Modernist Pizza in an Ordinary Oven: Oven Temperature

[mangosteenmonk]

Good morning folks,

 

I currently possess Modernist Pizza and am wanting to make so many of the creations but I am only equipped with a home oven that only goes up to 500. For those in the same scenario or with experience, would you have any recommendations on how to modify the cooking times/temps to make it work? Thanks so much!

Edited March 13, 2023 by Smithy
Corrected title spelling (log)

[AlaMoi]

use a stone - and preheat the oven to 500'F at least one hour to ensure the stone is hot.

my (new~) oven goes to 550'F - and I have to turn it down after the pizza goes in or things get too browned.

 

fwiw, I do not subscribe to the theory that a pizza must be baked to done in under 3 minutes... mine go 11-13 mins.

I preheat the tomato sauce - which helps the crust crisp 'all the way thru'

I also use round parchment paper - same diameter as stone - helps when rolling out the dough - and a cookie sheet to move it on/off the stone.

let it cool on a rack ~5 mins so everything 'sets up'

 

[btbyrd]

It depends on the type of pizza you're making. I'm pretty sure that they go into home oven techniques like using a steel in a maximally preheated oven and cooking using the broiler. But that's mostly if you're going for a particular style of pizza. You can also use a stone with a less hot oven for thicker crusts. Or make styles that make use of special pans (e.g., Chicago, Detroit, Sicilian, etc. -- all of which can be made well in a home oven). 

[TdeV]

I'm not a Modernist baker but I make pizza in my gas GE Profile home oven.

I have an Old Stone Oven Pizza Stone (clay) which might be like this which sits on a rack about 4" from the top of the oven, and 2" below the flame guard.

 

The oven theoretically heats to 550ºF (My oven has a VERY wide temperature drop before it restarts).

I always cook with convection on.

The oven is preheated 1 to 2 hours beforehand.

For the last 30 minutes of preheat, the broiler is turned on.

 

When the pizza goes in, it's necessary to turn the broiler off, or the top surface of the pizza will burn. (Reset oven to 550ºF).

My pizzas are generally cooked in about 6 or 7 minutes (I judge by the underside of the pizza)

 

P.S. The delivery pizza peel is square, so I make square pizzas (usually 16 pieces). 😁

 

P.P.S. Welcome to eGullet, @mangosteenmonk!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 13, 2023 by TdeV
Add welcome to eG (log)

[scott123]

The two most popular styles of pizza, New York and Neapolitan, rely, to varying extents, on rapidly expanding steam created by intense heat.  This rapidly expanding steam is what gives these styles their puff/volume.  As you work at lower oven temps, and/or with materials that transfer heat slower (like ceramics or thin metal pans) your bake time increases and your puff suffers. Neapolitan dough utilizes an unmalted flour that resists browning.  In an oven setup that bakes longer than 2 minutes, it takes on a hard, stale character that's a shell of it's faster baked potential.  Now, there are a LOT of home pizza makers who've never had properly baked Neapolitan pizza who torture their doughs (and their guests) with these long baked nightmares- and  who seem perfectly happy, but, if you're truly striving for the best possible results, you really want an oven that will char/leopard 00 flour in 90 seconds or less.

 

New York isn't that cut and dry.  New York uses malted flour, which encourages browning, and it almost always incorporate sugar and oil, both of which ramp up the browning even further.  As you work in cooler/slower heat transfer environments, New York doesn't go from majestic to barely edible like Neapolitan does.  But it absolutely loses a LOT of character.  Obsessives may argue over whether a 4 minute bake time is better than a 7 minute bake, but anyone that understands great pizza agrees that, as you start pushing into 9, 10, 11 minutes, that's just not going to be NY style at it's best.

 

Obviously, the original Modernist Cuisine was/is a big deal for many reasons, but, from a pizza perspective, they may not have invented steel plate, but, they put it on the map.  With thick enough steel, you can take a 550-ish home oven and produce a life altering 4-5 minute NY style bake.  This kicked off a home pizza baking revolution. 

So, to finally answer your question, heat transfer is absolutely critical to the two most popular styles of pizza.  There's absolutely no way to compensate for longer bake times.  You can't squeeze blood from a stone.  This being said... there are things that 500 degree oven owners can do.

First... very few people remember that, when the first MC came out, the steel plate page also referenced aluminum plate.  The increased conductivity  that makes steel transfer heat faster than stone causes aluminum to be superior to steel.  From a perspective of bottom heat, aluminum plate at 500 can match the transfer of steel at 550.  That's bottom heat, though.  For this kind of setup to work, you absolutely have to have a broiler in the main oven compartment, not a broiler drawer below the main chamber.  And the aluminum plate has to be thick- at least 3/4" of an inch. If you plan in cooking for larger groups of people, I'd go an inch or larger. You can get a reasonably sized 6061 aluminum plate for about $100 shipped.

 

Second, you can buy an Ooni.  A good Ooni (I recommend the Koda 16) will run you considerably more than $100, but... an Ooni gives you Neapolitan.  Neapolitan isn't happening in a 500 degree home oven.  

Third, I can't vouch for them, but MC has recipes for other styles.  Chicago styles (thin crust, deep dish) move into more of a pastry area, where intense heat isn't necessary.  Detroit doesn't require a blazingly fast bake either.  

Regardless of which direction you take, if you haven't experienced Neapolitan or fast baked NY style pizza, it's definitely worth pursuing.

Edited March 13, 2023 by scott123 (log)

[Chris Hennes]

I've made basically every base dough in Modernist Pizza (not New Haven yet...), and it's really only the Neapolitan that absolutely requires Ludicrous Speed baking (as @scott123 points out, and whose Ooni Koda 16 recommendation I wholeheartedly agree with). For the majority of the pizzas you're looking at ~5 minutes at 480°F, though the truly thick crust variants do take longer than that.

 

ETA: On a steel pizza "stone" that is.

[IndyRob]

I use a baking steel and that was a big step forward.  I'm happy with my neopolitan style pizzas, although leoparding is out of the question.  I really don't have much desire for something like an Ooni unless it can make big ol' NY style pies.

 

My oven will go to 550, but I've found 500 to be adequate.

 

But the characteristics of your particular oven are paramount.  500 in oven A can be totally different from 500 in oven B.  Sometimes you may want to make use of the power of the bottom rack/heating, or with another, take advantage of the broiler.

 

If you're new to pizza making, and have a Trader Joe's nearby, I'd recommend purchasing their fresh doughs for a consistent starting point.

 

 

[paulraphael]

I gave up on making neapolitan-style pizza in a home oven (although I haven't had a chance to use an oven with a top broiler yet, which should help at least a little). Even at 500° and with a 1/2" steel preheated for an hour, cooking times were over 5 minutes and the crust turned into a cracker.

 

Other styles don't interest me. So the whole project just turned into a workshop in making sourdough bread (sometimes with some Modernist Cuisine tweaks). And the pizzerias get to keep my business. 

[AlaMoi]

try an aluminum plate.

aluminum specific heat is 2x steel and heat transfer is 4x/6x better than carbon steel / stainless steel.

now.... the specific heat is a normalized value based on mass, so you'll need a aluminum plate about 2x as thick as a steel one.