Sansaire Searing Kit

[weedy]

So it's about $150 for a bernzomatic torch and canister and rack.

Apparently the torch has a slightly wider opening.

Why?

I can't see how this is anywhere near as good as a bernzomatic plus searzall combo.

[Seattle Food Geek]

Scott from Sansaire here. The Sansaire Searing Kit torch and the Searzall attachment are very different, and each good for their own use.

 

Because the Searzall takes a flame from the TS8000 or TS4000 (show in the middle of the photo below) and spreads the heat out over a 3" diameter baffle, the heat energy per square inch is quite low. A lot of energy is also lost out the sides and top of the baffle. The result is that it can take close to 3 mintues per side to sear a steak with the Searzall.

 

By comparison, the Sansaire Searing Kit torch produces the flame on the right - the largest of any torch in its class. The flame size is in a goldilocks zone between being larger than a normal hardware store torch (1" diameter) but not too large as to diffuse the heat too much. And, because the flame is concentrated, all of the heat energy is directed towards your food. The result is that you can put the same or better sear on a steak in 1 minute per side or less. Not only is this faster, but the heat has less time to encroach the interior of the food.

 

However, the Searing Kit Torch is too intense for some uses where the Searzall shines, like melting cheese, making toast, or even browning creme brulee (unless you take a step back and have a very steady hand).

 

To see the difference in action, check YouTube videos for the Searzall (ex.

) and the Sansaire Searing Kit (

)

 

Also note that the Sansaire Searing Kit includes the

 

torch head+

fuel cylinder+

searing rack and drip tray

= $159.

 

 

If you were to add up the equivalent components for the Searzall world, you'd get:

 

$75 for Searzall +

$48 for torch head+

$12 for fuel cylinder+

$85 for Searzall Steak Decorator (searing rack)

= $220

 

Again, both tools have uses at which they excel, but if your primary interest is in searing meats, the Sansaire Searing Kit Torch delivers much better results in my opinion.

[boudin noir]

I see no advantage of either over a good hot cast iron pan.

[KennethT]

I've stated this before, but my preference is for the hose torch:

http://www.bernzomatic.com/product/bz8250ht-trigger-start-hose-torch/

The propane canister hangs from your belt, and the torch has a large, swirl flame which gets really hot (and I've never detected any torch taste in years of use). Plus, the torch works just fine upside down or at any angle, no matter how filled the canister is.

[Seattle Food Geek]

I see no advantage of either over a good hot cast iron pan.

 

Cast iron can definitely deliver a great sear, but the torch has a few advantages:

1. Cast iron only sears flat things. It's great for strip steaks, but because cast iron relies on conduction as its only mode of heat transfer, it's pretty cumbersome to sear non-slab objects like a prime rib or rack of lamb. Even a chicken breast is a little too dome-shaped for reliable contact with the pan. The flame can sear round and uneven surfaces, and sneak into those nooks and crannies that conduction can't reach.
2. Temperature. On a powerful stove, you might be able to get your cast iron pan up to 600F. But, the temperature of the torch flame is 2200F. Temperature doesn't tell the whole story of heat transfer, but if your goal is to apply a dark outer crust fast without overcooking the interior, it matters a lot.
3. Smoke. When searing over a wire rack and drip tray - like the kind we built for the Sansaire Searing Kit - juices and liquid fat drip down off the food, away from the heat, and into the drip pan (ready to turn into a pan sauce). In a cast iron skillet, they have nowhere to go but airborne in the form of smoke. If you've got a kick-ass vent hood, then this isn't a big deal. But if your smoke alarm is like mine (even saying the word "smoke" out loud seems to set it off) then producing less smoke is an advantage.
4. Cleanup. The searing rack and tray from our searing kit are dishwasher safe, so I don't have to worry about rinsing out my cast iron right after searing.
5. Drama. I've yet to host a dinner party where the blowtorch searing step didn't make it to instagram. Pro tip: don't tell anyone what you're doing, just start searing in clear view of the dining room. Half way through, invite your 85-year-old grandmother to take over for you.

[weedy]

thanks for the response, SFG

 

part of the rationale for the Searzall was, clearly, the reduction in 'torch taste'

 

what's your response to that, as it applies to the Sansaire kit torch? 

Edited November 6, 2015 by weedy (log)

[AlaMoi]

here's a $8.99 solution:

 

http://www.amazon.com/Bernzomatic-810-Stainless-Steel-Spreader/dp/B0000DINGL

 

some torch kits come with a flame spreader.

[Seattle Food Geek]

thanks for the response, SFG

 

part of the rationale for the Searzall was, clearly, the reduction in 'torch taste'

 

what's your response to that, as it applies to the Sansaire kit torch? 

 

More great questions! We have not been able to produce "torch taste" with the Sansaire Searing Kit torch, despite trying really hard.

 

There are two prevalining hypotheses for what causes torch taste. Modernist Cuisine attributes it to the flavor of uncombusted fuel reaching the food surface. Dave Arnold and the Searzall team attribute it to chemical reactions that occur when food is exposed to too high a temperature, as you might experience with a direct flame.

 

I can't state with 100% certainty why the Sansaire Searing Kit torch doesn't produce torch taste, but we've empirically shown that it doesn't. I've even served seared steak to people who complain about being sensitivie to torch taste and they were delighted that it was absent from our setup. My best guess is that the temperature of our flame is actually a little lower than that of the TS4000 or TS4000. We've measured the blue main flame as 2200F in air. With a TS8000, the flame is designed to be considerably more concentrated and more intense. I don't have a temperature measurement, but it could be the case that there's a threshold north of 2200F at which "torch taste" begins to appear. We also advise folks to light our torch pointed away from their food, then bring the lit flame to the food surface, so that they avoid getting uncombusted propane on the food.

[dscheidt]

I've stated this before, but my preference is for the hose torch:

http://www.bernzomatic.com/product/bz8250ht-trigger-start-hose-torch/

The propane canister hangs from your belt, and the torch has a large, swirl flame which gets really hot (and I've never detected any torch taste in years of use). Plus, the torch works just fine upside down or at any angle, no matter how filled the canister is.

Two points:

 

1) you can get a hose for any torch.  attach one end to the cylinder, the other to the torch, and you get the same thing. 

2) better torches have a regulator in them, which keeps them from drawing out liquid from the propane tank, which is what puts the torch out when inverted. 

 

I fail to see what the sansaire gives anyone over a flame spreader.

[boudin noir]

 

Cast iron can definitely deliver a great sear, but the torch has a few advantages:

1. Cast iron only sears flat things. It's great for strip steaks, but because cast iron relies on conduction as its only mode of heat transfer, it's pretty cumbersome to sear non-slab objects like a prime rib or rack of lamb. Even a chicken breast is a little too dome-shaped for reliable contact with the pan. The flame can sear round and uneven surfaces, and sneak into those nooks and crannies that conduction can't reach.
2. Temperature. On a powerful stove, you might be able to get your cast iron pan up to 600F. But, the temperature of the torch flame is 2200F. Temperature doesn't tell the whole story of heat transfer, but if your goal is to apply a dark outer crust fast without overcooking the interior, it matters a lot.
3. Smoke. When searing over a wire rack and drip tray - like the kind we built for the Sansaire Searing Kit - juices and liquid fat drip down off the food, away from the heat, and into the drip pan (ready to turn into a pan sauce). In a cast iron skillet, they have nowhere to go but airborne in the form of smoke. If you've got a kick-ass vent hood, then this isn't a big deal. But if your smoke alarm is like mine (even saying the word "smoke" out loud seems to set it off) then producing less smoke is an advantage.
4. Cleanup. The searing rack and tray from our searing kit are dishwasher safe, so I don't have to worry about rinsing out my cast iron right after searing.
5. Drama. I've yet to host a dinner party where the blowtorch searing step didn't make it to instagram. Pro tip: don't tell anyone what you're doing, just start searing in clear view of the dining room. Half way through, invite your 85-year-old grandmother to take over for you.

 

I can't argue the temperature issues since i can't measure it.

I concede that sometimes irregular pieces of meat may have some unbrowned spots but they are generally small and aren't significant.

I was struck, watching the searsall video, by how long it took to sear the meat. It is much faster and darker in the cast iron pan. The second video was time compressed so the time to sear could not be judged.

I use a dry pan; no oil. To clean up I just warm the pan, scrape with a plastic spatula, rub with salt and rinse. Very fast.

Also I don't have another piece of equipment that I have to store.

No argument about drama.

[btbyrd]

It would be nice if there was a de-bundled version available and you could just buy the torch head. 16 oz propane tanks are cheap (they're like $3.50 near me) and a cooling rack set over a sheet tray works just as well as a uni-tasker searing rack. Given that most people buying a torch for SV purposes will already have a cooling rack and a sheet tray, the $160 price point for the bundle seems awfully high.

 

I also don't think that the relevant contrast is between the Sansaire torch head and the Searzall, but between the Sansaire and a TS8000. The reason the Sansaire is so much faster when searing is that it's using direct heat rather than the radiant/infrared heat kicked out by the Searzall. The latter will always be slower, but it's also what allows you to use the Searzall as a handhead broiler rather than a torch. The broiler applications are what the Searzall is really all about. If you want to go faster, you can just remove the Searzall and blast away with the TS8000. There are a lot of people who use the Bernzomatic torch heads to finish sous vide meats and don't complain about torch taste. The Sansaire looks like it has a superior flame for searing purposes (given its size) but the question is whether that improvement (and the additional searing tray) is worth the $100+ premium over a TS8000.

[dcarch]

More great questions! We have not been able to produce "torch taste" with the Sansaire Searing Kit torch, despite trying really hard.

 

There are two prevalining hypotheses for what causes torch taste. Modernist Cuisine attributes it to the flavor of uncombusted fuel reaching the food surface. Dave Arnold and the Searzall team attribute it to chemical reactions that occur when food is exposed to too high a temperature, as you might experience with a direct flame.-------------------

 

 

Propane does not have a smell.

 

For safety reasons, the smell is artificially added to propane.

 

dcarch

[rotuts]

this is my torch

 

 

as you can see the head swivels.  Ive had it for about 10 years.  I saw some pipe fitters with this and hunted it down

 

its very hard to find.  not at HD etc.

 

it comes w one head ( seen here ) 2 , and 3.   it seemed pricey, and the three head for sure.

 

i liked it as the canister stays upright more or less.

 

as you can see I don't use it that often, note the canister bottom.

 

but it does what i want for me.

 

ive never had any problem with the smell, which is the sulfur added for safety.

 

if you have, study somewhere on line the Anatomy of a Flame and learn where the hottest spot id

 

no sulfur would ever escape that zone " smelly "

[mgaretz]

I just got the Sansaire Searing Kit from SLT yesterday and tried it last night on a sous vide tri-tip.  I think it came out very well.  The searing rack is super heavy duty and I like the fact that the drip tray is held in place below it.

 

I didn't torch the tri-tip to get a super crust, just some nice browning all over.  Took about 4-5 minutes, though I didn't actually time it.  I put the tray/rack on my stovetop so I could use my extractor fan, and it produced minimal smoke using that setup.

 

Overall I am very pleased with it.

[Seattle Food Geek]

Thanks so much for sharing your experience, Mark! If you ever have questions, problems, or come up with novel uses, we'd love to hear from you!

 

-Scott

[mgaretz]

Did another tri-tip with the Sansaire Searing Kit.  Took some photos of the torch in action and the finished tri-tip.  The tri-tip was cooked sous vide for 6 hours or so, then seared.  Searing took 4 minutes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2015 by mgaretz (log)

[mgaretz]

Scott from Sansaire sent me a bottle of their Steak Aging Sauce to try.  It uses a combination of ingredients (Fish sauce, soy sauce, molasses, Worcestershire sauce, monosodium glutamate, citric acid, xanthan gum) to simulate the flavor profile of aged steak.  It's primarily recommended to use while cooking sous vide - they recommend 1 tbs per pound of meat.  

 

I tried it the other day with a sirloin tip roast.  I used the recommended amount and no other spices or rubs, vacuum sealed with the beef and SV'd for 8 hours.  It was then seared with Sanasire searing kit.  It was then lightly seasoned with McCormick's Montreal Steak Rub (usually I season with this before it goes in the bath, but Scott recommended to season afterwards).

 

First, the roast seared a lot faster with the steak aging sauce than roasts I've done without.  I'd say about twice as fast.  The flavor was very nice.  A bit strong for me when served warm (but cold leftovers were great), so I will try using less next time.  (Could be you need less with the long cook times.)  My wife, however, went bonkers for it.  She insists I make all beef this way from now on!

 

So, bottom line, this will become a regular ingredient at our house!

 

 

 

[Seattle Food Geek]

Thanks so much for sharing your experience, Mark! Glad it was a hit :-)

[mgaretz]

3 hours ago, Seattle Food Geek said:

Thanks so much for sharing your experience, Mark! Glad it was a hit :-)

 

What do you think about needing less when the bath times are long?

[Seattle Food Geek]

I haven't had the experience of needing less for long bath times. In fact, I use Steak Aging Sauce for my 72-hour brisket!

 

I think the culprit is likely the combination of the Sansaire Steak Aging Sauce and the McCormick's Montreal Steak Rub. McCormick's blends are really salty (usually, they're they only seasoning on the food), and in combination with Steak Aging Sauce, it could be too aggressive. If you like the flavor of both together, I'd recommend scaling them both back a bit.

 

Thanks again!

[mgaretz]

It wasn't the salt so maybe I'm just not used to that strong of an aged steak flavor.  

[paulraphael]

It can be challenging to use a torch without getting off-flavors from unburned hydrocarbons. One of the advantages of the Searzall (which I don't have) is that metal diffuser creates distance, and creates a red-hot screen for the gas to travel through. This eliminates the taint. There's endless discussion on which kinds of gas taste good or bad; Nathan Myhrvold has shown that they're all the same: they taste bad if you don't manage complete combustion. 

 

At the very least, you have to hold the torch at a distance. If any flame hits the food, it better be blue. 

 

Another problem with torches (ironically) is that they burn so cleanly. That ghost-like blue flame is indeed over 2000°F, but there is very little radiant heat. 1000° dull orange briquets or broiler coils (or searzall screens) produce much more infra-red energy, which is more efficient and controllable at searing food. With a gas flame, you have heat that's much too intense right at the tip of the flame (it just tends to incinerate the surface) but as you pull that flame away from the food, the proximity temperature plummets; there's just too little radiation going on. This is why torches are tricky to control. 

 

I use a torch for some things; typically for touching up an unevenly browned roast. For a steak, I'll take a hot pan or griddle every time. I haven't used a Searzall, but suspect I'd find it more useful than my humble torch. A searzall on a monster torch like this new one would be bigger step in the right direction.

Edited January 13, 2016 by paulraphael (log)

[dscheidt]

On 1/13/2016 at 9:43 PM, paulraphael said:

 

 

 

I use a torch for some things; typically for touching up an unevenly browned roast. For a steak, I'll take a hot pan or griddle every time. I haven't used a Searzall, but suspect I'd find it more useful than my humble torch. A searzall on a monster torch like this new one would be bigger step in the right direction.

 

There's nothing new or monster about the torch.  It's a Bernzomatic BZ4500HS; the HS is "heat shrink" -- it's got a spread out flame to make shrinking heat shrink tubing  and film easier.  Heat shrinking is much the same problem as searing food, and so a spread flame makes sense for both.  It's basically a TS4000, with a different nozzle and tip.  Actual heat output isn't any higher than a 4000 or 8000, so it wouldn't get you anything attached to a Searzall. 

[mgaretz]

Another roast.  This time I used 2/3 tbs per pound of the Steak Aging Sauce and seasoned with Montreal Rub before going into the bath.  I liked the results much better than the full 1 tbs/lb.  More details here: https://forums.egullet.org/topic/152590-dinner-2016-part-1/?page=9#comment-2042841