Sous Vide: Recipes, Techniques & Equipment (Part 9)

[Martin Fisher]

They are solid. The PolyScience balls are hollow.

Edited August 21, 2013 by DiggingDogFarm (log)

[Marius]

Food safety question: Does adding a slice of raw lemon to a bag of chicken breast reduce the amount of time it will last in the fridge after SVing? (doing cook->chill)

Edited August 21, 2013 by Marius (log)

[jmasur]

Marius, I'm not a food safety guy, or I'd weigh in more authoritatively, but I can't imagine how it would.

All: Has anyone tried the Oliso sealers? They say they're good for sous vide, and even have a video up showing how to use them with liquids in the bag.

The primary attraction for me would be the reusable bags -- my wife is annoyed at the plastic waste from my sous vide cooks. I'm not sure how you'd actually wash them out, though. And assuming that I can figure that out, I'm wondering whether the same technique could be used with FoodSaver bags, because if that works, I could just make longer bags than needed, slice off the ends when done cooking, wash, and reuse.

[Beusho]

Food saver and ziploc both have these: they're basically sous vide bags with a zip top (food savers seems sturdier to me). I prefer these to the vacuum heat sealer Food Saver (FS) for SV, for freezer or long term storage I use the bigger vacuum heat sealed FS. The bags have a port on them to apply a vacuum to, Ziploc has a manual pump and FS has a smaller 20$ battery pump, they're both at Target last time I checked. That Oliso is an overpriced version of these two. I would recommend getting the larger gallon freezer bags for liquids.

[jmasur]

Except that the FoodSaver and Ziploc things are actually different from the Oliso. I own the Ziploc; it was my first foray into vacuum sealing. The Ziploc has a dedicated port with a flap that you put the vacuum device on. The Oliso melts a hole in the bag, vacuums, and then heat seals to close the hole; subsequent uses create additional holes.

The Ziploc's vacuum flap seals are not terribly reliable, in my experience, and tend to fail when liquids engage the flap. I do use them occasionally for low-pressure, low-moisture vacuuming. The fact that the Oliso heat seals the holes suggests to me that they will be more reliable.

So again, the question I have is whether it's really possible to wash the Oliso bags and then reuse them, and if so, how? (And if it is, why can't I do the same thing with FoodSaver heat-seal bags?)

Edited August 24, 2013 by jmasur (log)

[rotuts]

Id avoid washing SV bags. you can save a lot of plastc elsewhere in your lives. the chance of contamination or illness must go up exponentially if you do this.

that being said, I use custom-cut long bags for saving things that are dry : green coffee beans, butter on sale, etc. I set the total length to include a 1 " cut off each time I open the bag to take out some of the contents so that I can re-seal that same bag.;

I get multiple "samplings" this way for one bag. 6 sticks of butter fit nicely into the 6 x 10 bag, which I then freeze. this prevents 'frost' and freezer flavors from degrading the butter over time, and each time I remove one stick there is plenty of space left in that bag to re-seal and re-freeze.

I freeze 5 lbs of green beans in a much longer and wider bag, and take out a few weeks worth of beans at a time, then reseal.

I dont freeze these green beans, just keep the bags in the coolest part of my basement.

[ThayerG]

Sous-vide Hainan Chicken?

Does anyone have any experience with this dish? There are a few blogs which mention it and today I tried a couple of pieces of dark chicken meat with ginger and soy sauce and a couple of dried red chilis. Conventional Hainan chicken is steamed and then chilled to gelatinize the liquids so I svied the chicken for two hours at 63C and then gave it a 30 minute ice bath. The results weren't bad but need some help. Brining?

[Robenco15]

Hello,

So now that the Anova Sous Vide Circulator is 200 dollars I am seriously beginning to think about starting to cook sous vide at home. I enjoy cooking complex meals and have wanted to get involved with sous vide for awhile.

Since you all have so many answers, I wanted to make sure of a few things before I made any purchases.

I do not plan on buying any type of vacuum sealing device or anytime in the near future. I have no space and while I have the money, I don't want to make additional purchases if I don't need to. Plus, no space. I was planning on using Ziploc bags zipper bags, but now I am reading that because they are made for the freezer or for carrying food at room temperature, they are not safe/good to use in sous vide instances where you are actually cooking food within them at a high temperature.

Is that correct? Does Ziploc even make heat safe bags? Cheap alternatives?

I am not trying to purchase anyting additional besides the circulator.

I have a smaller beer cooler that probably holds around 5 gallons and I would attach it to that. I would then put plastic wrap over the top as best as I can to provide insulation, along with a blanket I guess.

Does this all sound plausible? I do not want to purchase anything additional besides the actual sous vide. I was really hoping to use the ziploc bags I already own for various other reasons.

I appreciate your help as I have to convince my girlfriend that this is worth having, not overtly expensive, and worth doing! Thank you!

[gfweb]

I routinely use ziploc bags (the ones without the zipper, which tends to leak) when I intend to eat the dish within a day of SVing. If I'm going to freeze it then I vacuum seal it to prevent freezer burn.

I gather that there is concern that heating the polyethylene makes bad things happen. I haven't seen anything authoritative saying that this indeed a real problem and my family seems to be fine. (for perspective, consider that browned crusty meat and smoked meat are chock full of proven carcinogens).

Beer coolers are great, but with a powerful immersion heater you might do great using a small pot with a towel for insulation.

Worth doing? But of course!

[Lisa Shock]

I am a FoodSaver owner and love it. I vacuum seal all sorts of things in canning jars to help prevent pantry moths and keep things fresh: dry cat food, rice, sugar, flours, dry beans, raw nuts, dried fruit, bulk candy, etc. I also use the bags to portion out and preserve cheese, and items headed for the freezer. I also sous vide in canning jars as well as bags. I believe that I have gotten a great deal of value from my $150 purchase a decade ago.

That said, it appears that Ziploc has made a product just for you - a hand pump that costs less than $5, and, specially designed bags in lots of sizes: gallon, quart, etc.

[EMG]

Both Ziploc and Food Saver bags are BPA-free. Ziploc is microwave safe but not recommended for boiling. Lets not forget that Sous vide cooking never reaches boiling point.

Just a personal opinion (not fact): Anything is safer than a microwave.

[gfweb]

That said, it appears that Ziploc has made a product just for you - a hand pump that costs less than $5, and, specially designed bags in lots of sizes: gallon, quart, etc.

I have one of them, but the bags are pricy, so I just use water immersion to get the air out of the bag, because I'm a cheapskate.

[Beusho]

I have both a foodsaver vacuum that I got at Sam's and also the zip loc hand pump that I use with food saver bags. Food saver makes both the rolls that you cut your own bags out of and heat seal with their vacuum device as well as bags with a seal and a port you use a pump for, the pump in that video is much larger than the one you can get at any Target or Wal-Mart.

I usually cook for 1-3 people. I don't freeze things for extended periods. The food saver bags remove just about as much air as the more expensive heat sealing counterpart in my opinion. I like food saver bags compared to the zip loc because the port seems better and the seal seems stronger. I haven't froze things more than a month or so but in my mind it doesn't seem like the zip-top bags and pump would be much worse than the dedicated heat sealing vacuum. You can also lean the bag over the counter and remove the air from liquid containing bags.

I would say start with the food saver pump (get the one at your local retailer, it's $20 and is worth it rather than the $5 pump which now tends to come apart and is slow to remove air). If you're really unsatisfied with it you can spend the >100$ for the more expensive model,

Edited August 30, 2013 by Beusho (log)

[Docrjm]

Currently I use a foodsaver, purchased at costco, but have my eye on a chamber vac. Have a look at chefsteps, they use the water displacement method and ziploc bags quite a lot, despite having a chamber vac. This is done, I believe, to show that you do not need a vac sealer for basic sous vide cooking.

[Robenco15]

Thanks for the replies guys. I think I'm going to go the water displacement method for the time being. Not trying to buy more stuff and it should be fine. Thanks for the help guys!

[Beusho]

Steak and fish sauce.

MC recommends brushing fish sauce on steak for and letting it rest for 72 before cooking, if I'm going to cook flank steak for 18 hours can I brush it on and include the cooking time in the marinading time? e.g. I brush in on and let it rest for 54 hours, then cook it for 18. Will the cooking change the flavor of the fish sauce?

[greenmonk]

If you do decide to use zip lock bags and don't mind buying a cheap vacuming device, this Kickstarter just ended, but he's going to sell them in his online store around Nov. I'm supposed to get mine by the end of Oct.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1066541019/thriftyvac

[KennethT]

Sous-vide Hainan Chicken?

Does anyone have any experience with this dish? There are a few blogs which mention it and today I tried a couple of pieces of dark chicken meat with ginger and soy sauce and a couple of dried red chilis. Conventional Hainan chicken is steamed and then chilled to gelatinize the liquids so I svied the chicken for two hours at 63C and then gave it a 30 minute ice bath. The results weren't bad but need some help. Brining?

I've done this before - it works great with some modifications. First, in a pressure cooker, I make an intense chicken stock with ginger, garlic, shallots, etc. added. For the best results (especially with the skin, I'll take a whole chicken, do the whole salt scrub thing, then plunge into the boiling stock (which then turns into simmer and kept that way) for about 10 minutes, then plunged into ice water. This chicken is then cut up into parts, and pieces are individually bagged with some of the intense stock, and cooked SV at 140F (for the white meat), or 150F or so for the dark meat. The dark meat is cooked for a few hours, while the white meat can be done just to pasteurization. Some of the resulting stock from the bags is used to make the rice, while any extra is recycled. Over time, your stock becomes more and more chicken-y, although it will need to be topped up with water and more aromatics as time goes by.

[EMG]

If you do decide to use zip lock bags and don't mind buying a cheap vacuming device, this Kickstarter just ended, but he's going to sell them in his online store around Nov. I'm supposed to get mine by the end of Oct.

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1066541019/thriftyvac

What a clever device! thanks for sharing

[ChrisTaylor]

Sous-vide Hainan Chicken?

Does anyone have any experience with this dish? There are a few blogs which mention it and today I tried a couple of pieces of dark chicken meat with ginger and soy sauce and a couple of dried red chilis. Conventional Hainan chicken is steamed and then chilled to gelatinize the liquids so I svied the chicken for two hours at 63C and then gave it a 30 minute ice bath. The results weren't bad but need some help. Brining?

Keith_W is the man to speak to about this.

[Robenco15]

Sous Vide Lobster

I looked through the Sous Vide index and read the posts about cooking lobster Sous Vide. All of those posts are old, and while that isn't an issue because the information is still good, I had a question about any new advances in making sous vide lobster.

In the L'astrance cookbook Pascal says he freezes the lobsters first, then when they thaw the meat releases off of their shells, eliminating the need to parboil them. Has anyone tried something like this?

Any new/better times and temperatures for sous vide lobster? I assume it is always "poached" in butter in the bag. The temperatures I am finding now is 45C.

Thanks!

[Robenco15]

Thanks for sharing that device greenmonk! I'll look into it when it begins shipping.

A question that I can't seem to find the exact answer to.

If I sous vide a ribeye (or anything I guess) in a Ziploc bag using the water displacement method then put it in a ice bath (still in the bag) and then refrigerate it until I'm ready to sear it, etc. and serve, is that ok/safe? For how long can I refrigerate it? 24 hours? 3 hours?

Could I eliminate all questions of it being unsafe if, after I dunk it in an ice bath, I just put it in a new bag or put it on a plate and refrigerate it in the fridge with it covered?

[gfweb]

Keeping it in the already pasteurized bag is better. changing bags can introduce bacteria.

[Robenco15]

Keeping it in the already pasteurized bag is better. changing bags can introduce bacteria.

So it won't be a problem. Cool. And pasteurized means that it was cooked at a temperature to eliminate bacteria, right? So much lingo and it all revolves around safety so I'm really trying to get my head around it.

By the way, I like to pre-salt my steaks an hour per inch, rinse them, season them and then cook them on the grill or in a pan. Can I/Should I still do this when doing them sous vide? Do I season the steaks and then put them in the bag or do everything afterwards? Can I pre-salt at least, wash it off, dry, put it in the bag, sous vide, and season afterwards? Do you in general season everything after cooking it sous vide?

[gfweb]

I would SV steaks, then salt and sear on a hot pan then salt again. If you salt prior to a longish SV (eg >3 to 4 hours) the meat may get a slightly "cured" taste.

I recall a pork tenderloin that I salted well then cold smoked and then SVd with rosemary and garlic. It tasted like a hot dog.

.

You can season with spices or herbed butter etc prior to a long SV, just not salt in my experience.

Perhaps someone has studied this...