the middle of China.


It was fine by me. It wasn't what I would describe as 'solid', at all. But perhaps I prefer it less loose than you describe.

The restaurant in question is aimed at expats rather than the locals. The staff went out of their way to be sure that I realised it wasn't stir fried rice I was ordering.

#45 huiray

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 07:34 AM

Interesting about the 1:2 versus 1:1.5 (or so) rice:water ratios for cooking Basmati. When I do mine with 1:1.5 I simmer mine uncovered or at most only half-covered till the water is just absorbed then put the lid on and turn the heat down to very low. <<Shrug>> To each his or her own.

#46 Hassouni

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 07:47 AM

I imagine a lot of cooks of Middle Eastern background probably aren't making precise measurements for water - I know nobody in my family does, including myself (though obviously, when using a rice cooker, I have to)

#47 huiray

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 07:56 AM

Sometimes I do it the "old fashioned way" - water up to your first knuckle joint. Of course, some folks have long fingers and unusual inter-lengths... :smile:

#48 liuzhou

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 08:00 AM

I doubt anyone in China precisely measures rice water ratios either.

I put the rice in the rice cooker. Lay my hand flat on top of the rice, top up with water till my knuckles are submerged - just. Everyone I know does the same, despite having different sized hands.

Or when I cook my Hom Mali rice, I 80% fill the cup which lives in the rice bucket with the rice, wash it (the rice not the cup!) then add a brimful of water in the same cup. Works every time.

#49 patrickamory

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 10:35 AM

All measurements are approximate, and remember folks, the hardness or softness of your water, and your altitude, and the age of the rice, are all variables playing into the final result!

#50 scubadoo97

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 01:37 PM



a.k.a. "fan chew" in Cantonese. An old, old "stuff" known in most rice-eating cuisines for however long the cuisine has been cooking rice, methinks. :-)

The Chinese also cook rice with a melangé of stuff (meat + veggies + etc) in smallish clay pots [traditionally, preferably over charcoal fires] with a tight-fitting clay lid to give a wonderful meal-in-a-pot with very nice "fan chew" at the bottom. Some people push aside the rice & ingredients on top and get to the rice crust at the bottom first!
https://www.google.c...iw=1274&bih=981


Except our version is salty and buttery/oily, and I must say, laden with bias, that that makes it far tastier :biggrin: In Iraqi and Persian food, it's considered the highlight of the meal.

(The bottom of dolsot bibimbap (nurungji) is pretty good, but not as good, and the nurungji that gets served immersed in hot water is soggy and tasteless.)


I agree frying the rice in oil or butter does make rice really tasty.

#51 huiray

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 06:24 PM


a.k.a. "fan chew" in Cantonese. An old, old "stuff" known in most rice-eating cuisines for however long the cuisine has been cooking rice, methinks. :-)

The Chinese also cook rice with a melangé of stuff (meat + veggies + etc) in smallish clay pots [traditionally, preferably over charcoal fires] with a tight-fitting clay lid to give a wonderful meal-in-a-pot with very nice "fan chew" at the bottom. Some people push aside the rice & ingredients on top and get to the rice crust at the bottom first!
https://www.google.c...iw=1274&bih=981


Except our version is salty and buttery/oily, and I must say, laden with bias, that that makes it far tastier :biggrin: In Iraqi and Persian food, it's considered the highlight of the meal.

(The bottom of dolsot bibimbap (nurungji) is pretty good, but not as good, and the nurungji that gets served immersed in hot water is soggy and tasteless.)


I agree frying the rice in oil or butter does make rice really tasty.


Oh, such rice would be scrumptious indeed. Still, the use of butter in a Chinese cuisine sense would not be traditional. OTOH, those clay-pot rice concoctions would, depending on who's making it and/or the skill of the chef or vendor of same, would be a dish where the (oiled) drippings and sauces from the meats and other ingredients in the dish percolate to the bottom and form a fond - then the crispy bits of the rice form using the oily sauce rather than just oil or butter (again, not something commonly used in Chinese cuisine). Different strokes for different folks - no doubt rice fried in butter would appeal more to many folks here.

#52 haresfur

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 11:51 PM

An aunt taught me to toast brown rice and onion in butter then add water to cook. I use olive oil.
It's almost never bad to feed someone.

#53 Jim Dixon

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 08:11 AM

This medium grain heirloom variety brown rice tastes great and has the texture of white rice. I cook it using the Italian 'cook like pasta' approach. Bring lots of salted water to a boil, add rice, boil for 35 minutes, drain, cover, and rest for a few minutes.

Kokuho Rose Organic Brown Rice, available online here.

Bittman mentioned this rice a few weeks ago.

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olive oil + salt
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#54 dcarch

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 01:51 PM

How about Risotto made with regular rice? 10x cheaper.

Posted Image



Real Native American (not farmed) wild rice
Posted Image

dcarch

#55 Keith_W

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 01:57 PM

Risotto should be made with Vialone Nano rice! I have tried Carnaroli and Arborio - I find Vialone Nano the easiest to use. I make mine in the oven (no need to stir), and then give it a furious whisk before serving. This releases the starch and makes the rice creamy:

Posted Image
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#56 scubadoo97

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 03:35 PM

An aunt taught me to toast brown rice and onion in butter then add water to cook. I use olive oil.

.

The use of oil or other fat when making rice is common with Middle Eastern as well as Latin cuisine

#57 radtek

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Posted 17 December 2012 - 05:02 PM

Posted Image

Is this a medium for growing mushrooms? Cause there looks like some sort of dirt on that plate there... Maybe modernist cusine?

#58 dcarch

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Posted 17 December 2012 - 06:20 PM

Is this a medium for growing mushrooms? Cause there looks like some sort of dirt on that plate there... Maybe modernist cusine?


Those are Enokitake mushrooms to be eaten raw. The black "dust" sprinkle is chopped black olives.

dcarch

#59 liuzhou

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Posted 28 December 2012 - 08:28 AM

What about salt in rice?

Before I came to China about 17 years ago, I always salted rice when cooking it. Then I discovered that the locals here never do. In fact, they thought that I was totally deranged for doing so.

As they see it, the rice is a blank canvas behind the seasoned dishes; the dishes are the seasoning - and I find I agree. So now I never salt my rice.

#60 huiray

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Posted 28 December 2012 - 09:22 AM

I normally don't salt my rice when cooking it. Neither did *anyone* I know nor (as far as I know) did any Chinese restaurant in SE Asia and elsewhere do so (again, AFAIK) in the context of Chinese cuisine, although specific rice preparations such as Hainanese chicken rice *would* be made with salted stock - but those would be exceptions. I *have* done it with non-Chinese cuisine - when making biryani-type rice with "Indian"-type influences, or with other cuisines. But plain boiled rice? For Chinese or Chinese-derived food? Never.

Edited by huiray, 28 December 2012 - 09:23 AM.