Modernist Cuisine Baking Steel

[rob1234]

I'm actually making NY sausage pizza tonight using the recipe from the same site. It was extremely easy. http://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2010/10/new-york-style-pizza.html and http://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2011/09/juicy-sweet-or-hot-italian-sausage.html

I prefer his neapolitan dough more though http://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2012/07/basic-neapolitan-pizza-dough-recipe.html

and for the sausage next time I would increase the fennel seeds and decrease the garlic.

Edited May 29, 2013 by rob1234 (log)

[Lisa Shock]

Got myself the MC baking steel. Haven't had time to try it yet, but my plan is to freeze it and then pull it out and see how quickly it can (if it can) chill pie crust dough that's been rolled out on a silpat. (I may run a time test comparing silpat to parchment.) I also want to see if it will chill scooped out cookie dough, which I usually refrigerate for 20 minutes before baking, and if it will help me with unleavened pate sucre style cookie dough (mix, chill, roll out, chill, cut into shapes, maybe chill, place on silpat and bake.)

My idea is to see if I can use the steel instead of the fridge, or freezer, especially at home where it's BIG deal to clear out even a half sheet pan's worth of space.

If I make chocolates at home anytime soon, I will also play with piping on the steel and just placing molds on it instead of in the fridge.

[scott123]

Aluminum will transfer far less heat to the crust than cast iron, and cast iron is inferior to steel. Thus the baking steel.

Considerably thinner aluminum will transfer less heat to the crust than cast iron, but the same thickness of aluminum will transfer far more heat in a shorter amount of time.

Also, cast iron and steel have very similar thermal transfer rates. Again, thin cast iron is inferior to thicker steel, but cast iron, as a material, is comparable to steel.

[Lisa Shock]

I ordered the Modernist edition a few minutes ago, next I need a novice oriented tutorial on how to make a NY style dough. Can someone provide a link??? prefer it with videos. I've never made a pizza dough before. thanks!!

Try checking out Jeff Varasano's Youtube channel.

[slkinsey]

Aluminum will transfer far less heat to the crust than cast iron, and cast iron is inferior to steel. Thus the baking steel.

Considerably thinner aluminum will transfer less heat to the crust than cast iron, but the same thickness of aluminum will transfer far more heat in a shorter amount of time.

I wouldn't say it works exactly this way. Carbon steel has around 56% more thermal capacity compared to aluminum at the same thickness. And stored thermal energy is the name of the game here, because its not like a pan on a restaurant stove where the thermal energy is constantly replenished from below. So the aluminum slab would rapidly transfer some thermal energy into the crust at first, but we would expect it to come down in temperature more quickly than we would like and at the end of three minutes it is likely that the steel slab will have transferred more thermal energy into the crust. In order to take advantage of aluminum in this context, you would really want a slab that was around 60% thicker than the steel slab. It would still weigh less, but it's possible that you might run into issues of thermal energy transferring too fast and the bottom burning before the top cooked. It would be interesting to compare.

Also, cast iron and steel have very similar thermal transfer rates. Again, thin cast iron is inferior to thicker steel, but cast iron, as a material, is comparable to steel.

Cast iron, carbon steel and stainless steel all have poor thermal conductivity compared to aluminum and copper. But, again, when stored thermal energy has primary importance, we are more concerned about heat capacity than conductivity. The reason metal slabs work better than baking "stones" for home pizza making is mostly due to the fact that the metal slab holds way more thermal energy than the baking stone. If the thermal energy isn't there, all the conductivity in the world won't make much difference. I suspect that aluminum could work very well in this context, but it would definitely take some tweaking and experimentation to figure out the best thickness, etc. and it's no guarantee it would be better than carbon steel in the end.

[scott123]

Aluminum will transfer far less heat to the crust than cast iron, and cast iron is inferior to steel. Thus the baking steel.

Considerably thinner aluminum will transfer less heat to the crust than cast iron, but the same thickness of aluminum will transfer far more heat in a shorter amount of time.

I wouldn't say it works exactly this way. Carbon steel has around 56% more thermal capacity compared to aluminum at the same thickness. And stored thermal energy is the name of the game here, because its not like a pan on a restaurant stove where the thermal energy is constantly replenished from below. So the aluminum slab would rapidly transfer some thermal energy into the crust at first, but we would expect it to come down in temperature more quickly than we would like and at the end of three minutes it is likely that the steel slab will have transferred more thermal energy into the crust. In order to take advantage of aluminum in this context, you would really want a slab that was around 60% thicker than the steel slab. It would still weigh less, but it's possible that you might run into issues of thermal energy transferring too fast and the bottom burning before the top cooked. It would be interesting to compare.

>Also, cast iron and steel have very similar thermal transfer rates. Again, thin cast iron is inferior to thicker steel, but cast iron, as a material, is comparable to steel.

Cast iron, carbon steel and stainless steel all have poor thermal conductivity compared to aluminum and copper. But, again, when stored thermal energy has primary importance, we are more concerned about heat capacity than conductivity. The reason metal slabs work better than baking "stones" for home pizza making is mostly due to the fact that the metal slab holds way more thermal energy than the baking stone. If the thermal energy isn't there, all the conductivity in the world won't make much difference. I suspect that aluminum could work very well in this context, but it would definitely take some tweaking and experimentation to figure out the best thickness, etc. and it's no guarantee it would be better than carbon steel in the end.

Sam, thermal capacity plays less of a role in pizza bake times than you're giving it credit for. Before aluminum started being used for pizza, I crunched the numbers, just as you did, and, based on a capacity-centric perspective, I recommended a 50% increase in aluminum thickness (3/4") to the 1/2" steel people were already using. On paper, the lower density/decreased capacity had to be taken into account. Once the real world data started coming in, though, the results told a different story. I didn't foresee this at all, but 3/8" aluminum ended up producing bake times very much on par with 3/8" steel:

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,21951.msg233048.html#msg233048

and 1/2" aluminum ended up matching 1/2" steel results as well:

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,23750.msg241164.html#msg241164

The data, although a bit limited and preliminary, seems to strongly point towards aluminum's conductivity allowing it to deliver a greater amount of it's limited energy payload in the same amount of time.

This ended up being a paradigm shift in the way I viewed hearth materials. Prior to this, I was always recommending thicker stones in the belief that greater heat capacity would shorten bake times, but now I can see that the lower the conductivity, the more diminishing capacity's return.

Preliminary experiments with 3/4 steel provided another big piece of this puzzle If 1/4" steel can do 7 minute bakes at 550 and 1/2" can produce a 3 minute pie at 550, shouldn't a 3/4" version be able to trim off a minute or two and take it into the Neapolitan realm? I was certain that it could, but the real world data had different ideas:

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,16379.0.html

For this particular individual, 3/4" steel barely outperformed 1/2".

What this tells me is that, during these typical bake times, the heat in steel can't travel far enough to draw energy from the entire plate, whereas, with aluminum, it can.

Now, obviously, as I said, the results are still preliminary and I'm not taking recovery/multiple pies into account here. Aluminum's ability to transfer a far greater percentage of it's energy payload should negatively impact it's ability to do back to back pies, but... it's conductivity derived pre-heat ability might, to an extent, offset that. We'll see.

Aluminum, also, as you predicted, delivers more of it's payload at the beginning of the bake, producing more contrast to the undercrust coloration. For people working in this bake time spectrum additional contrast/char might not be too terribly undesirable. In addition, I believe that this propensity for undercrust contrast can be compensated for formulaically.

It's still early, but aluminum is showing a considerable amount of promise in thicknesses far lesser than I ever expected.

Edited June 2, 2013 by scott123 (log)

[Volition]

Hi everybody,

Well I have the baking steel now for about 2 months. I have cooked pizzas on it twice and they were great. Good charring, I liked the puffy blisters as well.

Guests said it was the best pizza they'd had. Obviously don't eat much pizza.

Another trick I used the steel for was to help keep some dough chilled while rolling it out. I had some really short dough for a lemon tart. And placed it between 2 sheets of baking paper I rolled it out. This was really helpful as it helped keep the dough elastic but not brittle as the butter didn't melt from all the work. I did flip the pastry every 2 or 3 minutes of rolling. I had the steel in the fridge for about an hour before I used. Not the freezer but fridge.

I like the idea before of using it to create chocolate decorations perhaps. I'll have to give that a go. Now to find the liquid nitrogen.

[cegadede]

Hello,

I'm thinking of buying a baking steel (I'll probably get a slab of steel cut to the right dimensions by a local seller, as shipping costs to Brazil would be astronomical).

The thing is: I'm on the market for a new oven as well, and I have a few questions about wich kind of oven/grill would be better for using in conjunction with a baking steel. Wich is better: a gas grill or a electric grill? Second question: every oven I've seen so far doesn't allow me to have both the oven and the grill turned on at the same time, is this a problem with the baking steel?

Thanks!

[rotuts]

what ever you do I think an electric over with a gas top is the way to go.

I think but do not know that the broiler element cut out then a temp sensor in the oven goes over a certain high number to prevent you from incinerating the neighbohood.

but as you do the research for this the Oven Gods will tell you what their products do.

[HungryC]

I have all gas (natural gas is cheap in my locale). No, you cannot switch on the oven & broiler at the same time, but it doesn't matter. Here's my method: baking steel preheats for an hour or so at max oven temp, then turn on the broiler to high and let it blast the steel w/heat for another 20 minutes. The surface of the steel exceeds 750 (as measured by IR thermometer) at the end of this preheat period. A 65% hydration pie cooks in 2-4 minutes (depending on toppings).

I'm buying a new range within weeks, and it will be an all-gas Bluestar, selected because it has nothing electronic.

[Twyst]

Is anyone seasoning their baking steel lke they would a cast iron pan? I washed mine, thought I dried it really thoroughly but must have missed a drop or 2 of water and got a few rust spots surprisingly quickly. They were not a problem to remove, but this thing will definitely rust in a heartbeat.

[rotuts]

its not stainless steel?

[HungryC]

I've not seasoned it deeply a la cast iron, but I have scraped the burnt semolina, occasional scrap of cheese, etc off of it and reoiled. Did notice some light rusting when I left it in the oven while baking a loaf of bread w steam.

[rotuts]

i'd erroneously assumed it was was SS. it says 'pre-seasoned' its got to be something different that cast iron.

did seasoning instructions come with it? Ive been keeping my eye on this so pls let me know

BTW has anyone used it on an induction surface? i have this one:

http://www.amazon.com/Max-Burton-6000-1800-Watt-Induction/dp/B000MVN1M6/ref=sr_1_4/188-8589762-2722703?ie=UTF8&qid=1372428161&sr=8-4&keywords=induction+cook+top

my guess is the induction portion is about 6 to 10" at least that what the two circles measure out to be.

thanks

[Syzygies]

Is anyone seasoning their baking steel lke they would a cast iron pan?

did seasoning instructions come with it?

There's an eGullet thread on seasoning cast iron: Reseasoning cast iron, flaxseed v. grapeseed oil, based on a blog post getting lots of traction: Chemistry of Cast Iron Seasoning: A Science-Based How-To. The overwrought, authoritative title aside, the blog post is onto something for the first phase of seasoning a pan: Drying oils, applied in thin layers at 500 F, with flaxseed oil the best food-grade home choice.

I found that this method nails one aspect of seasoning a pan: blackening it with a protective, rust-resistant coating. For the actual nonstick effect, I found that browning potato bits with salt and oil is crucial as a followup treatment. In other words, oil alone doesn't work without starch, like what happens naturally cooking hundreds of covers in a restaurant. In fact, my most heavily used pans start to look more silver again on the actual cooking surface, while maintaining a nice seasoned effect. The drying oil worked best for me to protect the rest of the pan. My favorite pans in this category are by Spring USA, such as this one: Spring USA 2 Quart Fry Pan.

In case, I don't have the directions in front of me (they're in my other kitchen) but the Baking Steel reseasoning directions were exactly in this school of thought: Apply thin films of flaxseed oil, and heat.

[scott123]

The thing is: I'm on the market for a new oven as well, and I have a few questions about wich kind of oven/grill would be better for using in conjunction with a baking steel. Wich is better: a gas grill or a electric grill? Second question: every oven I've seen so far doesn't allow me to have both the oven and the grill turned on at the same time, is this a problem with the baking steel?

I don't know the fuel costs in Brazil, but here, in the U.S., it tends to cost less to heat using gas than it does electric.

That being said, electric ovens tend to be a bit more powerful- stronger bake elements and far strong broiler (top) elements. It really depends on the style of pizza you're trying to make, but if you want the most out of steel, you want to be looking for an electric oven with high wattage. If you think you might want Neapolitan, then you need an electric oven with an incredibly powerful broiler. Something like this:

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,16227.msg167250.html#msg167250

Do you see the tight arrangement and number of coils? This is the minimum you need for Neapolitan top leoparding.

99.9% of people who buy steel get it for NY style, though. If that's the case, then it gets a lot easier- you'll want a broiler in the main oven compartment (no separate broiler drawer) and an oven that goes to 550. Convection is nice but not critical- if you do get convection, try to confirm that it it goes to 550 in convection mode, as some ovens will go to 550 in regular bake, but only 500 in convection.

Another factor to consider with NY style pizza is that pizza size matters. The aesthetic, the rim to sauce/cheese ratio, the way it feels in your hand. If you're purchasing an oven with NY style pizza in mind, my recommendation is to go big- at least 18" deep by 18" wide- and then get an 18" x 18" piece of steel. New Haven pies- another of the world's great pizza styles, also heavily favors larger oven setups.

Edited June 29, 2013 by scott123 (log)

[Paul Bacino]

So I thought I would post this here too!!

This is what I'm doing with my steel. I made a pizza oven using the steel as my top.

This weekend I cooked 4 pizz'a in 15-20 mins. With all this mass you hardly lose any oven temp!!

Paul

[rotuts]

PB post the ref to your latest Pizza's I dont know how to do that.

cheers!

[Paul Bacino]

Here is my complete work..

My last pizza turned out the best with all the tweeking I did.

http://forums.egullet.org/topic/145302-my-new-pizza-oven-design/

Paul

[btbyrd]

Pizza Steel: A Seasoning Story

 

A couple years ago, I got myself the MC edition steel for my birthday. It was beautiful and seriously heavy. I was so excited!

 

 

 

The first time I used it, however, it developed some serious rust spots. I used it on my grill for two pizzas and a steak. After use, it was still far too hot to move, so I let it cool down overnight in my covered grill. It wasn't a rainy night and I'm not exactly sure what happened, but the next morning my steel was a freaking rust bomb.

 

s

 

The horror. At this point, I moved the steel to a cool dry place where it sat for a year and a half. Until this weekend.

 

Cleaning the rust bomb was a rather involved process. I did a 24 hour vinegar/salt soak followed by vigorous scrubbing with steel wool and BKF. The vinegar worked wonders, but the wool and the BKF not so much. So I grabbed a pack of the Grill Stone blocks that the Baking Steel people recommend and went to town. Those things work extremely well, but I used a box of 3 for this (admittedly nasty) job. They're sort of like Magic Erasers for use on metal. After the scrubbing, the steel looked a lot better. It was actually much cleaner than it looks in the picture.

 

 

I spent much of this weekend seasoning it to build up a solid rust-proof coating. This is after 3 coats. I think I"m finally done.

 

 

So nice... and I'm finally able to use it again! If were to buy a steel again (for the first time) I'd season it once or twice immediately (even though it comes pre-seasoned) just to give myself some extra rust insurance. I also like the uniform darkening that the process creates.

 

Anyway, the moral of the story is that you shouldn't leave your steel outside overnight -- even on a dry evening. And if you do, grab some vinegar and some scrubby rocks and kiss your weekend goodbye.

[KennethT]

Nice job... for next time (if there ever is a next time) I have 2 words: naval jelly... or 2 others: muriatic acid!  Saves a lot of elbow grease... but you need some to wash the stuff off once it's done its job....  Another thing that saves time is a wire brush that you can put in an electric drill.... buff off the majority of the rust, and then use the acid or jelly so it goes faster.  And then season right away - it'll start rusting right away after the muriatic acid treatment since it's so clean!

[boilsover]

1 hour ago, btbyrd said:

Pizza Steel: A Seasoning Story

 

A couple years ago, I got myself the MC edition steel for my birthday. It was beautiful and seriously heavy. I was so excited!

 

 

 

The first time I used it, however, it developed some serious rust spots. I used it on my grill for two pizzas and a steak. After use, it was still far too hot to move, so I let it cool down overnight in my covered grill. It wasn't a rainy night and I'm not exactly sure what happened, but the next morning my steel was a freaking rust bomb.

 

s

 

The horror. At this point, I moved the steel to a cool dry place where it sat for a year and a half. Until this weekend.

 

Cleaning the rust bomb was a rather involved process. I did a 24 hour vinegar/salt soak followed by vigorous scrubbing with steel wool and BKF. The vinegar worked wonders, but the wool and the BKF not so much. So I grabbed a pack of the Grill Stone blocks that the Baking Steel people recommend and went to town. Those things work extremely well, but I used a box of 3 for this (admittedly nasty) job. They're sort of like Magic Erasers for use on metal. After the scrubbing, the steel looked a lot better. It was actually much cleaner than it looks in the picture.

 

 

I spent much of this weekend seasoning it to build up a solid rust-proof coating. This is after 3 coats. I think I"m finally done.

 

 

So nice... and I'm finally able to use it again! If were to buy a steel again (for the first time) I'd season it once or twice immediately (even though it comes pre-seasoned) just to give myself some extra rust insurance. I also like the uniform darkening that the process creates.

 

Anyway, the moral of the story is that you shouldn't leave your steel outside overnight -- even on a dry evening. And if you do, grab some vinegar and some scrubby rocks and kiss your weekend goodbye.

 

 

Please post a photo after your first 20 pies on this seasoned surface.  If it's like my steel, you're just ahead to scrape it with a bench scraper or stiff putty knife, wire brush it, then wipe it down with an oily rag.  It's gonna look rasty in short order, no matter what.

[btbyrd]

On 2/22/2016 at 8:40 PM, boilsover said:

 

Please post a photo after your first 20 pies on this seasoned surface.  If it's like my steel, you're just ahead to scrape it with a bench scraper or stiff putty knife, wire brush it, then wipe it down with an oily rag.  It's gonna look rasty in short order, no matter what.

 

I've started using it as a stovetop griddle and searing surface (for things that don't drip, like pancakes or searing large pieces of meat). It's working well and maintaining its slick surface. I used it last night for grilled cheese. It will probably get more use as a plancha than a pizza steel.

[boilsover]

4 hours ago, btbyrd said:

It will probably get more use as a plancha than a pizza steel.

 

Beats going to the gym for a deadlift routine.

 

What hobs are you putting it over?  Are you getting acceptably even heat?  I ask because the first prototypes of the hyperconductive cookware I'm working on are rimmed/troughed plancha/teppanyaki.  Hopefully, I can post some FLIR thermography soon.  I've cooked on it in the lab, and you can put a small gas hotplate at one extreme end, and cook burgers at the other end, 18 inches away.

[btbyrd]

I've only used it for tasks where evenness isn't an extremely high priority, but the whole thing heats up if I place it over two gas burners. From what I can tell with my IR thermometer, there are definite hot spots, so delicate foods like eggs wouldn't cook very evenly. But if you know where the hotter and cooler zones are, you can move things around to suit your purposes. I got my steel about four months before their newer griddle model came out. I wish I'd known, because it would be nice to have a grease trap around the edges for things like hamburgers and bacon. Oh well. I can always put the steel on my grill if I want to use it like that. I haven't tried the pizza steel with induction yet, but that's on my list of things to do. I suspect that my two gas burners will get more of it hotter than a single-burner induction hob will.