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Ice Cream


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#1 snowangel

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 03:07 PM

The new thread on ice cream machines has got me thinking. We make ice cream a lot in our house (use a Donvier). Anyone have any favorites, even if off the wall or with non-traditional flavorings? Always looking for new ideas. We usually use the custard method. Does anyone have a favorite way to infuse serious coffee flavor into ice cream?
Susan Fahning aka "snowangel"

#2 Steve Klc

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 03:12 PM

Make a home made extract: cook sugar dry to caramel until just before black, deglaze with freshly brewed espresso. Flavor your ice cream base with this thick syrup.
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#3 snowangel

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 03:27 PM

Make a home made extract: cook sugar dry to caramel until just before black, deglaze with freshly brewed espresso. Flavor your ice cream base with this thick syrup.

So, I don't have an espresso machine (on Xmas list). Do I just make some really, really strong coffee (using great beans from Peets) in my one-cup gold filter? A better method?
Susan Fahning aka "snowangel"

#4 torakris

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 03:30 PM

Make a home made extract: cook sugar dry to caramel until just before black, deglaze with freshly brewed espresso. Flavor your ice cream base with this thick syrup.

OOOOOOHHH!!!
Do you use this for anything other than ice cream?
Sounds heavenly!



I already left my favorite icecream of the moment on the machine thread, but have you ever tried cinnamon ice cream? Delicious! Top it with some hot fudge :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

Just don't make the mistake I did and tell your husband that it was better than sex! TRaht didn't go over real well, though my best friend completely agreed when I gave some to her :raz: :raz:

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#5 Steve Klc

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 03:48 PM

Yes, Torakris, I use it as a sauce for a chocolate dessert I call "Turkish Coffee," infused with a hint of cardamom. (Chocolate timbale cake, chocolate flan with a hint of anise, cardamom creme anglaise foam, toasted sesame, sea salt and candied orange zest sprinkled on top.)

I do cinnamon in the Pacojet now--no need to infuse the cinnamon just freeze a whole stick in the beaker with your mixture--then it is pulverized by the Pacojet's blades and infuses its flavor into the whole mixture amazingly deeply and efficiently, much more so than in any traditional infusion.
Steve Klc

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#6 Suzanne F

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 04:28 PM

Another way to get coffee flavor in is to add the ground coffee to the milk/cream when you scald it, then let it infuse for a while (as long as it takes to give you the strength you like). Then strain the grounds out, reheat the liquid, and proceed with the recipe as usual.

I am a very big fan of infusing the liquid with whatever flavor and then straining it. I've done it with toasted coconut in the milk/cream/coconut milk for coconut ice cream, and it works quite well.

Wouldn't it be divine to have a Pacojet, though?

#7 wingding

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 05:05 PM

The cleanest infusion for coffee ice cream is to crush A LOT of well roasted beans into a hot base to infuse.I strain it,then add a little white chocolate after doing the anglaise to smooth out the flavor a bit.There's no powdery mouth feel from grounds in the finished product.For the best cinammon,roast a LOT of cinammon sticks,and infuse into a hot base-no powdery finish,and lots of flavor....

#8 snowangel

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 07:24 PM

Thanks for the coffee suggestions. Has anyone done anything sort of off the wall with ice cream -- lavender, lemongrass, cayenne, other herbs or spices, whatever?
Susan Fahning aka "snowangel"

#9 Suzanne F

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 08:31 PM

As long as you have a basic vanilla version down, you can do just about any flavor. Instead of infusing the liquid with vanilla bean, add the lavender, or basil, or crushed lemongrass, or star anise -- whatever, to the milk/cream. Infuse, strain, proceed with the custard base. You can alway add in solids just as you churn, like chunks of crystallized ginger, etc.

When I was doing pastry, ice creams and sorbets were my favorite thing to make. I started working on things like a Beaujolais not-so-nouveau ice cream (I found a stash of unsold BN in the liquor room), and a tomato sorbet (for a contest). Come to think of it, this was the ONLY thing I liked about doing pastry! I've got all sorts of bizarre recipes, but I guess we'd have to talk privately for me to give you any -- © issues and all that -- but I'd be more than happy to do so.

#10 awbrig

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 08:35 PM

tomatoe sorbet?

Is it me or does this not sound right? I was at Charlie Trotters a few weeks ago and he had a desert...a corn cake or something w heirloom tomatoes...this, I dont care for...tomatoes w desert?!? or am I out of line...

#11 Bux

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 09:05 PM

tomatoes w desert?!?

Tomatoes are a fruit.

But I understand. When I ate at Arpege in Paris years ago, I thought the same thing so I passed on Passard's new tomato dessert and went for the avocado souffle.

Speaking of flavoring ice creams, I watched a pastry cook make ginger ice cream. A whole lot of fresh ginger went into the milk to simmer and thinking that weights were very critical to the success of pastry, I asked how the cook knew how much ginger to add. It looked like an awful lot. I got back the response that it wasn't important how much ginger you used as long as you kept tasting and strained the mix when you got the flavor concentration you wanted.
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#12 awbrig

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Posted 12 September 2002 - 09:08 PM

tomatoes may indeed be a fruit but they sure act like a vegetable to me...and thus dont belong in a desert...imo

#13 Brija

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Posted 13 September 2002 - 01:32 AM

I make fairly simple ice creams, but some of my favorites are mint chocolate (chocolate ice cream flavored with mint liqueur) and rum & raisin (soak the raisins in rum over night and add them to a basic mixture close to the end of the freezing time).

#14 Steve Klc

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Posted 13 September 2002 - 05:32 AM

This a good thread in the sense that it reveals how different pastry chefs approach the same tasks creatively and how methods might be adapted or bent to personal needs and different technologies.

On coffee, some pastry chefs don't like using real beans for an infusion for they fear the beans absorb too much moisture in the infusion process, especially from the cream. Others adjust their recipes to take this into account. Still others use an instant espresso powder, like a Medaglia D'Oro, which releases alot of flavor and supposedly does not suck up as much liquid. And then others change the parameters of the equation, as I do with the syrupy blackened espresso extract. This is also where a bit of inventiveness and science can come into play, as well as one's personality, philosophy and circumstances. In the end, it is all still coffee ice cream or gelato--but oh, the end results can taste very different in isolation and in a given application, as a component of a dessert, a larger whole.

The technology issue is a valid one--yes, it might be nice to have a PacoJet but you also have to be prepared to change or adjust every single one of your "traditional" ice cream and sorbet recipes. Things that work in a batch freezer will not work equally well in a Pacojet and vice versa; differences between a Krups Glaciere with removable gel core, which has to be frozen in advance and a much more expensive tabletop ice cream maker with a self-contained freezing unit are readily apparent as well.

And as far as mint and other herb infusions go--again, for some pastry chefs this isn't as easy as it sounds, for the oils and essences of some of these things are fragile and ethereal in nature, and at higher heat can possibly be frittered away into the air--rather than retained in the infusion. We've discussed the grinding of fresh lemon verbena leaves with sugar in a cuisinart before on this site. For mint, our method is to add fresh mint to your cold milk and cream mixture, whiz with an immersion blender until completely shredded into fine particles, and then cold infuse overnight in the fridge.

Sometimes we preface it with an additional step--flash the mint leaves briefly in boiling water and then dump in ice water.

Then prepare your creme anglaise with this mixture the next day, straining as usual. We like the color and it seems to retain more of what makes the mint minty this way. "Seems" is the operative word and this could be the subject of a paper at next year's Molecular Gastronomy Workshop if the subject hasn't already been investigated in the lab already.

Some pastry chefs hold back a portion of these cold infusions--so only a 1/3 or 1/2 of the mixture is heated at all, even to 180, as they prepare the anglaise. Still others wonder whether cream is the best vehicle itself for extraction--and if the high fat content in cream doesn't somehow interfere with the efficiency and effectiveness of the infusion process. I'm sure there will be alot more to uncover and share.
Steve Klc

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#15 Bux

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Posted 13 September 2002 - 06:10 AM

tomatoes may indeed be a fruit but they sure act like a vegetable to me...and thus dont belong in a desert...imo

That's the question. Do we treat them as a vegetable because they act like a vegetable or do they seem like a vegetable because we're used to treeating them as one? One of the most appealing simple desserts I've had in a bistro was braised fennel with a scoop of vanilla ice cream. Fennel is obviously a vegetable and definitely not a fruit, but it also has a flavor akin to one we often associate with candy--licorice. Braising it in a simple syrup made it taste like a dessert.
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#16 Bux

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Posted 13 September 2002 - 06:13 AM

This a good thread in the sense that it reveals how different pastry chefs approach the same tasks creatively and how methods might be adapted or bent to personal needs and different technologies.

That was a good post in the sense that it reminds us of the importance of keeping an open mind as well as the rather subjective nature of taste and traditional approaches to cuisine.
Robert Buxbaum
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#17 Heather

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Posted 13 September 2002 - 06:31 AM

An ice-cream place here in Melbourne makes a chocolate-chilli ice-cream (chilli being Australian for chile or hot pepper). I thought it would be "interesting" at best. But the combination is actually very good.

#18 Suzanne F

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Posted 13 September 2002 - 07:25 AM

Hey, awbrig, don't knock tomatoes and other vegetables in desserts if you haven't tried them. Wayne Harley Brachman's Fresh Corn Ice Cream (he's got both a smooth and a chunky version) is astonishingly good. He also has a Sweet Potato Ice Cream -- why not? sweet potato PIE is great.
Come to think of it, PUMPKIN is a vegetable; bet you eat pumpkin pie, right? Carrot cake? Zucchini bread? And what's one of the best things about a ripe, juicy tomato? How sweet it is!

I actually found a whole cookbook of desserts that include vegetables:
Desserts with a Difference by Sally and Martin Stone. Haven't tried any, but some actually do call to me. How about "Creamy, Crunchy Jicama Lime Pie" -- a key lime pie with lime-and-chili powder seasoned shredded jicama?

And don't forget the shocked but enthusiastic acceptance of Jean-Georges Vongerichten's White Pepper Ice Cream.

Steve K: Thanks; great information in your post.

#19 LaurieA-B

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Posted 13 September 2002 - 08:35 AM

tomatoe sorbet?

Is it me or does this not sound right?  I was at Charlie Trotters a few weeks ago and he had a desert...a corn cake or something w heirloom tomatoes...this, I dont care for...tomatoes w desert?!? or am I out of line...

"Sorbet" doesn't always mean dessert. I've seen savory sorbets on restaurant menus for different courses. At the Gramercy Tavern a couple of years ago I had heirloom tomato salad (first course) served with a scoop of tomato sorbet. I didn't really care for the sorbet, but it did have a very clear, pure tomato flavor.

At a recent farmers market cooking demo in Seattle, Jerry Traunfeld of the Herbfarm made a sorbet to top a cold vegetable soup. I think the sorbet was flavored with melon and fresh herbs (I didn't catch all the details).
Hungry Monkey May 2009

#20 Fat Guy

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Posted 13 September 2002 - 08:42 AM

The artificial distinction between savory and pastry ingredients and techniques is something that will inevitably break down along more sensible lines based on the progression of the meal rather than the inertia of a haphazard and incoherent tradition. But that would make a very good standalone thread.

Those who make ice cream, have you experimented with sugar substitutes?
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#21 Sandra Levine

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Posted 15 September 2002 - 02:46 PM

I use it as a sauce for a chocolate dessert I call "Turkish Coffee," infused with a hint of cardamom.  (Chocolate timbale cake, chocolate flan with a hint of anise, cardamom creme anglaise foam, toasted sesame, sea salt and candied orange zest sprinkled on top.)

[...feeling faint]

:wub:

#22 heyjude

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Posted 15 September 2002 - 03:16 PM

There is also a book called Vegetable Desserts by Elizabeth Schafer and Jeannette L. Miller which is subtitled Beyond Carrot Cake and Pumpkin Pie. They use vegetables in guises including Celery Doodles, Beet Mystery Pie, and Snappy Tomato and Spice Cake. Ice Creams and sorbets include Honey Garlic and Yam-Apricot Ice Milk.
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#23 Saffy

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Posted 15 September 2002 - 05:25 PM

Licorice icecream.... mmmmmmmm :biggrin:

#24 Kristian

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Posted 15 September 2002 - 11:06 PM

Finally, someone not from Finland (I assume?) who knows about licorice ice cream! :biggrin:

#25 Saffy

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Posted 15 September 2002 - 11:50 PM

Finally, someone not from Finland (I assume?) who knows about licorice ice cream!  :biggrin:

Nope, I am not from Finland, I am from the opposite end of the planet! :)

New Zealand.

There is a restaurant here that makes the most fabulous licorice icecream. It's very popular. If I had an icecream maker I would make it myself, but I never seem to have enough time to do it the old fashioned way. Trying to get it beaten at the right times is just too tough.
So I have to save up for one :/

#26 mhadam

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Posted 16 October 2002 - 01:20 PM

There is a restaurant here that makes the most fabulous licorice icecream. It's very popular. If I had an icecream maker I would make it myself, but I  never seem to have enough time to do it the old fashioned way. Trying to get it beaten at the right times is just too tough.

Never heard of licorice ice cream. Sounds dreamy....how would I go about making it? Anyone have a recipe?

Thank you in advance.

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#27 Lesley C

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Posted 16 October 2002 - 04:39 PM

I watched Gary Rhodes make some the other day on his cooking show. He melted black licorice and added it to a regular anglaise ice cream base. He served it with sticky toffee pudding I think. Looked great.

#28 High Priestess

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Posted 16 October 2002 - 06:43 PM

Dear Snow,

You must try rose petal or rose geranium petal (even better) icecream.

It's made with real flower petals, obviously organic.

It's great on a warm, fresh strawberry tart in summer, or just beside a bowl of fat, assorted summer berries.

I used to work in a restaurant where we served chartreuse ice cream, and I think that's my absolute favorite.

We made vacherin out of it by scooping it between two merangue wafers and then drizzling it with super dark, bitter hot fudge.

Even just thinking of chartreuse ice cream vacherins makes me happy, oh my God they're so good.

#29 maggiethecat

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Posted 16 October 2002 - 08:37 PM

To infuse the coffee flavor into ice cream we use one of Steve's alternate methods...the Medaglia d'Oro powder thing. Works for us. And a little dibble of Scotch whisky. Somehow Scotch supports the coffee flavor better than the likelier candidates like bourbon or rum.

Tomato desserts: does anyone remember a '60's favourite called...very forthrightly...Campbell's Tomato Soup Cake? Kind of a spice cake with raisins and cream cheese icing. A neighbor made it and I loved it as a kid.

Great post Steve...and all.

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