Bay leaves: useful, or wishful thinking?

[gulator]

Unfortunately, no garden for now    So, get bay leaves on-line in bulk and organic. Actually, for cooking this is very convenient, price is good, quality good, get another 1 pound bag whenever I need it. So, I am very satisfied  

[MokaPot]

Hi Guys: recently got some dried Turkish bay leaves from Penzeys. The leaves did have a nice fragrance, not strong, though. Made some split pea soup (yield was approx. 2 quarts or 2 liters). After cooking the onions, added four bay leaves (2 huge and 2 small). Soup did simmer for a while. No harm done by the bay leaves, but no detectable bay leaf flavor.

 

How many / much bay leaves are you supposed to add?

 

Also, looking for advice on what other things to put bay leaves in. I mostly eat vegetarian food.

 

Thank you!

 

[gfweb]

I've always suspected that dry bay leaves have lost most of the volatiles that give them flavor.

[Kerala]

I'd forgotten I'd posted on this thread 6 years ago. We're moving home soon, and I will be planting a bay bush and a rosemary bush as soon as I move in.

I often use bay leaves instead of nutmeg when I'm making a white sauce, and indeed did so this evening making chicken pie.

@MokaPot sorry, no idea about dried leaves. I'd suggest doubling the dose.

[JoNorvelleWalker]

43 minutes ago, MokaPot said:

Hi Guys: recently got some dried Turkish bay leaves from Penzeys. The leaves did have a nice fragrance, not strong, though. Made some split pea soup (yield was approx. 2 quarts or 2 liters). After cooking the onions, added four bay leaves (2 huge and 2 small). Soup did simmer for a while. No harm done by the bay leaves, but no detectable bay leaf flavor.

 

How many / much bay leaves are you supposed to add?

 

Also, looking for advice on what other things to put bay leaves in. I mostly eat vegetarian food.

 

Thank you!

 

 

I use the Turkish bay leaves from Penzeys.  I have been pleased with them.  The volatiles of bay leaf are almost insoluble in water.  Did you have a fair amount of fat in your soup to extract the flavor?

 

Can you describe the "bay leaf flavor" you were expecting and not finding?  McGee describes bay leaf component smells as "camphor, lavender, pine, woody".  Could you be expecting the flavor of California bay leaf, which is a different genus?  McGee describes California bay leaf smells as "fresh-harsh, medicinal, woody, pine".

 

A showcase for bay leaf is @lesliec's bay leaf ice cream.

 

[AlaMoi]

has anyone found a good reference for herb solvents as in cooking?

 

i.e.

some do better extracting in oil

some in water....

some in  alcohol....

 

I've not come up with a good guide/reference

 

as Jo said above, bay leaf is one that does well coming out with oil. 

for example doing chili with diced beef or ground beef I always put the bay in while the beef is rendering its fat -

 

@MokaPot - bay is a very subtle flavor.  you'll likely not notice it until it's 'over done' - and too much can be objectionable....

did a dish recently, forgot the bay leaf.... DW opined it wasn't as good as she remembered.  when I did a left over reheat, added a couple bay leaves and it improved by magic.....

[MokaPot]

39 minutes ago, JoNorvelleWalker said:

 

I use the Turkish bay leaves from Penzeys.  I have been pleased with them.  The volatiles of bay leaf are almost insoluble in water.  Did you have a fair amount of fat in your soup to extract the flavor?

 

Can you describe the "bay leaf flavor" you were expecting and not finding?  McGee describes bay leaf component smells as "camphor, lavender, pine, woody".  Could you be expecting the flavor of California bay leaf, which is a different genus?  McGee describes California bay leaf smells as "fresh-harsh, medicinal, woody, pine".

 

A showcase for bay leaf is @lesliec's bay leaf ice cream.

 

 

No, not a lot of fat in my soup. I thought about dropping the bay leaves at the very beginning, along with the oil & onions, but didn't want an overpowering bay leaf flavor. Next time, I'll drop the leaves in with the oil & onions. Thank you for the idea!

 

Good point about California vs. Turkish. I wasn't expecting the Turkish bay leaves to be like the California ones.

 

When I visited Muir Woods (northern California), there were tons of bay trees / leaves there. IIRC, smelled like eucalyptus. Supposedly, the Turkish are supposed to be better than the CA, so that's why I got them.

 

[Katie Meadow]

CA Bay Laurel is harsher. Turkish are better. I think most all dried bay leaves from spice stores are Turkish, no? 

[JoNorvelleWalker]

5 minutes ago, Katie Meadow said:

CA Bay Laurel is harsher. Turkish are better. I think most all dried bay leaves from spice stores are Turkish, no? 

 

I believe so.  The fresh leaves I've purchased did not taste good.  I now only buy dried.

 

[Elkyfr]

I used dried bay in only 1 recipe in my live... and this the most popular food in my town, a tuna stew with potatoes and laurel.

[haresfur]

I have a vague recollection of someone on the forum claiming that dried leaves tasted stronger than fresh. Or maybe I was dreaming. I think the flavour is a bit different, not just stronger/weaker. The dried ones I have now are similar to the fresh because they came from the same tree and I just air-dried them and they still look pretty green compared to the ones you buy. In any case I tend to use more fresh in a dish.

[heidih]

10 hours ago, Elkyfr said:

I used dried bay in only 1 recipe in my live... and this the most popular food in my town, a tuna stew with potatoes and laurel.

Interesting. I rummaged around and found an ancient McCormick jar of bay leaves (I'd toss but if step mom shows up she will consider me a wasteful @#$ though she never uses herbs).  A suggested use on the label is to add a couple bay leaves when boiling potatoes for mashed - remove before mashing.

 

On the fresh - pre Google my mom got some California bay leaves from her friend - fresh from the bush. She put one or two into long simmered meat sauce. We were all bay traumatized for a while. 

[Margaret Pilgrim]

II buy cheap dried bay leaves in the Mexican seasoning department.   Always add as part of a bouquet garni (dried bay leaf, fresh parsley and thyme tied together with string for easy removal) in meat braises,  , in beans and split peas, in potato soup, chili, Mexican sauces.     About 2" of leaf is enough.

[heidih]

18 minutes ago, Margaret Pilgrim said:

II buy cheap dried bay leaves in the Mexican seasoning department.   

Not only are those seasoning packets cheap - they also tend to be fresher than the stuff in the mainstream spice aisle. 

[AAQuesada]

I but fresh then keep them in the freezer. Usually toast or char them  before use. I'm one of those that never understood why people used bay leafs until I  tried fresh. 

[BeeZee]

I had recently gotten some organic California bay leaves (dried) from a seller on Etsy and they were much more fragrant than what I had gotten previously from the supermarket. I definitely noticed the difference in flavor when I made lentil soup.

[Elkyfr]

When I see more laurel branches, it is at the festival of "Palm Sunday". When I was a kid, we hung these donuts from San Blas.

 

[jimb0]

i tend to grind my own and the smell alone tells me how potent new bay can be. i like to blend it with dairy and strain before making ice creams or custards.

[BetD]

https://www.burlapandbarrel.com/collections/recommended-products/products/laurel-bay-leaves

 

This powdered bay packs a punch, very aromatic!  Recommended equivalence  is 1/8 tsp. to replace 1 leaf, I believe.

Edited January 23, 2021 by BetD (log)

[SLB]

On 1/18/2021 at 1:44 PM, heidih said:

We were all bay traumatized for a while. 

I heard/read somewhere Julia Child saying, "California bay leaves are TOO STRONG!"

 

It disturbs me that I can't quite remember the source of this (would've had to be a recording for me to hear it in her voice) -- but that's another thread . . . .

[HKDave]

On 1/18/2021 at 2:40 PM, Katie Meadow said:

CA Bay Laurel is harsher. Turkish are better. I think most all dried bay leaves from spice stores are Turkish, no? 

 

If a vendor doesn't say otherwise, it's almost always Turkish bay. "Spice Islands" is the only widely-available brand I'm aware of whose bay leaves are California bay laurel, and it would be nice if they clearly labelled it as such, but they don't. I have no problem cooking with either; I just use far less when it's California.