Eleven Madison Park goes vegan

[KennethT]

44 minutes ago, Eatmywords said:

Is it true they're working with Danny Meyer to put a Shake Shack 50 yards away (like EMP) in case diners get hungry?

EMP is already about 50 yards from the OG shake shack...

[weinoo]

1 hour ago, Eatmywords said:

Is it true they're working with Danny Meyer to put a Shake Shack 50 yards away (like EMP) in case diners get hungry?

No - In n' Out.

[Eatmywords]

55 minutes ago, KennethT said:

EMP is already about 50 yards from the OG shake shack...

that was the joke, Ken.  this other place is in CA.

 

I think Weinoo got it w his In n Out ref.  (Why can't we have one? 😔)   

[weinoo]

On 5/4/2021 at 6:24 PM, btbyrd said:

his was apparently done in the name of sustainability.

 

Know what's not sustainable?

 

$300 3-star 10-course dinners. 

 

This makes no sense.

 

Well, maybe makes no sense to some, but...

 

because according to Bloomberg, the waitlist for June and July now stretches more than 15,000 people long.

[btbyrd]

Of course, having a long wait list for something doesn't mean that it makes sense. Business sense, sure. But selling $335 vegan meals as "sustainable" is either laughably naïve or grotesquely disingenuous. Humm's implication that anything animal-based is somehow unsustainable is obviously false and does a real disservice to farmers, fishers, and purveyors who responsibly produce and source animals for culinary use. There are a bunch of good reasons to have a plant-based fine dining menu, but sustainability isn't one of them. Nothing about fine dining is sustainable. It's a luxury pleasure business.

[weinoo]

Most of what matters in the restaurant business is the business of restaurants.

 

Successful ones often have good marketing. I doubt that humm's fishers, farmers and purveyors have a problem with it.

[chromedome]

Tripped across this today, thought some of you would be interested...

https://ny.eater.com/platform/amp/22650875/eleven-madison-park-review-vegan-menu-dishes-price-2021

[gfweb]

39 minutes ago, chromedome said:

Tripped across this today, thought some of you would be interested...

https://ny.eater.com/platform/amp/22650875/eleven-madison-park-review-vegan-menu-dishes-price-2021

Bet they are still busy after this pretty darn bad review.

[rotuts]

just because some people have

 

so much ' disposable ' income

 

doesn't mean they have deep insight

 

on how to dispose of it.

 

the price of the experience 

 

does not even make a dent

 

in their daily lives

 

this restaurant is simply the place

 

to be , so that you can be seen keeping up

 

w your financial peers.

 

 

Edited September 2, 2021 by rotuts (log)

[Anna N]

6 hours ago, gfweb said:

Bet they are still busy after this pretty darn bad review.

Well I hope so. I do not wish them ill.
But if it were possible I am quite sure I would rather dine at at Vedge. 
I wonder how the staff (chefs and cooks) are adapting. I would think that there is a certain pride and status in being trusted to handle caviar, heritage meat, foie gras etc.  
You have to have a very special character and a very special dedication to believe that there is much status if you are preparing beets. Nothing wrong with beets. I love them. But if they come to a bad end….. surely the consequences are considerably reduced. 
I don’t know.  Could I transfer my  reverence for, let us say a jar of caviar, to a bushel of beets? It is quite the leap.

[rotuts]

@Anna N 

 

your points are well taken.

 

especially the trust in handling very 

 

expensive ingredients ,  and understanding

 

how to cook them perfectly.

 

I think , in a neutral way  , that Veg cooking

 

is very much about presentation and textures.

 

the Beet flavor being a constant one.

Edited September 2, 2021 by rotuts (log)

[rotuts]

in the NYTimes ( today , being 29 Sept 2021 )

 

there is a review of 11MP.  Pete Wells

 

( possibly of the Per Se review , times past )

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/09/28/dining/eleven-madison-park-restaurant-review-plant-based.html?action=click&module=Well&pgtype=Homepage&section=Food

 

no doubt behind a paywall  its an entire page ++ long

 

good reading :  for review purposes :

 

""  The man with the hammer treats everything as a nail, the saying goes. Something like that seems to be afflicting Eleven Madison Park in its new vegan incarnation ""

 

"'  Almost none of the main ingredients taste quite like themselves""

 

""" Some are so obviously standing in for meat or fish that you almost feel sorry for them ""

 

""  In tonight’s performance, the role of the duck will be played by a beet, doing things no root vegetable should be asked to do ""

 

""  They used to do a similar beet act at Agern, a New Nordic restaurant in Grand Central Terminal, roasting it inside a crust of salt and vegetable ash. That beet tasted like a beet, but more so. The one at Eleven Madison Park tastes like Lemon Pledge and smells like a burning joint. ''

 

you get the idea

 

P.S.:  he did like a few items :

 

""  here is a plant-based version of the restaurant’s wonderful bread, like a savory croissant rolled into a crisp golden swirl. Originally kneaded with cow butter, the laminated dough has been rejiggered with butter made from sunflower seeds, and it’s an unqualified success. So is the nonbutter that arrives with the bread, molded into the shape of a sunflower, bright yellow with a dark eye of tangy fermented sunflower seeds in the center. ""

 

one last note , the last paragraph:

 

""  Eleven Madison Park still buys meat, though. Until the year ends, the menu offered to customers who book a private dining room includes an optional beef dish, roasted tenderloin with fermented peppers and black lime. It’s some kind of metaphor for Manhattan, where there’s always a higher level of luxury, a secret room where the rich eat roasted tenderloin while everybody else gets an eggplant canoe.""

 

Edited September 29, 2021 by rotuts (log)

[Chris Hennes]

That review was pretty brutal, EMP is probably fortunate that the Times isn't doing star ratings right now: no way that describes a four star restaurant. I admit that I had planned on giving this menu a try, but I think it's off the list now. I prefer vegetables to be allowed to be vegetables, not forced into some kind of meat stand-in role.

[rotuts]

11MP  

 

is no longer 

 

Best Stuff ,  Treated Best-ly , on 

 

The BestPlate NYC 

 

I did chuckle a bit , (  more than that ! )

 

then re-thought :  Exceptional Disposable Income  

 

aside  and of course it can't be put aside 

 

some mighty fine talent  

 

is temporarily lost

 

until someone

 

puts some Clothes 

 

on that Emperor 

 

or not.

 

 

 

 

[weinoo]

It’s a one or two star review, in my opinion,  with very salient points, especially of the times we are in.

[gfweb]

Pretty damning review.

 

Earlier I had wondered if the value of the destination for expense account dining would carry the restaurant through this. 

 

That clicking I hear is reservations being cancelled.

[weinoo]

8 hours ago, gfweb said:

Pretty damning review.

 

Earlier I had wondered if the value of the destination for expense account dining would carry the restaurant through this. 

 

That clicking I hear is reservations being cancelled.

 

Not (yet) according to the reservation website, which shows not a single open reservation through the end of October. You can't really be surprised that there are many, many people who don't read Pete. And there are many, many people with lots of money and zero taste.

 

However, if one really must have a meal with no meat, nor fish, nor chicken, nor rabbit, nor doe, nor ortolan, there's always Dirt Candy, serving a meal focused on vegetables, and with this philosophy:

 

Quote

Dirt Candy doesn’t care about your politics. We aren’t saying “no” to meat, but saying “yes” to vegetables. We don’t care about your health. Our food won’t make your skin glow, it won’t make you live longer, it won’t super-charge your free radicals with antioxidants. We simply want to make vegetables as delicious as possible.

 

 

Which I kinda like. And it's only $85! And there are actually reservations available.

[rotuts]

@weinoo  

 

how can you give a star to :

 

'  tastes like Lemon Pledge and smells like a burning joint '

 

the setting ?  the expense ?  The Swells ( right next to you ! )

 

NYC inflation ?

[rotuts]

@weinoo 

 

beet me to it.

 

See and be Seen

 

is what 11MP is about 

 

not the food.

[weinoo]

16 minutes ago, rotuts said:

@weinoo  

 

how can you give a star to :

 

'  tastes like Lemon Pledge and smells like a burning joint '

 

the setting ?  the expense ?  The Swells ( right next to you ! )

 

NYC inflation ?

There were certainly some dishes he liked and that blew him away.  And yes, the service and intangibles play into it.

 

I wish he would've at least discussed the wine list.

[weinoo]

And everywhere you walk in NYC, it smells like a burning joint.

[chromedome]

Another perspective on the changeover, and a commentary on some (much) of the critics' response:

https://www.aliciakennedy.news/p/on-fine-dining

[gfweb]

On 9/30/2021 at 9:49 AM, weinoo said:

And everywhere you walk in NYC, it smells like a burning joint.

 

It masks the other smells

[Anna N]

So how is the turn to vegan going? Hasty google search suggests not quite what we had been led to believe? Just curious and would like to hear it from those who know best. 

[gfweb]

https://ny.eater.com/2022/1/27/22905120/eleven-madison-park-price-hike-no-tipping-nyc-restaurants?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Eater National - 01/28/2022&utm_content=A&utm_term=Eater Today

 

So they renounce fair wages etc and go back to tipping with no decrease in menu prices.