What does a city have to do to get some respect?

Gifted Gourmet · July 27, 2005

Well, they aren't here, either. So there!
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I don't know what it is about Trader Joe's but they have some sort of an indefinable "je ne sais quoi" (but I repeat myself) ... the items offered are unusual in some cases and hard to find elsewhere ... the prices, which one might expect to be higher, are surprisingly reasonable ... the variety ... it is such a pleasure to shop there (even if one is not able to use one's cellphone in their building! :shock: )

Yeah, Trader Joe's would be a very welcome addition to the food scene in Atlanta ...

daniellewiley · July 27, 2005

(b) I am looking for a Trader Joe's basically ... can't understand why they are not yet in this city...
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Well, they aren't here, either. So there!
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Ahh, but you can take a short ride on the LIRR and have access to the one in Oceanside or the one in Merrick. So, you're not totally screwed. :rolleyes:

Cleo · July 27, 2005

(b) I am looking for a Trader Joe's basically ... can't understand why they are not yet in this city...
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Well, they aren't here, either. So there!
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Ahh, but you can take a short ride on the LIRR and have access to the one in Oceanside or the one in Merrick. So, you're not totally screwed.
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And rumor has it that they are opening on 14th Street in the relatively near future. So there.

robyn · July 27, 2005

Hard for me to believe that Atlanta is that bad
What are you looking for in Atlanta that you can't find? Robyn
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(a) it's not that bad at all and, if you read my initial post, you will find the answer to
(b) I am looking for a Trader Joe's basically ... can't understand why they are not yet in this city...
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I don't know anything about Trader Joe's because it isn't in Florida. And - after taking a look at its website - I wouldn't trade my Fresh Market for a Trader Joe's because it doesn't sell duck (Fresh Market is the only place here that sells duck breasts). Robyn

Pan · July 27, 2005

... it is such a pleasure to shop there (even if one is not able to use one's cellphone in their building! )...
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That's a blessing! :biggrin: :raz:

I went to Kalustyan's this afternoon. Maybe you could start wishing for their equivalent in Atlanta, though I have a feeling from therese's blog that you actually have some pretty good Middle Eastern and South Asian stores in those parts.

daniellewiley · July 27, 2005

... it is such a pleasure to shop there (even if one is not able to use one's cellphone in their building! )...
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That's a blessing!
I went to Kalustyan's this afternoon. Maybe you could start wishing for their equivalent in Atlanta, though I have a feeling from therese's blog that you actually have some pretty good Middle Eastern and South Asian stores in those parts.
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Oh!! I miss Kalustyan's... we lived about a block away. Michael would frequently get a mjadara sandwich there for lunch. yum...

Busboy · July 27, 2005

So, GG, what is it you feel you are missing that Trader Joe's or Balducci's would bring to the table? I've never actually been to the TJ's nearest my home -- people rave about it but the stuff they bring back from the store never seems that impressive, and Balducci's is rapidly becoming a parody of an overpriced "gourmet market." Good fish, though, and the occasional bit of obscure, if overpriced, vegetable matter. Or is it a purely a respect thing?

For what it's worth, my brief forays into the Atlanta area reveal weaknesses in the cheese and bread area. Despite the scorn heaped upon it by New Yorkers, D&D is the only one of the chains to offer really good bread in this area (even Whole Foods is disappointing) and their cheese and charcuterie counters are excellent. For most everything else, however, I'd rather have the DeKalb market than any of these places.

Gifted Gourmet · July 28, 2005

So, GG, what is it you feel you are missing that Trader Joe's or Balducci's would bring to the table?

Let me submit an opinion from a friend when asked about this thread by email, which rather expresses and echoes my personal feelings:

Atlanta's greatest failure is that there is not ONE particular place where one may find a complete array of wonderful foods, "one stop shopping," if you may. Instead, a couple of fine balsamics here, a couple of excellent olive oils there, a great array of cheeses in another spot, produce, breads, pastries the same. With all due respect, "all under one roof" Fresh Market, Whole Foods, and Eatzis are dreadfully puny.
The issue is not their availability, but their consolidated availability -- as there is at Zabar's, Trader Joe's, Zingerman's, et al.
Oh, I can prepare a decent dinner in Atlanta, but not without zigzagging 150 miles to procure the best provisions. This is the issue that Atlanta's purveyors and culinary community (note: both) have yet to address.

SuzySushi · July 28, 2005

Oh, I can prepare a decent dinner in Atlanta, but not without zigzagging 150 miles to procure the best provisions.

The thrill of the chase is supposed to be part of the enjoyment!

joiei · July 28, 2005

There is not one central place for me to do all my shopping. I do try to avoid Albertsons, but I run between several places because I know each one, even Wild Oats does not satisfy all my needs.

Now several people I know will not shop anywhere but Wal-mart supercenter, Wal-mart Neighborhood Markets. That is their choice, but for me, they have extremely limited selections, there is no butcher that I can talk to, the produce folks just unload boxes.

If I lived in Texas, I doubt that Central Market, no matter how good it is, could fulfill my total needs. It is just a part of living. We do not have a TJ's, and probably will not get one, We are too far from their distribution areas. I remember when Publix opended their first store in northwest Florida. They had to wait until their distribution warehouses were closer than Jacksonville. Now they are all over the panhandle of Florida. But that took them 15 years to accomplish that.

And even with all the stuff that I do have locally, I do have to shop online at times.

chemprof · July 28, 2005

Melissa,

I too love TJ's :wub: and go every time I'm in CA visiting family, or in DC visiting friends. Last summer I went to a conference in DC (about 5 hours from Greensboro) and a friend and I made a car-filling trip to the TJ's in Tyson's Corners on the way home. While we were shopping, I noticed to TJ folks looking at a display, commenting on it, saying stuff like "this works really well, we should use it". I went up to them and asked "so, are you planning displays for you new store in NC?" :cool: (at this point I would excited if even they ended up in Charlotte, which has everything, of course). They said something along the line of "well, once we get the distribution center in Atlanta built, then maybe we could come to NC".

I kind of assumed that was something in the works, probably wishful thinking on my part. :sad:

But maybe not... :smile:

Anne

Gifted Gourmet · July 28, 2005

They said something along the line of "well, once we get the distribution center in Atlanta built, then maybe we could come to NC".
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If this is true, Anne, then I will personally give you a free gift card to the nearest TJ's and an airplane ticket ... :wink:

When I visit my daughter on the central coast of California, I purposely pack lightly going out and leave room for my TJ's "stash" coming home .. this time, my bag was weighed and was tagged "HEAVY BAG" :hmmm: .. sure I was embarrassed trying to drag it off the carrousel, but, hey, it is Trader Joe's!

How much could my full ripe Turkish apricots and orange scented dried cranberries weigh? So what if I bought 6 big bags of each? plus the candy and cookies, and miniature bell peppers and lemon curd and jams and jellies and ...

Busboy · July 28, 2005

So, GG, what is it you feel you are missing that Trader Joe's or Balducci's would bring to the table?
Let me submit an opinion from a friend when asked about this thread by email, which rather expresses and echoes my personal feelings:
Atlanta's greatest failure is that there is not ONE particular place where one may find a complete array of wonderful foods, "one stop shopping," if you may. Instead, a couple of fine balsamics here, a couple of excellent olive oils there, a great array of cheeses in another spot, produce, breads, pastries the same. With all due respect, "all under one roof" Fresh Market, Whole Foods, and Eatzis are dreadfully puny.
The issue is not their availability, but their consolidated availability -- as there is at Zabar's, Trader Joe's, Zingerman's, et al.
Oh, I can prepare a decent dinner in Atlanta, but not without zigzagging 150 miles to procure the best provisions. This is the issue that Atlanta's purveyors and culinary community (note: both) have yet to address.
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I think you may be chasing a dream. It's the nature the genus eGulletus to seek out tiny incremental advantages between stores: "TJ's has great olive oils but the boules at La Boulanerie are just better. And the cheese -- I hear there's a new place in Alpharetta that has Italian sheeps cheeses nobody else has. Of course, you have to go to a real butcher to get meat. And I wanted to do an Asia de Cuba theme, so I guess it's back to the DeKalb Market for produce..." :biggrin:

You think "one great store" is the answer, but it ain't.

Toliver · July 28, 2005

Things get even more interesting when one looks at the location of these TJs and WFs around San Diego....
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Don't forget there's a Trader Joe's near Grossmont Shopping Center. They used to be located in the Grossmont Trolley Shopping Center but it was a really bad location with absolutely horrible parking. Their new location is in a small shopping center diagonally opposite the Claim Jumper (southeast of the actual shopping center). There's now lots of parking and it's always doing a brisk business.

...The other Whole Foods is in an area of La Jolla known as "The Golden Triangle" because of a significant concentration of corporate office towers and condo towers, as well as a major pretty-upscale shopping mall--in this case, it seems WF is going where the bucks are.
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I read somewhere on eGullet that their nickname is "Whole Paycheck" so it doesn't surprise me they're going where the money is.

robyn · July 28, 2005

Oh, I can prepare a decent dinner in Atlanta, but not without zigzagging 150 miles to procure the best provisions.
The thrill of the chase is supposed to be part of the enjoyment!
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I agree - although after you know an area - it's not so much of a chase as you buy this stuff here - and that stuff there. We don't have as many food shoping places as Atlanta - but I shop at the following on a regular basis: Publix, Harris Teeter, Fresh Market, Costco, and a couple of small specialty stores (like Asian market stores - a small French place - etc.). I'm lucky that the first 3 places are all within a 10 minute drive from my house - and Costco is 15 minutes away. Traffic in Atlanta being what it is - my Costco would probably be 30 minutes away if it were in Atlanta.

As for Whole Foods = Whole Pay Check (mentioned in another message) - we don't have one in our area - but I've shopped there. Some of the prices are silly - but if you look - there are some real bargains (e.g., the Whole Foods "House Truffles" at about $6 for a half pound). Robyn

robyn · July 28, 2005

There is not one central place for me to do all my shopping. I do try to avoid Albertsons, but I run between several places because I know each one, even Wild Oats does not satisfy all my needs.
Now several people I know will not shop anywhere but Wal-mart supercenter, Wal-mart Neighborhood Markets. That is their choice, but for me, they have extremely limited selections, there is no butcher that I can talk to, the produce folks just unload boxes.
If I lived in Texas, I doubt that Central Market, no matter how good it is, could fulfill my total needs. It is just a part of living. We do not have a TJ's, and probably will not get one, We are too far from their distribution areas. I remember when Publix opended their first store in northwest Florida. They had to wait until their distribution warehouses were closer than Jacksonville. Now they are all over the panhandle of Florida. But that took them 15 years to accomplish that.
And even with all the stuff that I do have locally, I do have to shop online at times.
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Do you live in northwest Florida? I live in northeast Florida (Jacksonville area) - and Albertson's has just closed all its stores here (the leases have been bought up by someone local who has a "concept" that I don't remember that was described in the local papers). There wasn't an Albertson's near where I live - so I rarely set foot in one. But I think a lot of people will miss some of them because they had extensive Kosher food selections (one even had a Kosher butcher section). Robyn

Pam R · July 28, 2005

As for Whole Foods = Whole Pay Check (mentioned in another message) - we don't have one in our area - but I've shopped there. Some of the prices are silly - but if you look - there are some real bargains (e.g., the Whole Foods "House Truffles" at about $6 for a half pound). Robyn
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What I love about Whole Foods is that while they may charge a lot, they give you some service with it. I did a cooking demo at the Whole Foods in Toronto that was open to the public at no charge. They also offer their teaching kitchen up for use for community meetings and events at no charge. Our national chain of grocery stores (Superstore) may charge less for foods, but they charged $30 for my cooking demo. They don't carry the same products, they don't have the same helpful staff and they charge shoppers .04 per bag! I hate that.

If you live in a city with other good gourmet or high-end foods, then maybe a place like Whole Foods isn't all that. If you live in a town without any of these places, seeing a Whole Foods going up would bring joy and happiness to your life :wink:

savvysearch · July 28, 2005

What's the big deal with Trader Joes? I think the produce is worse there then at my local chain supermarket. It's a past-ripe soft organic produce hell. I still shop at Joe's but you will soon be craving for a genetically modified, toxic pesticide sprayed vegetable after buying any produce at trader Joe's. And worst grapes ever!

Edited July 28, 2005 by savvysearch (log)

mizducky · July 29, 2005

What's the big deal with Trader Joes? I think the produce is worse there then at my local chain supermarket. It's a past-ripe soft organic produce hell. I still shop at Joe's but you will soon be craving for a genetically modified, toxic pesticide sprayed vegetable after buying any produce at trader Joe's. And worst grapes ever!
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I think you must be cursed with a TJ's with atypically bad produce, then. I've shopped TJ's in both Southern California and the Seattle area, and never had anything but good experiences with the quality.

Admittedly, I don't usually make my major produce buys at my local TJ's, but that's more because produce is not one of their more "bargain" offerings. Plus I confess I do find their habit of bundling produce into multi-piece containers rather than letting me buy one or two pieces of an item rather a pain. No, the things I really make special trips to TJ's for is just about everything they carry *other than* the produce. Especially their cheeses, breads, dried fruit, canned and bottled goods, chocolates, flash-frozen seafoods, condiments, wines, vitamins and nutritional supplements, pastas, grains, etc. etc. etc. ... that's more than enough to make them a big deal to me, at any rate.

rosebud · July 29, 2005

OK, I'm going to have to revise my opinion of TJ's. I heard a commercial for them on the radio today . . . they have skinned, boneless, WILD Coho salmon (frozen, of course) for $5.99 @ pound. I'm going to have to jump on the subway and go visit them for some of that.

Because I live in the middle of city (in a very "hip" neighborhood which, nevertheless, doesn't have wonderful food vendors), I have just become used to travelling around to find the best of everything. For example, my local Safeway sometimes puts crab meat on sale for about $10 per pound. For my husband and myself, I will make 6 crab cakes out of that pound and serve a dinner where we each get two. With the remaining two uncooked cakes, I will go to the Whole Foods and get two boned (!!!), farmed Rainbow Trout and stuff each with a crab cake. The trout is about $6 per pound.

It just takes a little bit of thought and planning.

I do, however, sympathize with those of you who don't have access to this kind of stuff. When my mother graduated from college at the age of 68 in El Paso, the whole family went down for the ceremonies and I planned on cooking a celebratory meal for the 9 people I had to worry about. I was astonished that I couldn't find fresh basil, and I had to go to I don't remember how many supermarkets to find fresh lobster--I wanted to make lobster risotto as an appetizer course. I had thought to bring some pine nuts, since nobody down there knew what I was talking about. And, I also carried a carton of mascarpone cheese and Italian Lady fingers to make tiramisu for dessert.

I won't even discuss finding appropriate wine. The dinner was memorable and everybody had a good time. (The following week, my mother reported that a bunch of supermarkets were advertizing lobsters on sale. They must have ordered some after I visited so many making inquiries.) Go figure.

Curlz · July 29, 2005

Melissa, I'm not sure why you're fixated on places like D&D and Balducci's when what you should really be pining for is WEGMANS!!! :wub:

And, hey--it could happen. They're as far south as VA already! Start the petition...

Carrot Top · July 29, 2005

(calming down, now breathing normally) We actually do have Fresh Market, Whole Foods, and Eatzis, so we are not about to starve anytime soon ... I think I really became most envious when I went to Trader Joe's ...
now, if we could only get a Zingerman's or Balducci's ....
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Ah. I think this is the point of it right here, Melissa.

The problem is not lack of Trader Joe's in Atlanta. . .it is that you went the wrong place for vacation. Your daughter should not live in such a nice place as California with all these things around to tempt you. She should live in some place that you could visit where Atlanta would look great in comparison! :laugh:

Please. Do yourself a favor. ( :biggrin: ) Next time you go somewhere, go somewhere WORSE than Atlanta. It will make you feel better. . .

Gifted Gourmet · July 29, 2005

you went the wrong place for vacation. Your daughter should not live in such a nice place as California with all these things around to tempt you.
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When queried as to where she might choose to live in her future, my daughter looked at me with shock and awe as she responded, "Whaaaaat?! and give up this piece of heaven on earth??" ... as a vegetarian, she is in the heart of organic farm-perfect living in Santa Cruz ...

joiei · July 29, 2005

Melissa, don't you all still have Harry's Markets? or did those go away? I think that store is what Central Markets in Texas were fashioned after. I remember going into the one in Gwinnett. It was pretty awesome, but that was a long time ago and things change.

**Kevin72** · July 29, 2005

Melissa, don't you all still have Harry's Markets? or did those go away? I think that store is what Central Markets in Texas were fashioned after. I remember going into the one in Gwinnett. It was pretty awesome, but that was a long time ago and things change.
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Yep, CM's execs actually went to Atlanta and modelled their concept after Harry's.

Whole Foods bought them out and they are now called I think "Whole Foods Farmers Market". If you ever watch Good Eats, you can notice the name transition over the years when Alton shops there. I'm guessing by reading this thread that it's no longer as great as it was.

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