marijuana food

[sladeums]

8<

( i just posted this under another thread, how the hell did that happen?)

>8

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um, because you were high chef?

[Patrick S]

Do shrooms provide munchie type cravings?

I am unfamiliar with this with regard to shrooms...

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No. Quite the opposite. Nausea is quite common in the first hour or so after eating shrooms.

[Patrick S]

No!  For goodness sakes don't wash it!  But do destem it and then run it thru your spice grinder before making the brownies, for best results.

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You could wash it if you are going to use it in food. The THC is contained in glandular trichomes which are waxy and are not going to be washed away, so long as you are gentle. Cannabinoids in general are almost completely insoluble in water.

[Patrick S]

Back in my techno loving days, I got my hands on some hash oil.  It's a thick black sludge, not at all unlike engine oil.  I thought brownies would be a good way to go.  Nope.

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From your description, this was an oil extracted from cannabis using alcohol as a solvent. By far the best oils are derived using a butane extraction, which yields a superpotent (90%+ THC by weight) oil that looks just like honey and has the same viscosity.

[Patrick S]

First, from a purely scientific perspective:  Hashish and weed have Delta 6-tetrahydrocannibinol in them.  It is with the addition of heat, that it turns into that rigthgeous delta 9-tetrahydrocannabinol.

So, the whole point of eating raw hashish or raw weed (how do you swallow raw weed...yuck) is that you're wasting it, because of the relative greater psychotropic properties of delta 9 vs. delta 6.

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Actually, there is another major reason why eating cannabis is extraordinarily inefficient, a reason that is common to many other drugs. The reason is this -- hepatic, or 'first-pass' metabolism. When you eat cannabis, the THC must first pass through your stomach and then the liver, where most of it is degraded by DMEs (drug-metabolizing enzymes) to inactive metabolites, before it can ever reach the cannabinoid receptors in the brain and exert any psychoactive effects. This is in contrast to inhalational delivery, in which THC merely has to diffuse across a 0.5 micron thick capillary membrane in pulmonary capillaries, straight into the systemic circulation. This effect is not something unique to THC, but is common to a lot of drugs. Here's something I wrote on the subject about 2 years ago, based on my review of the scientific literature of cannabinoid pharmacology.

The bioavailability of THC, i.e. the amount of THC in a given dose that makes it to general circulation, varies dramatically depending on the method of delivery. When THC is delivered intraveneously (a bioavailability of 100%), it produces effects at only 0.06mg/kg (Ohlsson et al, 1980). Intravenous doses of 5mg can produce peak plasma concentrations of greater than 400 µg/L (Kelley and Jones, 1992). The amount of THC in a cigarette is typically between about 10 and 100mg of THC. A single, high potency (10% THC by weight) cannabis cigarette weighing one gram contains 100mg of THC. Half or more of this THC is lost in sidestream smoke that is never delivered to the lungs (Perez-Reyes, 1990). Experiments using a smoking machine show that depending on puff volume and puff interval, as little as 16-19% of the THC present in the cigarette may be delivered as mainstream smoke, while as much as 69% is transferred to mainstream smoke if the cigarette is smoked in a single puff with no loss via sidestream smoke (Davis et al, 1984). About 30% of THC is assumed to be destroyed by pyrolysis. More THC is lost due to incomplete absorption of inhaled doses in the lungs. Actual bioavailability via a cigarette, i.e. the percentage of THC in the cigarette that is delivered to general circulation, ranges from 10 to 35%, and varies according to puff volume, breathhold duration, and depth of inhalation (Grotenhermen, p. 331). More experienced users tend to achieve higher levels. This appears to be due to different smoking behaviors in experienced users, since plasma levels and AUC values are about the same for heavy and light users following intravenous THC administration (Ohlsson et al, 1982). Bioavailability is higher (45% in one case) with pipes, which reduces loss via sidestream smoke (Agurell and Leander, 1971).

Bioavailability is significantly lower with oral consumption, due in part to elimination via that gastrointestinal tract, and to the first-pass effect. THC must first pass through the liver, where it is degraded by drug metablizing enzymes, before reaching the general circulation. This means that much higher oral doses of THC are needed to achieve smoking-typical plasma concentrations of THC. Bioavailability of dronabinol has been estimated to be approximately 7+/-3% (Spokart et al, 2001). Peak plasma concentrations following 20mg oral doses of THC were only 4.4-11 µg/L (Ohlsson et al, 1980). The much slower release of THC into systemic circulation also results in much lower peak plasma concentration, though the low levels are sustained for a much longer period of time. Oral THC results in a much higher proportion of the psychoactive THC metabolite 11-OH-THC, which about as psychotropically potent as THC itself (Perez-Reyes et al, 1972). With smoking, the peak plasma levels of 11-OH-THC are about 1/20th that of THC, while oral adminstration produces peak plasma ratios closer to 1:1 (Grotenhermen, p. 336).

Edited January 22, 2005 by Patrick S (log)

[deltadoc]

Oral THC results in a much higher proportion of the psychoactive THC metabolite 11-OH-THC, which about as psychotropically potent as THC itself (Perez-Reyes et al, 1972). With smoking, the peak plasma levels of 11-OH-THC are about 1/20th that of THC, while oral adminstration produces peak plasma ratios closer to 1:1 (Grotenhermen, p. 336).

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Finally, a real scientist! I remember a friend giving me several lbs (read: elbows) of particulary yucky herb. I first performed the acetone extraction, and then proceeded to perform a secondary process on the extract which involved using NaHCO3 to produce "honey oil" which was a beautiful red oil.

While I started with several lbs. of the yucky herb, I ended up with only several drops of the red oil.

It was wonderful, but disappointing due to the fact there was so little of it. Yet, in retrospect, those few drops turned something that was completely unusable into a small, yet wonderful, few drops of heaven.

Ah....the old days.

Yes!

doc

[jodicalhoun]

Oral THC results in a much higher proportion of the psychoactive THC metabolite 11-OH-THC, which about as psychotropically potent as THC itself (Perez-Reyes et al, 1972). With smoking, the peak plasma levels of 11-OH-THC are about 1/20th that of THC, while oral adminstration produces peak plasma ratios closer to 1:1 (Grotenhermen, p. 336).

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Finally, a real scientist! I remember a friend giving me several lbs (read: elbows) of particulary yucky herb. I first performed the acetone extraction, and then proceeded to perform a secondary process on the extract which involved using NaHCO3 to produce "honey oil" which was a beautiful red oil.

While I started with several lbs. of the yucky herb, I ended up with only several drops of the red oil.

It was wonderful, but disappointing due to the fact there was so little of it. Yet, in retrospect, those few drops turned something that was completely unusable into a small, yet wonderful, few drops of heaven.

Ah....the old days.

Yes!

doc

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And greet the new days! Adding stems and "water leaf" to a glass pint of any good cold pressed peanut oil and left for several days, even weeks will provide an excellent rub for aches, bruises and the like. It will not, unfortunately get you high unless you follow the above mentioned extraction processes, but the muscle rub value has been documented since the 19th century in Asia and is in use in the northwest currently to replace OTC liniments. A warning...besides setting off the dogs at ANY security check point, your clothing will become saturated with an oily substance that will make them stand alone in the corner. Burning them is preferable to washing unless you follow the oil-field practice of a bottle of Coke per wash (Really!) to desolve this soiled clothing sludge. Also , it takes several days to feel the effects, but keep at it. Reccomended by a high country EMT-trainer for cross-country racers and Triatheloners. Michael Calhoun

[Patrick S]

Adding stems and "water leaf" to a glass pint of any good cold pressed peanut oil and left for several days, even weeks will provide an excellent rub for aches, bruises and the like. It will not, unfortunately get you high unless you follow the above mentioned extraction processes, but the muscle rub value has been documented since the 19th century in Asia and is in use in the northwest currently to replace OTC liniments.

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I've never tried this, but I've heard other people swear by topical cannabis extracts as well. And there is an abundance of research showing that THC and cannabidiol have anti-inflammatory, analgesic and immunomodulatory properties. So there may be something to it. But I admit I'm puzzled as to how it would work, because natural cannabinoids are exceedingly 'lipophilic' (fat-loving) and it is very difficult for them to diffuse past the fatty layer of skin known as the stratum corneum. In experiments where cannabinoids are delivered transdermally (i.e. in a patch on the skin), typically only the tiniest amounts are detected in the bloodstream (amounts far too small to produce a psychoactive effect). There are some newer, synthetic, water-soluble cannabinoids that are much better candiates for transdermal delivery though. It may be that the therapeutic effect of topical cannabis extract is not mediated by cannabinoids, but by some other compounds in the extract. I dont know one way or the other, but thats my 2 cents.

Edited January 24, 2005 by Patrick S (log)

[Romy]

Well, I guess I'm going to bring this discussion back into the realm of the anecdote:

Went to a party a fairly long time ago with a friend of mine. She was intensely high (and yes, I was completely sober, an impartial observer, of course!) on E, and had bought a bag of oranges on her way over. As soon as she got to the point where mingling without handling people was nearly impossible, she pulled me over to a couch in a back room and started talking and peeling and eating the oranges, one after another, after another, after another... until the whole bag was gone. When she got through that last orange, she dropped the bag in her lap, and we just stared at each for a moment. I pointed at her and stated the obvious: "You ate the whole thing! You're gonna die!"

The night went on, and was a fantastic time-- but needless to say, she was not a happy person for the next few days. Pretty hilarious from my perspective though!

But as for what to eat while conventionally high: I think grilled cheese is great. Ice cream with huge gobs of peanut butter. Buckets of chips and salsa. Steak fries covered in salt and ketchup. Any fast food, especially if someone else goes to buy it. And extra thin, crsipy cheese pizza. A whole one. For myself.

Edited January 30, 2005 by Romy (log)

[NulloModo]

Speaking of munchy-food, check out Chef Ra's Random Munchie Generator, some of it is hilarious, some of it looks downright tasty...

http://www.hightimes.com/ht/lounge/content.php?page=munchie

[Daniel]

I love the scrapple grahm cracker sandwich.. For some reason cocktail franks and lemon wedges made me lose it.. That shizz is funny.

[Patrick S]

When i lived in Pt. St. Lucie,Fl. from 84-86 there was a cow pasture about 2 blocks from my house that you could literally stuff a garbage bag full of magical mushrooms,well we made shroom tea and preceded to watch "The Wall",worst and last trip of my life.I seriously thought i was having a nervous break down and spent 6 hours in my room traumatized with images of goose stepping hammers and such.lol good old days my ass

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LOL! How about the part with animated snake/flower/woman/monster chasing Bob Geldolf in the hotel room? Or the school kids marching off of the conveyor belt into the meat-grinder? Or Bob Geldof shaving his nipples off? Seriously, how did watching 'The Wall' on psychedelics ever become a tradition?

Thank goodness the kids of today have more wholesome, less traumatizing movies to watch while tripping, like 'Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas,' or Ren and Stimpy episodes.

[Lonnj]

...and some Funions, man.

(If that makes no sense, go see Half Baked)

[patti]

...But do destem it and then run it thru your spice grinder before making the brownies, for best results....

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Damn, that's where we went wrong. Talk about some tough and crunchy brownies! We figured it out in time for the second ceiling staring batch, though.

Taco Bell. Always the perfect munchie, way way back in the day.

[creaton]

This thread brings back some great memories of stumbling around Amsterdam on a mission for food...

Orange juice and Cheetos were always my munchie foods of choice. Never have tasted OJ as good since....

[markovitch]

wow... this thread will never die

i guess the urge to experiment has broader considerations that food for a lot of us!

bubble bubble bubble...

i recently wrote a column for my college rag about munchies, maybe i should post it.

[kguetzow]

A little addition to the mushroom question, I have made big batches of Mushroom burgers. Always a hit. Just put dehydrated shrooms in the food processor and make into a fine powder. Distributes more evenly into the burger and avoids yucky taste. You can put quite a dose into one burger with very little change in taste. So be a good grill host and label the burgers "shroomed" and "regular".

And on the pot smokin' munchie food topic it always seemed to me that acidic food made me feel happy and helped dry mouth.... which is why we often munched on raw rhubarb. It's really good

Edited February 19, 2005 by kguetzow (log)

[Patrick S]

A little addition to the mushroom question, I have made big batches of Mushroom burgers.  Always a hit.  Just put dehydrated shrooms in the food processor and make  into a fine powder.  Distributes more evenly into the burger and avoids yucky taste.  You can put quite a dose into one burger with very little change in taste.  So be a good grill host and label the burgers "shroomed" and "regular".

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Tea works great for those who can't hang with the shroom mouthfeel. Crumble. Put in coffee maker. Brew. Drink. Trip.

[mizducky]

Heh. As an egullet newbie, I just can't resist adding to this thread ...

A college boyfriend of mine had a muchie routine he referred to as the Fresh Fruit Stone. Before we'd light up, we'd do a supermarket run for some really great fresh fruit--strawberries, melon, etc.--get it all washed, cut, and prepared, and then light up. Later, after much time listening to Firesign Theater and Doors records, we'd pig out most pleasantly...

Back in those days, I would occasionally get what I called Reverse Munchies--I would be craving eats, alright, but I could think of no food item I would want to put in my mouth in that highly sensitized state. On one occasion my smoking buddies and I lit up and then went to dinner in the dorm dining room. I collected an entire trayful of dinner, sat through the whole meal with my friends, and then deposited the entire meal, untouched, in the trash. You have to realize how *odd* this behavior was for me--I normally have to be at death's door to not eat food placed before me.

Oh, and then there was the College Theater Brownie Adventure. I was involved in a school production of The Who's "Tommy"--a terrific adventure in itself which, alas, would go way off-topic for this board. But anyway, a "secret" portion of the production budget was handed over to our costume designer to purchase, erm, supplies with which to make some brownies for the cast party; as she put it, there wasn't a whole lotta flour in them thar brownies. I recall spending a goodly amount of time at that cast party standing in the kitchen with the show's director, trying to decipher the instructions on a frozen pizza box, and only figuring out about a half-hour later that the pizza would get done a whole lot faster if we'd actually turn the oven on.

Edited February 26, 2005 by mizducky (log)

[Kayakado]

I can remember (well not really) in the late 60's we regularly pulled out a giant lasagne pan or something similar and made a layered dessert. I have been thinking about this recently and wishing I could remember the formula. I think we layered the bottom with crackers or cookies, maybe grahams or famous choc wafers but then we added layers of chocolate chips, potato chips, coconut, chocolate syrup, caramel, marshmallows, granola, honey, brown sugar, nuts, dried fruit, pretzels, probably anything we could find and baked it in the oven. It came out in a form that was sliceable and ohhhh, it was wonderful! Salty, sweet, crunchy, gooey.........if only I could remember the details.

[lesfen]

Damn you all!!! I've been on the weed wagon for over 4 years, and you're making me want to jump right off... right into the grocery store!

The ex and I used to get high on Sundays (we tried to be responsible pot heads) and I'd set to making grilled sandwiches. Good bread, good butter, melty cheese, stone ground mustard, and what ever meat looked good. Awww maaaaannn!! I wanna sandwich!! Oh, and some of those Flaky Flix cookies, made by Mother's (I think), but I'd have to go back west for those. Hm... maybe the ex will mail me a package.

If we had extra cash, I'd make him take me to Jack Shrimp and we'd burn in the parking lot. You've never seen anything as intense as two stoners, a bowl of peel and eat shrimp, spicy broth, and a basket of bread 'n butter.

Oh, and the other think that made me consider buying a pack of Jokers is the new Take 5 candy bar! Oh my god! Stoners never had it so good!

[DeVeaux]

I had a buddy in college who would NEVER bring food to our "toke-downs", but never hesitated to eat what everyone else brought. One night when we had cheddar cheese & triscuit munchies we decided to teach him a lesson.

We cut up a bar of orange Dial Soap into bite sized pieces, put them on triscuits, and placed the plate on the coffee table. He helped himself to the whole plate, too stoned to notice the flavor or that no one else was eating. Until the next morning.

The wierdest thing we ever ate was the big shredded wheat biscuits with cream cheese on them, since that was all that was in the cupboard.

[touaregsand]

I never get the munchies. Well that should be past tense, my smoking days are over, well if I'm at a party and it's just there. I have no discipline.

Anyway, highschool. We were partying. Bong and some joints. One guy was smoking Thai buds...um... a little while later he's drinking the bong water! Would that qualify as a "marijuana munchie"?

Is the stuff from Humboldt still the best in Cali *sigh*

[Patrick S]

I never get the munchies. Well that should be past tense, my smoking days are over, well if I'm at a party and it's just there.    I have no discipline.

Anyway, highschool. We were partying. Bong and some joints. One guy was smoking Thai buds...um... a little while later he's drinking the bong water!  Would that qualify as a "marijuana munchie"? 

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No, but it would qualify as a 'this is your brain on drugs' moment!

Is the stuff from Humboldt still the best in Cali *sigh* 

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The best outdoor bud probably does come from Humboldt, Mendocino and Shasta. But nowadays, geography is completely irrelevant, because so many people have moved to an indoor grow, and you can grow the same freakishly potent doobage whether you live in Alaska or Cali.

[ChefDanBrown]

A number of years back I had a buddy who was a grower (no pun intnded) who would make butter out of evrything that was left from the cleaning and drying process, the process was big enough that he's borrow big stock pots from the restaurant we worked at. He's trade the high-test butter for whatever he could, and I managed to get my hand on a couple of pounds. I purchased a 10# bag of mussels and did the classic garlic-butter mussels with an obvious addition. I can still taste them. The sauce was rich, deep, and full of body, and they just got better and better as I plowed through them. I wound up eating about 3# myself, and my guests didn't leave a scrap of food in my house that night.

edited for typos

Edited March 2, 2005 by ChefDanBrown (log)