The Bread Topic (2015-2016)

[keychris]

7 hours ago, paulraphael said:

I'm activating my very first sourdough starter and am wondering if anyone has recommendations on the best sources for sourdough bread knowledge?

 

I have Ed Wood's book ... it's alright, but goes out of its way to take a folksy tone and to avoid technical talk. I'm not sure if it's up to date on modern breadbaking techniques.

Also have Reinhart's Breadbaker's apprentice. What's the word on his approach to sourdough?

 

Any other great sources, online or off?

 

Reinhart's is what I use - the most recent one I made I followed the procedure in his Whole Grain Breads book and it was very successful (see my posts earlier in this thread). I like how he presents the information in his books and the recipes mostly seem to work well.

 

There's always http://www.thefreshloaf.com/ for an online place dedicated to bread which has a huge amount of information.

 

[ElsieD]

1 hour ago, Captain said:

Had to make some crusty bread to go with my soup.

Very happy with the results.

 

Very nice.  I'd be happy too if my bread looked like that.

[Tere]

OK, people, I screwed up.

 

I was intending to make my friend who is coming to stay tomorrow some Estonian rye bread (that is about 40 wheat to 60 rye at least according to most recipes) but I realised this afternoon I was supposed to make a starter for 3 days then make the dough for three and then bake the thing. I think it's supposed to be pretty sour tasting.

 

There is a less labour intensive version but it still relies on the 3 day starter and then takes a day and a half.

 

He's coming tomorrow afternoon and is leaving Friday afternoon. I have put a starter on today using commercial yeast, rye flour and hot water as directed but it's definitely not going to have 3 days!

 

Can anyone recommend any quick rye / wheat recipes I can bake in that time? Happy to use commercial yeast, in any case I think I have no choice. I can always use the proto starter as a slightly sour flavour component, but I just don't have the time it needs to fully mature. Is there anything else I can use to sourify the taste? I have sour cream, vinegar, citrus juices. I also have kummel / caraway which is a very Estonian bread spice.

 

At a loss here, help?

 

(FWIW, last year's attempt, when I mixed the rye 5 days before according to instructions, was to my mind a complete failure since it was stupidly heavy (and also 100% rye flour which it shouldn't have been) but he still liked it and took all the leftovers for fruit soup and all sorts of rye bread recipes. So he's flexible).

[pbear]

Hey Tere.  Bear in mind commercial yeast only can tolerate light acidity, so it seems to me the present plan is about as good as you can do under the circumstances.  IOW, treat the proto starter as a preferment.

[DianaB]

1 hour ago, pbear said:

Hey Tere.  Bear in mind commercial yeast only can tolerate light acidity, so it seems to me the present plan is about as good as you can do under the circumstances.  IOW, treat the proto starter as a preferment.

 

I have Eric Kayser's version of a German rye loaf if you opt for dried yeast rather than a liquid starter. PM if you want the recipe.  Am out first thing but will be around from mid-morning.  

 

Glancing through the method you would need 1 hour first rise, then 16-20 hours second rise then 6 hours to cook.  I've not tried this recipe but everything else from the same book has given fantastic results.  This is supposed to be baked in a covered ´Pullman' type tin 17cm X 7.5cm X 7.5 cm but am sure you could improvise with an ordinary loaf tin.

[Tere]

That recipe would be great if you have the time to type it out! I'll PM you. Thanks

[liuzhou]

I have had a miserable couple of days. I won't bore you with the details, Fortunately I mixed up a dough for olive bread on Tuesday, gave it an initial two hour rise then whacked it into the fridge.

This morning (Friday) I took it out, let it come back to room temperature (about 35ºC here at the moment) then punched it down and left it on my bed under a blanket while I went shopping.

Two hours later I returned, cranked up the oven and baked the thing. I haven't tasted it yet, but it's looking good, I think. Baking therapy!

 

The black dots are chia seeds which I just happened to find on Tuesday and added to the dough.

 

I'm happy so far. Wlil let you know how it tastes when it cools down.

Edited June 24, 2016 by liuzhou (log)

[shain]

6 hours ago, liuzhou said:

 

The black dots are chia seeds which I just happened to find on Tuesday and added to the dough.

 

 

In my limited exprience baking with chia seeds, I have noticed they tend to retain moisture and alter the bread texture somewhat (in a mostly positive fashion). I'd like to hear if you notice something unusual as well.

[liuzhou]

5 minutes ago, shain said:

 

In my limited exprience baking with chia seeds, I have noticed they tend to retain moisture and alter the bread texture somewhat (in a mostly positive fashion). I'd like to hear if you notice something unusual as well.

 

Can't say I noticed any difference in that sense. The only thing I noticed was visual. I only added 25g of seeds to 500g of flour. Maybe that makes a difference.

But I was happy with the taste of the bread. Only tried one slice with butter as a test but was well satisfied.

Edited June 24, 2016 by liuzhou
typo (log)

[Franci]

For my daughter school party the other day I was supposed to bring sandwiches...so I decided to make panettone gastronomico. This is a typical buffet item in Italy, it's an enriched bread baked in a panettone mold. Then it gets sliced horizontally and filled then built back.

It was really good, all parents (more than kids) liked it a lot.

 

I didn't have a panettone mold so I made one myself. I used a not so sweet brioche recipe. It's better to make the bread one day in advance, so it's not so crumbly when slicing and if filled with some hours in advance tastes nicer. I wasn't particularly creative with the filling because was meant to be for kids, so I did: one layer of mayo and ham, another one with tapenade and ricotta, another with brie and speck, then butter and genoa salame. I realized later that I didn't take a photo of the dressed panettone...I made some skewers with tomatoes to stick on round top.

These were 2 panettoni of 850 g each, weight before cooking.

After cooking,  I let it cool head down.

 

 

 

 

 

Then when you build it back the second layer need to be staggered and so on.

 

Edited June 26, 2016 by Franci (log)

[Shelby]

Your daughter and her classmates are lucky kids, Franci!

Edited June 26, 2016 by Shelby (log)

[curls]

@tikidoc's cream scone recipe with bits of Jarlsberg cheese. Don't know why I waited so long before trying this recipe (link to recipe in the breakfast thread). Delicious and super easy to put together!

Edited June 26, 2016 by curls
re-attaching "lost" jpg file (log)

[cakewalk]

Focaccia. This is from a Nick Malgieri recipe. It was nice, but a bit too greasy for my taste. A little less olive oil next time. 

[Smithy]

My latest sourdough bread.  I'm very pleased with the taste, and I'm getting the hang of shaping - not as quickly as I'd like, but I'm pretty happy with today's batch.  

 

 

I'm trying to figure out how to get the crust right.  My last loaves had a softish crust - not terrible, but not as crackly as I'd like.  This time I ran the heat higher (around 450F before steam added) and then lowered the temperature to 400F to finish.  The crumb is good, but look at the whitish ring around the edge, just inside the golden crust:

 

(The gold flecks in the interior holes are surface crumbs that were picked up from the bread board.) This crust is hard.  It looks from the cross-sectional ring as though there's a tough, dry ring around the perimeter.  Does this mean I cooked it for too long at high heat before turning the oven down? If not, what?  What should I try next?

Edited June 28, 2016 by Smithy
Changed 'tough' to 'hard' in crust description (log)

[shain]

16 hours ago, Smithy said:

 

(The gold flecks in the interior holes are surface crumbs that were picked up from the bread board.) This crust is hard.  It looks from the cross-sectional ring as though there's a tough, dry ring around the perimeter.  Does this mean I cooked it for too long at high heat before turning the oven down? If not, what?  What should I try next?

 

 

I've noticed that you changed your description from tough to hard, if so, that means much over baking.

Try to do the following:

Spray your loaves with water before putting them in the oven and introducing the steam. Bake all the way at 440dF, but remove the loaves while somewhat lighter then your target shade. Make sure that the interior is fully baked before you do - use a thermometer if you have one. 

Let the loaves chill somewhat, at least until just warm to the touch,but they can even be frozen at that stage. 

Now place them in 400-410 dF until fully browned and hopefully crisp to your liking. 

I should mention that I haven't tried it on sourdough. 

I really hope it will work for you. 

 

 

Edited June 28, 2016 by shain
Wrong temp (log)

[Smithy]

Thanks for that suggestion, @shain.  I understood that good oven spring required an initial high heat.  Is 230F hot enough to get the necessary expansion of gases?

[shain]

On 6/28/2016 at 5:53 PM, Smithy said:

Thanks for that suggestion, @shain.  I understood that good oven spring required an initial high heat.  Is 230F hot enough to get the necessary expansion of gases?

 

Oops, I'm a celsius head, that should be 440F.

Edited June 30, 2016 by shain (log)

[Smithy]

1 hour ago, shain said:

 

Opps, I'm a celsius head, that should be 440F.

 

Ah, thanks!

[Franci]

I have been refreshing my durum old dough, cannot call it mother really. I made a biga yesterday, added my old dough plus some yeast and salt, a little more flour and water,  80% hydration. I didn't have time to bake yesterday so left in the fridge to proof until today. Took out of the fridge, I gave the dough some folds, preformed, formed and final proof in the banneton. I decided to use only 750 g for a 1kg banneton and use 250 g of the dough to make a large pita with some crumb. I was thinking of making "pane cunzato" with it.

I finally figured out how to use the steam in my Cadco oven ( it's a manual device)...wow, what a difference in oven spring! I should have baked at higher temperature to get a thicker crust (I also let the steam escape by opening the door oven a bit at the end of cooking). 

 

 

 

Edited July 3, 2016 by Franci (log)

[cakewalk]

Very nice, Franci. I'm still looking for that remilled fine durum. They didn't have it in the Italian store in Chelsea market, which surprised me. I won't pay the price Amazon is asking! In the meantime I'm making a loaf with regular fine durum (rather than the coarse semolina I usually use), bread flour and rye flour. It will proof overnight in the fridge then I'll finish it tomorrow. (Such backbreaking work!)  

[Franci]

Really,  they didn't have at Chelsea market?  I remember them carrying Spadoni brand not sure if rimacinata! Cakewalk, if we ever manage to meet, I'll bring you a couple packages

[Okanagancook]

J Pepin's one pot bread.  Not bad for the amount of work it is.

[Anna N]

@Okanagancook

 

thanks for posting about the one pot bread.  I have watched him make it and despite the faith I have in Jacques  I never could quite bring myself to try it. 

Edited July 4, 2016 by Anna N (log)

[Okanagancook]

If it turns out for me, it'll turn out well for anybody seeing I am "baking impaired" as my DH says!

[ElsieD]

1 hour ago, Okanagancook said:

 

Well, here we go again in that I am having trouble with quotes.  Apologies to Okanagancook.

 

On the other hand, thanks for posting about this.  I had not heard of this and immediately went into the kitchen and made up a batch.  We'll see tomorrow how it turns out.