Japanese foods--kudamono

[torakris]

As Jin commanded!

Favorite fruits?

[Bigfoot]

Since coming back to the States, I have serious cravings for beautiful, sweet, perfect Japanese fruit (although not the price tag). Favorites:

Beautiful big strawberries

Persimmons in the fall

Crunchy, cold nashi

Juicy white peaches with their lovely perfume

Melon, of course (so ripe & juicy, no knife required once you've got a slice)

Big bag of lychees (does this count as Japanese?)

[torakris]

Japanese fruits are some of the best I have ever eaten, of courser they have the price tag to go with it!

huge, dark purple, juicy grapes

melons that are so soft they fall apart at the touch of your fork

the nashi in Japan can't even be compared to the ones sold abroad

I have also discovered new fruits like biwa, anyone know what this is?

[Bigfoot]

I think biwa are loquats -- I had them for the first time in Japan, too.

[torakris]

I think biwa are loquats -- I had them for the first time in Japan, too.

Thanks! That sounds right.

Just to lazy to go look it up!

[torakris]

and how can I forget the japanese cherry-- sakuranbo!!

[smallworld]

Actually, I'm not happy with the fruit situation in Japan. Not just the fruit itself, but the price, selection and availability.

First of all, too much value is placed on appearance and sweetness, so much so that I find all fruit tastes the same. Sure, the strawberries are sweet, but they don't have much of the juicy STRAWBERRY flavour they do back home. Apples don't have that apply tartness, grapes aren't very grapey.

I know I shouldn't compare everything to Canada, but can't help it- the fruit is so much better back home! So much more selection, longer seasons, MUCH cheaper prices. And how ironic that I could go to my local Asian market and pick up tropical fruit like mangoes, papayas, finger bananas and pineapples for dirt cheap, yet here, smack dab in the middle of Asia, these items are expensive and usually hard to find.

So anyway, I went from eating about 3 servings of fruit a day back home (5 or 6 in the summer) to one or less here in Japan. Not happy!

Well, I should finish my rant here before it gets any longer...

[torakris]

I know what you mean about prices!

We buy watermelons maybe once or twice a year and last year I never bought peaches, they seemed to be so high all summer. I wait for the gifts!

Once at the beginning of summer I saw a small bowl of American dark cherries, there wer maybe 14 or 15 in the bowl and the sign said 500yen ($5), I was a little high but I had a sudden craving for them, when i got up to the register it turned out I had neglected to read the fine print that said 500 yen for 100grams (less then a quarter pound) My small bowl cost just under $10!

I never ate cherries so slowly in my life.......I savored every expensive bite!

[rcarter]

I'm new to egullet, and your Japanese food thread has made me extremely homesick! The fruit I get at Asian markets in the U.S. just doesn't compare. The "Asian Pears" are good, but not quite Nashi. Clementines are not as satisfying as a good mican, and I really miss the tiny grapes that you pop from the skins into your mouth. I think I have seen them in food magazines as Champaign grapes, but I have yet to see in a store. I haven't been to Japan in a few years and oddly enough, I think about the fruit in season when I occasionally check out air fares. This forum might actually make me stop waiting and finally buy a ticket!

[torakris]

rcarter welcome to egullet!

hope to hear more from you on the Japan board.

I know what you mean about those little grapes, they are wonderful and I can never figure out why they are not more popular in the US.

[Jinmyo]

Yes, welcome rcarter.

As for me, I don't much care for fruit anymore. The apricots I had as a child... Sigh. Fruit today just tastes like sweet pulp.

Perhaps a Japanese apricot might heal my broken heart.

[smallworld]

Cherries! Oh how I miss them. Back home our neighbor has a few cherry trees and there are a few weeks in the summer when they keep bringing us bowls of them. Non-stop juicy cherries- fantastic!

I think I'll have to time my next trip home to coincide with cherry season.

RCarter, I agree about the mikan. That's the only fruit that is reasonably priced, delicious, and available most of the year. In the summer mikan are sometimes eaten half-frozen- a very refreshing snack.

[Muffin210]

My boyfriend and I visited Japan together last fall and were fascinated by the beautiful fruit displays in the department store food floors and dedicated fruit shops. Even though the fruits were absolutely beautiful (and displayed/wrapped equally beautifully), we couldn't bring ourselves to spend that kind of money -- for example, $100+ for a single (albeit unblemished and amazingly symmetrical) melon. I'm guessing that the vast majority of these expensive fruits are given as gifts, but I'm wondering: has anyone tasted these themselves? Are they really worth the money? Or is it just the inflated prices that makes them such prestigious gifts?

[Jason Perlow]

Many kinds of fruit are obscenely expensive in Japan because it all has to be imported and they deteriorate very quickly when shipped. Those fruits grown locally are also expensive because there is so much llimited real estate for farming.

Only about 5-10 years ago did certain fruits which we consider commonplace in the US become widely avalaible in Japan. It was only after Japan started doing a lot of agricultural trade with Washington State in the last several years did Apples became more commonplace and relatively inexpensive. When they first started selling Washington State Apples, local supermarkets would have promotional events showing people how to eat an apple the "american way" by biting into it and taking a big chunk out of it -- previously, Apples were given as gifts (like when one would visit another's house, etc) and would be cut up in THIN sections and savored one at a time by a group of people as a delicacy. Same goes for peaches.

[smallworld]

Many kinds of fruit are obscenely expensive in Japan because it all has to be imported and they deteriorate very quickly when shipped. Those fruits grown locally are also expensive because there is so much llimited real estate for farming.

Only about 5-10 years ago did certain fruits which we consider commonplace in the US become widely avalaible in Japan. It was only after Japan started doing a lot of agricultural trade with Washington State in the last several years did Apples became more commonplace and relatively inexpensive. When they first started selling Washington State Apples, local supermarkets would have promotional events showing people how to eat an apple the "american way" by biting into it and taking a big chunk out of it -- previously, Apples were given as gifts (like when one would visit another's house, etc) and would be cut up in THIN sections and savored one at a time by a group of people as a delicacy. Same goes for peaches.

Imported fruits are expensive, yes. But so are domestically grown fruits. Those $100 melons are all grown right here in Japan.

Jason, I'm afraid someone has given you incorrect information. I'm pretty sure apples and peaches have been grown in Japan for ages, in fact I've never seen American-grown ones here. The only American fruits I recall seeing are blueberries, raspberries, and cherries (not that I buy them- they're ridiculously expensive!).

There is a wonderful variety of apples here and they're all quite nice. Some have become popular overseas (and in a nice reversal of the above, that includes in America). I remember going apple picking as a kid (in Canada) and being amazed at all the different apples, and I distinctly remember some Japanese varieties, like Fuji.

That said, I'd give anything for a tart, crisp, juicy Ontario apple!

And one more thing- I've never seen a Japanese person eat an apple the 'American way'! Gotta be chilled, peeled, and sliced.

[Hiroyuki]

The point is, there are farmers who are willing to grow such artistic products for whatever reason, and there are consumers who are willing to buy such artistic, expensive products for whatever reason, for their own use, whatever. And, there is a market catering for such customers. Such consumers are not always wealthy, but appreciate the true value of such products.

[Jason Perlow]

Jason, I'm afraid someone has given you incorrect information. I'm pretty sure apples and peaches have been grown in Japan for ages, in fact I've never seen American-grown ones here. The only American fruits I recall seeing are blueberries, raspberries, and cherries (not that I buy them- they're ridiculously expensive!).

Nah, its true, I remember there being a CNN peice on it.

[Jason Perlow]

http://www.american.edu/projects/mandala/T...japan-apple.htm

This case brief from American University Law School details the history of the Japanese import ban on apples and the releasing of the trade restrictions in 1995.

After Japan opened its apple import market in 1995, U.S apples

entered at much lower prices than their Japanese counterparts.

However, after initial success U.S. apple sales dropped off.

Japanese consumers complained that U.S. apples were too sour.

Note that I didn't say Japanese apples don't exist -- they sure do, but they are very expensive compared to the US imports.

BTW most of the "Fuji" varieties in the world are grown in Washington State (as are 90 percent of ALL apples grown in the US) and those "domestic" Japanese varieties get shipped back to Japan.

[Hiroyuki]

I read the posts of you two with great interest.

As a native Japanese, I have a say in this, but it's going to be a long story. In short, apples were as commonplace forty years ago as they are now in Japan (I'm 43), and we eat apples in both what you might call the American way and the other way that you two mentioned. That depends. Some Japanese may hesitate to eat apples the American way. Since the application of post-harvest agricultural chemicals to imported fruit and vegetables became a social issue here in Japan, I guess (just guess) that more Japanese have learned to eat them (and domestic ones, too) in the latter way.

And I remember the first year in which American apples were imported to Japan, as Jason Perlow mentioned. That event received a lot of news coverage. Even in such a small town as Shiozawa, far away from Tokyo, I saw American apples sold at a supermarket. I don't remember whether I bought some, though.

But, the point is, I'm pretty sure that Muffin210 is talking about those super, super expensive melons that he found in Japan, not the apples and other fruits that Japanese buy on a regular basis, whether or not you may think them expensive.

Edited March 31, 2004 by Hiroyuki (log)

[torakris]

My boyfriend and I visited Japan together last fall and were fascinated by the beautiful fruit displays in the department store food floors and dedicated fruit shops. Even though the fruits were absolutely beautiful (and displayed/wrapped equally beautifully), we couldn't bring ourselves to spend that kind of money -- for example, $100+ for a single (albeit unblemished and amazingly symmetrical) melon. I'm guessing that the vast majority of these expensive fruits are given as gifts, but I'm wondering: has anyone tasted these themselves? Are they really worth the money? Or is it just the inflated prices that makes them such prestigious gifts?

I have tasted quite a few of these outrageously priced fruits, obviously they were gifts I don't know anyone who would spend this much money on themselves.

Although you can still see them in stores, I think it was 15 to 20 years ago during the bubble when the giving of these was all about the prestige. The gift fruits are still out there but the 5000 yen ($50) range seems to be more common.

As to their taste, they are really good but in my opinion the $100 melon isn't much different than say a $25 melon except for it perfectly symmetrical shape and perfectly twisted stem. I have eaten $100 melons that actually melt in your mouth, but I have also experienced this with types in the $25 range.

Some of the best fruits I have had in this country are of the more expensive type, the cheaper kyohou grapes just don't seem to have the sweetness of their slightly pricier counterparts. The pricier the peach generally the sweeter, juicier it will be, though I have also sometimes splurged on pricier fruits sometimes to be incredibly dissapointed and then other times I pick up a bag of cheap apples at the supermarket only to be pleasantly surprised with their great taste. Though the cheap apples are never going to hjave this honey like sryup dripping out of the middle when you cut them like these very expensive apples I have eaten.

In my personal observations in Japan with fruit these are my feelings:

cheap fruits can be hit or miss; I have had stuff that was completely flavorless and then the next day get something that was just incredible

I generally divide the expensive fruits into 3 types

1. lowest level: more expensive than the cheap fruits but if you are not on a strict budget these can be bought for daily fruit eating; these are also hit or miss, this price range in no guarantee of flavor and this is probably the most common price range in the markets.

2. mid level: these are generally not for everday eating (unless you are very wealthy) and are more reserved for special occasions or when you have guests coming over or as for taking as a gift to someones house. I really wouldn't consider these prices outrageous and the quality on these fruits is usually the best, you are pretty much guaranteed to be getting a good product.

3.high level: these are the mega ezpensive fruits that are pretty much only for gift giving, I personally don't consider these worth their money and don't find the taste much better than their mid level range counterparts.

To get the best fruits in Japan, get them at the peak of their season and get them as close to their place of origin as possible, sometimes the best fruit can be found by ordering it directly from the farmer/orchard.

[torakris]

and we though $100 for a melon was expensive....

Last night on the news they were showing some black skinned watermelons that were selling for 250,000yen (about $2,500) a piece! Unfortunately I just caught the end of the story so I am not sure what made them so special.....

[Hiroyuki]

Unfortunately, I missed that news story, and I couldn't find any related story on the Internet. But, I did find this:

210,000-yen melon

http://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20040514...0109-kyodo-soci

On May 14, a box of two Yuubari melons was put up at auction (the first auction of the year) in a market in Sappro, Hokkaido, and was sold at the highest price ever, 420,000 yen, 90,000 yen higher than last year, by a local department store, Robinson Sapporo. The two melons were sold on the same day at the store, at the same price, 210,000 yen each.

You may ask, who's going to buy it? Never mind. I think it's more like advertising, trying to get attention.

Edited June 11, 2004 by Hiroyuki (log)

[butter]

When I lived in Japan, about 5 years ago, I had the most delicious sweet "mandarin" (not sure if that's what they are really called) oranges. Now that I'm in Canada I can't get the same sweetness and the amount of white, stringy pith is too much. I have bought boxes of these just to be very disappointed each time. Someone told me that perhaps I need to look for boxes that say "from Japan" (others come from Korea or China) on them so I did, but still not happy. Just wondering if you are all enjoying the same sweet oranges I did years ago or has the quality gone down? Or are we just getting the lower quality crops here in Canada? Last year, a flight attendant friend, brought some back from Osaka, and they were so juicy, sweet, and delicious. Some friends have never had the pleasure of the Japanese oranges, so they are quite satisfied with the ones we get here. Ahhhh, I miss the food in Japan, it is always done so well. (The exception is bread, but that's another topic.) Thanks in advance for your comments.

[torakris]

butter,

I live in Japan and I can't always get the good ones either.

It really seems to be hit or miss for me, there are about a hundred varieties here and I can't possibly remember them all to try to buy the same ones year after year. I normally just buy what is on sale at the supermarket and sometimes I hit the jackpot and sometimes I am stuck with duds.

A friend just came back from Shizuoka with gifts of mikan and I was very excited as Shizuoka is quite famous for their mikan but was quickly disappointed, they too have the pith that is impossible to remove and no sweetness at all. Now I have two bags of mikan that the kids don't want to eat....

[Hiroyuki]

I really can't give you good advice...

How about settling for canned mikan or having a Japanese friend or relative send Pom juice or something?

A description of Pom juice:

http://www.ehime-iinet.or.jp/ehime_e/prod/item3/item3.htm