NYTimes Articles on Food, Drink, Culinary Culture 2013–

[radtek]

Whats wrong with a simple bologna/tuna/ham/turkey sandwich, a bag of chips and an apple or orange and a carton of milk? Sack lunches available for a dollar but no hot food. I don't think we should be putting that much effort into feeding kids whose parents ought to be packing an appropriate lunch for them anyway. 

[Deryn]

I agree with Mr. Miller. I don't think it really will make a difference one way or another if schools have or don't, use or don't use, a deep fat fryer. I doubt kids are going to get any slimmer if the fryers are put back in but I also doubt they are going to put on more weight either as a result of them being reinstituted. I hope that is not all he is doing, mind you - I hope that he is still conscious of the need to make 'some' changes from the diet that used to be back when the fryers were there - and isn't just completely capitulating to student demands.

 

I think more damage has been done by the way the extreme opposite (of what is now deemed completely unhealthy) was instituted than would have been done over the long haul if things had stayed the same as they used to be. Small improvements to the diet offered in schools, over time, would have been a much better idea - but this country is given to swinging the pendulum wildly and never allowing it to settle in the middle.

 

I agree with you too, radtek. Unfortunately, your suggested lunch doesn't even come close to meeting the current 'guidelines' that schools taking funding assistance to feed kids who supposedly cannot afford a decent lunch require them to meet either. And in some places/schools, if you were to show up with a packed lunch such as you suggest, some or all of it would be confiscated, if the school/board/district remains part of the School Lunch program. That needs to change!

 

I think you are right too that eliminating the 'hot lunch' would be a cost savings that could easily fund your approach - and I would applaud that as well - though maybe part of that is because I grew up never even having a cafeteria in any school I attended till I was in university - so unless I walked home for lunch, it was never 'hot'. Of course, we never had chips either.

 

The program itself and how it was instituted, in my humble opinion, stinks - and has just cost us all a LOT more money in wasted food and probably helped to add to the weight problem (because kids sneak off and buy a lot of junk food as a result of being hungry) than just leaving things as they were.

 

What really is needed I think is for schools to start putting back recess (without so many restrictions that kids are scared to do anything but stand in a corner the whole time instead of kicking around a ball or playing hide-and-seek) and PT/PE periods at least 3 times a week as well. And make a lot of them walk to school too (any place it is not too dangerous for them to do so and/or the distance is less than a mile or two). Kids will burn off a lot of energy/food (and it helps them focus better too) if exercise is included in the curriculum but most schools would rather talk about the food aspect than that.

 

Along with that, small additions/changes to the menus which move in a more positive direction over time, may be helpful in getting kids to try new things that are healthier. Or keep the same foods but make sure the ingredients are a bit less fatty, that they are 'cleaner' (if not organic), etc. Radical changes instituted quickly will usually always be a failure in the long run.

Edited June 20, 2015 by Deryn (log)

[rotuts]

although Fat Kids die sooner

 

all you can do is hope that by example, not having  fried foods etc at your school where you might learn

 

4 - 6 kids might learn that point by example

 

save - save

 

4 to 6 is  4 - 6

 

Mr Big Belly has no capacity to understand this

 

one might be enough 

 

there is more than BBQ going one here

 

its $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

[Ttogull]

I grew up in Texas. I ate in the public school cafeterias. Most days I ate pizza and French fries or chimichangas (deep fried burritos) and french fries. I recall full sugar jello too! The schools had special lines for these. The "healthy" lunch was usually disgusting, but the line was short if you were in a hurry.

I tend to agree with the above. Everyone it seems has a different definition of healthy. My daughter's school won an award for its "healthy" fare, and I think it is pure trash. My daughter takes her lunch every day.

It starts at home. My daughter knows our definition of healthy food. Out of 21 meals per week (3 per day), only 5 would be at school. Snacks, say 14 per week, are also the parents' responsibility. The majority of the meals and nearly all of the snacks are under the parents' control. My daughter splurges with her friends, eating stuff that she knows we deem unhealthy, but her attitude is good - once in a while is ok. Indeed it is, I think. Is 5 bad meals out of 21 considered "once in a while?" Close, I think.

I am dubious that a school cafeteria can produce food I'd call healthy. I remember too well mushy green beans, probably originally from a large can. Shudder. I eat healthy now, and would still prefer a chimichanga.

Conversely, I've seen kids that are allowed, for example, to eat only fried chicken nuggets at home. Or just boxed Mac and cheese kids who eat no vegetables at all. One lunch was simple white bread - a whole loaf. Not at just special meals, but at nearly all meals at home. I was aghast. The parents just shrug. What good is trying to force these kids to eat a "wholesome" lunch at school. Even if they did eat it - which they are unlikely to fo - it's 5 out of 21 meals. Of dubious nutrition.

The effort to benefit seems lopsided to me.

[rotuts]

school should set an example.  if that helps only 2 out of 100  to sit up and notice, so be it.  better than 0 out of 100.

[scubadoo97]

Sounds like more a political ploy

[Shel_B]

Whole Foods Markets: Throwing Organic Farmers Under the Bus?

 

Organic Farmers Call Foul on Whole Foods' Rating System

 

Whole Foods Description of "Responsibly Grown"

Edited June 23, 2015 by Shel_B (log)

[GlorifiedRice]

[rotuts]

nice

 

thanks.

 

@ $ 5.50 a lunch  ( if i heard correctly ) is this subsidized ?  that seems high for a school lunch.

 

then again, Austin TX in no run of the mill ordinary place .

[rotuts]

this is more a business article, but there's interesting stuff in it about kimchi traditions in Korea :

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/30/business/international/chinese-trade-rules-put-south-koreas-kimchi-industry-in-a-pickle.html?ref=business&_r=0

 

I don't think its behind a pay-wall

[Smithy]

From the article:

"By classifying kimchi as pickled goods, the Chinese government basically blocked all imports of the product from South Korea. Kimchi is fermented and has high levels of bacteria. As such, it did not pass the hygiene standards normally applied to pickled goods, which are sterilized and have low amounts of bacteria."

Are pickled goods normally sterilized, at least in China? If the kimchi were to be sterilized, how would that affect the flavor and/or texture? Is the fermentation finished by the time of packaging? I'm missing something here.

[Deryn]

If kimchi is such a national treasure to South Korea (as I think it is and should be), it seems to me that a political countermeasure on the part of the Koreans (declaring some similar reason why imported kimchi should not be allowed to cross the border from China) is in order. It seems that China is playing foul with their declaration that South Korean kimchi does not meet their standards while it is sending masses of jars of their own product to S. Korea, flooding the Korean market with cheap versions manufactured in China from inferior products, and destroying the desire and capability of local Koreans to continue a long held tradition - one which is a large part of their cultural identity.

 

That said, I wish I could answer Smithy's questions because they interest me too. I guess one could say that pickles are a) in sterilized jars and b) probably at least water-bathed and could argue that is 'sterilization'. I don't know if doing the same to kimchi would change it substantially as it is essentially a 'raw' product that doesn't require heat but I suspect it would change at least the texture, if not the taste. Mind you, we can buy 'canned' (jars of) kimchi in North America and I presume it has been put up in sterilized jars and processed somehow to get by our import laws too.

 

On the other hand, maybe the South Koreans could freeze-dry their kimchi and get that through the bureaucracy and the borders! I am sure they are less concerned about the authenticity of the process or product once it crosses the border out of the homeland, as long as they can keep the good stuff for themselves, the jobs from making it and the tradition alive while also making money from its production on the side.

 

Since all this however makes China seem rather bully-ish, I think I better read the jars more carefully when I buy some myself in future to be sure what I am buying is a Korean product, not Chinese.

Edited July 31, 2015 by Deryn (log)

[rotuts]

I think maybe the jar'd stuff known as pickles are pasteurized, not sterilized.

 

I think that the kimchi we get here is also pasteurized. and the true kimchi in SK is fermented and in so sort of crock, not in pasteurized jars.

 

size wise, and food wise, I can't imagine a country like SK, re food, doing any sort of reciprocal damage to Chine.

 

but  its a good idea to look at the jars here a little more carefully.

 

there is a Korean store very near me.   I hope to remember to take a look there next time Im there.

 

who knew commercial Kimchi was so Geo-Complicated.

 

and the jars I get, both from the Korean store and a large Chinese store, are no way as aromatic as the stuff mentioned in the article.

 

Im betting that stuff is 'sanitized' for my delicate palate western palate.

Edited July 31, 2015 by rotuts (log)

[Norm Matthews]

About 30 years ago when I was still married and we had a Korean restaurant we bought kimchi that was made by a company in Chicago.  Last week I got a smaller jar of kimchi at a large Asian market and it was still made by the same company in Chicago.   Back then my wife asked me to make some kimchi jars. During a few months period, I made around 20 out of stoneware in1 to 3 gallons in sizes.  They all ended up in the hands of Koreans in the community.  Even years later, I'd come across them on someone's back porch but if I recall correctly, they were nearly always used for keeping a red pepper seasoning paste. Pretty soon after that, Kimchi jars imported from Korea became available.  Whenever I saw someone making kimchi at their home, it went into glass jars, then in the refrigerator, not outside or in one of those kimchi jars.

Edited July 31, 2015 by Norm Matthews (log)

[Anna N]

About 30 years ago when I was still married and we had a Korean restaurant we bought kimchi that was made by a company in Chicago. Last week I got a smaller jar of kimchi at a large Asian market and it was still made by the same company in Chicago. Back then my wife asked me to make some kimchi jars. During a few months period, I made around 20 out of stoneware in1 to 3 gallons in sizes. They all ended up in the hands of Koreans in the community. Even years later, I'd come across them on someone's back porch but if I recall correctly, they were nearly always used for keeping a red pepper seasoning paste. Pretty soon after that, Kimchi jars imported from Korea became available. Whenever I saw someone making kimchi at their home, it went into glass jars, then in the refrigerator, not outside or in one of those kimchi jars.

I am always quite amazed to see kimchi refrigerators in one of the Korean grocery stores we visit. These are refrigerators for sale not in use in the store! So I am guessing some Korean households are still making their own kimchi but it is now going into dedicated refrigerators rather than being buried in the backyard.

Edited to fix a typo or two

Edited July 31, 2015 by Anna N (log)

[hummingbirdkiss]

I have eaten "shelf stable"  kimchi and even  "canned kimchi" myself  and it is "ok" just like sauerkraut that is shelf stable is "ok" if you have nothing else to fill the spot … but it is like a shelf stable pickle of any type stops at the point you want to keep going with the flavor and with pickles I want the taste to be "alive"  there is no control over what could contaminate kimchi but I know for a fact nothing hides when  it is "off" LOL! wow but it is hard if it is prepared well and the fermentation is good and the right bacteria are in doing their thing ? it is a super safe food in my opinion. I never mind buying fresh kimchi or freshly fermented food in places where I am fine eating most anything ..….the only thing I see that is different and I call kimchi "pickles" is that you either stabilize it for the shelf or keep it alive and I do that with all fermented or pickled things. 

 

About half my Korean friends my age make their own kimchi like their mother did (I am 57 years old) and if they do not make it their moms do and give it to them or they buy it from a local kimchi deli ..younger kids are eating more mass marketed kimchi and now there is this renewed excitement and fermentation is still "on trend" so kids are starting to make their own kimchi and recipes are being revived..I am speaking from someone who adored kimchi ..have always live in areas with strong Korean communities  I eat kimchi almost daily either  my own, my friends (I get a gallon jar from a friend as my holiday gift each year she knows me that well they are mini naps stuffed like no others ) I adore our locally produced. kimchi here in the Federal Way and Tacoma area of the Puget Sound our kimchi choices are endless and it was part of why we choose to settle here ..the food! 40 years I have eaten kimchi …in fact I am about to scramble ducks eggs with kimchi for breakfast . 

 

the article was interesting thanks .I  am not sure where I am going with this early morning ramble …but saw a kimchi topic and jumped in. 

 

ps I am putting  a kimchi fridge in my kitchen plans ..they are fantastic if you keep lots of pickles or like fermenting or making salsas or sauces you do not want can but want to keep …chutney … I have always wanted one and converted an old beer fridge into a kimchi fridge ages ago ..time to upgrade and very excited to see the size I want available now! 

[rotuts]

""  scramble ducks eggs with kimchi for breakfast ""

 

my kind of breakfast !

[rotuts]

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/11/24/cokes-chief-scientist-who-orchestrated-obesity-research-is-leaving/?_r=0

 

why does this not surprise me ?

 

where I grew up there was a major high school across the street from one of the very early outdoor shopping centers.  High Schoolers

 

were not permitted to cross that road and go over there during school hours.

 

Times Change.  not long ago a major stop-light was installed to facilitate that flow of kids across that street.

 

there was a large supermarket there.  I was there once during lunch or a break time at that school.

 

Herds of kids descended on this supermarket for lunch/snacks :

 

large bottles of Coke, chips and candy bars were the standard snack.  Coke machines appeared in schools even in my time.

 

I assign no blame for this behavior.  not to the parents, the school district, nor the kids themselves.

 

as I get older, I say not just what a shame, and it is a shame, but why do I  have to pay for this behavior through my health insurance?

 

clearly some classy lawyers could make a bundle and let Coke pick up most of this bill.  

 

as Mr. Potato Head exclaims in " Toy Story " :

 

" Money Money Money ! "

 

you have to hear this quote to appreciate it.

 

and here it is :

 

 

I think Mr.P animated says this better later in the film while robbing a train

 

here is a version :

 

 

 

BTW  Ive got nothing against money.

Edited November 25, 2015 by rotuts (log)

[rotuts]

I enjoyed this article :

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/25/dining/table-manners-thanksgiving.html?ref=dining&_r=0

 

although Im right handed, I use my knife at the table w my left.  guess I would not have done well in times of Yore.

[blue_dolphin]

Nice article.  Thanks for the link.  

[JoNorvelleWalker]

I know how to set a table but these years I place the fork on the right so not to get in the way of the book on my left.  For what it's worth I recall in school being instructed to cut through the tines of the fork.

[Kim Shook]

Great article.  Bless this lady.  Timely and more important than some folks think.

[firion]

NYT often has some good food-related articles. Just today saw this one. Seems pretty interesting to try out. Especially the Maple Pecan Pie.

Edited November 26, 2015 by firion (log)

[firion]

 

 

large bottles of Coke, chips and candy bars were the standard snack.

So the blame is not just Coke's alone.

[rotuts]

added sugar and salt.

 

plenty of blame to go around.  don't forget your are picking up the bill !