Top Chef Masters

[Nicholas Ellan]

Agreed. 6 competitors with 2 advancing is too confused to interest the audience. It also annoys me because it emphasizes the inequality of the competition: some episodes people are randomly forced to pair, other episodes they compete individually, and I'm sure in future episodes they will get to pick teams.

I'd suggest that if all of the preliminary episodes had the same challenges, it would make for more interesting tv. I'd rather see how 24 talented chefs approach the same problem, than how a couple winners randomly emerge from a pile of crap.

[llc45]

Agreed. 6 competitors with 2 advancing is too confused to interest the audience. It also annoys me because it emphasizes the inequality of the competition: some episodes people are randomly forced to pair, other episodes they compete individually, and I'm sure in future episodes they will get to pick teams.

I'd suggest that if all of the preliminary episodes had the same challenges, it would make for more interesting tv. I'd rather see how 24 talented chefs approach the same problem, than how a couple winners randomly emerge from a pile of crap.

I also don't think the chefs are getting a fair shot to win based on the way they set up the challenges (Moonen getting to choose fish rather than drawing from a hat like they would have done on TC). Unlike TC where only one person goes home each week, these chefs only get one shot to advance. One mistake means the end vs TC where they get more chances to redeem themselves as long as they are not sent home that week. Given that these chefs get only one shot, TCM needs to make it as fair as possible.

I like your suggestion but also like to see them mix it up. At least, keep all challenges individual and try to keep the playing field level (e.g., one person ends up with an easy protein while another ends up with something like kidneys!). This is expecially important when they are including votes from the public with less refined palates. In the case of the Housewives form OC, saying that they have a less refined palate is an understatement!

[Tri2Cook]

This is expecially important when they are including votes from the public with less refined palates. In the case of the Housewives form OC, saying that they have a less refined palate is an understatement!

I don't know. If Grant Achatz, Thomas Keller, the OC Housewives and the janitor from the bus station all spend their money on dinner at your restaurant, then what each and every one of them thinks of the food matters. If you tell yourself "well that person just doesn't have a refined palate" every time someone without a pedigree you respect doesn't love your food, you won't be around long.

My biggest disappointment so far this season... Wylie being eliminated by 1 point. I really wanted him to advance, I enjoy seeing his approach to the challenges.

[jesteinf]

At least Grant Achatz, Thomas Keller, and (probably) the janitor enjoy eating solid food. The Housewives seemed put off by the entire endeavor, making them pretty terrible judges for a food competition.

[Claudia Greco]

I totally agree. I could see the chefs' faces just crumple during the housewives' judging since they had no palates whatsover - "And our food is being judged by these people . . ." (or words to that effect). They didn't get it. You can't dismiss an entire dish because you don't eat or don't like a certain ingredient in it. The brownies (or was it Girl Scouts?) had more discerning palates than the housewives (!!)

[Lupinus]

To me, I think the difference is simple.

Yes, in the restaurant, you can't market and stay in business with ONLY those with great palates. But in the restaurant those people wouldn't be ordering things they don't enjoy.

To be a good food judge you have to be able to put some personal like or dislike away and appreciate the dish for what it is and is supposed to be.

You can absolutely hate raw fish, but with a good palate and knowledge of food you can know if it is a good dish.

Not every dish is going to personally be for every person, but a good food judge should be able to tell the difference between a bad dish and one that just don't float your boat.

[Tri2Cook]

To me, I think the difference is simple.

Yes, in the restaurant, you can't market and stay in business with ONLY those with great palates. But in the restaurant those people wouldn't be ordering things they don't enjoy.

To be a good food judge you have to be able to put some personal like or dislike away and appreciate the dish for what it is and is supposed to be.

You can absolutely hate raw fish, but with a good palate and knowledge of food you can know if it is a good dish.

Not every dish is going to personally be for every person, but a good food judge should be able to tell the difference between a bad dish and one that just don't float your boat.

Fair enough... but in a real-world setting nobody will care if it's technically good. They'll only care if they like it or not. The guest judges cover that aspect. The professional judges are there to weigh in on the technical merits and have enough votes to outweigh guest judge opinions during the eliminations if they feel the need.

[Claudia Greco]

I think the operative words here are "good judges" - professional or otherwise. The housewives were neither professionals, nor had they good palates for "civilians", and dismissed dishes based on whether they liked an ingredient in them. Which is a damn shame - like I said, I really felt for the chefs (yes, even Ludo!) watching these know-nothings sniff at their food.

[Lupinus]

Fair enough... but in a real-world setting nobody will care if it's technically good. They'll only care if they like it or not.

True. But in the real world someone who hates ginger, isn't going to order a dish with ginger. Someone who hates raw fish, isn't going to order the sashimi. A good judge isn't going to discard an entire dish because they don't like it or it's contents. Even a guest judge should be able to look past basic likes and dislikes and judge the dish.

[Tri2Cook]

Even a guest judge should be able to look past basic likes and dislikes and judge the dish.

I agree with you in spirit, I'm just not sure most people, OC Housewife or not, have the ability to do that. If you hate liver and you're not on some branch of the culinary professional tree with the ability to suck it up and judge a dish on it's technical merits, how do you taste it and think anything other than "yuck, liver"? Which leads to saying "then don't use those people as judges"... but TC always has and probably always will so that's part of what you sign on for if you do the show. If everybody is subject to it, then it's fair. Undoubtedly frustrating at times, but fair. I'm not trying to convince anyone my way of thinking is right, I'm just not as offended by non-professional opinions on the food as some seem to be. I have to live with non-professional opinions of my food every day and I'm fine with it.

[pax]

I've been doing a TCM marathon to get a knitting project done. I am aggravate by these cheap petrol station challenges and team clusterfucks. LET THEM COOK THEIR FOOD, already.

Jeez.

[Toufas]

can someone tell me what brand is the cookware they are using?

[CtznCane]

I was surprised to log on today and see nothing has been said on this thread in over 2 weeks! Okay, obviously I haven't been on here in a couple of weeks myself do to a busy schedule. Have we lost interest in TCM? Have we just lost interest in posting? I don't have a clue.

I must say that while I enjoy the chefs I haven't enjoyed this season as much as lasts. I must say though that I really enjoy watching Jonathan and Rick. While I'd like to see both of them in the finals it seems like Suser and Marcus will both get there. Regardless of who makes the finals, I hope the final is either the same format as last year or somewhat similar.

Having been absolutely swamped recently and then seeing no new responses I wonder if I'm in somewhat of a time warp.

[dhardy123]

I'm still watching it too.

It definitely isn't as interesting as last year but I do enjoy Susur (but that might be because I am live near Toronto)

[MattyC]

I tried again to give it a shot this season, but just ended up being bored with it like I was last season. I think the only times I watched it were the first two episodes, then the two with Jody Adams, because her place is right down the road from where I work, and she is a friend of my boss, so I felt I had to show some pride. Other than that though, while it's not bad, I still can't find the motivation to keep enjoying this season.

[et alors]

I was furious about the kaya toast! I have eaten at susan feniger's street twice now and had Kaya Toast both times because it is brilliant and fabulous. I'm annoyed by the narrow mindedness of the chef's expecting nothing but classic cuisine. It only has to delight, surprise and taste and look awesome. If you can do it with a sandwich, than rock it. It's possible she didn't execute as well as she did in the restaurant, but that's not the message I got.

I actually prefer this season to last; I like the narrowing down bit by bit and I like to see master chef's pushed hard. The way they rise to the challenge shows what professionalism can be.

[Claudia Greco]

I'm rooting for Susur, too - I think he's creative and talented, and does his best to figure out challenges that are completely alien to him. ("Dionysus? I figured out he likes WINE!") I was sorry to see Susan Feniger kicked to the curb, though. Although I estimate she's made the most for her charity without winning the 100K (I think she was up to $32,500 before she was cut?)

Rick Moonen looks HUNGRY, though. I think he wants this more even more than Marcus, and God knows HE'S pretty hungry! Well, looks like we're NY-heavy in the final: Marcus of Aquavit (where I've eaten a few times), Susur (who has a Shang here as well as his flagship restaurant in Toronto), and ex-NYer Moonen - although I'd have to go to Sin City now to eat his food!

Do we have any predictions for the winner?

[LizD518]

I'm enjoying this season, although I really liked Adams and Feniger and would have loved to see one of them in the finale. I also like Jonathan Waxman, his vibe is pretty mellow and his food looks delicious.

Rick Moonan is entertaining me, but I think he'd be a little intense to be competing next to. Susur seemed to blow away the competition for some of the challenges, but his food isn't necessarily grabbing me, personally. But he'll be in the finale. Samualsson is getting this season's "villian" edit so I think he will be in the finale, for sure.

I don't mind all the weird challenges - just giving them carte blanche to cook what they like can get boring because some people can get trapped in a rut, or it just doesn't seem like much of a challenge if they can just do whatever they like. Plus, I like seeing the differences / similarities between the more experienced chefs and the less-experienced cheftestants on TC. However, I did love the format of the final challenge last season, and I hope it is the same this season.

[meepyummy]

I actually really like the team challenges. It's fun to see the masters talk to each other and throw ideas off each other. It's insight into brilliant minds.

[Kevin72]

I liked Waxman but he seemed to just give up once they hit the semifinals, particularly after his throwdown with the judges a few eps back. It got pretty frustrating having him do the requisite "I'm just going to cook what I want" every episode. He kept getting called out for it and looked like he didn't care at that point. So I think the dish he went out on was his final shrug of indifference: cooking what I want anyways, and here's some sliced avocado on the side.

Last season of TCM had its problems but finished very strong, including the finale, which remains the best single episode of Top Chef I've seen. Hopefully they don't tinker with that formula and just step back and let them tear loose this time.

I think that TCM and Next Iron Chef have the same problems: they brought out the big guns for their first season, chefs with a national recognition quotient. Now with the following season you're probably pulling for a chef because they're from your city. I was well acquainted with last year's TCM finalists, this year I only really know Samuelson and Fenniger.

[IndyRob]

I think the finalists this time were very iconic.

But for me, I think this was the most, um..., ambiguous final result of any Top Chef variant I remember. The previous TCM top three (plus Collichio perhaps) gave four stars to each chef (hopefully that wasn't some sort of agreement).

So it was down to the regular judges. Out of the three judges, two gave 5 star ratings to different chefs.

With it being so close, and with Bayless, Chiarello, Keller and Collichio there, I have a bit of a problem accepting this result as..., well, authoritative.

And that's not to say I have any bones to pick with any of the finalists. I just have a lot more respect for the chefs than the critics.

[nonblonde007]

ditto