Cook-tops: gas and/or Induction?

[Raamo]

Is it true that even the big flexi zone induction tops only support 4 pans at a time? Seems so disappointing when you have that much space...

 

 

Mine is 30" only has 4 - the 36" model has 5.

 

 

There could be a few explanations.  First, if your spoon is 18/8 or 18/10 SS, it is not induction-compatible--the magnet test is not always determinative.  Second, your spoon might be too far outside the *true* diameter of the coil under the glass.  The painted circles on the glass are generally much larger than the actual coils.  Third, there may be some sensor at work.

 

Try your two smallest mixing/mise en place bowls on that large hob, see what happens.

 

I'll have to give that a try later.

[FauxPas]

Sears in Canada now has a Kenmore induction/convection standalone range. I've been watching prices on it for awhile. Regular price was $2,000 or more but it was usually on sale for about $1500, but this weekend it's on sale for $1,049 for a stainless steel one. 

 

(For anyone who still has white appliances, Kenmore also has this induction/convection range in white for $999.) 

 

That's a very good price for induction and the reviews are mostly good. I ordered one, but won't receive it until November. I understand it is actually made by Electrolux. 

 

White details and reviews here. 

 

Stainless steel details and reviews here. 

[gfweb]

We are still circling getting a new kitchen and maybe an induction top. The question arose about vent hood power for induction.

 

Since there's far less hot air rising upward into the hood do you need a more powerful suck to evacuate smoke etc?

[Deryn]

Why would there be far less heat rising upward with an induction burner (covered with a pan of boiling water for instance, or a frying pan with a steak sizzling in it) than there is if the same items are heating on a conventional electric coil or radiant burner?

 

I am sure there is a technical explanation but right now it is definitely escaping this simple mind. I hope someone will answer as I would also like to know if a different fan would be required for induction than any other type of cooktop.

Edited January 17, 2015 by Deryn (log)

[gfweb]

There would be less heat escaping with induction because of the inefficiency of gas or electric heating methods where a lot of heat is applied to a pot and only a small fraction (a pure guess,,,20%) is absorbed. The rest goes up into the air. Induction makes the pan hot by generating heat within the metal of the pan, so there is almost no wasted heat (other than what radiates from the pan).

[Smithy]

gfweb, you raise a really good question. (That's shorthand for "I dunno".) My question is whether the rising heat is supposed to be taken into account when sizing range hoods? I assumed, based on industrial experience, that it was related to the volume of the air being treated (surface area of the stovetop, distance to the air intake) and a certain capture efficiency coefficient, rather than counting on a 'boost' from the range heat.

Lucky you! Planning a new kitchen is fun, and using it when finished is even more fun. I didn't think much of the in- between steps  .

[Deryn]

My idea of a perfect stovetop would be something along the lines of a Jenn-air modular one - with a grill section and another section which could use either an electric (prefer coil but for cleaning purposes I guess ceramic/radiant would do) or an induction module - all with some kind of powerful downdraft vent/fan (since it will go into an island to replace the lousy glass/ceramic one that is there right now).

 

I have had 2 Jenn-air slide ins in the past and loved them but they don't make a modular induction unit too that would fit. Can't figure out why they don't but if they did I would (even though I know they are not as good as they used to be when Jenn-air was actually Jenn-air) buy another one in a heartbeat.

 

Right now I have NO fan/vent and the cooktop sits right below 2 suspended lights, open downwards. I didn't design this - bought the house from a woman who I guess never actually cooked. This is dangerous and must be replaced soon. Not to mention that now my cupboards are peeling from the humidity that remains in the kitchen after I have been boiling pots of water for things like pasta.

 

I have extra induction units and a 'griddler' style grill I can set up but I am getting tired of my entire island being covered with those items and really only using the glass electric cooktop as surface area to put pots and pans to go on or cool off from the induction units or to hold a cutting board. Would go with just an induction/grill unit if I could find it but I still have a few old pans I like to use from time to time and don't want to have to then have a single coil unit to plug in and use on the side - which just would mean I effectively have the same problem I currently am dealing with.

 

Downdraft is necessary for me - two storey house with not enough room to open up the ceiling for a pipe so nothing can vent out the top. Never thought about whether the same downdraft that works well enough for me for both grill and electric modules would be sufficient for induction as well. Perhaps because it would be pulling down from close by it wouldn't matter?

Edited January 17, 2015 by Deryn (log)

[gfweb]

If my speculation about the heat rising being important for traditional hoods is right, then downdraft ought to work better with induction than it does for regular stovetops

[Dave W]

Downdraft will work better for induction than conventional heat sources but is still a pale substitute for the mechanical capture ability of a properly sized hood above re cooking area. The hot effluent from your pan will always rise and that is what you are most concerned with capturing.

If the hood is too small to capture that column of areosolized grease or underpowered to pull it out of the capture area before it escapes, the effluent goes in your kitchen.

Down drafts don't mechanically capture the column so they have to pull really hard whether or not you have induction. Most downdrafts don't pull that hard or even as hard as cheaper overhead vents.

[Dave W]

Deryn with all that in mind it's ok to have your venting go sideways or down or wherever but my point was try to put a capture hood above the cooktop as it will work the best.

[Deryn]

I would love to do that, Dave, but unless I move the stovetop under the window or am prepared to walk quite a distance to use it, that is unlikely to happen in this house. I could use a recirculating hood I suppose but I regard those as mostly useless so probably won't go that route. Thank you for your comments though - I will need to keep that in mind.

 

gfweb - Sorry, I don't know the answer to your question (and sorry if I diverted attention from it - I hope someone will address it soon).

[hummingbirdkiss]

Ok DIY kitchen remodel is going very slowly but should pick up speed now because the solar tube was finally purchased and goes in this tuesday! I am so excited !!! it is the coolest thing it has a dimmer and LED light inside so this will be amazing and bring light into the third most dark spot in our home ..it literally sucks light out of the rest of the area just having such a dark spot!

 

 I have so many things running through my brain ..it gets painful in this head….but both my husband and I have agreed that we need to start with lighting and then work our way to the floor ..I wanted to replace my ceiling it has that texture crap on it ..but wow what a can of worms so no that is not happening …that was tough we had a month of battles some marital therapy and then a big ass fight… just to get this far! 

and yet we continue! 

 

 

The next thing after the lighting will be the cabinets and the countertops so I have to figure this out and land a decision. The sink  and the cooktop plan ..I will not trouble you with the sink this time. But it is tormenting me as well. 

 

the cooktop is more critical and I thought it was easy had what I wanted chosen and then things changed

 

My gas cooktop caught fire and burned a little under two weeks ago …so knowing I would be "out a kitchen" for a while .. I purchased a cheapo induction burner to keep me going and I like it! I really do ..but it is not everything to me and if it meant either or I would go with gas still but what i love is how easy clean and quick it is and my grandkids like cooking on it ..very safe for them they have both made grilled cheese and eggs on it and gave it a big thumbs up (5 years old and 9 years old) 

 

My question is has anyone done this and it is silly and unrealistic to think ???

 

I would like to  do a side by side of induction and gas burners for a cooktop? Whatever we do I would just like to have 4-5 good strong burners of any type is fine I do not want fancy just good heavy duty burners.  I am trying to imagine how to do it .there is the capacity electrical and gas to do either .…we are putting a pass through on the stove side of the kitchen I have a decent but not great sized area of planning the oven is another matter but has no relevance here because no countertop is involved (thank goodness this can be broken down into smaller chunks)  

 

I had planned to just put gas burners in  .. then after using this induction I kind of like it ..a lot! I can not believe how hot it gets and how fast! …but we have to have gas burners because really the power goes out a lot here ..I love cooking on a good gas burner and am plumbed for gas. 

 

so tell me what you think and please if you have any ideas or just think I am being a nutcase it is ok I can take it …my husband funny enough was the one who thought of this first ..he REALLY likes the induction burner and said "why can't we have half and half do folks do that? " it got me thinking then asking you fine folks 

 

I have moved around a lot in the past and now this is the first time in my life i did not have to fit myself into a kitchen I am fitting this kitchen to me ..I do not care about resale I can do anything that works for me now, convention be damned …all that matters is if I am happy and can cook in there !   

 

[Smithy]

Are you asking whether:

a. anyone has installed both gas and induction, or

b. compared the two side by side, or

c. whether there are dual units?

I could imagine installing a standard gas oven/range and having a separate induction cooktop if I had the room.

[ElsieD]

I have had both gas ranges and induction ranges. I much prefer induction. I now have a cook top, not a range and it is induction. I would not own anything but induction any more.

[Shel_B]

I have a question about induction burners, specifically about the stand-alone or portable burners.  Can any of them be set to maintain a specific or steady temperature over a period of time, such as a couple of hours?

[btbyrd]

A lot of portable induction burners claim to be able to maintain steady temperatures, but few are actually capable of doing so. The Vollrath Mirage Pro is the best I know of in this regard, as it has 100 power/temperature settings and is much better designed than the cheap burners which typically have only 10 or 12 settings. But it's also very expensive compared to what else is out there. If you have the funds for it, it's definitely worth it. If you really want something that will maintain a constant temperature, I'd suggest a quality portable gas burner combined with Meld (once Meld comes out).

[Shel_B]

A lot of portable induction burners claim to be able to maintain steady temperatures, but few are actually capable of doing so. The Vollrath Mirage Pro is the best I know of in this regard, as it has 100 power/temperature settings and is much better designed than the cheap burners which typically have only 10 or 12 settings. But it's also very expensive compared to what else is out there. If you have the funds for it, it's definitely worth it. If you really want something that will maintain a constant temperature, I'd suggest a quality portable gas burner combined with Meld (once Meld comes out).

 

I'll look at the Vollrath.  Can't use gas here ....

 

ETA: Yikes!  $500.00 for the Mirage Pro at Amazon ... more than I care to spend.

Edited July 1, 2015 by Shel_B (log)

[Dave W]

My portable induction hotplate (max burton) is fast as heck but the lack of specificity of temperatures and the bang/bang on-off nature of the controller means it's a little unstable to use at a bare simmer.

[FauxPas]

 …my husband funny enough was the one who thought of this first ..he REALLY likes the induction burner and said "why can't we have half and half do folks do that? " it got me thinking then asking you fine folks 

 

 

Check out the appliance stores - there are some mixed units. Here is a 36" unit with two induction zones and three gas burners. 

 

http://www.ajmadison.com/cgi-bin/ajmadison/PM363I0.html

[EnriqueB]

Likely the relative prices of electricity and gas have something to do with it, but here in Spain and a good part of Europe you will mostly see electrical cooktops at homes, unlike in the US. I would chose induction over any alternative any day. It is fast, powerful, efficient, clean, programmable, reproducible and safe. That said, to me the best world is a main induction cooktop and one or two powerful gas ranges for things like paellas, woks, or when there are power shutdowns.

[FauxPas]

Yes, like EnriqueB says, I would go for induction. And maybe have a BBQ with a couple of side burners for spares. But if you really want both in your kitchen, then only you can decide how much you want to spend. 

[hummingbirdkiss]

Thanks so much for the responses.

 

I Have to have gas cooking  in the house ..we loose power too often to be with out gas in general and it is super cheap for me hear it is our heating, water and stove (oven is electric) … if there is no realistic way of doing this that I can afford…but I think I can afford it if I am careful and figure this out .. I will stick with gas ..even thought the induction is cool it is not practical for us to have it only especially during the winter when we can loose power for days and the gas is still on always… my budget would make you laugh if I told you but I am going to make it work. I would like to find a two burner built in or built-in-able…cooktop for induction if possible 

 

I was thinking of two professional gas burners on the left side   lf where I would put the cooktop and and then two induction burners built in on the right side ?  I have a cheap <$50 table top induction burner that is fantastic! I am stunned at how easy this is too cook on! wow I will give it away when I put the cooktop in but for now it is getting a great deal of usage I can simmer on it ..it has a setting ..but for long low and slow i am using an "Instant pot" and that damn thing is very cool! I am not a gadget person in history but suddenly I am finding all this cool shit I want to buy and really now I need to focus on the cooktop and sink …because my husband is already setting up for the countertops …YIKES I hate when he is ahead of my brain! 

 

oh and because we are pouring concrete countertops? there is no room for error here I have to have this plan solid so the template is accurate. 

 

my head hurts but I love doing this it is really fun to have this freedom! just stressful knowing this is "IT" never again and I probably will not move until I die! So I want to think of ease and accessibility as we grown older and older 

[hummingbirdkiss]

Check out the appliance stores - there are some mixed units. Here is a 36" unit with two induction zones and three gas burners. 

 

http://www.ajmadison.com/cgi-bin/ajmadison/PM363I0.html

that is exactly what I would LOVE to have but can not afford anything remotely like that ..but wow! nice thanks for the validation I was not just thinking crazy here!  but yes this is what I would love to have ..I am planning to spend < 1/4 of that price far less the burners I am looking at for the gas side are $200 for two ..the induction side i have no idea I am just now realizing I can maybe do this …so still trying to figure out the models and stuff ..but wow would I love to just buy this cooktop and call it good! 

[jaynesb]

In 2008, I purchased a high-end brand induction cooktop when we did a kitchen renovation. I was very happy with it and at the time, gas wasn't an option because my neighborhood didn't have gas lines. I bought a small induction plug-in that we used during the renovations and it worked really well for us. I also bought a small cast iron plug-in unit so that we could still use our Whirly-Pop popcorn maker and a small Greek coffee pot since these weren't suitable for the induction cooktop. For the most part, I really liked the induction cooktop for the first 2-3 years but then, the cooktop started flaking out on me. I had numerous service calls and but I was getting more and more frustrated. It would stop responding and start flashing error codes while I was in the middle of cooking and it got to the point where almost every day, I had to reset the circuit-breaker in order to finish making dinner. All coils and boards in my unit had been replaced by this point in time too....I needed to replace it with something and heard that our neighborhood was getting gas service. So we struggled along, using the cooktop as best as possible and using the cast-iron plug-in unit as an alternate. Now we've got a gas cooktop and I'm very happy to not have electrical issues interrupting my cooking. I think that my case isn't everyone's experience though.

 

That said, the things I miss are (1) How quickly water came to a boil (2) The fact that only the pan and food get hot, not the entire kitchen (3) the very-low setting that meant that I rarely needed to pull out a double-boiler. (4) easier cleanup.

 

Jayne

p.s. We're not getting rid of the plug-in units..... They do have their uses but we don't use them for everyday cooking.

[ElsieD]

Jaynesb, can you elaborate on the cast iron plug in? I don't think I have ever heard of such a thing.