Miracle Whip: The Topic

[Kim Shook]

Back to Sandy's original question, although I was born in Washington, DC I consider myself double-Southern since my mother was born in South Carolina and my father was from Virginia.  Also when I grew up in DC it was often called a sleepy Southern town since there were so many people from the South who transplanted there.

Seriously, as I've already said I LIKE BOTH MAYO AND MW; it just depends on what I happen to be making or adorning.  I wonder, does that make me bi-condimental?

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DIVA!! I, too, am a born in Washington, double Southerner (Daddy VA, Momma TN) . I never ate anything at home but MW growing up.

[Toliver]

It's funny that those of you who are attempting to recreate MW at home  keep mentioning mustard and vinegar. That's exactly what my mom uses with MW when making her deviled eggs or potato salad (usually both at the same meal). She uses the same MW base for both.

In a bowl, she spoons a healthy healping of MW, some milk to thin it a little, a whisper of cider vinegar and just a wee bit of regular yellow mustard. Blend it all together.  She's like a lab chemist as she tastes the mixture, then adds a skosh more vinegar or the smallest dab of yellow mustard to balance out all the flavors equally.

And when you add this base to potato salad, make sure you also add in the secret ingredient...celery seed (where is fifi? That's her secret ingredient, too  ).

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The mustard I use is Coleman's DRY mustard - a totally different thing - you know when you feel the "bite."

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That sounds really good, but it's not something my mom would ever try. She's not one to change ingredients. I'm sure you know the type.

The one thing she did use dry mustard for was a recipe out of her Better Homes & Gardens cookbook for a hot mustard "dip" for ham. I use the quotes because it was very much a liquid sauce as opposed to a thick dip for chips. I seem to recall it being a combination of dry mustard, hot water, salt and vegetable oil. You would cut a bite of ham off the slice on your plate and dip the bite into the sauce before eating it. If it was made correctly, the mustard sauce would clear your sinuses for a month.

As for MW, once a summer my mom would grind up bologna (that's redundant isn't it? ), mix it with pickle relish and MW and either put it on slices of white bread for a sandwich or sometimes eat it with just saltine crackers. I saw that someone else on eGullet posted this same concoction once so it wasn't just my family's recipe.

[jsolomon]

Oh my, I have no idea how many metric tons of chicken salad, egg salad, ham salad, and roast beef salad sandwiches I've eaten with MW, meat du jour, pickle relish (homemade), and finely diced celery. Got me through a lot of fence fixing, pipe laying, and stick picking, though.

MW is a farm family's friend, it seems.

[Badiane]

I was reading a women's magazine today at the doctor's office...there is a big MW ad, full page, with a spelling mistake in it. They have 'ailse' instead of 'aisle'. Kind of entertaining.

MW is a cooked salad dressing rather than a doctored mayonnaise, for those of you experimenting with recipes...give it a google and you will find a bunch of variations including a few called "mock Miracle Whip"

[ludja]

Coincidentally, I came across something interesting that reminded me of this thread. I was skimming through "The Gift of Southern Cooking" by Edna Lewis and Scott Peacock and was reading the recipe for boiled dressing.

A quote from the intro to the recipe:

Unfortunately, you hardly see it anymore; in the age of refrigeration, boiled dressing has largely been replaced by mayonnaise.  But it is worth turning back the clock to enjoy its creamy sweet and tart flavor in potato salad or coleslaw, in deviled eggs, on a cold pork sandwich, or even over hot boiled potatoes.

This reminded me of the uses many have mentioned here for Miracle Whip. Also the recipe has a significantly larger amount of vinegar (cider) than a mayonnaise and is also cooked as Badiane noted. The "fat" here is provided by eggs, cream and butter rather than soybean oil.

I've made a boiled dressing for coleslaw before that includes celery seeds and it is actually a favorite recipe.

Here is a version of the boiled dressing in "The Gift of Southern Cooking" with my version of the directions in case you want to try this as a substitute for purchased Miracle Whip. (The ingredients are bit more real!) I suspect the texture will be thinner than Miracle Whip so it would not serve as a substitute in all applications.

1 cup cider vinegar

3 egg yolks

2 tsp granulated sugar

1 tsp dry mustard

2 tsp all-purpose flour

1/8 tsp ground cayenne pepper

1 tsp salt

1/2 tsp black pepper

1 Tbs unsalted butter

1/3 cup heavy cream

Place egg yolks in a small bowl and mix in all ingredients except for the vinegar, butter and cream. Bring vinegar to a good boil in a saucepan and slowly whisk it into the egg mixture. Pour dressing back into pan, stir constantly and cook over medium heat until it thickens. Remove from heat and stir in butter; then stir in cream and cool. Will keep for 2 weeks in fridge, covered.

I would be curious if anyone tries this and thinks it has a similar flavor profile to MW. (One could also add in paprika, dried garlic, etc.)

Edited June 8, 2006 by ludja (log)

[divalasvegas]

Hello All,

A few random, MW drenched thoughts:

1) Well my experiment is still in the fridge. I haven't decided whether to try to rescue it using my mini food processor. As for the observation made by Sandy/MarketStEl about the use of garlic salt, I did reduce the amount of regular salt called for in the original recipe and my addition of cayenne was just sheer desperation actually. Also, I tasted it again today; flavor is a little more pronounced but the oily/flat component is still present. There's no way at this point that I would waste the cheapest white bread or bologna on this stuff as it exists now. If I do decide to try this again, I will definitely try not to forget to pickup some garlic power as well as Coleman's dry mustard, as mentioned by andiesenji.

What I'm considering is giving this stuff a whirl in my mini processor with the addition of water, maybe adding the water a little at time. As ludja has pointed out, MW contains a great deal of water. The recipe I used OTOH contained none.

2) Badiane thanks for the tip about MW being a cooked salad dressing. You're absolutely right. I think that I really wanted to avoid all of those recipes that included cornstarch and required some cooking; might not be able to.

3) Along the same lines, thanks so much ludja for that recipe for boiled dressing. I hadn't thought about that dressing for years. Though I never made it, I'm sure I must have had it growing up. I think it has to be the precourser to MW where commercial producers sought to duplicate the flavors of this dressing in a mass produced/infinite shelf-life version. Probably why so many liked it then and throughout the years because it echoed a familiar flavor. However, you mention making it as a substitution it for MW. I see it as a completely different beast not as a substitute. I think it sounds delicious on its own and could be a great base for other uses as you say with the addition of other ingredients.

4) Funny where a discussion of such a benign product can lead you. When I read Toliver's description of mustard dip--a recipe I hope you'll share with us--it kind of sounded like a close cousin to Chinese mustard (at least what passes for it here in the US). Or like Kim Shook and I being double Southern, native Washingtonians and how it was the "condiment du jour" in both our households. Or that, thanks to jsolomon, I now know that I'm not alone in the universe in matching liverwurst/braunschweiger with MW, onions and rye. (To be precise: rye, mustard, then onions, then liverwurst/braunschweiger, then slice of rye with MW) Yum.

5) Sandy about your latest attempt at creating a homemade MW, are you still using the same recipe as a guideline and how did you arrive at the modifications, i.e., 2 egg yolks, the amount of oil, mustard, etc.? When you say that the consistency was right, meaning as in regular MW? Did you use a whisk, immersion blender or food processor? Inquiring minds must know!

All of you are so fantastic and, like me, strange.

Carry on.

[MarketStEl]

5) Sandy about your latest attempt at creating a homemade MW, are you still using the same recipe as a guideline and how did you arrive at the modifications, i.e., 2 egg yolks, the amount of oil, mustard, etc.?  When you say that the consistency was right, meaning as in regular MW?  Did you use a whisk, immersion blender or food processor?  Inquiring minds must know!

Yes, I was working off the same base recipe. As I had planned on making a larger quantity than 1/2 cup of dressing, I added the second egg yolk to try to keep it from getting too oily and separating. I did succeed at that, but as I remarked above, the color then becomes too yellow. The consistency was just a little thinner than regular Miracle Whip, but thick enough to be acceptable.

I used an immersion blender to do the work, except at the very end, when I was adding spices to adjust the flavor. Then I used a whisk.

All of you are so fantastic and, like me, strange.

See my .sig quote. (As I will inevitably change it, I will repeat it here for the benefit of anyone who stumbles across this thread after it's been changed: "You're crazy as a loon. But you do great work." --My former boss, Libby Rosof, first editor of the Penn Current)

Carry on.

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I never had boiled dressing--guess neither side of my family was that Southern. (I know that there are relatives on Dad's side who are from Louisiana, but nothing more than that they exist(ed); Dad's mom came up from Texas, and there's some Caribbean ancestry somewhere on Mom's side, but beyond that, all the family lineage I'm aware of is strictly Midwestern.) It sounds interesting, and I think I'll want to try making some.

[ludja]

Here is another article on boiled dressing along with a recipe: click

Salads have always been an important dish on the Southern table. A century before "green" salads became a regular element in the American diet, Mary Randolph, through "The Virginia Housewife," gave detailed instructions on making a fresh garden salad with a dressing which included tarragon vinegar and hard-boiled eggs.

The Southern states had essentially no vegetable oils until the late nineteenth century, which meant that vinaigrettes and mayonnaise were confined to the tables of the wealthy who could afford imported olive oil. Boiled salad dressings were the solution for the rest of the people, using cream or a combination of butter and milk for the fat. Similar to hollandaise sauce, it is not actually boiled, but gently cooked in the top of a double boiler.

I think I'll start another thread in the "Southern Culture" section on boiled dressing.

edited to add: Here's the new thread in the Southern Culture subforum: click

Edited June 8, 2006 by ludja (log)

[Kouign Aman]

I tried Miracle Whip again last night. I experienced the tanginess. The sweet-icky* component outweighs it IMO and I still dont like MW. When it comes to tanginess, I like the lemony taste of mayo better, even tho its less pronounced.

I tried MW on a BLT. It was ok. The half with mayonnaise was more to my taste. The Tenor also did the experiment. He still prefers MW on his BLTs.

I can certainly taste how one would not substitute for the other in a salad. We will continue to store large jars of both.

* I dont like sweet pickle relish either - same flavor.

[VenerableBede]

I grew up in California, but my mom is from Alabama so there would always be some Miracle Whip around the house when i was growing up. However, and i can't pinpoint the time, it got replaced by mayo (best foods), and i have stayed with mayo ever since.

However, when I now go to my in-laws house in Chicago, they have nothing but MW (my wife's mother is from Iowa). course, they also have margarine but no butter. knowing what i know, i have a feeling that they simply have MW (lite, if i remember) and margarine because she read it in a health magazine somewhere, and has no regard for taste (which also helps explain why there's no whole milk hanging around for cooking purposes). for some reason, i'm not asked to cook when i'm over there, despite my pleas.

and just one final bit- my mom swears by pickle juice instead of vinegar as her "secret ingredient" for deviled eggs.

[Toliver]

....and just one final bit- my mom swears by pickle juice instead of vinegar as her "secret ingredient" for deviled eggs.

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Pickle juice is vinegar kicked up quite a notch, so to speak, so she's doing just fine, as far as I'm concerned. I'll have to give that a try next time I do deviled eggs.

[deibu]

Hmmm... Growing up in South Carolina, have to say our fridge was always stocked with Hellman's. My mom was a Miracle Whip-snob, and she looked down on some people using it ("don't anyone ever tell me *that* was supposed to be mayonnaise"). And my grandmother (her mother) always used Duke's mayo, but mom preferred Hellman's. I think my father's side of the family might have used MW though...

[Toliver]

When I read Toliver's description of mustard dip--a recipe I hope you'll share with us--it kind of sounded like a close cousin to Chinese mustard (at least what passes for it here in the US). 

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Share I will...it's a very simple recipe (actually, just a short paragraph that I've reworded) from the 1953 edition of Better Homes and Gardens New Cookbook. It turns out that this is one of the recipes that got cut from later editions of the cookbook which is why I had to find this specific edition on eBay in order to get the recipe back.

"Chinese Mustard Sauce"

Put 2 tablespoons of dry mustard in a small bowl that can handle hot temperatures. Add 6 tablespoons of boiling water and stir until blended. Add 2 teaspoons of a mild vegetable oil (as opposed to olive oil or something with flavor) and also add 1/2 teaspoon of salt. Blend it all together.

That's it. It's not a thick sauce. Like I mentioned earlier, we always make it when we have ham for dinner. Dip a bite of ham in the sauce before eating it. Fair warning, as Andie also pointed out, depending on the dry mustard you use, this can have a kick to it and can turn out very spicy hot. Which is why my brothers and I always loved it.

To go back on topic, I mentioned this discussion to my mom who said she is looking forward to making a tomato sanwich from the first tomatoes of the season from her garden. It was something she ate as a kid in Kansas. Her tradition is to slice them up on white bread and top them with MW. Sometimes simple is better.

[scordelia]

I like Miracle Whip too, but not on everything. I am also a huge fan of Heinz's Salad Cream--a similar product, but not as thick! That's a little harder to find, but can be gotten at Carribean markets.

But what I really use MW for is it is the secret ingredient in my chocolate buttercream! The MW gives the buttercream a satiny texture and a slight tang.

[joiei]

I had some friends in from Belize when I lived in New Orleans and we scoured the city for some Salad cream. But alas, no luck. So the last time I was in Belize, I tried it. It isn't miracle whip and it isn't mayonnaise. I did sort of like it, considering that most of the Belizean cusine was pretty dreadful. I did learn that the next time I am down there, I will stay at a resort real close to one owned by Francis Ford Coppola, his dining rooms rock. The Lobster Pizza at The Turtle Inn was heaven.

[divalasvegas]

When I read Toliver's description of mustard dip--a recipe I hope you'll share with us--it kind of sounded like a close cousin to Chinese mustard (at least what passes for it here in the US). 

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Share I will...it's a very simple recipe (actually, just a short paragraph that I've reworded) from the 1953 edition of Better Homes and Gardens New Cookbook. It turns out that this is one of the recipes that got cut from later editions of the cookbook which is why I had to find this specific edition on eBay in order to get the recipe back.

"Chinese Mustard Sauce"

Put 2 tablespoons of dry mustard in a small bowl that can handle hot temperatures. Add 6 tablespoons of boiling water and stir until blended. Add 2 teaspoons of a mild vegetable oil (as opposed to olive oil or something with flavor) and also add 1/2 teaspoon of salt. Blend it all together.

That's it. It's not a thick sauce. Like I mentioned earlier, we always make it when we have ham for dinner. Dip a bite of ham in the sauce before eating it. Fair warning, as Andie also pointed out, depending on the dry mustard you use, this can have a kick to it and can turn out very spicy hot. Which is why my brothers and I always loved it.

To go back on topic, I mentioned this discussion to my mom who said she is looking forward to making a tomato sanwich from the first tomatoes of the season from her garden. It was something she ate as a kid in Kansas. Her tradition is to slice them up on white bread and top them with MW. Sometimes simple is better.

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Thanks for the recipe Toliver. I actually have a ham parked in the fridge and will have to give this a try. I love spicy, sinus clearing condiments! Kudos to your mom as she has described one of my favorite sandwiches of all time and definitely one of my favorite ways to enjoy MW. Agreed: simple and delicious.

[divalasvegas]

I had some friends in from Belize when I lived in New Orleans and we scoured the city for some Salad cream.  But alas, no luck.  So the last time I was in Belize, I tried it.  It isn't miracle whip and it isn't mayonnaise.  I did sort of like it, considering that most of the Belizean cusine was pretty dreadful.  I did learn that the next time I am down there, I will stay at a resort real close to one owned by Francis Ford Coppola, his dining rooms rock.  The Lobster Pizza at The Turtle Inn was heaven.

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After checking out some info, including the ingredient list, I think Heinz Salad Cream is a condiment--like Miracle Whip--which appeals to those of us who like that sweet/tangy taste on selected items. It seems to have a similar flavor profile as the boiled dressing recipe featured ludja's boiled dressing thread.

I know I've never purchased this product and I never saw it in my home growing up. I'd definitely be willing to give it a try.

BTW joiei and scordelia I found a source for Heinz Salad Cream:

Heinz Salad Cream via Vermont Country Store

It seems a bit pricey, but hey when ya gotta have it, ya gotta have it! I'll try looking for it first at local grocery stores.

[FabulousFoodBabe]

I had some friends in from Belize when I lived in New Orleans and we scoured the city for some Salad cream.  But alas, no luck.  So the last time I was in Belize, I tried it.  It isn't miracle whip and it isn't mayonnaise.  I did sort of like it, considering that most of the Belizean cusine was pretty dreadful.  I did learn that the next time I am down there, I will stay at a resort real close to one owned by Francis Ford Coppola, his dining rooms rock.  The Lobster Pizza at The Turtle Inn was heaven.

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Ooh, cool! I'm going to Belize at the end of the month, and will look for the Salad cream.

I wonder if there's any relationship between sweet pickle relish lovers and MW lovers? (I personally love sweet relish in my tuna salad, on sandwiches, etc.)

[FabulousFoodBabe]

To go back on topic, I mentioned this discussion to my mom who said she is looking forward to making a tomato sanwich from the first tomatoes of the season from her garden. It was something she ate as a kid in Kansas.  Her tradition is to slice them up on white bread and top them with MW. Sometimes simple is better.

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Okay, here I am, having another flashback to my childhood. That's just what we did, too. Thanks for the memory, Toliver!

[MGLloyd]

Heinz Salad Cream is beloved in the United Kingdom. Any store that sells 'British' foodstuffs will likely stock Salad Cream. In my area north of Seattle, there are three stores within a 15 mile radius that sell it, along with many other British delicacies.

[jasie]

Got a jar of Miracle whip. I'm now a convert! It makes egg salad alot more tangy than mayo.. yum!

Boyfriend isn't convinced, he says that its too sweet. Guess we'll just have to have both in the fridge.

edited to add: hit enter too fast.

Edited June 11, 2006 by jasie (log)

[divalasvegas]

Got a jar of Miracle whip. I'm now a convert!  It makes egg salad alot more tangy than mayo.. yum!

Boyfriend isn't convinced, he says that its too sweet. Guess we'll just have to have both in the fridge. 

edited to add: hit enter too fast.

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Thanks for sharing your "conversion" jasie! On behalf of MW lovers everywhere I want to congratulate you on your adventurous, unbiased and openminded investigation. Kudos for boldly and unashamedly declaring your conversion for all to see.

As you are only at the beginning of your journey in MW-land, please check throughout this thread for other delicious ways to enjoy it. Also, since not everyone in your life may understand why you have chosen this path, remember we'll always be here for moral support (and recipes).

But, more importantly, you are a pioneer as you now occupy the honorary position of being our FIRST CONVERT TO THE CAUSE!!! I therefore call upon all MW lovers to welcome jasie to the fold. The first but undoubtedly not the last.

[andiesenji]

A neighbor did some shopping for me yesterday and brought me a jar of "Durkee Famous (Sandwich and Salad) Sauce" (I had been telling her about this discussion.)

She is from Coffeeville, Kansas and said this was a staple in their kitchen during her teen years in the late 60s, early 70s. Her dad was a Kansas Highway Patrol officer and her mom would prepare a stack of sandwiches for him, MW on one slice of bread, the Durkee on the other, with various meats and cheeses between, no lettuce, no tomato, occasionally some pickle slices somewhere between the meat and cheese to keep the pickle juice from soaking into the bread.

She said that seeing the jar of Durkee on the shelf in the market brought back fond memories of her dad going off to work with the round plaid cooler that held his soft drinks and a good supply of sandwiches and fruit to keep him going for his entire shift, with enough to share with other officers who might be out in the boonies, far away from a food source.

So our discussion here has created ripples that have spread out and brought a happy memory to someone outside of our little community.

Edited June 12, 2006 by andiesenji (log)

[Jaymes]

Ah yes, Miracle Whip & Durkee's. The underpinings of many a great sandwich, and egg salad, and potato salad, and deviled eggs....

[MarketStEl]

A neighbor did some shopping for me yesterday and brought me a jar of "Durkee Famous (Sandwich and Salad) Sauce"  (I had been telling her about this discussion.)

She is from Coffeeville, Kansas[...]

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Ordinarily, posts like this one are bad form, but as others might get the wrong idea about the origins of this small Sunflower State community by reading this, I need to note that the name of this burg in the state's southeast corner is Coffeyville.

Great Freudian slip, though. I could go for a cup myself right now.