Beef Short Ribs -- The Topic

[Duvel]

I agree. Plenty of fat, plenty of connective tissue - same success factors as for a good braise. Temperature renders connective tissue into gelatin, and tightens muscle fibers. The equilibrium between both determines your final product. Tenderness can be achieved at any temperature depending on time - and the question of covering the braise ultimately affects the liquid part more than the solids …

 

 

[Tropicalsenior]

36 minutes ago, Duvel said:

Yeah … 

 

How do you explain the surprisingly successful pressure cooker stews ?!

I do it all the time.

 

32 minutes ago, rotuts said:

personally think for a P.C. stew to be edible , the meat itself has to be reasonably fatty , if not more so .

There's no such thing as marbled fatty beef in Costa Rica. In order to make it edible I have to use the pressure cooker or braze it for more hours than I care to do. The trick to making it tasty and tender is to Brown it thoroughly and not overcook it. Even if it is nicely marbled, meat that is overcooked in the pressure cooker is going to be stringy and tough.

[Rickbern]

@Duvel I think there’s a lot of approaches to braising. If cooking at a hard boil works for you , more power to you. In my experience, I like to keep the temperature lower, I find the parchment paper helps me out. May not work for you.

 

As far as the pressure cooker goes, there’s danger in quick releasing the pressure, every pc braise recipe I’ve ever looked at encourages natural release, perhaps it’s the same problem kenji was pointing out. I’m not that knowledgeable on the subject. 
 

I’ve made brisket in a pressure cooker, it turned out pretty good, I don’t tend to do it so much anymore because I like the lower temperature approach and I’ve gotten away from using brisket all that often. Nowadays my pressure cooker is only used for making stock, just personal preference. 

[rotuts]

@Rickbern

 

the danger w quick release of P.C.s is 

 

1 ) getting burned w steam

 

2 ) creating a rapid boil of the contents of the pot , a sort of foaming action .

 

the temperatures in a PC ( high or low pressures )  are well above the temperature issues mentioned in the Kenji article.

 

quick release does not increase the temperature of the pot.

Edited 1 hour ago by rotuts (log)

[Tropicalsenior]

5 minutes ago, rotuts said:

creating a rapid boil of the contents of the pot , a sort of foaming action

I don't know the science behind it but I've always heard that using quick release with meat can toughen it. I can't prove it because I never use Quick Release with meat.

[rotuts]

@Tropicalsenior

 

I think that is incorrect .

 

fast release,  releases a lot of steam , which concentrates the liquid portion of the PC contents by  evaporation .

 

I use this feature all the time when making stock .  if i start w 3 cups of water , use quick release , there is less water left in the pot.

 

in terms of toughening meat  , I cant think of a mechanism for toughening the meat .  there still might be one, but

 

I doubt it.   quick release might dry the meat , if the meat is not totally submerged in the liquid :  the exposed meat will

 

' boil ' making that portion dry 

 

here is a ref.  

 

https://www.hippressurecooking.com/meat-openings-pcs/

 

you have to read it carefully .  

 

dryness is not the same as toughness .

Edited 1 hour ago by rotuts (log)

[Tropicalsenior]

4 minutes ago, rotuts said:

quick release might dry the meat , if the meat is not totally submerged in the liquid : 

As I said I know nothing about the science behind it so you could be right. I have mainly heard it in reference to making pot roast and other types of meat that would not be covered by a liquid. I've never tried making them in an IP. I've only used it for stews and soups.

[rotuts]

another way of looking at rapid release of meat might be this :

 

say you pressure cook meat , and the meat is partially submerged in liquid , or not at all : pressure steamed.

 

the PC temp is well above 221 F , sea level boiling.

 

rapid release creates a rapid boil in the pot , and on the surface of the meat .  that surface , above the liquid will be dry.

 

the problem is the dry meat will seem tougher than wet meat , but I see no way that can be true 

 

dry and wet have different mouth feel .

 

on the other hand , dry meat has mouth feel similar to toughness , but was tender when moist.

 

extreme example :  jerky 

 

so rapid release will dry meat that's above the ' water line '

 

but the meat under the water line will stay moist and feel in the mouth  tender .

 

one last thought :  the dry parts of meat , above the waterline @ quick release , may ' chew ' tought

 

as is , but left in the liquid will re hydrate w time .  

 

a tough piece of meat will remain tough in any liquid .

Edited 28 minutes ago by rotuts (log)

[AlaMoi]

quick pressure release . . . 

 

at lower pressure, water boils at a lower temperature.

this is the whole point of a pressure cooker - increase the pressure, boiling point also increases, makes things 'cook faster' at a higher temperature.

 

it's not impossible that quickly releasing the pressure could result in (some) moisture inside the meat 'boiling off' rapidly, leaving the meat dry / drier / tougher.