Home Made Ice Cream (2015– )

[Darienne]

[Host's note: to avoid an excessive load on our servers this topic has been split.  The discussion continues from here.]

 

 

Many batches of Apple Pie Ice Cream later and I'm still in love...think it's the crust factor although I am embarrassed to say so.  I've never had cookie dough ice cream, but I imagine it's pretty much in the same category. 

I'm thinking about making Pumpkin Pie Ice Cream...or pretty much any pie ice cream...well, not Lemon Meringue...fruit pies, nut pies,...????   Thanksgiving (in October here in the Far Frozen North) might be a good time to try the Pumpkin idea. 

Edited December 28, 2015 by lesliec
Added host's note (log)

[Vasco]

Am I the only one that does not like icecream made with fruit because the flavor is always masked by the yolks/cream/milk?

When you get good fruit you just want to eat it like that, in its natural state, so sorbet is the natural option, yet the tendency atleast in portugal is icecream of any flavour over sorbet

[Smithy]

Am I the only one that does not like icecream made with fruit because the flavor is always masked by the yolks/cream/milk?

When you get good fruit you just want to eat it like that, in its natural state, so sorbet is the natural option, yet the tendency atleast in portugal is icecream of any flavour over sorbet

It might depend on the proportions you use. My fruit ice creams, made with nectarines, plums, peaches or raspberries, taste intensely of the fruit in question, but the dairy portion is relatively small in order to keep that flavor.

[RWood]

Many batches of Apple Pie Ice Cream later and I'm still in love...think it's the crust factor although I am embarrassed to say so.  I've never had cookie dough ice cream, but I imagine it's pretty much in the same category. 

I'm thinking about making Pumpkin Pie Ice Cream...or pretty much any pie ice cream...well, not Lemon Meringue...fruit pies, nut pies,...????   Thanksgiving (in October here in the Far Frozen North) might be a good time to try the Pumpkin idea.

I have Apple Crisp ice cream in the works right now, and pumpkin pie lined up. I have made lemon meringue ice cream. It was well received, but I'm not a meringue fan. I just baked a half sheet of meringue until lightly browned and dry. Then, crushed the pieces and added it to the lemon ice cream.

This has got to be one of my favorites: rosemary brown butter with hazelnuts. So good, I may put it with a fig special this weekend.

[Darienne]

Apple Crisp Ice Cream sounds quite doable.  And do you have crust in your Pumpkin Pie Ice Cream?

[RWood]

Apple Crisp Ice Cream sounds quite doable.  And do you have crust in your Pumpkin Pie Ice Cream?

Doubt I will do just crust, may go with ginger snaps.

[mgaretz]

I am going to try my cherry non-dairy ice cream with some pie crust to make cherry pie ice cream.  Travelling this week so will likely be next week until I get to it.

[Darienne]

mgaretz, I'll be interested to know how it works.  We're also on the road this week and so my pumpkin pie ice cream will have to wait.

[paulraphael]

Am I the only one that does not like icecream made with fruit because the flavor is always masked by the yolks/cream/milk?

When you get good fruit you just want to eat it like that, in its natural state, so sorbet is the natural option, yet the tendency atleast in portugal is icecream of any flavour over sorbet

 

You're not alone. But this can be a matter of degree. Sorbets are great, but a well made fruit ice cream can be great also. In the sorbet you taste an intensified version of the fruit; in an ice cream you taste fruit and cream. 

 

I agree 100% that the cream should be reduced and the eggs should not be perceptible. I'd suggest thinking more along the lines of what people in the U.S. consider gelato: aim for milk fat between 10 and 12%, and keep the eggs at or below two yolks per 1000g. If you go below this level of yolk, you may want to introduce another source of emulsifier.

[JoNorvelleWalker]

I am of the school that ice cream is all about texture, with the rich taste of eggs and cream.  Vanilla is lovely, as are leslie's bay leaves.  But just cream, sugar, and eggs are delightful.  Bright fruit flavors are for sorbet or for mai tais.  Your mileage may vary.

[Jim D.]

Many batches of Apple Pie Ice Cream later and I'm still in love...think it's the crust factor although I am embarrassed to say so.  I've never had cookie dough ice cream, but I imagine it's pretty much in the same category. 

 

Darienne,

You have convinced me to try this recipe.  I don't know which type of apple I will use (I agree with you about Delicious, but I find that Granny Smith are often tasteless), but it is the height of apple season here in Virginia, so I will have a wide selection.

 

One question:  Have you ever made it without the xanthan gum?  If so, how much of a problem is the iciness?

[Vasco]

Quick question, how much % fat do you aim for in the icecream base when you then want to add nuts that carry a high fat percentage for example cashew or pistachio that for every 100gr have 44g to 50g fat in them

[Darienne]

Darienne,

You have convinced me to try this recipe.  I don't know which type of apple I will use (I agree with you about Delicious, but I find that Granny Smith are often tasteless), but it is the height of apple season here in Virginia, so I will have a wide selection.

 

One question:  Have you ever made it without the xanthan gum?  If so, how much of a problem is the iciness?

I used Macs from our backyard tree with no problem.  Never tried it without the xanthan gum.  Sorry.  Should add that my ice cream base is always based on cornstarch and half & half.  No eggs.  No full fat cream.  And according to the chief boss the mouth feel is just fine for him.

[JoNorvelleWalker]

No more tomatoes this year, so it's back to ice cream on the kitchen counter:

 

heavy cream 1000 g

large egg yolks 6

sugar (sucrose) 120 g

kosher salt pinch

vanilla paste 1 Tablespoon (very approximate)

 

 

The mix (less the vanilla paste which is added just before spinning) brought quickly to 160 deg F on stovetop, then transferred to the Precise Heat Mixing Bowl set to 198 deg F.  Mindful of paulraphael's advice that cream has less milk solids than milk I compensated by reducing the mixture for an hour and forty five minutes rather than an hour in the PHMB.  On speed 2 of the KitchenAid KSM8990WH.

 

I may have over compensated on the milk solids but no matter.  More on that later.  After pouring into the homogenization vessel (my eight inch deep 1/6 hotel pan) temperature was 159 deg F.  Almost perfect.

 

I homogenized five minutes on high then transferred the vessel to an ice bath.  I've found the 8 quart bowl that comes standard with the KSM8990WH makes the perfect ice bath for the homogenization vessel.  The pan comes to the exact height and the corners just touch.  Almost as if they were made for one another.

 

I then refrigerated for about twenty hours.  After stirring in the vanilla paste I spun half the mixture in the Cuisinart for fifteen minutes, without bothering to read the draw temperature.  In my experience the spin time is crucial and the draw temperature, while interesting, is inconsequential to the result.

 

Then I spooned the frozen mix into a shallow hotel pan and deep froze as usual.

 

Ryan, my grandson, proclaimed the result "better than Costco" (a high compliment, I understand, indeed) and stated that there was no longer any need to go out and buy ice cream (from Thomas Sweets, a locally favored purveyor).  He asked if I had a magic wand?  "Why, yes," I said, "I do!"

 

I showed him the BioSpec 1285 and explained what it was for:  "Harry Potter should get a wand like that!"

 

My son questioned that when he was little I served whole cream ice cream that left his mouth coated in fat.  He wondered what was the difference.  I said it's the homogenizer!

 

But sadly I know all was not perfect.  The ice cream was softer that I would have liked.  I think the mix was over reduced.  And unfortunately I do not presently have a good method of monitoring the reduction other than by cooking time.

 

Ryan suggested that I should sell it.  I doubted one could make a profit considering the ingredients and the method.  My son countered it depends on how much you sell it for.

 

It was only later I remembered Ruben is actually doing this commercially.

 

[pbear]

... unfortunately I do not presently have a good method of monitoring the reduction other than by cooking time.

 

I've only been dropping into the thread occasionally, so apologies if this has been discussed.  My usual way of solving that problem is by using a scale.  Note weight of empty vessel; add liquid being reduced; calculate target weight (including the vessel); weigh as needed while reducing.  If overreduced, it's usually okay to add back a little water.

[JoNorvelleWalker]

I've only been dropping into the thread occasionally, so apologies if this has been discussed.  My usual way of solving that problem is by using a scale.  Note weight of empty vessel; add liquid being reduced; calculate target weight (including the vessel); weigh as needed while reducing.  If overreduced, it's usually okay to add back a little water.

 

The complication is that the Precise Heat Mixing Bowl sits in a commercial KitchenAid Mixer as it cooks.  There are scales that can deal with this kind of weight, but I don't have one.

[pbear]

Okay.  But, you can move the bowl/cooker (with stirring paddle, if convenient) to the scale and back more easily than you can decant the contents and check by volume.  And of course you'd still use time to decide when to start weighing.  Anyhoo, just a thought.

[JoNorvelleWalker]

The maximum capacity of my current scale is 300 g so I would have to weigh the mix in batches, the same way I weighed the cream in the first place.

[JoNorvelleWalker]

I just finished the last batch of ice cream.  (Finished eating, that is.)  Seems the problem yesterday was that I had not allowed sufficient time to harden.  I might have preferred it slightly harder still, however the hardness after another day was now quite acceptable.

 

Wish I had a real blast freezer.

[Vasco]

Good afternoon!

 

Has anyone tried the more scientific method of not heating up the icecream mixture past 71º to help prevent the development of that "eggy" and cooked milk flavour? Start reading about it recently and will definitely try!!

[JoNorvelleWalker]

Good afternoon!

 

Has anyone tried the more scientific method of not heating up the icecream mixture past 71º to help prevent the development of that "eggy" and cooked milk flavour? Start reading about it recently and will definitely try!!

 

Welcome to the discussion, Vasco.  Assuming that's 71 degrees Celsius, much of this thread is relevant.

[Ruben Porto]

Good afternoon!

 

Has anyone tried the more scientific method of not heating up the icecream mixture past 71º to help prevent the development of that "eggy" and cooked milk flavour? Start reading about it recently and will definitely try!!

 

A good evening to you Vasco!

 

I have indeed tried the around 72°C heating method and I for one think it's a marvellous way to make ice cream!

 

It takes a bit more time and effort but the results are certainly worth it.

 

Feel free to send any questions my way.

[Vasco]

It seems it is the best way to up the NFSM without adding milk powder although time consuming, have to try ALso ruben how did you come across the information that made you decide to do icecream with such a method?

Anyway settings my eyes on making a blood ice cream...have been thinking that ever since I tasted sanguinaccio, that italian chocolate/blood dessert. My question is...the blood replaces the eggs but to stand out as a flavor per say the amount has to be alot more than the usual yolks for a 1L ice cream.

Edited November 15, 2015 by Vasco (log)

[paulraphael]

It seems it is the best way to up the NFSM without adding milk powder although time consuming, have to try..

I'm going to suggest that milk powder is the best way to add MSNF, short of reverse osmosis. The trick is to find a good brand like Now, which 100% skim milk solids, and which is spray dried at low temperatures. If your goal is to concentrate milk solids while exposing them to the minimum amount of heat, you're not going to beat an industrial spray drier with your stove.

 

I've found that with the package sealed in an additional ziploc bag in the freezer, this kind of dry milk lasts months without developing off flavors.

[paulraphael]

Has anyone tried the more scientific method of not heating up the icecream mixture past 71º to help prevent the development of that "eggy" and cooked milk flavour? Start reading about it recently and will definitely try!!

 

I haven't experimented with temperatures below 71C, but did some systematic tests cooking the mix at 72C, 75C, and 80C (sous-vide, with agitation) for times ranging from 15 to 60 minutes.

 

I used a mix that had 2 egg yolks per 1000g (because I don't like a lot of egg) and no flavoring ingredients. It was 10% MSNF. Milk and cream were low-temperature pasteurized, from a local farm coop with grass-fed cows.

 

I did two rounds of blind triangle taste tests on myself, and one round on my girlfriend. 

 

The differences were extremely subtle. So subtle that after tasting four or five samples, fatigue was strong enough that we couldn't tell the difference between any of them anymore. I have doubts that there would be any perceptible difference if the ice cream had any flavor ingredients.

 

I doubt that cooking at 70C would have made much difference.

 

We were not tasting for texture.

Edited November 17, 2015 by paulraphael (log)