Freeze Dryers and Freeze Dried Food (Part 1)

[Deryn]

Thank you Kerry for starting this fascinating topic! And thank you for all your 'experiments' and the pics that accompany them. I hope you will show us reconstituted results too when you can.

 

To the discussion at hand, about freeze dried 'dinners' ... you can freeze dry the individual ingredients then reconstitute and combine just as you would for your favorite recipe. For example, you can freeze dry hamburger, fresh or canned tomatoes, herbs, chiles, other vegetables, even cooked spaghetti, rice, noodles or potatoes. Or you can freeze dry the sauce once you have made it on the stove and add the starch (either freshly cooked or freeze dried separately) at the last minute. No freezer or fridge space required. Even kids can get dinner ready if they can boil water.

 

When dinner is finished, if it were me and I had left overs, I would no doubt try to 're-freeze-dry' the result. Home made freeze dried dinners are much healthier for you than the preservative laden ones you can buy (from Mountain House and other companies). Although you could package the ingredients together, keeping them stored separately gives you much more flexibility for different 'recipes' you may want to prepare from day to day.

Edited September 18, 2014 by Deryn (log)

[rotuts]

excellent points

 

I wonder if there then would be a way to shorten then 'boil-up'

 

BTW  does the North of the Border area have any  *** excellent *** orchards

 

for Apples and even better Pears ?

[rotuts]

I can't even manage to think that a 'FD'd' dinner would be even close to a non-FD,  Frozen'd dinner carefully VaC'D

 

OK

 

 

think FD'd  Coffee.  it might be an improvement on what Came Before That

 

but Yuk !  its for people who just want a bit of caffeine

 

Taste Buds Differ.  Some have < than reasonable.

 

whoever, good for them   Much More To " *** enjoy *** "

[Kerry Beal]

Rotus - indeed we do.  I am working today at the hospital which is located on the Niagara Peninsula - that is the area that grows  mostly wine grapes now - but in it's previous life it was all orchard.  

 

My last house had a Clapp's Favourite Pear tree in the back yard - great pears, lots of wasps.

[Kerry Beal]

I can't even manage to think that a 'FD'd' dinner would be even close to a non-FD,  Frozen'd dinner carefully VaC'D

 

OK

 

 

think FD'd  Coffee.  it might be an improvement on what Came Before That

 

but Yuk !  its for people who just want a bit of caffeine

 

Taste Buds Differ.  Some have < than reasonable.

 

whoever, good for them   Much More To " *** enjoy *** "

Ah yes - but I buy freeze dried cappuccino bits from Sosa at a very dear price that I then add to bark.  

[rotuts]

fair enough.  you are adding flavor to ' something else '  that is in a different dimension entirely.

 

excellent.

 

but  FD'ing something and thinking ' just add water ' to get back to where you started suggest :

 

You have got :

 

1 ) very few taste buds    ( not so bad, every things tastes  Sooooooo Goood  )  this i envy.

 

2 ) or are Extreemly Hungry   'On the Trail '   also good.

[Kerry Beal]

I don't think when I purchased this I was really thinking of it as something to use to preserve food - more as a means produce things I use in other things.

[rotuts]

Just So.

[Shelby]

But, now, when the end of the world comes, we can all go live with Kerry and eat freeze dried food 

[rotuts]

Crunch Crunch

[Harvest Right]

Some fun stuff on here about doing full meals and the answer is a definite yes you can FD meals. Soups, stews, pasta sauces, rice dishes work wonderfully. Also, proteins (pulled pork, chicken, steak, ham....) re-hydrate and taste almost identical to the original product. One of the reasons meals you can buy that are commercially FD might not taste quite as good is due to the quality of the food or meal that is freeze dried. The higher the quality of the original product, the better tasting the final product will be. Having said that.....extreme hunger/camping does make everything taste good  

[Chocolot]

Matt, I love the idea you told me about where you FD baby food in ice cube trays so that when you are out and about, you can just add water and feed the baby:)

[Kerry Beal]

Matt, I love the idea you told me about where you FD baby food in ice cube trays so that when you are out and about, you can just add water and feed the baby:)

I thought that was a brilliant idea when Matt mentioned it.  

[Mr. Mike]

I'm new to this forum, but I have been working with Matt from Harvest Right for about 4 months now.
 
I just picked up my 3rd machine and if that doesn't say enough about what impact it's had on me.. Well, I can post pics of all the foods I have done...of which is a TON of different things.
 
I've pushed the machine very hard in capacity, food type and the "learning curve" for what does and doesn't work...along with a few process improvements H.R. has taken for machine modifications and for myself.
 
I have to figure out how to post pics here..I have no clue..
 
What I have done do far is...
 
Meats: Anything grilled-smoked: pulled pork, brisket, ribs, sausage, smoked ham, turkey, lunch meats- turkey, pastrami, ham, grilled burgers, hamburger, steak, gyro meat, pizza toppings of various types,   meatballs,
 
Pasta:
Spaghetti w/ meat-sauce,
 
Eggs:
Raw eggs, scrambled eggs, omlets, hard boiled eggs.
 
Veggies:
Baked potato-loaded, sliced, mashed pototaos, grilled-squash, zuch, asparagas, peppers- bell- green-red, hatch chilies, jalapenos, onions- grilled raw, fresh sliced-cooked mushrroms, pickles- sliced chiped, various frozen veggies- corn, beans, okra, veggie blends, sundried tomatoes, brussel sprouts, peas-snap-snow, broccoli, carrots, celery
 
Dairy:
Cheese-fine, course, string, sour creme, cottage cheese, various ice cremes types, IC samitches, puddings,
 
Fruits:
Strawberries, peaches, pineappples etc,,
 
Snacks:
Twinkies, Zingers,
 
What doesn't work:
Pepperoni, any bread-flour based product -cookie- cake type product, honey- doesn't go bad. Stick butter, ( you CAN use butter IN products..not just by itself.) Any sausage product including hot dogs.. too much fat collects on the exterior and will go bad over time...nasty to say the least.
 
Now.. I have to figure out how ti post pics.
 
Q's ... let'er rip.
 
Mr. Mike

[Kerry Beal]

Glad you've jointed us Mike - will send you a PM to give you some info on posting pictures.  

 

I've got a couple of questions to start - what happens with cookies and cake etc?  (Of course this doesn't mean I won't try them).  Have you done high fat cream?  

Edited September 20, 2014 by Kerry Beal (log)

[Mr. Mike]

Drying any bread product bascically turns it into a crouton.

 

High fat is relative .. I won't do anything that is hight fat for a long term storage situation....goes rancid over time and heat.

 

High fat to me is marbeled steak, bacon,, sausages or pepperoni.

 

High fat ice-creams...sauces.. no biggie.. Note.. that the fat WILL go rancied over time.. (what that "time" is.???  it's.relative to temps and duration of time and storage method  vac seal vs. #10 cans w/ 02 absorber..) 

 

Alfredo, Velveta cheese, philly C. cheese...no biggie.  I'll psot pics when I figure that out....with your help.

 

Higher quality ice creme make for a better freeze and dried product..  I had "blow outs" where the "samitch" will loose the ice cream out the sides.  A FULL cycle of freezing is a must.  I shortened the freezing time and it "blew out" on quite a few samitches...SO bummed uot.. Icre cream samitches are the dastuff.com!

 

For reconstitution of various items requires different strategies.

 

Twinkies.... steam them back to life... about 6-7 min and the center comes back in a taffy like consistency...not creamy.

 

Cheese... if using it like on a pizza-nachos......crush it down to have smaller pieces... to make it melt better, to spritz it down with water real well... let is abosorb.. spritz as needed again, but not to a soggy state .and then you can microwave it. or bake it on the pizza with out it burning.

 

As a side note... I don't see my first post on the board.. is there a delay?  and per the "notification" this is my last post opportunity til the 21st due to "approval" .what ever that means.. No flame intended.

 

Hope this helps.

 

Mr. Mike

 

 

[Kerry Beal]

I know you won't be able to respond yet due to the approval process - but I'm interested in the whole steaming of twinkies thing.  It makes me wonder if a crouton could be made back into a bread cube with steam (i.e. in a Cuisinart Steam Oven).  

 

So high fat can be done - just not with plans to keep it for a long time.  Having cream powder to keep for a limited time would still be useful I think.  The anhydrous butter I made got put in the fridge - wasn't really thinking of it as being preserved - more just dried out!

 

Matt gave me the heads up right away about the ice cream sandwich blowouts - so I've probably been over freezing things to avoid that.  

[Deryn]

Welcome to the forum, Mike. And thank you for that comprehensive list of things you have experimenting with drying. I look forward to you being able to post pictures, as I am sure most here do. I hope to purchase a Harvest Right drier soon myself - and therefore also thank you for what you have contributed to its development/improvement.

 

Questions (for the next time you can post - I'm new too so I understand the limitation there): Have you tried doing fish and shellfish? And do you have pictures as well as your personal taste opinion about most or all of the items you have successfully dried once reconstituted?

Edited September 20, 2014 by Deryn (log)

[dbinokc]

Greeting all.

 

I saw the thread about the freeze dryer and decided I would sign up to comment. I have had one for about two months now and have really been wanting to share experiences with others who have used the unit. I wish Harvest Right would set up their own user forum already!

 

Primarliy at this point I have stuck with basic fruits. Apples, banannas, strawberries, blue berries. All come out great. The only limitation I have really found is with the ice capacity of the machine. It seems to be able to extract about 3 pounds of water before defrosting. is need. Otherwise the time to finish goes way up. I have some ideas on how to maybe increase that with some theirmal shielding, but have not tried yet.

 

I will share one thing that did not go well with freeze draying. That is orange juice concentrate. It has some much sugar in it, that even at -50F, I ended up with a messy explosion of  freeze dried OJ. I did let the process complete and the freeze dreid OJ concentrate reconstiuted just fine. I was just a really messy clean up. I probably will not try it again.

 

An interesting comment on the hot dogs not freeze drying well. That was one of the things I was planning to try in the near future. I will still try it and also see how well it holds up under vacuum sealing.

 

Looking forward to hearing from the other HR users.

[Kerry Beal]

Welcome dbonokc.  Is there a short form for that?

 

I was wondering earlier if adding maltodextrin to juice would help - but then making it back into juice might be an issue.

[Beth Wilson]

How would you go about drying cappuccino for bits to include in chocolate?  I like the sound of that in a chocolate.

 

Can you use your Foodsaver to store all this freeze dried stuff or does it have to be in mylar bags with oxygen keepers?

[Deryn]

If you add gelatin to orange juice it should dry well (like the freeze dried ice cream but crispier) I believe. Kerry, you may find that the result would be good enrobed in chocolate. If you reconstitute it however, it won't be pure orange juice.

 

Beth, you could use a Foodsaver to store it, but, you should include O2 absorbers in the package - and mylar would be a longer term storage solution. You can also use mason jars (if you have a jar vacuum attachment) but again, include an O2 absorber. My chamber vac can seal mylar (can't be done well with a Foodsaver) but you can also use a flat (or round if you are careful) hair straightener/curler or an iron to seal a wide strip across the top after vacuuming with your Foodsaver. Mylar is difficult to vacuum with a regular Foodsaver type machine however because the bags are completely smooth - it can be done by inserting a piece of a textured bag into the top but may not be worth the effort if you are doing many bags.

Edited September 20, 2014 by Deryn (log)

[Kerry Beal]

How would you go about drying cappuccino for bits to include in chocolate?  I like the sound of that in a chocolate.

 

Can you use your Foodsaver to store all this freeze dried stuff or does it have to be in mylar bags with oxygen keepers?

Doing a combination of vacuum bags and mylar - and mason jars that I vacuum shut with my foodsaver attachment.  

 

Cappuccino bits - experiments to be determined!

 

If you add gelatin to orange juice it should dry well (like the freeze dried ice cream but crispier) I believe. Kerry, you may find that the result would be good enrobed in chocolate. If you reconstitute it however, it won't be pure orange juice.

 

Beth, you could use a Foodsaver to store it, but, you should include O2 absorbers in the package - and mylar would be a longer term storage solution. You can also use mason jars (if you have a jar vacuum attachment) but again, include an O2 absorber. My chamber vac can seal mylar (can't be done well with a Foodsaver) but you can also use a flat (or round if you are careful) hair straightener/curler or an iron to seal a wide strip across the top after vacuuming with any chamber vac. Mylar is difficult to vacuum with a regular Foodsaver type machine however because the bags are completely smooth - it can be done by inserting a piece of a textured bag into the top but may not be worth the effort if you are doing many bags.

Wonder how thick-it would work.  Still you couldn't reconstitute to regular juice.

 

My bigger foodsaver has an adjustable heater - so I can seal the mylar with the extra time.  

Edited September 20, 2014 by Kerry Beal (log)

[dbinokc]

Hi Kerry, I am not sure what you mean by short form?

 

I notice people mentioning using foodsavers. I would highly recommend getting a chamber style vacuum sealer if the budget permits. The bags being much much cheaper compared to foodsaver style bags. The chamber in my model is big enough that I can put mason jars with lids in on their sides and vacuum seal them that way. Other models also have a nitrogen purge feature, so you can backfill with nitrogen gas for items that would be crushed by the bag in full vacuum.

 

The model I use is a Vacmaster B210. I have had it for about 2 years and have used the heck out of it. I use it so I can cook in large batches. I can pretty much do most of my cooking on the weekends.

 

 

Just to stay on the topic of the freeze dryer, one thing I will add for people who might contemplate getting one, is the machine puts out a lot of heat. Of course you are running freezer, vacuum pump and heaters all at the same time. I have been limited to running my machine on the weekends when I am home all day and I run the AC. With temperatures about to start to cooling down, I will be running my machine more frequently

Edited September 20, 2014 by dbinokc (log)

[Kerry Beal]

Hi Kerry, I am not sure what you mean by short form?

 

I notice people mentioning using foodsavers. I would highly recommend getting a chamber style vacuum sealer if the budget permits. The bags being much much cheaper compared to foodsaver style bags. The chamber in my model is big enough that I can put mason jars with lids in on their sides and vacuum seal them that way. Other models also have a nitrogen purge feature, so you can backfill with nitrogen gas for items that would be crushed by the bag in full vacuum.

 

The model I use is a Vacmaster B210. I have had it for about 2 years and have used the heck out of it. I use it so I can cook in large batches. I can pretty much do most of my cooking on the weekends.

 

 

Just to stay on the topic of the freeze dryer, one thing I will add for people who might contemplate getting one, is the machine puts out a lot of heat. Of course you are running freezer, vacuum pump and heaters all at the same time. I have been limited to running my machine on the weekends when I am home all day and I run the AC. With temperatures about to start to cooling down, I will be running my machine more frequently

Not sure where I said short form - think I meant short term and it probably got autocorrected.  

 

Can you post a picture of vacuuming on the side in your chamber vac?

 

I do have a chamber vac - but so far haven't used it for anything from the FD'er.  I'm just using the Foodsaver to seal the mylar bags (as well as unvacuumed chamber vac bags) and with the mason jar attachment to evacuate and seal mason jars.  

Edited September 20, 2014 by Kerry Beal (log)