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Babies/Children in Restaurants (merged topic)


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#91 woodburner

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 05:49 PM

I think the restaurant has the right to throw out customers who won't or can't control the behavior of their babies, within reasonable limits.

I would agree with that! Any disruptive element should be removed. Childeren under 6 don't belong at such a place.

speaking of official policies, i would think that knowing this might happen would be deterent enough for people to leave their kids at home. actually, i wonder if that's why many don't bring their kids to high-end restaurants to being with?

I think the shark attorney's would have restraunteurs in civil court, by adopting any policy. You can't by law violate the liberties, of complete idiotic morons, especially in public places.

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#92 WHT

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 05:56 PM

what if it's a business dinner?

what if your babysitter canceled at the last minute?

what if it's a gift certificate?

what else should one be able to afford if they can afford a high-end restaurant? seems to me that if you're spending a lot on a dinner, maybe you don't have a lot left over. well, it doesn't actually seem that way to me, but clearly that can be the case. and for many people, it is.

If I found a child at a business dinner I was hosting they would not be doing business with me. That’s totally inappropriate. If the sitter cancels ether get another or call off the evening. As far as the gift certificate thing a straw man argument much like your other two suppositions. Not saying it doesn’t happen but Ford owners are seldom given a Cadillac for a gift. I think the same applies to most situations.

There are places where disruptive or boorish individuals are not welcome and should be asked to leave whatever the age.

As to kids playing in places like that it’s inviting an accident to happen.
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#93 Steve Klc

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 07:09 PM

Restaurants like Citronelle have dress codes which are enforced. Jackets, ties, no sneakers, no sandals, whatever, are a restaurant's way of defining expectation, defining acceptable behavior. They often have a wine "code" as well called a corkage policy. Why shouldn't we expect baby codes? If a restaurant doesn't develop and enforce a baby code--and also take the time to explain the existence of such a code to everyone making a reservation--as Citronelle does by informing everyone making a reservation of the dress code--then I'd suggest a restaurant, and unfortunately you Mark in this case, is on pretty thin ground complaining about or getting frustrated by activity which is within your power to curtail.

You dictate acceptable attire for your diners, you dictate whether wine can be brought into your restaurant, why isn't the onus also on you to dictate acceptable behavior or impose other conditions as well--like bringing little kids into your restaurant?

Then the marketplace chooses whether your dictates are acceptable or not.

And you're covered as long as your dictates are clearly delineated and consistently enforced.
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#94 greenfield

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 07:54 PM

This is definitely a very interesting thread. I have some very mixed feelings about children in restaurants. Personally, I don't mind children who stay in their chairs and behave reasonably well. For what it's worth, I definitely go out with friends and their children, but I have not been to any high-end restaurants with them.

One time a friend's child started to get a bit cranky. Since it was the end of the evening, they had a simple solution--time for them to go! It was a very nice solution and the entire evening was pleasant. Had it been the middle of the dinner, they probably would have stepped outside for a few minutes until the child was a bit calmer. (Of course, this can be a bit tricky in the winter in a small restaurant.)

I have another friend who allows her child to roam around the restaurant. She justifies this behavior by saying that if the restaurant wants to stay in business in our neighborhood, they will allow children to scamper about. Not only do I find this a bit annoying, but it can also be quite a bit dangerous. As a result, I try not to go out with this friend.

There has been a lot of discussion on why a child would be brought to a high-end restaurant. As a child, my brother and I were brought to high-end restaurants on two occasions: my grandparents' 70th and 75th anniversaries. The restaurants in question were Tavern on the Green and Windows on the World. In both cases, my grandparents wanted to have a nice meal with great service; they also wanted to spend time with the people who were close to them. I still vaguely remember both restaurants, and I definitely remember my grandparents being very happy that I was there with my younger brother. For what it's worth, I think we were very well behaved. (I can also remember the venison pate with truffles on the menu at Tavern on the Green, and I can also remember that it was my first introduction to a fixed price menu.) I know my grandparents would not have wanted to have an experience at a nice restaurant for these occasions without my brother and myself in attendance.

My brother has some very nice memories of Windows on the World. They gave him his own miniature bottle of soda, they put him next to the window, and they tried to make sure that he was having a good experience. This had a two-fold effect: he remembers nothing but good service at Windows on the World, and he was very pleasant because his needs were met.

Well, here was the specific scenario last night: Couple number 1 arrives with infant, toddler and granny in tow. They are shown to a small semi-private room in the restaurant where the infant immediately starts wailing and the toddler starts unpacking toys on the floor and singing. Couple number 2 arrives, also with infant and toddler and granny. They are shown to an adjacent table. Mother comes flying to the hostess stand where she complains that the other children are making noise. She is then shown to another alcove in the restaurant where her children can now start wailing and singing without being bothered by the other children. At one point in the evening, it seemed the children at both tables were communicating in screams "I've got this part covered, too". The daddy in the main dining room picks up the infant and starts slowly strolling THROUGH THE RESTAURANT, oblivious to the 4 food runners, 6 waiters, 2 sommeliers, and other 80 customers. This is in contrast to the night before when an African diplomat brought his family, including 3 small children. They sat perfectly poised at the table. The maitre d' offered children items to the parents, pasta and such. He was astonished when the littlest boy said in perfect French "I want the lamb. I really like lamb".  It was a rough night.


So what could have been done in this situation? Honestly, I don't work in a restaurant, so take my advice with a grain of salt. And I certainly do not want to try to second-guess the situation. As a customer, I would like the same sort of treatment in any high-end restaurant if I had or did not have children. I would want to have a good meal with unobtrusive and polite service. I guess it can be hard to be diplomatic in this kind of situation. I don't know who said it, but I think this quote is oddly appropriate: "A diplomat is a person who can tell you to go to Hell in such a way that you actually look forward to the trip."

Did you have a well-stated policy? If you require a jacket and a tie, I want to know ahead of time. Similarly, I want to know if children aren't allowed.

If there is a problem with my behavior, I want to know in a polite and inconspicuous way. For example, if I accidentally knock a plate off the table at a nice restaurant, I want the situation taken care of without a big deal. If I have a child who has toys on the floor, I would like to be politely asked that they be moved so that waiters won't trip.

Finally, if I am disturbing other guests, I want to be treated how you would other bad guests. What do you do if a guest is drunk and loud? Can you do the same with a parent who has a screaming child?

A Windows on the World approach may have worked as well. Perhaps children should merely be treated as customers with special needs. Give them extra attention during their experience at the restaurant, and if they don't need the attention, then throttle it back throughout the meal. Maybe a waiter or busboy that was good with children can be assigned to look after tables with children.

On the flip side, the next time these parents attempt to make a reservation or attempt to come into the restaurant, the restaurant might want to think twice before accepting the reservation or offering seats.

As for the other customers, were the ones who were visibly disturbed offered a complimentary dessert or glass of wine even if they didn't complain directly? If I were a pissed off customer, this would definitely go a long way to making me happy.

It sounds like an awful evening for almost everyone concerned. It's really too bad--one of the goals of all people who go out for the evening is to have a good time.

#95 tommy

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 08:06 PM

As far as the gift certificate thing a straw man argument much like your other two suppositions.

i don't think so. suggesting that if one can "afford a high end restaurant, you can afford a sitter" might be, however.

fwiw, i've been on several successful casual business meeting/dinners with a child. not an infant, but a child. the point is, of course, that perhaps no one in the group was actually paying for the dinner, therefore the argument above is meaningless. perhaps the rest of the world doesn't share your values.

Edited by tommy, 26 December 2003 - 08:09 PM.


#96 tommy

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 08:10 PM

i wonder if that's why many don't bring their kids to high-end restaurants to being with?

I think that most people don't do it because:

1) Most people are generally respectful of others

2) It is a waste of money (generally speaking)

3) It is not fun or fair for the the children (generally speaking, once again)

4) Nice dining is a big occasion for most people. Correcting a child all night long would sort of take the shine off of the apple. And trust me, having a disagreement involving children is no way to "get lucky" :laugh:

or to sum it up nicely, i think: they realize it's generally not appropriate.

#97 fifi

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 08:20 PM

greenfield, I haven't come across you before, so welcome to eGullet.

You make a good point about Windows on the World. That restaurant was a tourist destination and quite probably experienced in handling a mixed crowd as to age. This is unlike the other high end dining establishments. But, I am sure that some of the techniques that they used would be instructive. Thank you for sharing the experience.

May Windows on the World and its loyal employees rest in peace.
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#98 Mayhaw Man

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 08:21 PM

A Windows on the World approach may have worked as well. Perhaps children should merely be treated as customers with special needs. Give them extra attention during their experience at the restaurant, and if they don't need the attention, then throttle it back throughout the meal. Maybe a waiter or busboy that was good with children can be assigned to look after tables with children.

It has been my experience that this is usually exactly what happens if the children are behaving appropriately. Cool drinks, jokes from the waitstaff, maybe a dessert set up for the child-these things come with the territory for a kid who has just eaten a meal with adults and has behaved. It is pretty natural for people to be polite to a precocious, reasonably entertaining, well behaved child. This treatment is onw of the rewards for behaving and it is only good business (aside from some kind of natural tendency to be nice to children) to treat young customers well if they are with their parents. THey will come back and fill our seats again on some other night.

The issue, once again, is whether establishments should have stated rules about the dining ages of their patrons? I tend to lean towards no toddlers or babies, but as someone stated above, there are exceptions to everything.

After the age of 9 or 10, I think that the parent should have a pretty good grip on what the child can do and what the child WOULD LIKE to do. Some children, like some adults, are NOT EVER going to like sitting down to a multi course degustation. Some people would rather go to McApplebacks and count the "flair" on their waitron's suspenders while they are waiting on their pressed meat baby back ribs. More power to them. They can have my seat. :wacko:

On the other hand, some kids take to fine dining pretty early and I think that after a couple of practice runs at sit down and long service/multi course eating that they should be able to tag along if they are interested and you have a want or a reason to take them. Just be prepared to bail without complaint if it starts to go South.

I like eating with enthusiastic young diners and I am not only talking about the Little Mayhaws. We eat a decent meal or two every couple of months that generally involves a older adolescent or a young teen and I like it when they start asking questions concerning food or service or just about the business of running a high end place.

I think that I have repeated myself enough at this point. :laugh:
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#99 Bux

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 08:55 PM

I think the restaurant has the right to throw out customers who won't or can't control the behavior of their babies, within reasonable limits.

I would agree with that! Any disruptive element should be removed. Childeren under 6 don't belong at such a place.

I'm a bit confused as to what exactly you're advocating. I would agree that any disruptive element should be removed from a fine restaurant. As for kids under six, I don't see how or why anyone should care if they're not a disruptive element. I've seen five year olds sit quietly in a restaurant and draw no special attention to themselves or their table, except perhaps because others find them remarkable, but if people who appeared remarkable were barred from restaurants, how would escorts earn a living?

I have another friend who allows her child to roam around the restaurant. She justifies this behavior by saying that if the restaurant wants to stay in business in our neighborhood, they will allow children to scamper about. Not only do I find this a bit annoying, but it can also be quite a bit dangerous. As a result, I try not to go out with this friend.

The free market can be a wondrous, or at least mysterious thing. There's much to be said for a neighborhood restaurant allowing children to scamper about, if that's what the neighborhood wants and supports. I suspect Le Bernardin (I'm trying to give equal credit to the star places in my posts) would not stay in business if it allowed children to scamper about. Quite frankly, that's not their trade and I doubt there are enough families with scampering children intent on eating there to keep it in business after their regular trade leaves.

I'd prefer not to see restaurants have to enforce "no children policies" but I understand why they might. I find it a pity that more people aren't responsible for their actions and their children's. As I've said, I enjoy seeing children in restaurants and that includes fine restaurants, but I don't enjoy scampering children in fine restaurants and don't expect either parents or management to allow adults or children to spoil my dining experience. I do find the assumption that a child doesn't belong without any knowledge about the child's history in restaurants to be one of prejudice. In a certain way, when restaurants begin to enforce age regulations to keep children out, it seems to take any responsibility away from the diner and parent. A rule against six year olds, implies that a seven year old is okay even if he misbehaves, while a rule against misbehaving will work for the rude six year old, the rude seven year old and the rude forty year old.
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#100 Mark Sommelier

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 11:23 PM

Restaurants like Citronelle have dress codes which are enforced.  Jackets, ties, no sneakers, no sandals, whatever, are a restaurant's way of defining expectation, defining acceptable behavior.  They often have a wine "code" as well called a corkage policy. Why shouldn't we expect baby codes?  If a restaurant doesn't develop and enforce a baby code--and also take the time to explain the existence of such a code to everyone making a reservation--as Citronelle does by informing everyone making a reservation of the dress code--then I'd suggest a restaurant, and unfortunately you Mark in this case, is on pretty thin ground complaining about or getting frustrated by activity which is within your power to curtail.

You dictate acceptable attire for your diners, you dictate whether wine can be brought into your restaurant, why isn't the onus also on you to dictate acceptable behavior or impose other conditions as well--like bringing little kids into your restaurant?

Then the marketplace chooses whether your dictates are acceptable or not.

And you're covered as long as your dictates are clearly delineated and consistently enforced.

Dear Steve,
Citronelle doesn't do corkage. When people actually ask before they come if they can bring bottles, they are politely told no. Unfortunately, people don't usually ask if it is appropriate to bring an infant, so we don't get the chance to tell them, no, maybe this isn't the best place to bring an infant. I started the thread to discern if there was a way to tell people discreetly, other than a NO BABIES sign posted at the door . I have enjoyed many of the answers and will use the feedback with our hostess staff. Another thing, Steve. The guy I work for is French. His frame of reference is Paris 3 star restaurants. I was recently in Paris. I ate at some pretty fine restaurants. According to my boss, infants are not brought to fine restaurants in Paris. The best restaurants rarely accept tables larger than 6, also. When I was in Paris I have to admit that I never saw children in restaurants, nor wild tables of 8 conventioneers whoooping it up, either.

Steve, you also said: "Then the marketplace chooses whether your dictates are acceptable or not.
And you're covered as long as your dictates are clearly delineated and consistently enforced."

Steve,
You know that I work in one of the busiest restaurants in town. Apparently, the "dictates" are not much of a problem. Its not that hard to put a coat on and lose the jeans for most people. The wine policy has been discussed elsewhere, so I won't go in to it. I started the baby thread to discover what other people out there thought about it. That's all.
Mark

#101 Pan

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 11:26 PM

Seth, as a musician, I disagree with the idea that kids shouldn't be brought to concerts. Kids are the audience of tomorrow and should be introduced to live music.

As a bad amatuer musician, I completely agree that children must be introduced to music as early and as often as possible, and I never meant to suggest otherwise. There are many concert settings designed with children in mind or held in places (i.e., outdoors) appropriate for children of any age. When I made reference to the "concert hall," I meant to evoke more formal concert settings. The concert I was remembering was a piano recital at Carnegie Hall. There was a young child who behaved remarkably, even astonishingly well. But he still fidgeted throughout the first half of the show, and often whispered this or that to his mother. These were distractions from Maurizio Pollini's wonderful performance, and I'll never get that performance back.

Sorry for the off-topic chat.

I was at a Pollini recital at Carnegie Hall 2 or 3 years ago, and the problem I had was not with a kid but with some adults who wouldn't shut up, no matter how much I stared at them. I still loved the recital, however. Nothing like live music.

OK, now back to our show... :biggrin:

#102 Mark Sommelier

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 11:30 PM

greenfield, I haven't come across you before, so welcome to eGullet.

You make a good point about Windows on the World. That restaurant was a tourist destination and quite probably experienced in handling a mixed crowd as to age. This is unlike the other high end dining establishments. But, I am sure that some of the techniques that they used would be instructive. Thank you for sharing the experience.

May Windows on the World and its loyal employees rest in peace.

Windows on the World is scheduled to re-open in several years when the new building is built. It was in the NYT this week.
Mark

#103 Mark Sommelier

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Posted 26 December 2003 - 11:33 PM

Seth, as a musician, I disagree with the idea that kids shouldn't be brought to concerts. Kids are the audience of tomorrow and should be introduced to live music.

As a bad amatuer musician, I completely agree that children must be introduced to music as early and as often as possible, and I never meant to suggest otherwise. There are many concert settings designed with children in mind or held in places (i.e., outdoors) appropriate for children of any age. When I made reference to the "concert hall," I meant to evoke more formal concert settings. The concert I was remembering was a piano recital at Carnegie Hall. There was a young child who behaved remarkably, even astonishingly well. But he still fidgeted throughout the first half of the show, and often whispered this or that to his mother. These were distractions from Maurizio Pollini's wonderful performance, and I'll never get that performance back.

Sorry for the off-topic chat.

I was at a Pollini recital at Carnegie Hall 2 or 3 years ago, and the problem I had was not with a kid but with some adults who wouldn't shut up, no matter how much I stared at them. I still loved the recital, however. Nothing like live music.

OK, now back to our show... :biggrin:

I love opera. I have yet to see someone bring an infant to an opera performance. I was 16 when my mom took me to see Leontyne Price sing Aida at the Met. I remember the camels.
Mark

#104 Pan

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 12:06 AM

I think I was 8th grade when I saw the first opera I loved, The Magic Flute. I had been to La Boheme earlier, was bored by the act that was a long love scene, and left after that act so that my mother and her friend could enjoy the rest of the opera in peace. It's all about having an adequate attention span and being considerate.

I don't think that Carnegie Hall is the same as the Metropolitan Opera, but we should probably drop this tangent. :smile:

#105 Bux

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 12:17 AM

I have seen a fair number of kids in two and three star restaurants outside of Paris and youngsters (not babies, and my one NY sighting in Daniel was admittedly an exception) in top Parisian restaurants. It's not common to see children in two and three star restaurants in Paris, but when you do, they are exceptionally well behaved, especially if they are French. In the provinces, I've seen kids more mobile in top restaurants, but there's generally more room in the dining room and I've also seen kids come and go out into the garden to play. I've also seen large dogs in restaurants in France. At Veyrat's place outside of Annecy, there was a young girl who ran all over the dining room. In fact, more than once, a waiter almost tripped over her. My recollection was that she pestered at least one other table, but they may have encouraged her. I was rather surprised to say the least, although it didn't disrupt my meal. Veyrat himself was there in the dining room and appeared to know the people at the table. Either they were relatives, good customers or his banker.
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#106 Bux

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 12:36 AM

In NY in the mid seventies, I watched a young, maybe three year old, girl tear across a SoHo gallery running headfirst toward a very large painting. She caught the attention of the dealer who practically leaped from her office, although it was obvious she could never beat the kid to the painting. The kid came to a dead stop about eighteen inches from the painting, proceeded to put her hands in the back pockets of her overalls and leaned forward looking at the painting rather discriminatingly over her nose. It was hard to tell if the kid really liked that painting, but she clearly knew how to look as if she belonged in a gallery. On the other hand, I've seen any number of adults lean back against work on the walls in a gallery and in some cases actually put their hand out to brace themselves on a work of art.
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#107 Pan

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 01:16 AM

Bux, my parents told me about a time when they went with my brother (then 5 years old) to a restaurant in France that was no high-end place or obviously fancy. They say that my brother behaved perfectly well from their American perspective and spoke in a normal conversational voice - and everyone stared at him, because in those days (this would be 1963 or '64), children were "seen and not heard," and none of the French children in the place said a word the entire time in that silent room. Needless to say, my brother really disliked the experience and my parents were uncomfortable but learned something about cultural differences.

Clearly, things have changed since then, as I found during my trip to France in June of 2002 that talking in a normal voice and laughing in Michelin-starred restaurants was evidently quite acceptable.

The French love affair with dogs is something that most anyone who's been to France has experienced - the way they feed excellent humans' food to their dog, who is sitting next to them, perhaps without a leash on. I have my doubts that dogs can appreciate haute cuisine better than a nice, juicy piece of raw meat, but who am I to tell people to stop anthropomorphising their pets?

#108 Mabelline

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 02:08 AM

I have read the whole thread, Mark, and sought to give you some advice about your problem. But I keep coming up with the fact that no matter what you wish to do, the ones who need the talkin' to are precisely also the ones obtuse enough to be a real problem in the first place. The father taking his child around the room was a sweetheart-but someone should have said something like it could not be allowed because of the hazard to staff, diners, and dad/child. I would seriously consider a children welcomed night,have reservations inform callers from the get-go like previously mentioned, and segregate a child area.


By the way: read sweetheart as a synonym for @**hole. I think there is hopefully a special ring of hell for anyone who puts others off their feed.

#109 jackal10

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 02:16 AM

Babies in restaturants? I don't think I could manage a whole one.
St John serves an excellent suckling pig, one per table...

#110 balex

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 02:29 AM

They might not be happy about seeing a black man being seated next to them. Or a group of American tourists. So what? I am not interested in people's prejudices -- the important thing is how individuals behave.  I don't see why well-behaved children should not be allowed into fancy restaurants just because some children are badly behaved, any more than we should ban all Americans from Arpege just because someone ordered a Coke there  once.

I think there is a tremendous difference between racial prejudices and "age" discrimination -- in this case unruly children in high-end, fine dining.

The key, at least for me, is the propensity of a child to misbehave. As I noted above, children become crabby and tired, which may very well be a child that 99.999999% of the time is an absolute angel with their track record of public behaviour. Well rested, excited and enthusiastic children can become overbearing as well, just to the brink of another diner being made uncomfortable.

I for one, do not appreciate the exaggeration being applied here.

Americans have a propensity to talk loudly and order coca-cola in fine restaurants. This is not racial prejudice but national prejudice which perhaps isn't so taboo.

And this is not about unruly children but about children in general -- I think everybody agrees that unruly children should not be allowed -- the question is whether all children should be banned from high end restaurants. In particular I object to the idea that well-behaved children should not be allowed because of the prejudices of other diners, based on what I admit are real propensities of children.



And I did say

Ok, I'm exaggerating a bit, but you get the drift wink.gif

And I don't appreciate that qualification being snipped off. But let's not get too pompous. Merry Xmas all!

#111 Mabelline

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 02:41 AM

Babies in restaturants? I don't think I could manage a whole one.
St John serves an excellent suckling pig, one per table...

:laugh: That reminds of a Roseanne episode where one kid was being a kid-type pain and she says something like, "Now I know why some animals eat their young."

#112 Louisa Chu

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 02:45 AM

Mark, sorry but I think you have your answer here - you can't do a no babies policy in the States. It's such a hot topic that you'd generate a lot of bad publicity - especially because your boss is French.

At ADPA - Ducasse in Paris - we have a no babies policy. And no dogs. Considered kind of strict even for Parisian standards, because usually it's just an unspoken rule - to have an actual policy in place is kind of a big deal. But it is enforced. Children are allowed though.

#113 Pan

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 03:00 AM

What's the age that's generally considered to be acceptable at Ducasse?

#114 fifi

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 03:04 AM

Is it true that you can't do a "no babies" policy in the US?
Linda LaRose aka "fifi"

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#115 torakris

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 03:25 AM

I started the thread to discern if there was a way to tell people discreetly, other than a NO BABIES sign posted at the door

Why can't you ask when they make the reservations something like how many adult will be in their party. If they reply that they have children/toddlers/babies you can respond that you prefer not to seat children under a certain age or that you only seat tables with children for lunch/before 6:00, etc.
Wouldn't there be some way to do this when the reservation is being made.
When making reservations in Japan we often say or are asked the number of adults and the number of children.

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#116 hjshorter

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 05:32 AM

I love opera. I have yet to see someone bring an infant to an opera performance. I was 16 when my mom took me to see Leontyne Price sing Aida at the Met. I remember the camels.

I worked at the Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts for several years. There was one instance where a woman brought an infant to the ballet, and subscriptions were purchased to the ballet and symphony for kids as young as three. The ushers were trained to deal swiftly with anyone disrupting a performance.

There was no rule banning infants and no signs to that effect, but since everyone must have a ticket regardless of age, most reasonable folks left the kids at home. A babysitter is usually cheaper than a theater ticket. However, if signs did go up you can be sure that a stink would be raised based on the policy of "age discrimination." Never underestimate the buying public.
Heather Johnson
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#117 fresco

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 05:45 AM

The French love affair with dogs is something that most anyone who's been to France has experienced - the way they feed excellent humans' food to their dog, who is sitting next to them, perhaps without a leash on. I have my doubts that dogs can appreciate haute cuisine better than a nice, juicy piece of raw meat, but who am I to tell people to stop anthropomorphising their pets?


On the whole, I think it is less harmful to treat one's pets as human than to treat one's infant offspring as adults.
Arthur Johnson, aka "fresco"

#118 balex

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 06:02 AM



The French love affair with dogs is something that most anyone who's been to France has experienced - the way they feed excellent humans' food to their dog, who is sitting next to them, perhaps without a leash on. I have my doubts that dogs can appreciate haute cuisine better than a nice, juicy piece of raw meat, but who am I to tell people to stop anthropomorphising their pets?


On the whole, I think it is less harmful to treat one's pets as human than to treat one's infant offspring as adults.

I was at a concert here in London about a month ago and a blind person had brought her dog with her. Which started barkiing during the performance. My children on the other hand behaved perfectly.

:raz:

Edited by balex, 27 December 2003 - 06:03 AM.


#119 fresco

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 06:03 AM

Yes, those damn blind people. They're a nuisance and should be dealt with.
Arthur Johnson, aka "fresco"

#120 Mayhaw Man

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Posted 27 December 2003 - 06:17 AM

or to sum it up nicely, i think: they realize it's generally not appropriate.

Nice summation, counselor :laugh:
Brooks Hamaker, aka "Mayhaw Man"

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