Easter 2021 April 4

[chromedome]

I was not previously aware of that tradition. Another rabbit hole yawns before me...

 

 

(ETA: I guess real rabbit holes are probably too small to "yawn" impressively, but Easter is after all a time of rather unnatural rabbits)

Edited April 1, 2021 by chromedome (log)

[Allura]

So question on the deviled eggs. I love them. But I grew up thinking the dyed eggs were unsafe to eat because they'd been sitting out for a couple of days on the table. Is that true, or can I actually use them instead of wasting them this year?

 

[heidih]

35 minutes ago, chromedome said:

I was not previously aware of that tradition. Another rabbit hole yawns before me...

(ETA: I guess real rabbit holes are probably too small to "yawn" impressively, but Easter is after all a time of rather unnatural rabbits)

Mike Peters - Mother Goose & Grimm today. Rabbit holes are good sized. Bunnies have junk in the trunk

 

[Kim Shook]

44 minutes ago, Allura said:

So question on the deviled eggs. I love them. But I grew up thinking the dyed eggs were unsafe to eat because they'd been sitting out for a couple of days on the table. Is that true, or can I actually use them instead of wasting them this year?

 

I would not eat hard boiled eggs that have sat out that long.  Ours are only out long enough for Jessica to see her basket and then they go right back in the fridge (yes, my 37 year old daughter still gets an Easter basket - mostly filled with good cheese rather than candy, though 🙄😄).  Over the years, we've dyed blown eggs and decorate with those.  

[kayb]

Green Thursday...hadn't thought about it, but being that Misfits delivered me a big ol' box just now, and it had lots of lettuce (and pea shoots; I have learned I love pea shoots!), would a big ol' salad count?

 

 

[heidih]

Sure. - no rules

[Toliver]

1 hour ago, Allura said:

So question on the deviled eggs. I love them. But I grew up thinking the dyed eggs were unsafe to eat because they'd been sitting out for a couple of days on the table. Is that true, or can I actually use them instead of wasting them this year?

 

Boiled eggs shouldn't be out of the refrigerator longer than 2 hours. It's a food safety issue.

If they have been out for days, I wouldn't recommend eating them.

[Duvel]

2 hours ago, Toliver said:

Boiled eggs shouldn't be out of the refrigerator longer than 2 hours. It's a food safety issue.

You’ve got to be kidding, no ?

Edited April 1, 2021 by Duvel (log)

[Duvel]

4 hours ago, Allura said:

So question on the deviled eggs. I love them. But I grew up thinking the dyed eggs were unsafe to eat because they'd been sitting out for a couple of days on the table. Is that true, or can I actually use them instead of wasting them this year?

 

A hard boiled egg, with no damages to the shell and that has cooled down naturally (not shocked in cold water) positively keeps for days, if not 2-3 weeks outside the fridge. As long as the dyeing process does not impart the structural integrity of the shell, it doesn’t shorten the shelf life.

[Kim Shook]

I wouldn't take the chance:

 

http://USDA GUIDELINES

[Duvel]

It seems that the general outlook on the bacterial load of eggs is vastly different between the US and Germany. I cannot judge whether this reflects the reality or not.

From my personal viewpoint, the USDA rules of 2h out side the fridge is not comprehensible. Even the most conservative article I could find (and which I still would not fully subscribe to) assigns a minimum shelf life of 2.5 days at room temperature in summer for hard boiled eggs. If that were the case for the eggs sold in Germany, I’d assume larger areas of Germany would be unpopulated.

Maybe the risk perception is a different one here, but I will consume our dyed eggs happily next week ...

 

 

[heidih]

I think the issue on raw eggs in US is that they are scrubbed - lose their natural barrier  but boiled should be equivalent to others

[Anna N]

10 minutes ago, Duvel said:

Maybe the risk perception

Or perhaps there’s less litigation! 

[AlaMoi]

USDA assumes every egg is contaminated with salmonella.

 

instead of vaccinating laying hens, the USDA choose to require refrigeration from egg lay to exiting the supermarket.

stupid.   yes, it's just plain stupid.  when one looks at countries that vaccinate laying hens (+/- $0.25) vs the cost of nest to pan refrigeration.... especially stupid.

 

the documented incidence of salmonella in Europe - with vaccination and no refrigeration - vs the US:  positive proof of Dummheitness.

[Duvel]

2 minutes ago, Anna N said:

Or perhaps there’s less litigation! 

I understand that aspect, and for professional operations it certainly makes sense to follow (and document adherence to) very strict hygienic standards. But we are talking here home cooking. I hope that sueing family members over food issues is not common, even in a litigation-probe society ...

[Duvel]

3 minutes ago, AlaMoi said:

USDA assumes every egg is contaminated with salmonella.

 

instead of vaccinating laying hens, the USDA choose to require refrigeration from egg lay to exiting the supermarket.

stupid.   yes, it's just plain stupid.  when one looks at countries that vaccinate laying hens (+/- $0.25) vs the cost of nest to pan refrigeration.... especially stupid.

 

the documented incidence of salmonella in Europe - with vaccination and no refrigeration - vs the US:  positive proof of Dummheitness.

Thanks, that is very helpful. Is there any data on how prevalent the salmonella infestation is amongst the chicken populations ?

 

Eggs here are sold outside the fridge, and contain each an individual printed-on shelf life date for storage at RT, typically ~3 weeks in the future. 
 

 

[Duvel]

12 minutes ago, AlaMoi said:

USDA assumes every egg is contaminated with salmonella.

Come to think of it - if you hard boil an egg (~10 min rolling boil), there is no residual salmonella anymore present 🤔

 

So that alone would not diminish the shelf life of the product to 2h at RT ...

[Anna N]

40 minutes ago, Duvel said:

I understand that aspect, and for professional operations it certainly makes sense to follow (and document adherence to) very strict hygienic standards. But we are talking here home cooking. I hope that sueing family members over food issues is not common, even in a litigation-probe society ...

I don’t think it’s about home operations. The thing is that the USDA sets the rules for commercial operations and as far as I know there are no separate rules for home kitchens. The USDA seems to be particularly conservative with regard to food safety. That makes sense in a litigious society. (I don’t think the CFIA (The Canadian equivalent of the USDA) is much different.) What our government has to say about eggs might persuade you to give them up for life! Eggs.

[weinoo]

 Are we using the $6 or $7 a dozen fancy farmer's market eggs for dyeing, or eggs that cost $1.29 a dozen.

 

If the latter, I'd be willing to toss once they've served their purpose (as I toss the leftover matzo and other garbage from passover). If the former, why are you using them anyway?

[AlaMoi]

boiling is one "treatment" however it can happen that a cracked/otherwise damaged egg is contaminate _inside_.

 

and, just for jollies, during the last round(s) of research it was discovered and proven that an infected hen can produce a egg that is contaminated before it was expelled.  not only that, but not every egg a contaminated hen produces is infected....

 

so much simpler to vaccinate the bird . . . eliminate the problem instead of spending billions to avoid an issue....

 

was it Holland that had one single case in YYYY? - and that individual had been on holiday in a very suspect country.

 

the 'raw data' rate is estimated at 2.3 million infected eggs in 46.8 billion eggs produced.

since not all eggs are consumed as shell eggs off the shelf,

and those sold / used as shell eggs are not all undercooked,

. . . the estimate of human infection risk is 1:30,000.

and of that 1:30,000 incidents requiring medical intervention are

hospitalizations @ 5%

deaths @ 0.05%

[Toliver]

Got a small Smithfield ham from Walmart for my Easter dinner (and leftovers for the days afterwards).

Served with rice and oven-roasted asparagus (a la Roasted Cauliflower) which was just a delivery system for the melted parmesan cheese I showered over the roasted spears. 

[kayb]

I am happy to report I sent half the leftovers home with Child C, and took the rest to a friend who'd just gotten out of the hospital. I kept the hambone, enough ham for three or four days' worth of sandwiches or otherwise, and some big chunks of ham that'll be ground up and packaged and frozen.