Jump to content
  • Welcome to the eG Forums, a service of the eGullet Society for Culinary Arts & Letters. The Society is a 501(c)3 not-for-profit organization dedicated to the advancement of the culinary arts. These advertising-free forums are provided free of charge through donations from Society members. Anyone may read the forums, but to post you must create an account.

Atomizer

Sous Vide & Traditionally Steamed Puddings

Recommended Posts

Hi I am thinking of making a Steak & Kidney Pudding and instead of steam it, I was thinking of vacuum packing the whole lot including the pudding basin and Sous Vide-ing. Does anyone know how the Suet Pudding Pastry would take to it, I was thinking of a Temp around 80C for 12 hours? David

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I seem to recall reading in the Pudding Club Cookbook that suet might require higher temperatures - but I'm thinking an experiment might be in order. Report back!


Edited by Kerry Beal (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thats what I thought if you don't experiment then you will never learn. As a meal for family I think I will cook something else alongside just incase.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I suspect if you tried the sous vide for a regular steamed pudding that the vacuum step might just knock all the air out of it and make it rather stodgy. Pressure cooker pudding suggests 20 minutes at simple boiling temperature before applying the pressure to prevent just that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

apropo the above:

i routinely SV my classic stuffing when Im dispatching a couple of 22 lbs Turks.

I make my traditional mix, ( cornbread, cranberries, apples, sausage, pecans, ... , ) and let it sit for a bit so the breadcrumbs equilibrate with the stock.

i then vacuum portions in bags ( Weston not Chamber ) and add them to the white meat batches SV

Why ? well, then its done. usually 4 - 8 6" x 10 " bags. 1 - 2 Arnnold CornBread stuffing mix bags ( unseasoned )

Ive learned to microwave the apple portion as the white meat temps do not cook the apples through ... still a bit of crunch left at SV White meat temps.

sausage etc cranberries etc.

the result is indeed stodgy. but tasty. and they wait expectantly in my freezer next to the SV white and dark meat.

I re-heat as I do the meat, but then open the bag, put the 'mass' in a corningware casserole dish and fluff it up a bit w a fork

then pop that into the Oven-toaster to brown the top.

is this as good as just cooking the mass en casserole ? nope. but being raring to go, its a bazillion times better than no stuffing at all.

just my thoughts on SV and "stodgy"


Edited by rotuts (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Interesting - last stuffing I made outside turkey was terribly dry - this would be a very worthwhile solution I think.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

your outside stuffing was dry simply because you didnt add enough stock to the mix before hand.

just saying. :raz:

( come on, its a Joke ! :wink: )

I have not added stuffing to any bird for at least 40 years. the key is the stock you use which makes all the diff.

F.D. I saw this first ( revelation ) on a Canadian Cooking Show a long time ago: Burt somebody was on a trans canadian RR trip it was about the Train Food and the various places they stopped at.

the Canadian RR did it outside the bird as did some massive massive hotel somewhere in the Rockies.

the SV is in that sense fairly new 2 years or so ..

added bonus: plenty of bags get used for breakfast : microwave an aliquot out side the bag of course, then top with SV eggs

Yum !


Edited by rotuts (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That was part of it for sure - I've made good outside stuffing once or twice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I suspect if you tried the sous vide for a regular steamed pudding that the vacuum step might just knock all the air out of it and make it rather stodgy. Pressure cooker pudding suggests 20 minutes at simple boiling temperature before applying the pressure to prevent just that.

I think that this is right. The thing wouldn't rise at all.

But the essence of steaming a pudding (and the pain in the ass of it) is controlling the heat by having a constant level of steam. For constant, don't worry about it heat; SV is the thing. Why not just plop your vessel into the SV so it is ~ 50% immersed and cover with the traditional towel. I'd pick a higher temp...90C? so as to get close to steam and keep your times the same.

I'm very interested in your expt. This year we abandoned the steamed persimmon pud because of the PITA factor and made individual sticky toffee puddings (which were great BTW).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The above is absolutely brilliant.

a new way to use the SV system.

Brilliant !

the perfect water bath. Set it, and do something else ...

examine your Cork Collection, for one

:biggrin:


Edited by rotuts (log)
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I suspect if you tried the sous vide for a regular steamed pudding that the vacuum step might just knock all the air out of it and make it rather stodgy. Pressure cooker pudding suggests 20 minutes at simple boiling temperature before applying the pressure to prevent just that.

I think that this is right. The thing wouldn't rise at all.

But the essence of steaming a pudding (and the pain in the ass of it) is controlling the heat by having a constant level of steam. For constant, don't worry about it heat; SV is the thing. Why not just plop your vessel into the SV so it is ~ 50% immersed and cover with the traditional towel. I'd pick a higher temp...90C? so as to get close to steam and keep your times the same.

I'm very interested in your expt. This year we abandoned the steamed persimmon pud because of the PITA factor and made individual sticky toffee puddings (which were great BTW).

Yes you are probably correct, but I was looking for the 12 hours time to make the meat really tender, which I don't think I would get with conventional timings ????

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I suspect if you tried the sous vide for a regular steamed pudding that the vacuum step might just knock all the air out of it and make it rather stodgy. Pressure cooker pudding suggests 20 minutes at simple boiling temperature before applying the pressure to prevent just that.

I think that this is right. The thing wouldn't rise at all.

But the essence of steaming a pudding (and the pain in the ass of it) is controlling the heat by having a constant level of steam. For constant, don't worry about it heat; SV is the thing. Why not just plop your vessel into the SV so it is ~ 50% immersed and cover with the traditional towel. I'd pick a higher temp...90C? so as to get close to steam and keep your times the same.

I'm very interested in your expt. This year we abandoned the steamed persimmon pud because of the PITA factor and made individual sticky toffee puddings (which were great BTW).

Yes you are probably correct, but I was looking for the 12 hours time to make the meat really tender, which I don't think I would get with conventional timings ????

Indeed - I think 12 hours or even longer would make nice tender meat.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good point, maybe a pre-SV for the meat, then again with everything in the basin for a second time? Looking at Nigella's recipe, I think this might work well


Edited by gfweb (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Similar Content

    • By boilsover
      Yes, the vacuum blender, Luddites.  http://www.gadgetreview.com/what-is-a-vacuum-blender
       
      I am waiting for the WiFi version, so I can turn my smoothie into soup from Mars.
    • By boilsover
      Solid intermediate cook, here.  Not especially intimidated by elaborate preps.  But I'm new to SV, and would like a recommendation for a cookbook for guidance and exploration.
       
      I was thinking of Tom Keller's Under Pressure, but I'm wondering if the preps he includes may not be the most generally useful.  What do you all like, and why?
       
      Thanks!
    • By Chris Hennes
      On Nov. 7, 2017, Modernist Bread will finally arrive on my doorstep. Having preordered it literally the first day it was available, to say I'm excited about this book is a bit of an understatement. The team at The Cooking Lab have been gracious enough to give @Dave the Cook and me early electronic access to the book and so I've spent the last week pouring over it. I'm just going to start with a few initial comments here (it's 2600 pages long, so a full review is going to take some time, and require a bunch of baking!). Dave and I would also be happy to answer any questions you've got.
       
      One of the main things I've noticed about this book is a change in tone from the original Modernist Cuisine. It comes across as less "everything you know is wrong" and more "eighty bazillion other bakers have contributed to this knowledge and here's our synthesis of it." I don't think it's an exaggeration to say that Myhrvold and company are now the most experienced bread-bakers in the world. Not necessarily in terms of the number of identical loaves they've produced, but in the shear number of different recipes and techniques they've tried and the care with which they've analyzed the results. These volumes are a distillation of 100,000 years of human breadmaking experience, topped off with a dose of the Modernist ethos of taking what we know to the next level.
       
      The recipes include weight, volume, and baker's percentages, and almost all of them can be made by both a home baker and someone baking in a commercial facility. The home baker might need to compromise on shape (e.g. you can't fit a full-length baguette in most home ovens) but the book provides clear instructions for both the amateur and professional. The recipes are almost entirely concentrated in volumes 4 and 5, with very few in the other volumes (in contrast to Modernist Cuisine, where there were many recipes scattered throughout). I can't wait for the physical volumes to arrive so that I can have multiple volumes open at once, the recipes cross-reference techniques taught earlier quite frequently.
    • By eG Forums Host
      Introduction

      Welcome to the index for the Sous Vide: Recipes, Techniques, & Equipment topic, one of the largest and most influential topics on eG Forums. (The topic has been closed to keep the index stable and reliable; you can find another general SV discussion topic here.) This index is intended to help you navigate the thousands of posts and discussions to make this rich resource more useful and accessible.

      In order to understand sous vide cooking, it's best to clear up some misconceptions and explain some basics. Sous vide cooking involves vacuum-sealing food in a plastic bag and cooking it in a water bath at precise temperatures. Though it translates literally as "under vacuum," "Sous vide" is often taken to mean "under pressure," which is a misnomer; not all SV cooking involves food cooked in conditions that exceed atmospheric pressure. (See below.) In addition, calculations for SV cooking involve not only time and temperature but also thickness. Finally, due to the anaerobic conditions inside the bag and the low temperatures used, food safety issues are paramount.

      You can read the basics of SV cooking and equipment here. In the summer of 2005, Nathan Myhrvold (Society member nathanm) posted this informative, "I'm now going to answer my own initial questions" post, which addresses just about everything up to that point. For what came next, read on -- and be sure to order Nathan Myhrvold's highly anticipated Modernist Cuisine book, due in spring 2011.

      As with all indexes of on-going discussions, this one has limitations. We've done our best to create a user-friendly taxonomy emphasizing the categories that have come up repeatedly. In addition, the science, technology, and recipes changed over time, and opinions varied greatly, so be sure to read updated information whenever possible.

      Therefore, we strongly encourage you to keep these issues in mind when reading the topic, and particularly when considering controversial topics related to food safety, doneness, delta T cooking, and so on. Don't read a first post's definitive claim without reading down the topic, where you'll likely find discussion, if not heated debate or refutation, of that claim. Links go to the first post in a series that may be discontinuous, so be sure to scan a bit more to get the full discussion.

      Recipes were chosen based solely on having a clear set of information, not on merit. Indeed, we've included several stated failures for reference. Where possible, recipes include temperature and time in the link label -- but remember that thickness is also a crucial variable in many SV preparations. (See below for more information on thickness.)

      History, Philosophy & Value of SV/LTLT Cooking

      Over the years, we've talked quite a bit about SV as a concept, starting with this discussion about how SV cooking got started. There have also been several people who asked, Why bother with SV in the first place? (See also this discussion.) What with all the electronics and plastic bags, we asked: Does SV food lack passion? Finally, there have been several discussions about the value of SV cooking in other eG Forums topics, such as the future of SV cooking, No More Sous Vide -- PLEASE!, is SV "real cooking," and what's the appeal of SV?

      Those who embrace SV initially seek ideas about the best applications for their new equipment. Discussions have focused on what a first SV meal should be -- see also this discussion -- and on the items for which SV/LTLT cooking is best suited. There's much more along those lines here, here, and here.

      Vacuums and Pressure in Sous Vide Cooking

      As mentioned above, there has been great confusion about vacuums, pressure, and their role SV cooking. Here is a selection of discussion points on the subject, arranged chronologically; please note that later posts in a given discussion may refute earlier ones:

      Do you need a vacuum for SV cooking, and, if so, why? What exactly is a "vacuum"? Click here, here, and ff. Are items in vacuum-sealed bags "under pressure"? Does a vacuum sealer create a vacuum inside the bag? Do you really need a vacuum, or can you use ZipLoc bags? Also see here, here, and here. If "sous vide" means "under pressure," aren't the items in the bag under pressure? There is more along these lines to be found in this discussion.  

      The Charts

      We've collected the most important of many charts in the SV topic here. Standing above the rest are Nathan Myhrvold's charts for cooking time versus thickness and desired core temperature. We worked with him to create these three reformatted protein tables, for beef, fish, and chicken & pork.

      Nathan provides additional information on his charts here. Information on how to read these charts can be found in this post. For an explanation of "rest time" in Nathan's tables, click here.

      Other Society members helped out as well. Douglas Baldwin references his heating time table for different geometric factors (slab/cylinder/sphere) here; the pdf itself can be found here. pounce created a post with all three tables as neatly formatted images. derekslager created two monospace font charts of Nathan's meat table and his fish table.

      Camano Chef created a cumulative chart with information gathered from other sources including Thomas Keller's Ad Hoc. Douglas Baldwin shared this chart devoted to pasteurizing poultry. PedroG detailed heat loss and steady state energy consumption of sous vide cookers in these charts.

      Finally, there is also an eG Forums topic on cooling rates that may be of interest.

      Acknowledgment & Comments

      This index was built by Chris Amirault, Director, eG Forums. It was reviewed by the eGullet Society volunteer team as well as many Society members. Please send questions or comments to Chris via messenger or email.
       
       
    • By Paul Bacino
      Wonder if someone could get me in the ballpark..the amount of Transglutamase...to make scallop noodles..    %  I mean
       
      ill use a food processor..to purée the scallop..  then inject into a water or broth..to cook?
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×