Taming Bitter Garlic

[Paul Bacino]

I see my fair share of recipes that call for fresh garlic. I guess Im not a big fan. How to tame the acridness /bitterness in garlic

I had one recipe said I could boil the garlic 5 times changing the water after each boil?

I have seen, poaching in milk, then De-hydrating and then micro-planing it in?

Ideas?

TIA

Paully

[rotuts]

its commonly said that the 'germ' or sprout ( green inner growth ) is the bitter part and should be removed.

too much work for me, and ive never tasted the 'plain' white bits and compared them to the green shoot.

maybe someone else has ?

Im fairly sure that older garlic that's been sitting around would add to the bitter ness.

but have not tested this out myself.

[BeeZee]

David Leibovitz tested cloves with and without the green sprout and found that he only tasted a difference when the garlic was used raw.

Roasting whole garlic makes it sweeter, perhaps if you'd like to use garlic you could pre-roast it?

[SylviaLovegren]

I see my fair share of recipes that call for fresh garlic. I guess Im not a big fan. How to tame the acridness /bitterness in garlic

I had one recipe said I could boil the garlic 5 times changing the water after each boil?

I have seen, poaching in milk, then De-hydrating and then micro-planing it in?

Ideas?

TIA

Paully

Seems like if you don't like the taste of fresh garlic, don't use it. You could substitute shallots for a milder flavor. What kind of things are you hesitating to use fresh garlic in?

[Paul Bacino]

I see my fair share of recipes that call for fresh garlic. I guess Im not a big fan. How to tame the acridness /bitterness in garlic

I had one recipe said I could boil the garlic 5 times changing the water after each boil?

I have seen, poaching in milk, then De-hydrating and then micro-planing it in?

Ideas?

TIA

Paully

Seems like if you don't like the taste of fresh garlic, don't use it. You could substitute shallots for a milder flavor. What kind of things are you hesitating to use fresh garlic in?

Don't use it I agree..

But.. its not called the " Stinking Rose " for a reason !!

I made Pommes Aligot from the "Tasting Table" called for sliced fresh garlic-- man after using it ( now I mircoplaned it ) the recipe called for sliced

http://www.tastingtable.com/entry_detail/chefs_recipes/16393/Pommes_Aligot_Recipe.htm

That's all I could taste for the next half hr, seems like another way to tame the Rose!! Ie like onions you can soak in vinegar and water.. to cut the edge!!

[djyee100]

Not sure I understand your post. The recipe calls for minced garlic, not sliced. If you used a microplane, you're grating the garlic, and that method is supposed to maximize the acrid compounds in garlic. See post numbered "14" here:
http://cooking.stackexchange.com/questions/274/is-there-any-difference-between-chopped-and-crushed-garlic-in-cooking
This blogger and others go into detail about the science of it all--I do like this post:
http://www.skilletdoux.com/2006/07/deconstructing_.html

I was taught to chop or mince garlic with a sharp chef's knife to minimize the release of these bitter compounds.

Depending the recipe, try subbing garlic oil for the chopped fresh garlic. The flavor is garlicky without being overwhelming. (At least for me--I know people taste differently.) I don't recommend any store-bought garlic oil. I prep mine fresh before making a dish. Annie Somerville's Greens recipe for garlic oil here:
http://ediblemontereybay.com/recipes/spring/fava-bean-puree-with-garlic-toasts-and-shaved-pecorino/

I started with this recipe and over the years I've gotten way more casual about quantities and steeping times. It works.

[lesliec]

To add to what djyee100 said - when you're mincing garlic, mix in some coarse salt. Twofold benefit; it's easier to mince because of the grinding effect of the salt, and salt helps counteract bitterness.

[Paul Bacino]

This is why..I'm asking!!

[JoNorvelleWalker]

To add to what djyee100 said - when you're mincing garlic, mix in some coarse salt. Twofold benefit; it's easier to mince because of the grinding effect of the salt, and salt helps counteract bitterness.

But isn't the salt hard on the knife? If I'm mashing garlic, say for pesto, I will add coarse salt to the mortar.

I'm a bit confused because "bitterness" is not something I associate with garlic. And I eat a lot of garlic.

[dcarch]

try using elephant garlic.

dcarch

[jmacnaughtan]

Wait until spring and use the very fresh young garlic, the sort with the edible skin. As garlic gets older, it gets more bitter and pungent.

[Lisa Shock]

Not sure I understand your post. The recipe calls for minced garlic, not sliced. If you used a microplane, you're grating the garlic, and that method is supposed to maximize the acrid compounds in garlic. See post numbered "14" here:

http://cooking.stackexchange.com/questions/274/is-there-any-difference-between-chopped-and-crushed-garlic-in-cooking

This blogger and others go into detail about the science of it all--I do like this post:

http://www.skilletdoux.com/2006/07/deconstructing_.html

I was taught to chop or mince garlic with a sharp chef's knife to minimize the release of these bitter compounds.

Depending the recipe, try subbing garlic oil for the chopped fresh garlic. The flavor is garlicky without being overwhelming. (At least for me--I know people taste differently.) I don't recommend any store-bought garlic oil. I prep mine fresh before making a dish. Annie Somerville's Greens recipe for garlic oil here:

http://ediblemontereybay.com/recipes/spring/fava-bean-puree-with-garlic-toasts-and-shaved-pecorino/

I started with this recipe and over the years I've gotten way more casual about quantities and steeping times. It works.

I looked at that garlic oil recipe, it's also a fine recipe for culturing botulism. Removing the crushed garlic with a strainer doesn't remove the spores, and refrigeration temperatures are the zone they thrive the best in.

About 20 people a year in the US die each year from botulism, most of them from garlic oil. Serving house-made, non-acidulated, garlic oil is an offense that requires the health department to immediately close a restaurant in virtually every county in the US. Check out this eG thread on garlic, botulism and garlic oil recipes online.

[Anna N]

Not sure I understand your post. The recipe calls for minced garlic, not sliced. If you used a microplane, you're grating the garlic, and that method is supposed to maximize the acrid compounds in garlic. See post numbered "14" here:http://cooking.stackexchange.com/questions/274/is-there-any-difference-between-chopped-and-crushed-garlic-in-cooking

This blogger and others go into detail about the science of it all--I do like this post:http://www.skilletdoux.com/2006/07/deconstructing_.html

I was taught to chop or mince garlic with a sharp chef's knife to minimize the release of these bitter compounds.

Depending the recipe, try subbing garlic oil for the chopped fresh garlic. The flavor is garlicky without being overwhelming. (At least for me--I know people taste differently.) I don't recommend any store-bought garlic oil. I prep mine fresh before making a dish. Annie Somerville's Greens recipe for garlic oil here:http://ediblemontereybay.com/recipes/spring/fava-bean-puree-with-garlic-toasts-and-shaved-pecorino/

I started with this recipe and over the years I've gotten way more casual about quantities and steeping times. It works.

I looked at that garlic oil recipe, it's also a fine recipe for culturing botulism. Removing the crushed garlic with a strainer doesn't remove the spores, and refrigeration temperatures are the zone they thrive the best in.

About 20 people a year in the US die each year from botulism, most of them from garlic oil. Serving house-made, non-acidulated, garlic oil is an offense that requires the health department to immediately close a restaurant in virtually every county in the US. Check out this eG thread on garlic, botulism and garlic oil recipes online.

Lisa,

Please check your sources for the incidence, causes and prevention of botulism. The CDC suggests that garlic oil BE REFRIGERATED.

[Lisa Shock]

Annie Sommerville's linked recipe uses just raw garlic and oil, no salt, no acid. It recommends allowing 30 minutes 'steeping' at room temperature. It also recommends storing garlic oil in the refrigerator indefinitely.

Even older sanitation references that mention refrigeration give a three day maximum for holding the oil. I have never seen any reliable source recommending indefinite storage under refrigeration. Most guides also note that freezing will not kill the spores, just slow them. And, of course, any toxins produced are deadly at any temperature.

Of course, best recommendation is to eat garlic oil immediately. Even two hours at room temperature can result in significant amounts of toxin.

Botulism isn't one organism. It's a group of them and each type has a different ideal temperature for spore growth. Some types are slowed by refrigeration (if the refrigerator in question is reliably under 41°F -if the fridge gets to 50° most botulism will thrive) some types not so much. With a 30 minute room temperature steeping followed by months or possibly years of refrigeration, people are bound to culture a significant amount of spores and their toxin.

[Anna N]

Annie Sommerville's linked recipe uses just raw garlic and oil, no salt, no acid. It recommends allowing 30 minutes 'steeping' at room temperature. It also recommends storing garlic oil in the refrigerator indefinitely.

Even older sanitation references that mention refrigeration give a three day maximum for holding the oil. I have never seen any reliable source recommending indefinite storage under refrigeration. Most guides also note that freezing will not kill the spores, just slow them. And, of course, any toxins produced are deadly at any temperature.

Of course, best recommendation is to eat garlic oil immediately. Even two hours at room temperature can result in significant amounts of toxin.

Botulism isn't one organism. It's a group of them and each type has a different ideal temperature for spore growth. Some types are slowed by refrigeration (if the refrigerator in question is reliably under 41°F -if the fridge gets to 50° most botulism will thrive) some types not so much. With a 30 minute room temperature steeping followed by months or possibly years of refrigeration, people are bound to culture a significant amount of spores and their toxin.

I was hoping you might provide a citation for the 20 people per year who die of botulism mostly from garlic oil and one that the refrigerator is an improper place to store garlic oil.

[Lisa Shock]

Page 23 of the 2013 food code does a pretty good job of explaining untreated garlic-in-oil concoctions; the pH and Aw scores place it squarely on the chart as a non-TCS food.

Storing garlic oil at all is a bad idea; refrigeration slows the botulism spores but does nothing to kill them. Even sites recommending refrigerated storage specifically mention 3 days as the maximum time it can be kept.

About 145 people die each year from botulism, about 15% of them from foodborne toxins. When there's an outbreak, meaning multiple people being poisoned, it's usually from poorly home-canned goods. But, the high number of garlic oil related deaths was the impetus for the FDA to add mention of it specificallly to the 1998 food code.

[djyee100]

I looked at that garlic oil recipe, it's also a fine recipe for culturing botulism...

The Garlic Oil recipe is a subrecipe of another recipe. It says nothing of long-term storage, and I doubt if any long-term storage is intended. If anything, people are told to refrigerate the oil prior to its use in the main recipe, for maximum safety.

I posted the recipe to give the OP some guidelines of proportions (garlic to oil) and method. As I mentioned in my earlier post, I prefer to make garlic oil fresh every time I use it. It's so simple to do. Certainly that's safer, but mostly it tastes better.

Thanks for expressing your concerns.

[heidih]

try using elephant garlic.

dcarch

I will second that suggestion. I am a garlic piglet, but have friends who are not and they have been very happy with using elephant garlic. I understand that it is not true garlic, but in the leek family; however, it carries the garlic note first.

Edited February 17, 2014 by heidih (log)

[Anna N]

Page 23 of the 2013 food code does a pretty good job of explaining untreated garlic-in-oil concoctions; the pH and Aw scores place it squarely on the chart as a non-TCS food.

Storing garlic oil at all is a bad idea; refrigeration slows the botulism spores but does nothing to kill them. Even sites recommending refrigerated storage specifically mention 3 days as the maximum time it can be kept.

About 145 people die each year from botulism, about 15% of them from foodborne toxins. When there's an outbreak, meaning multiple people being poisoned, it's usually from poorly home-canned goods. But, the high number of garlic oil related deaths was the impetus for the FDA to add mention of it specificallly to the 1998 food code.

I am not and never have advocated storing garlic in oil (refrigerated or otherwise) I just like to avoid statistical and factual inaccuracies that soon lead to fear mongering. Over and out. Best, Anna

[Kerry Beal]

Page 23 of the 2013 food code does a pretty good job of explaining untreated garlic-in-oil concoctions; the pH and Aw scores place it squarely on the chart as a non-TCS food.

Storing garlic oil at all is a bad idea; refrigeration slows the botulism spores but does nothing to kill them. Even sites recommending refrigerated storage specifically mention 3 days as the maximum time it can be kept.

About 145 people die each year from botulism, about 15% of them from foodborne toxins. When there's an outbreak, meaning multiple people being poisoned, it's usually from poorly home-canned goods. But, the high number of garlic oil related deaths was the impetus for the FDA to add mention of it specificallly to the 1998 food code.

But aren't non-TCS foods those that don't require time/temperature control for safety - ie - not potentially hazardous?

[Lisa Shock]

Page 23 of the 2013 food code does a pretty good job of explaining untreated garlic-in-oil concoctions; the pH and Aw scores place it squarely on the chart as a non-TCS food.

Storing garlic oil at all is a bad idea; refrigeration slows the botulism spores but does nothing to kill them. Even sites recommending refrigerated storage specifically mention 3 days as the maximum time it can be kept.

About 145 people die each year from botulism, about 15% of them from foodborne toxins. When there's an outbreak, meaning multiple people being poisoned, it's usually from poorly home-canned goods. But, the high number of garlic oil related deaths was the impetus for the FDA to add mention of it specificallly to the 1998 food code.

But aren't non-TCS foods those that don't require time/temperature control for safety - ie - not potentially hazardous?

It's my understanding that non-TCS foods, the page 23 description of which includes raw meats, are not recommended for packaging and some types of storage.

In terms of numbers, some years it's 37 people dead, others 22 dead and in others 11 or 5, so yes, it varies and the numbers are far less than they were before electric refrigeration was commonplace.

" I started with this recipe and over the years I've gotten way more casual about quantities and steeping times. It works."

The steeping time referred to here is at room temperature. With garlic oil, once you exceed two hours you enter the danger zone.

[Kerry Beal]

I agree that garlic in oil is an unsafe food - but when I look at those tables - I read non-TCS foods as safe. TCS foods (formerly known as Potential Hazardous Foods) are those that need time/temperature treatment for safety - that would mean non-TCS don't. When I look on the tables at non-TCS foods they are those with some combination of lower pH, lower aW.

Perhaps I'm just interpreting things wrong - but the foods they define as PA (meaning they need to prove they are safe due to other intrinsic factors not related to aW or pH) seem to be the one's that I would consider TCS or potentially hazardous. Strange that no where in their tables do they call anything TCS - just non-TCS or PA!

[djyee100]

" I started with this recipe and over the years I've gotten way more casual about quantities and steeping times. It works."

The steeping time referred to here is at room temperature. With garlic oil, once you exceed two hours you enter the danger zone.

Lisa, The recipe cites a 30-minute maximum time to steep, which you have said is safe. Why do you assume I would take longer? My adjustment is always to lessen the time.

Also, cooking neutralizes botulism toxin, which is the real danger. We have been talking about the substitution of fresh garlic in cooked dishes, yes?

From the CDC: "Despite its extreme potency, botulinum toxin is easily destroyed. Heating to an internal temperature of 85°C for at least 5 minutes will decontaminate affected food or drink."

http://www.bt.cdc.gov/agent/botulism/clinicians/control.asp

About 145 people die each year from botulism, about 15% of them from foodborne toxins. When there's an outbreak, meaning multiple people being poisoned, it's usually from poorly home-canned goods. But, the high number of garlic oil related deaths was the impetus for the FDA to add mention of it specificallly to the 1998 food code.

In terms of numbers, some years it's 37 people dead, others 22 dead and in others 11 or 5, so yes, it varies and the numbers are far less than they were before electric refrigeration was commonplace.

Pls give us the sources for your numbers. The CDC National Botulism Surveillance has reports from 2001-2011 online. For this 10-year period, the CDC reports a low of 8 foodborne botulism cases (2003) to a high of 33 foodborne botulism cases (2001). For five years of this 10-year period, no deaths from foodborne botulism were reported. For the other five years, the number of foodborne botulism deaths ranged from 1 to 3. Where the cause of the deaths was given (this was done for most of the years), none of the deaths resulted from garlic oil botulism.

CDC National Botulism Surveillance:

http://www.cdc.gov/nationalsurveillance/botulism_surveillance.html

[kayb]

To repeat/paraphrase a post on the other garlic topic currently on the board: I don't care for the taste of fresh garlic. It has a sharp, metallic tang that I don't find pleasant. I buy the big bags of peeled garlic cloves (because I am lazy), and confit them, and use that in any application that calls for fresh garlic.Works for me. Your mileage may vary.