Pâte de Fruits (Fruit Paste/Fruit Jellies) (Part 2)

[Sadie90]

With blisters on my feet and locked joints, I finally have accomplished something that resembles pate de fruits with grocery store ingredients! I followed this great post here that uses Certo liquid pectin. 

 

Last week I tried my hardest using Certo "Light" crystals. I added this stuff in right after the puree like the boiron recipe, but everything got super thick quickly and the puree/sugar was splattering everywhere. I suspect that the pectin was setting too quickly since this is not the slow setting pectin that we are supposed to use. 

 

The liquid pectin recipe seems to add the pectin at the end - after the sugar temp has reached the final temp (111C) - and boiled for only a minute. There is also ~30ml of lemon juice. Am I correct to assume that after temperature is achieved, that by adding the liquid pectin and only boiling for 1 minute, totally messes this up, cause the sweating that I am experiencing on day 2, and shorten shelf life? I need to get a refractometer...

 

The worry from the Certo crystals was that the pectin was going to set too quickly. 

 

 

 

 

 

This picture is when they were JUST coated with sugar. 

Edited April 24, 2018 by Sadie90 (log)

[Sadie90]

This is what they look like today, after air drying for a day. The sweats!! Grrrrr...

 

 

Recipe: 

 

• 2 cups puree (~550g) (I used frozen strawberries, unstrained, with 10% sugar added)
• 3 cups sugar (675g)
• 2 - 3oz packs of Certo Liquid Pectin
• 2 Tablespoons of Lemon juice

 

1. Heat puree to 140 F
2. Add sugar and heat to 235 F
3. Add liquid pectin and boil for 1 minute
4. Take off heat, add lemon juic
5. Cast in pan

Edited April 24, 2018 by Sadie90 (log)

[Kerry Beal]

Just talked to @Alleguede - he has some at the shop - passion fruit. Gouter - 3507 Bathurst. I'd say firmer than jam.

[Sadie90]

19 minutes ago, Kerry Beal said:

Just talked to @Alleguede - he has some at the shop - passion fruit. Gouter - 3507 Bathurst. I'd say firmer than jam.

 

Thanks! Looks like a great little shop that may be worth an outing  I'm down by Union station. 

 

If it is just firmer than Jam, then I think I have achieved that. Now to work on the sweating. I posted some pics to show that they were a bit wet to be honest. I'm going to try adding in the liquid pectin and cook it all up to the correct 235F degrees this time. I think the short 1 minute boil of the liquid pectin is not enough since we are adding quite a bit of liquid with the two packs at the end (170ml total solution of liquid pectin) 

 

But I'm just guessing haha...

Edited April 24, 2018 by Sadie90 (log)

[Chocolot]

2 hours ago, Sadie90 said:

 

Thanks! Looks like a great little shop that may be worth an outing  I'm down by Union station. 

 

If it is just firmer than Jam, then I think I have achieved that. Now to work on the sweating. I posted some pics to show that they were a bit wet to be honest. I'm going to try adding in the liquid pectin and cook it all up to the correct 235F degrees this time. I think the short 1 minute boil of the liquid pectin is not enough since we are adding quite a bit of liquid with the two packs at the end (170ml total solution of liquid pectin) 

 

But I'm just guessing haha...

 

 

That recipe is from Grewelings at Home book, but he cooks to 238 and uses 1 T lemon juice, not two. I would do it exactly like Greweling says and see if you like that. I have used this recipe for classes, and it has worked well. We have to adjust for the altitude, but the Certo works well when used as he instructs.

[Pastrypastmidnight]

17 minutes ago, Chocolot said:

 

That recipe is from Grewelings at Home book, but he cooks to 238 and uses 1 T lemon juice, not two. I would do it exactly like Greweling says and see if you like that. I have used this recipe for classes, and it has worked well. We have to adjust for the altitude, but the Certo works well when used as he instructs.

I’ve used the Greweling at Home recipe to make raspberry pâte de fruit successfully with liquid Certo pectin. I only tried it once, but mine didn’t sweat at all. I followed his instructions exactly. 

[keychris]

Sweating pdf is also caused by storage conditions, if you've got a humid environment I think it's practically unavoidable.

[Sadie90]

On 4/24/2018 at 10:10 PM, Chocolot said:

 

That recipe is from Grewelings at Home book, but he cooks to 238 and uses 1 T lemon juice, not two. I would do it exactly like Greweling says and see if you like that. I have used this recipe for classes, and it has worked well. We have to adjust for the altitude, but the Certo works well when used as he instructs.

 

Thanks! I haven't managed to find the exact recipe Grewelings teaches. There are quite a few recipes out there but they are a bit different. I did find a recipe that called for 1 T Lemon juice - but that was for 1 cup of puree, not the 2 that I am using. 

 

By adding in a liquid (pectin) at the end, do you believe this will affect shelf life? Since we are adding in more liquid? 

 

I tried another batch of mango this time, and put the liquid pectin in a lot earlier than instructed. It gelled (sp?) into a thick mess way too early and the whole thing lost a lot of volume. Who am I to think I can just make up order of operations??

[Sadie90]

On 4/24/2018 at 10:29 PM, Pastrypastmidnight said:

I’ve used the Greweling at Home recipe to make raspberry pâte de fruit successfully with liquid Certo pectin. I only tried it once, but mine didn’t sweat at all. I followed his instructions exactly. 

It seems that after a couple of days of initial sweating, everything has stopped now after a fresh coating of sugar. 

 

Hope it lasts!

 

Will be trying another batch of mango today, following the instructions exactly and will go to 238F this time. Another issue I find with this recipe is that it just calls for 2 cups fruit puree. But with the Boiron and other recipes, each recipe changes depending on fruit chosen. 

 

Why is it that any fruit can be used in Greweling's recipe without changing anything else? 

Edited April 26, 2018 by Sadie90 (log)

[Pastrypastmidnight]

Greweling’s C&C at Home

1 pound (2 cups) fruit puree

24 oz (3 cups) sugar

6 oz Liquid Pectin

1TBSP lemon juice

1/4 cup sugar for coating

 

Cook purée and 3 cups sugar to 238F. 

Add pectin and return to boil while stirring, boil 1 minute. 

Stir in lemon juice and remove from heat. 

Pour into pan lined with oiled plastic wrap. 

Cool completely (2 hours or overnight) 

Cut and roll in sugar. 

 

My my guess is that berries are going to behave differently than, say, citrus fruit, but that for the home cook this works well most of the time for most of the fruits. 

Edited April 26, 2018 by Pastrypastmidnight (log)

[Pastrypastmidnight]

For juice recipes it says to use 10oz (1 1/4 cups) juice and 8oz (1 cup) unsweetened applesauce. 

[Sadie90]

2 hours ago, Pastrypastmidnight said:

For juice recipes it says to use 10oz (1 1/4 cups) juice and 8oz (1 cup) unsweetened applesauce. 

 

Thanks for all the recipes! Have a batch of mango cooling down now - this time only with 1 T of lemon juice. 

 

Compared to the strawberry that boiled to a nice volume to allow the candy thermometer to reach deeper into the liquid, the mango this time got thick very fast and never really boiled up in volume. You could almost pick it up with your whisk when it was close to the 238F temp! 

 

But the liquid pectin was able to soften it up a bit, and then the lemon juice. Hope they turn out well

 

Also ordered the yellow pectin, glucose liquid to try the Boiron recipes shortly and will post my experiments. Also ordered a cheap refractometer!

 

If these Greweling’s C&C at Home PDFs work well, what is the reason to go for the more difficult Boiron recipes? 

[ChocoMom]

With the use of fruit purees in PdF's, I've either made my own or used the Borion purees.  Recently, as I was perusing Ebay and Amazon for pricing on Borion, I think Amazon suggested another brand "Vinter's Harvest".  Has anyone heard of it, or tried it, in a PdF?   There seems to be an enormous variety of purees available.  It is not frozen, but canned- which makes me wonder about the flavor and quality.  I've not gotten a response from any Amazon buyers yet when I asked about the PdF application.   I noticed that the manufacturers said its perfect for use in beer, wine and mead production.    It is WAY more cost effective than Borion, but, I am concerned about puree being canned and the quality/flavor.

 

If no one has tried it, I'll 'take one for the team', give it a whirl, and report back.   In the meantime, thank you - in advance- for any feedback! Andrea

 

EDIT....I just discovered I can zoom in on the can's label. On the cherry puree label, and it specifically said "For Beer and Winemaking".  So perhaps, its application is limited.  Phooey. 

Edited May 6, 2018 by ChocoMom (log)

[Kerry Beal]

3 hours ago, ChocoMom said:

With the use of fruit purees in PdF's, I've either made my own or used the Borion purees.  Recently, as I was perusing Ebay and Amazon for pricing on Borion, I think Amazon suggested another brand "Vinter's Harvest".  Has anyone heard of it, or tried it, in a PdF?   There seems to be an enormous variety of purees available.  It is not frozen, but canned- which makes me wonder about the flavor and quality.  I've not gotten a response from any Amazon buyers yet when I asked about the PdF application.   I noticed that the manufacturers said its perfect for use in beer, wine and mead production.    It is WAY more cost effective than Borion, but, I am concerned about puree being canned and the quality/flavor.

 

If no one has tried it, I'll 'take one for the team', give it a whirl, and report back.   In the meantime, thank you - in advance- for any feedback! Andrea

 

EDIT....I just discovered I can zoom in on the can's label. On the cherry puree label, and it specifically said "For Beer and Winemaking".  So perhaps, its application is limited.  Phooey. 

 

But if it's puree with nothing else added (maybe some sugar) - it might be worth a try.

[ChocoMom]

@Kerry Beal....I pondered it a bit, and figured 3 pounds (net) for under $20, it would be worth a try.  I did find on the manufacturer's website that there is no sugar added, so going with the Boiron formula, I can add 10% and go from there.   Should have it next week. =)   I shall report back. 

[Kerry Beal]

I might not bother with the 10% sugar - just use as is.

[Sadie90]

Found this picture on the web. Interesting to see cut-what-you-want pate de fruits at a French market!

 

 

[Rajala]

I made my first batch of pate de fruit today. Pretty satisfied with the result, however, I feel like the texture isn't smooth enough. I did use pectin NH, maybe different pectins can give you different texture?

 

Suggestions on how to make it smoother? I followed a recipe from Boiron posted in this thread. The blackcurrant one.

 

 

Bonus question for anyone that might now the answer; the same guide suggests to use pear puree if you want to do a lemon pate de fruite, can it be done without? Same thing with mango (apricot instead of pear.) Don't have any pear/apricot puree.  

Edited May 31, 2018 by Rajala (log)

[Kerry Beal]

1 hour ago, Rajala said:

I made my first batch of pate de fruit today. Pretty satisfied with the result, however, I feel like the texture isn't smooth enough. I did use pectin NH, maybe different pectins can give you different texture?

 

Suggestions on how to make it smoother? I followed a recipe from Boiron posted in this thread. The blackcurrant one.

 

 

Bonus question for anyone that might now the answer; the same guide suggests to use pear puree if you want to do a lemon pate de fruite, can it be done without? Same thing with mango (apricot instead of pear.) Don't have any pear/apricot puree.  

 

I know when I've used the wrong apple pectin (the stuff for jam) I got a pretty lumpy PDF.

 

You need either apple, pear or apricot to make any of the citrus PDF - citrus doesn't have enough structure on it's own. Use unsweetened applesauce in place of the pear.

[Rajala]

1 minute ago, Kerry Beal said:

I know when I've used the wrong apple pectin (the stuff for jam) I got a pretty lumpy PDF.

 

You need either apple, pear or apricot to make any of the citrus PDF - citrus doesn't have enough structure on it's own. Use unsweetened applesauce in place of the pear.

 

I'll try another kind of pectin tomorrow! I have a citrus pectin as well.

 

It should be possible to find some unsweetened applesauce in some store... I'll see if I can find any tomorrow. Thanks for the suggestion.

[Kerry Beal]

The called for pectin in those recipes is apple pectin (vitpris).

[Rajala]

15 hours ago, Kerry Beal said:

The called for pectin in those recipes is apple pectin (vitpris).

 

Don't have that. I don't mind playing around though, so we'll see how it ends up with the citrus pectin.

 

The blackcurrent batch I made felt better now.

Edited June 1, 2018 by Rajala (log)

[Rajala]

Citrus pectin seems to work well too. Might need to increase the amount with 10-20 percent though (that's just a guess,) the product isn't as solid as you'd want it to be.

 

My lemon pate de fruit is extremely sour though. Might be good that you can only handle to eat one piece without waiting an hour or so before you eat more.  

[DJ Silverchild]

Scaling Up:
I use the basic Boiron recipe [1000g fruit, 1000g sugar, 200g glucose, 100g sugar, 25g pectin) except I use citric acid.  I use an induction burner and heavy stainless pot. Each batch takes about 45 minutes.  It's working and in general, I'm happy with the process.

.

Business is good, I need to scale up and I have no idea how.  Do I need a Savage Fire mixer?   What about custom silicone frames and a large cutter?  Who can I turn to for help?  I called two of the bigger candy equipment companies and got zero help!

As I write this I wonder if the answer isn't just more staff and induction burners.

Edited August 23, 2018 by DJ Silverchild (log)

[Jim D.]

I'm trying to produce a decent peach taste in a bonbon filling--without much success yet. I thought making a PdF from it might help boost the flavor without having to use chocolate to reduce the water content, but that was fairly bland. Somewhere I saw a suggestion to roast the fruit first to add flavor. I also happened to have a "stone fruit crisp" at a dinner recently where peaches and another fruit were combined. Thus the new idea: to roast peaches, add dried cherries, and make the whole thing into a PdF, then add a spiced shortbread cookie to simulate the "crisp." Excess sugar in the result is now the issue I fear, especially if I add any brown sugar to the roasting process (almost a requirement, I would say). And that leads me to my question: Is there any scientific/taste reason that brown sugar could not be used to make a PdF? If it could be, then I could simply roast the peaches in butter and use brown sugar to add the caramelized taste in the process of making a PdF. I think a hefty squeeze of lemon might help control any excess sweetness. By the way, I'm using Pomona's pectin, so the brown sugar would get cooked only briefly, thus is not likely to burn.