Why do restaurants allow this?

beans · April 12, 2004

Most: $2.13 an hour. That is fairly common.

Minimum wage? :laugh:

Schielke · April 12, 2004

Servers in Washington State have it pretty sweet comparatively. Min wage and tips.

Ben

Squeat Mungry · April 12, 2004

Waitpersons in California earn at least minimum wage as well, with tips on top of that. Last year, San Franciscans voted to raise the City's minimum wage (already higher than the state's) to $8.50/hour. Many restaurant owners have been worried that this will eliminate their already slim profit margins, forcing them out of business. I know a couple of longtime restaurants in my neighborhood have closed since the law took effect in February, but I'm not sure that's the reason. I also know servers who worried that people would tip less, and diners who worried that menu prices would rise. It's probably too early to tell yet what the longterm effect on the industry will be.

As for the question in question, I admit I do find it a bit annoying, but usually don't have a problem letting it slide if the service has been acceptable otherwise.

lia · April 13, 2004

Instead servers are trained to immediately return with a guests change, or announce that they will be right back with change. The latter being statement not a question.

I'm a manager and while I never ask 'the question' if i pick up a check, I do the same...announce that i'll be right back with the change. OT, i learned a customer found the phrase "are you still working on that?" offensive. I agreed, and now i get the staff to say, "are you ready to have that cleared?" and (ha) then THEY usually say, 'no thanks, still working on it.'

back to tipping, while 'the question' never bothered me either, i'm usually annoyed at restaurants' seeming refusal to give back small change in ones. I pay for a $13 lunch with a twenty....why do you bring me back a five and two ones? Yeah, i actually planned on leaving you THREE.....you didn't really think you were getting the five, did you??

winesonoma · April 13, 2004

I pay with a credit card and tip in cash. On the slip it says no tip. Management thinks I'm cheap, I give the server ammo for the IRS who says everyone tips and I have great service when I go back.

Pan · April 13, 2004

i'm usually annoyed at restaurants' seeming refusal to give back small change in ones. I pay for a $13 lunch with a twenty....why do you bring me back a five and two ones? Yeah, i actually planned on leaving you THREE.....you didn't really think you were getting the five, did you??

Yeah, that's really annoying, and I tell waiters off when they do that, as in:

"I need change for that five."

"You want change?"

"Yeah, if you want a decent tip."

tommy · April 13, 2004

i wonder if restaurants/servers sometimes have a shortage of small bills. as a server, i might forego the extra dollar that i might get, for convenience, and just give back the 5 and 2 singles. however, if i'm being told off when i do that, well that just doesn't sound very pleasant.

Edited April 13, 2004 by tommy (log)

NeroW · April 13, 2004

Right now I wait tables in a Guest Services class in the Cafe at my culinary school. We aren't allowed to keep our tips, so when they pay me, even if i'm busting my ass, I ALWAYS bring them change in a flash, without asking :biggrin:

JPW · April 13, 2004

i'm usually annoyed at restaurants' seeming refusal to give back small change in ones. I pay for a $13 lunch with a twenty....why do you bring me back a five and two ones? Yeah, i actually planned on leaving you THREE.....you didn't really think you were getting the five, did you??
Yeah, that's really annoying, and I tell waiters off when they do that, as in:
"I need change for that five."
"You want change?"
"Yeah, if you want a decent tip."

It seems as if the servers can't win because I'm the other way. I find the automatic return of seven singles in this case to be presumptuous.

In Pan's little dialogue, the server deserves a wise ass answer because, after being told that change is needed, he responds idiotically. Not IMO because he brought back a five and two ones.

If you want all ones, ask for it up front.

Just my 2 cents...

beans · April 13, 2004

i wonder if restaurants/servers sometimes have a shortage of small bills. as a server, i might forego the extra dollar that i might get, for convenience, and just give back the 5 and 2 singles. however, if i'm being told off when i do that, well that just doesn't sound very pleasant.

It isn't pleasant.

In that situation of $7.00 change, I'd have to agree that it is out of convenience. Why sweat over a big $1.00 in the difference in the tip?

The change thing is often true, with exception to one establishment I once bartended. Were I currently work, we seem to be the "supermarket" emergency place to call for all other surrounding restaurants/bars, or other fellow managers in the biz that there may be an existing comfortable relationship (awkward for former employees in good standing, or buddies, working elsewhere). Run out of champagne, Jäger, togos, buns or change? They all check with us if we can help them out no matter if it is a rocking busy Friday night, Sunday early afternoon or Tuesday evening. Despite we seem to be the resource for emergency change "purchases," we run with barely getting by always having to recycle tip change.

That exception establishment with plenty of singles, fives and quarters (nothing smaller -- it was not permitted as tender!)? When I bartended for an adult entertainment club. My opening drawer which was scavanged by all of our cocktailers and customers for change and usually was a starting $500 bank consisting of $50 in quarters, $250 in singles and $200 in fives.

Back to the subject matter question. I do understand how some find it offensive or rude but I watched our servers during a slow day at work. We use the small folder books and usually throw away the Amex cheque trays that we receive every six months since too many credit card slips were lost due to a warm breeze off the lake. Come to think of it, money too.... But 99.99% of the time the server isn't picking up the book pointedly examining through the monetary bills while inquiring if change is needed. More likely, the book is picked up without knowledge of what bills are enclosed and the question is out of convenience and economy of time.

Ever notice those little books have a pocket near the top especially designated for a charge card? Or when the check is settled up in cash that diners often let a wee bit of the bills peek out? :wink:

cakewench · April 13, 2004

When I waited tables, I always did the "I'll be right back with your change" thing. This was to avoid the perception that I was trawling for extra money. I would have loved to have just asked if they needed change, because even when I DID do the hinting "I'll be right back with your change!" thing, more than half the time I would just get the bills back anyway.

Server wage in VA is $2.13, and it was the same in Dallas when I was there. This might have changed, though, because it has been a while since I waited tables.

...and now I'm in Germany, where the most 'rounding up' that is expected is that you don't request actual coins back.

(and yes, people leave more than that, usually. Just not in the same league as American tipping)

Busboy · April 13, 2004

i'm usually annoyed at restaurants' seeming refusal to give back small change in ones. I pay for a $13 lunch with a twenty....why do you bring me back a five and two ones? Yeah, i actually planned on leaving you THREE.....you didn't really think you were getting the five, did you??
Yeah, that's really annoying, and I tell waiters off when they do that, as in:
"I need change for that five."
"You want change?"
"Yeah, if you want a decent tip."
It seems as if the servers can't win because I'm the other way. I find the automatic return of seven singles in this case to be presumptuous.
In Pan's little dialogue, the server deserves a wise ass answer because, after being told that change is needed, he responds idiotically. Not IMO because he brought back a five and two ones.
If you want all ones, ask for it up front.
Just my 2 cents...

In my day, we always brought back the small bills in hopes of picking up the extra single or two. Waiters play the percentages and they know that if the diner has a choice, the waiter is about 20 times more likely to get $3 than they are to get the five-spot on a $13 tab. A Waiter who gives back a five two singles is probably...just bringing you your change change.

JPW · April 13, 2004

Agree with you, Busboy, used to do the same thing myself.

Doesn't mean that getting the 7 singles doesn't irritate me as a patron.

All together now "I'm a hypocrite and I don't care..." :wacko:

menton1 · April 13, 2004

I didn't know I was in a restaurant to save time. They could bring out every course all at once to save time; And as far as being part of the wait staff's salary, that may be true, but it is also voluntary-- I'm in the school that thinks that the best way to get generous gratuities it to give GREAT service! (something rather rare today). Usually if a patron is wowed by the service they will tip accordingly. I definitely feel that it is rude, off-putting and a little sleazy to be asked "do you need change".

beans · April 13, 2004

I didn't know I was in a restaurant to save time.

You'd be surprised at how many patrons are on a time schedule -- lunch, meetings, shows/concerts/performances, getting back home being mindful of a baby sitter, etc. However it was more from a service perspective of economising on time and simplification/streamlining of tasks for optimal efficiency.

Ironic how the premise of efficient and precise service is construed as rude, off-putting and offensive. Yes, while there are blatent instances wherein a server is simply working the tip angle, don't lump the whole world of service staff into that one bad apple category.

I remember group training with a "Creating Raving Fans" philosophy, and in the service industry the worst offense to the guest was the foodrunner auctioning off of the plated entrees.

* * * * * *

Foodrunning Server: "Who had the salmon?"

Foodrunning Server: "The Beggar's Purse?"

[et cetera, et cetera; repeat process at each table throughout the shift]

* * * * * *

The "do you need change issue" wasn't listed. So much for industry management publications/studies in assisting and coaching a staff to provide effective guest service! :rolleyes:

Milt · April 13, 2004

Time for my two cents worth. I am not pleased to be asked "the question". I generally don't adjust the tip. I just think that the server is less professional. Service is all that the server can provide. The food quality and preparation is the responsibility of someone else. When I am in a hurry, I leave the exact change - and then I leave. At that point, it is obvious that I don't expect any change. If I am still there, I probably want the change. It is also interesting to note that when the check is, for instance, less than forty dollars and the cash is two twenties and then some, the question still gets asked. That is proof that they haven't looked, and are trying to save an extra trip to the table. The extra trip is what the professional server does, in my opinion. Similarly, I feel that I am receiving excellent service with something as simple as refilling my tea, water, coffee without asking - even though this will mean throwing out a nearly full glass when the table is cleared. Extra effort on the part of the server is what impresses me most. Extra effort may be defined many ways, but bringing my change to me is certainly one of them.

lia · April 14, 2004

It seems as if the servers can't win because I'm the other way. I find the automatic return of seven singles in this case to be presumptuous.

That's a very good point, but looking at it from both sides, I still would prefer the smaller change, simply because it's just a bit more convenient for the customer. after all, they don't HAVE to leave anything more than they want.

Edited April 14, 2004 by lia (log)

Miss Edna · April 14, 2004

If there were a book of etiquette for semi-fast food service; this might be found in the chapter "Courteous remarks to be made by a waiter/waitress." No less annoying than would you like french fries with that order?

sassybat · April 14, 2004

i hate "the question." i understand that the server is just trying to save themselves an extra trip back to the table, but i still find the question tacky. i've worked in restaurants for the past 10 years, and i always said something along the lines of "i'll be right back with your change." if the person wants me to keep the change, they'll say so. i've gotten the question a few times while dining, and it always irks me slightly.

also, i'm with the people who give back a 5 and ones. giving back all singles feels presumptious the same way asking "do you want change?" seems presumptious. plus, i hate dealing with a large collection of ones, and if for example my dining companion was going to take care of the tip, then i would be stuck with 7 ones and that would just annoy me. so adhering to the service for me as a server, i would always bring back the person's change as a collection of larger bills and ones, simply because if i was them and i received my change all in ones, i would feel annoyed at the presumption.

sweetblue · April 15, 2004

When I waited tables: Asked the question only when I didn't have time to count the money being offered. Would never do this if the amount offered obviously did not include tip (i.e. C-note for $65 tab, etc.)

Now that I don't wait tables: Doesn't really bother me, but again, if the difference between bill and amount offered is obviously not the tip, to me it implies one of two things about the server: (a) presumptuous or (b) clueless. Either option diminishes the chance of me leaving a little something extra.

In the end, it's all part of the dance. But unless you're in a really nice place, nothing to get too wound up about.

A somewhat related pet peeve: When you belly up to the bar, order a $4 drink (no, I don't live in NYC - there are actually $4 drinks where I live), and let's say you pay with a five. Bartender brings $1 change back and sets it in front of you. Several minutes pass. Bartender comes along, grabs bill, stuffs in tip jar.

Couple of points: I'm going to leave the $1 anyway unless the bartender is a complete jerk. But no way should s/he pick up the bill unless I've left, or otherwise indicated they're to keep the change. If the bartender is really, really busy, it's no big deal (lord knows I have a lot of huge-tip bartender karma to pay off), but when it's only moderately busy, it bugs me. One of those irritating situations where it's not worth the trouble to make a big deal about it, especially if you like the place or you're with friends. Just something that gets under my skin.

Thanks for the opportunity to rant. :)

ellencho · April 15, 2004

Sometimes I ask for specific change. For example, if I know that I'll be receiving 13 dollars in change, and I wanted to tip 4 dollars, I'd ask for a five, and the rest in ones. That way, I get to tip how I like - and it's awkward to receive a ten and three ones, and have to ask the server to go back and get you change for the ten.

I do the same for hairstylist and shampooer tips too.

Edited April 15, 2004 by ellencho (log)

lala · April 15, 2004

I have found that that question is usually uttered by some wait-schmoe who has also been overly aggressive in his/her efforts to upsell the table. "Would you like a mixed drink to start? How about an appetizer? Groaning in ecstacy over the (unpriced) special, urging me to get it before it runs out. Would you like any sides with that - the asparagus is good today? Dessert? Coffee drink? After dinner drink?" On top of all of that, and having to say 'No' a dozen times, that final question just seems to be a bit much. Just bring my change, ok? :hmmm:

I usually try to circumvent the process by bringing enough small bills, so I can tell them that we don't need the change when I lay the money down.

rancho_gordo · April 15, 2004

I hate the question and find it very tacky.

The fact that so many object to it makes me think a clever waitperson should switch to the just as easily said, "I'll be right back with your change."

beans · April 15, 2004

I have found that that question is usually uttered by some wait-schmoe who has also been overly aggressive in his/her efforts to upsell the table. "Would you like a mixed drink to start? How about an appetizer? Groaning in ecstacy over the (unpriced) special, urging me to get it before it runs out. Would you like any sides with that - the asparagus is good today? Dessert? Coffee drink? After dinner drink?"

Ah, but servers are sales people, not mere order takers and food runners.

Every manager and restaurant owner glows when they hear their front line team adding on to guest checks. Also, once a server provides their guests with options that may increase their guest check averages, they also see the $$$ benefits in their own pockets.

A restaurant must find ways to make revenue. Empowering your service staff to make a difference in their earnings by suggestive selling is key.

Why resent them for doing their job?

lala · April 15, 2004

I have found that that question is usually uttered by some wait-schmoe who has also been overly aggressive in his/her efforts to upsell the table. "Would you like a mixed drink to start? How about an appetizer? Groaning in ecstacy over the (unpriced) special, urging me to get it before it runs out. Would you like any sides with that - the asparagus is good today? Dessert? Coffee drink? After dinner drink?"
Ah, but servers are sales people, not mere order takers and food runners.
Every manager and restaurant owner glows when they hear their front line team adding on to guest checks. Also, once a server provides their guests with options that may increase their guest check averages, they also see the $$$ benefits in their own pockets.
A restaurant must find ways to make revenue. Empowering your service staff to make a difference in their earnings by suggestive selling is key.
Why resent them for doing their job?

Yes, I know that waiters are sales people. I've worked both front and back of the house, and am well aware that the restaurant lives and dies on the waiter's ability to move the food/drinks. The key phrase in my post was 'overly aggressive'. You know, the one who looks at you with dollar signs dancing in their eyes, who couldn't care less if you have an enjoyable time, just if you spend enough money so the bill will be well padded for calculating the tip. We've all seen this, where you feel harrassed, not served. That's not upselling, it's a bad waiter, doing a bad job. And in my experience, each time I get one of these jerks, they invariably ask if I want the change when I pay.

One example was where I felt so harrassed that I finally told the waiter to get his crowbar out of my wallet, as my money was clearly all he was interested in.

Edited April 15, 2004 by lala (log)

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