Stoves and Ovens: Wolf? Thermador? Bluestar? Viking?

[gfweb]

12 minutes ago, SLB said:

Rx:

1. Oven floor needs replacing because rivets on the sides holding the pieces together corroded.  Existing piece may be able to be rigged with some bolts, which is what the tech recommends.
2. Said oven floor fell onto the burner and igniter when the rivets failed.  
3. Entire igniter assembly is broken.
4. Oven burner is corroded and needs to be replaced (again).

Parts estimate coming. 

 

Tech was wonderful and it was nice to have an actual person in my home.

 

I may just go ahead and get me a Magic Chef. 

 

That's horrible.

 

You might contact BS. This shouldn't happen.

[Barrytm]

Sorry to hear about the problem.  I had a SIL with a Viking with a similar 2 piece floor, and the rivets - or welds, don't recall which, failed.  I agree with the tech that nut and bolt would be a great repair.  Something sounds wrong if the burner tube rusted out again -  I could see that with a burner tube in an outdoor grill which is subject to tons of humidity, but I would want to contact BS to see if they can help with the cost of the part. 

[SLB]

Update:  Bluestar had no idea what was going on.  But they did offer 25% off the parts, so I appreciate the nudge from you folks.  

 

I pulled the records, that burner had been last replaced in 2015.  

 

I'll check with the tech if there isn't some humidity problem in my homemade kitchen plumbing . . . .

[CentralMA]

On 2/17/2021 at 2:50 PM, SLB said:

Update:  Bluestar had no idea what was going on.  But they did offer 25% off the parts, so I appreciate the nudge from you folks.  

 

I pulled the records, that burner had been last replaced in 2015.  

 

I'll check with the tech if there isn't some humidity problem in my homemade kitchen plumbing . . . .

The byproducts of burning natural gas are CO2 and H2O, there will be humidity within the oven (one of the reasons my wife wasn't keen on going away from our electric oven). Do you have other local to your area possibilities that could "attack" your oven? Near the sea (salt air, a killer of outdoor grills), other excessively humid environment?

 

Quick question: For the repair did the range need to moved, or was the fix able to be completed through the front of the oven?

 

And I'm intrigued with your "homemade kitchen plumbing". Got any pics? 

 

 

Edited February 22, 2021 by CentralMA (log)

[IEATRIO]

I have the Blue Star Platinum Range, and while I've never had any operational issues with my oven, I have noticed that the moisture produced when the oven is turned on is much higher than what I've experienced with other ovens. The moisture fogs up the glass . . . and then dissipates as it heats up.  Not in and of itself a problem for me, but something I have found unusual.

[CentralMA]

37 minutes ago, IEATRIO said:

I have the Blue Star Platinum Range, and while I've never had any operational issues with my oven, I have noticed that the moisture produced when the oven is turned on is much higher than what I've experienced with other ovens. The moisture fogs up the glass . . . and then dissipates as it heats up.  Not in and of itself a problem for me, but something I have found unusual.

Same scenario with my install.

Not only foggy glass during the initial heat up, but I have a stainless wall piece behind the range, the left side of the venting seems to produce quite a bit of moisture. 

I'm betting the glass fog is due to a tighter, more energy efficient oven space.

[gfweb]

@CentralMA Yup. I think that's it. Thing is tight.  Might help to leave the door ajar between uses. as I do with the cuisinart steamer

[Gayle28607]

@CentralMA How are you liking your Blue Star? I’d love an update when you have time. This has been a very informative thread.

[SLB]

Newsflash!  Oven won't light!  

 

Sigh.  

[Gayle28607]

20 hours ago, SLB said:

Newsflash!  Oven won't light!  

 

Sigh.  

So sorry to hear you continue to have problems.

[gfweb]

22 hours ago, SLB said:

Newsflash!  Oven won't light!  

 

Sigh.  

The oven lights slowly. Who knows why. Its a Blue Star  thing

Set the temp and walk away for a couple minutes.

[SLB]

No -- it wasn't lighting at all.  

 

Turns out the new igniter was bad, see image below with strange white spots at the top.  It did something weird when it was first installed  -- sparked like it was burning off something -- which the tech noted, but then it smoothed out, and worked fine for about 2 weeks. 

 

Until yesterday, with a 10-egg frittata ready for some hear, no dice.  

 

Bluestar is sending me another new igniter.  Squabble over the labor -- I see the problem as about the warranty of the latest igniter, and not any error on the part of the tech.  So tech needs to be paid by them for the replacement work.

 

I'm confident we'll work it out.  

 

But in the meantime, it's back to Stovetop Cooking.  

Edited March 11, 2021 by SLB (log)

[gfweb]

8 minutes ago, SLB said:

No -- it wasn't lighting at all.  

 

Turns out the new igniter was bad, see image below with strange white spots at the top.  It did something weird when it was first installed  -- sparked like it was burning off something -- which the tech noted, but then it smoothed out, and worked fine for about 2 weeks. 

 

Until yesterday, with a 10-egg frittata ready for some hear, no dice.  

 

Bluestar is sending me another new igniter.  Squabble over the labor -- I see the problem as about the warranty of the latest igniter, and not any error on the part of the tech.  So tech needs to be paid by them for the replacement work.

 

I'm confident we'll work it out.  

 

But in the meantime, it's back to Stovetop Cooking.  

 

wow

look at that!

[CentralMA]

On 3/10/2021 at 9:08 AM, Gayle28607 said:

@CentralMA How are you liking your Blue Star? I’d love an update when you have time. This has been a very informative thread.

 

Well, so far I'm quite pleased. The cooktop is better than I imagined. My wife is getting quite comfortable with the gas oven, excellent results so far. The banana bread has been the hit of the neighborhood kids.

 

I've stated in earlier posts that it was a struggle to get my better half to acquiesce to a $5000 range. I pushed the purchase with her almost knowing when I signed....

 

Now I wish I had gone with the 36", lost 6" of cabinets and gained a griddle. My wife thinks the same. Ah well.

 

And Trump paid for 1/2 of the range, now Biden is paying for the other half. Life is good.

 

On other news, we've got a water main break in the front of the house. Full shutdown 8am - 4pm tomorrow. Just put buckets out in the front walk, filled them with water. Maybe 50 - 60 gallons. For the neighbors, and our own use. It's a real crappy neighborhood....

[Gayle28607]

12 hours ago, CentralMA said:

Well, so far I'm quite pleased. The cooktop is better than I imagined. My wife is getting quite comfortable with the gas oven, excellent results so far. The banana bread has been the hit of the neighborhood kids.

 

I've stated in earlier posts that it was a struggle to get my better half to acquiesce to a $5000 range. I pushed the purchase with her almost knowing when I signed....

 

Now I wish I had gone with the 36", lost 6" of cabinets and gained a griddle. My wife thinks the same. Ah well.

I'm glad to know about your positive experience with the oven, too. I've been thinking about getting one of these - also 30 inch because of existing cabinetry. I think hearing both the good AND the bad is useful, at least for me. I'm in no rush as I have a Kenmore Elite glass cooktop that is serviceable. But when the electricity goes out, which happens often enough, I find myself longing for the days when I had a gas stove. I'll have to get the gas line routed to the kitchen and so on, much like you, so I've book marked this as it has been illuminating regarding the various things to think about.

[CentralMA]

I believe I saw an announcement recently that BlueStar is coming out with a gas top / electric oven unit?

[tppytel]

As others have noted, this has been an informative thread - thanks all!

 

I just purchased a new 30" open-burner RCS - pedestrian by Bluestar's standards, but quite the dream of mine. I'm looking forward to getting it installed in 2 weeks or so after we get some other work done for a backsplash and hood. It will be perversely amusing seeing a kick-ass range like that in our shabby old kitchen... function over form, baby! Maybe we'll rehab the kitchen once we put the kids through college and with luck the Bluestar will still be kicking by then.

 

Any info or tips on the current Bluestar RCS or parts are appreciated. Sounds like I'll want to give some attention to adjusting the simmer burner at least. I'm interested in the "DIY 22K Burner" option that others have mentioned. Seems like the 18K/22K burners are still available online without a serial number and the orifice is a standard part, unless something has changed recently. I could easily live with "just" the 15K burners but having a single 22K sounds awfully enticing for stir-fry work. If anyone has, like... burned their house down - or racked up a huge repair bill - that would be nice to know. I'm not sold on it either way yet. We'll have a relatively modest 450 CFM hood running at 28" above the stove, but I can't see us running more than a single burner at full blast. It's rare I have more than two pots on the stove in the first place, especially if I'm stir-frying.

 

I'm also looking ahead to replacing my old 14" flat-bottom wok with a mix of excitement and sorrow. My girlfriend (now wife of 20+ years) and I mail-ordered that wok from The Wok Shop back in college. Ah... the days of putting a check in an envelope. The wok is the oldest pan in our kitchen. But I've got to get a round-bottom wok to use those fancy new burners, right? Do Bluestar wokkers go with a 14" or 16"? Or even something bigger? Seems like the burners should handle a 16" (especially at 22K), which would be convenient when stir-frying for bigger groups though it probably doesn't leave much space on other burners. I could maybe do both a 14" and a 16" round. Storage space isn't that tight here.

 

Can't wait to cook on this thing.

[gfweb]

Definitely adjust the simmer burner.  There are you tubes...very easy.  Or ask the installer to do it

 

I just have the 15 K burners which are plenty hot for any cooking I do. Certainly hotter than what's in a Chinese home range where lots of woks are used.

[CentralMA]

1 hour ago, tppytel said:

As others have noted, this has been an informative thread - thanks all!

 

I just purchased a new 30" open-burner RCS - pedestrian by Bluestar's standards, but quite the dream of mine. I'm looking forward to getting it installed in 2 weeks or so after we get some other work done for a backsplash and hood. It will be perversely amusing seeing a kick-ass range like that in our shabby old kitchen... function over form, baby! Maybe we'll rehab the kitchen once we put the kids through college and with luck the Bluestar will still be kicking by then.

 

Any info or tips on the current Bluestar RCS or parts are appreciated. Sounds like I'll want to give some attention to adjusting the simmer burner at least. I'm interested in the "DIY 22K Burner" option that others have mentioned. Seems like the 18K/22K burners are still available online without a serial number and the orifice is a standard part, unless something has changed recently. I could easily live with "just" the 15K burners but having a single 22K sounds awfully enticing for stir-fry work. If anyone has, like... burned their house down - or racked up a huge repair bill - that would be nice to know. I'm not sold on it either way yet. We'll have a relatively modest 450 CFM hood running at 28" above the stove, but I can't see us running more than a single burner at full blast. It's rare I have more than two pots on the stove in the first place, especially if I'm stir-frying.

 

I'm also looking ahead to replacing my old 14" flat-bottom wok with a mix of excitement and sorrow. My girlfriend (now wife of 20+ years) and I mail-ordered that wok from The Wok Shop back in college. Ah... the days of putting a check in an envelope. The wok is the oldest pan in our kitchen. But I've got to get a round-bottom wok to use those fancy new burners, right? Do Bluestar wokkers go with a 14" or 16"? Or even something bigger? Seems like the burners should handle a 16" (especially at 22K), which would be convenient when stir-frying for bigger groups though it probably doesn't leave much space on other burners. I could maybe do both a 14" and a 16" round. Storage space isn't that tight here.

 

Can't wait to cook on this thing.

OK. As the original poster I'll add in here.

 

I love my BlueStar. I did go with the big burners, and Im glad I did. I've sourced two woks, thrift store finds (months of searching, I'm picky), sizes vary by about 2 to 3 inches. Maybe 4. 

 

My wife works with some lovely people that have been instructing her on the finesse of Vietnamese eggrolls. With the woks and the BlueStar the results have been very nice.

 

My wife, the baker, has adjusted to a gas oven. Great results.

 

My recently acquired heavy Darto pan has become the implement of choice.

 

It just gets better and better. I should have bought this years ago.

[gfweb]

10 minutes ago, CentralMA said:

OK. As the original poster I'll add in here.

 

I love my BlueStar.

It just gets better and better. I should have bought this years ago.

Completely agree. Who knew a simple really hot bunch of burners would be more....fun.

[tppytel]

@gfweb - I'm probably going to end up doing the actual install myself. The delivery guys are just going to drop it off in my kitchen, uncrate it, and level it. Any particular tips on installation from anyone are welcome. I'd gladly pay the $100 installation fee on the $4000 stove but that adds another layer of scheduling and another 2-3 week delay. I was lucky to find the RCS in stock right now at all with appliance availability being what it is. It's crazy finding anyone to do anything right now, or the parts for them to do it with. Plus I like doing things myself when I can.

 

I totally agree that 15K is damn hot already. I stir-fry now on a 15K Iwatani butane burner and I'm not at all unhappy with it. The basic Bluestar does that already with a far better burner pattern and stability for round woks. But... I *can* do a 22K, right? For less than $200 and a bit of tinkering? Seems pretty attractive, even if hardly necessary. As I understand it, there's absolutely no difference in the actual stove between the RCS and RNB beyond the burner parts themselves. Yeah... warranties, insurance, etc. I get it. I do. Like I said, not sold yet. Gonna get it in and play around with it and see what I think.

 

@CentralMA - I'm curious about what exactly you were looking for in thrifting woks like that. Is there something you were looking for that you couldn't find elsewhere? Even a high-end 16" hand-hammered carbon steel wok isn't all that expensive.

 

As for the gas oven... yeah, I thought about that a lot. I do some reasonably serious cake and pastry work myself. But all the absolute worst horror stories I read about Viking/Wolf gear revolved around dual-fuel ranges with dodgy oven elements that hit owners for $1K repair bills over and over and over. I can live with a gas convection oven in exchange for a better shot at reliability. I could get cakes I was proud of out of my old crappy Maytag... I'm sure I can do at least that well with a Bluestar gas convection unit. If I want to get really hardcore about it, I could get a small commercial convection oven and run it in the mud room off the kitchen. Probably that would require a 220V line, but that's not so expensive to install if I really want it. Better - IMO - than worrying about the reliability of our main range. YMMV. But I very much doubt I'll ever go that far.

[weinoo]

Don't have any problem here using a flat bottom, 14" carbon steel wok (from The wok Shop, iirc!) on 15K burners. 

[CentralMA]

21 hours ago, tppytel said:

@gfweb - I'm probably going to end up doing the actual install myself. The delivery guys are just going to drop it off in my kitchen, uncrate it, and level it. Any particular tips on installation from anyone are welcome. I'd gladly pay the $100 installation fee on the $4000 stove but that adds another layer of scheduling and another 2-3 week delay. I was lucky to find the RCS in stock right now at all with appliance availability being what it is. It's crazy finding anyone to do anything right now, or the parts for them to do it with. Plus I like doing things myself when I can.

 

I totally agree that 15K is damn hot already. I stir-fry now on a 15K Iwatani butane burner and I'm not at all unhappy with it. The basic Bluestar does that already with a far better burner pattern and stability for round woks. But... I *can* do a 22K, right? For less than $200 and a bit of tinkering? Seems pretty attractive, even if hardly necessary. As I understand it, there's absolutely no difference in the actual stove between the RCS and RNB beyond the burner parts themselves. Yeah... warranties, insurance, etc. I get it. I do. Like I said, not sold yet. Gonna get it in and play around with it and see what I think.

 

@CentralMA - I'm curious about what exactly you were looking for in thrifting woks like that. Is there something you were looking for that you couldn't find elsewhere? Even a high-end 16" hand-hammered carbon steel wok isn't all that expensive.

 

As for the gas oven... yeah, I thought about that a lot. I do some reasonably serious cake and pastry work myself. But all the absolute worst horror stories I read about Viking/Wolf gear revolved around dual-fuel ranges with dodgy oven elements that hit owners for $1K repair bills over and over and over. I can live with a gas convection oven in exchange for a better shot at reliability. I could get cakes I was proud of out of my old crappy Maytag... I'm sure I can do at least that well with a Bluestar gas convection unit. If I want to get really hardcore about it, I could get a small commercial convection oven and run it in the mud room off the kitchen. Probably that would require a 220V line, but that's not so expensive to install if I really want it. Better - IMO - than worrying about the reliability of our main range. YMMV. But I very much doubt I'll ever go that far.

 

Thrifting woks...it's the hunt, don't you know.

 

I'm certainly not finding anything better in a product, but as I don't "need" them, I can wait for the fun to happen. Out in my area I can find good vintage carbon steel woks, most look like they've been used once or twice or not at all. Usually well under $5.00. I'm set, but I've been looking out for more for my youngest on their request.

 

Same with other kitchen items. Recent finds have been a cast iron Weber branded skillet, designed to work with their "Gourmet BBQ System", I have the needed fixtures for my 22" kettle. Other recent Weber finds were a new in box vertical chicken roaster, and a new in box pizza stone accessory. Both vintage goods, and quite usable. 

 

Cast iron oyster grill pan? Got that too. Fun to use and looks great serving the table. And again, at less than 10% of what it would be retail.

 

But, anyway. Talking about self installing...

 

I went that route, but to an extreme. I picked up the stove at the dealer myself, got it into the back of a van, transported over state lines (sounds bad, huh? but saved a state tax...) and got it into my house with the help of a good friend. Saved me a bit over $600 (about 10%) off of other quotes in my area, that included delivery into the house, but not the actual installation. Remember that these stoves weight well over 300 lbs, getting them into a tight spot after hooking up the gas line is not easy.

 

For our install I had a plumber in to extend our gas line to the kitchen area (we had electric stove previous). As part of the $500 charge he would come back for the final install, permit signing, etc. I rented an AirSled from a rental outfit some 30 miles away for a half day, about $30 or so. Scheduled the plumber for that time spot. With the AirSled and some extra shimming from scrap lumber for height the two of us were able to slide the stove in with just finger pressure on the front of the stove. It was like the 350 lbs was on ice. Once tested for operation, he left. I leveled it myself, again the Airsled in use. 

 

 

I also looked at getting the less expensive model, then eventually getting the hotter burner in by hook or by crook. But then the Gov't decided to pass out a bunch of $$$$, I decided to spend it on a true American made product (Something I don't usually look to do as a priority). That paid for half of it. And then incredibly enough, they gave me the other half this year? What's up with that?  

 

As part of the BlueStar purchase I agreed to put the electric oven in the basement, with 220v accessible. My wife was seriously concerned about the baking aspect. So far it's not been used.

 

She also was somewhat against the purchase itself of the BlueStar. After the install and a couple of uses, she was going through the installation manual / instruction set and asked me why I didn't get the 36" with griddle? My oh my...

 

And with the hot burners, get yourself some good thick carbon steel pans. Darto, de Buyer Mineral B, others. A pleasure to use. Indestructible. 

 

 

 

 

[gfweb]

@CentralMA
couldn't agree more. The carbon steel goes great with the BS. I have a darto and a matfer...joy to cook with. But the all clad master chef are happy there too. 

 

Re the griddle, I had a Vulcan with a big one. Maybe used it twice. PITA to clean and unless you cook for a crowd its more than you need

[CentralMA]

15 minutes ago, gfweb said:

@CentralMA
couldn't agree more. The carbon steel goes great with the BS. I have a darto and a matfer...joy to cook with. But the all clad master chef are happy there too. 

 

Re the griddle, I had a Vulcan with a big one. Maybe used it twice. PITA to clean and unless you cook for a crowd its more than you need

 

My wife likes a griddle for arepas, pancakes, bacon, flatbreads (as do I). 

 

Going from a 30" to a 36" would have taken up counter and cabinet space, something that was in contention at the time. Add in an expense of another $800 or so.

 

But, now that we're here, we could have easily given up the counter and cabinet space, and the $800 wouldn't have been a dealbreaker. But, it was the time and place of a kitchen redo, with the majority of the design and actual labor our own. Not something I'd do again.

 

Well, maybe I would. But I'd like to shoehorn in a 48" unit....that'd go over well.