Home Made Ice Cream (2013– )

[JoNorvelleWalker]

I agree that the reviews are usually not impartial - They don't get home made enough to evaluate, and never get more experimental flavours...

I have a question for anyone that might know :

atomized glucose 21 DE and atomized glucose 52 DE

If I understand correctly these would basically be dextrose with starch filler - 21% and 52% dextrose and the rest starch?

Has anyone tried mixing their own instead of buying it (for those that have used it)?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dextrose_equivalent

[Bojana]

I can report that raspberry sorbet is going to be a big success! At least, to my liking that is. What i love in sorbets is when they have an almost creamy mouth feel, without being heavy like cream based ice cream. The one I made last night is just that: tart, not too sweet and creamy but not chewy.

I used my home blended stabilizer for the first time. Sifted together 10 gr xantan gum, 10 gr kappa carrageenan (turned out I did not have locust bean gum in my powders) and 17 gr guar gum. I think kappa does not do much in sorbets anyway, since it needs dairy protein to react but I figured it would not do much harm and wanted to test that anyway.

Next one will be cream vanilla-cardemom base with toffee cookies. Stay tuned

[Darienne]

I can report that raspberry sorbet is going to be a big success! At least, to my liking that is. What i love in sorbets is when they have an almost creamy mouth feel, without being heavy like cream based ice cream. The one I made last night is just that: tart, not too sweet and creamy but not chewy.

Interesting side note: What you like about the sorbet...and I LOVE raspberries...is what my DH dislikes about it. Two people raised on different food patterns married now for over 53 years and still the childhood experiences linger on forever... He wants it heavy and creamy and I want it light and tart.

I did make a raspberry ice cream last year and ate the whole thing myself. No, he did not like it. Not creamy enough.

[paulraphael]

I don't have Francisco Migoya's Frozen Desserts book ... i read that it has a recipe for sorbet stabilizer made from some combination of carboxymethylcellulose, guar gum and locust bean gum.

[timpoblete]

One of the local ice cream shop, Delise Dessert Cafe, uses fruit pectin as the stabilizer in their sorbets.

[JoNorvelleWalker]

Sorry, I returned my copy of Frozen Desserts to the library. Currently reading ICE CREAM! The Whole Scoop by Gail Damerow. Damwrow has a chapter on emulsifiers and stabilizers, and for sorbets recommends arrowroot or kudzu starch in conjuction with gelatin and pectin, at the rate of one teaspoon per quart of arrowroot to a half teaspoon each of gelatin and pectin. I'm not much into sorbet, so I'll leave the experiment for others to try.

[paulraphael]

For sorbets I use gelatin (0.15%) and xanthan (0.05%). Same ingredients but different proportions than for ice cream.

People like pectin because it allows them say the sorbet is vegetarian, but I don't think it's as good a stabilizer as gelatin. If veggie is important, I'd go for the gums. They're more effective than starches and give better texture than pectin.

Pectin exists on its own in many fruits. The quantity of stabilizer you use should probably be modified with this in mind. Here's some info I've compiled:

High pectin content fruits:

Citrus skins (oranges, tangerines, grapefruit, lemons, limes, etc. - the pectin is high in the skin but low in the fruit), tart cooking apples, crab apples, most plums, lemons, and wild grapes (Eastern Concord variety), cranberries and boysenberries. Blackberries.

Medium pectin fruits:

Apricots, rhubarb, quince

Low pectin fruits:

Cherries, grapefruit, grape juice, grapes (other than wild and Concord types), melons, oranges

Very Low pectin fruits:

Nectarines, strawberries, peaches, pears, figs, elderberries, raspberries, grapes (Western Concord variety), guava, pomegranates.

[Bojana]

The flavour of cardemom tofee cookie ice cream is amazing. The texture...less so. My dairy based ice cream reacted so much stronger to my stabilizer than the sorbet. The cooled mass was very thick and a bit elastic, so I run it through the blender. After churning and freezing , the ice cream maintained a slightly elastic, gummy texture that was just wrong. I used 0.5% of stabilizer, next time I'll try with 0.3% before giving up on this specific stabilizer blend.

On the very positive note, both raspberry sorbet and cardemom ice cream were easily scoopable at -18C and were quite pleasant to eat from the temperature point of view. Corvitto principles really helped me to get the proportions of different sugars and fats right to achieve this.

[paulraphael]

Is there carrageenan in it? That will work much more powerfully if there's calcium around.

Gums in general are really powerful, especially in certain combinations. It can be a challenge mixing in small enough quantities for home-sized batches.

[JoNorvelleWalker]

Is there carrageenan in it? That will work much more powerfully if there's calcium around.

Gums in general are really powerful, especially in certain combinations. It can be a challenge mixing in small enough quantities for home-sized batches.

This makes me think that I am indeed using a stabilizer in my ice cream after all. The ultra pasteurized cream I usually buy has carrageenan as an additive.

[paulraphael]

This makes me think that I am indeed using a stabilizer in my ice cream after all. The ultra pasteurized cream I usually buy has carrageenan as an additive.

That's a great point. I've noticed this when I'm not buying fancy cream from artisinal dairy. It's frustrating, because the cartons are vague about how much is in there. I've never tried figuring it out or compensating for it, but it probably makes at least a small difference. The carrageenan is used as a whipping aid.

[Emily_R]

I wanted to share a new recipe I created that I'm really happy with! Rhubarb Maple Sherbet. Sweet and tart, and deeply flavored with brown sugar, maple, and vanilla...

http://food52.com/recipes/22368-rhubarb-maple-sherbet

[Bojana]

Is there carrageenan in it? That will work much more powerfully if there's calcium around.

Gums in general are really powerful, especially in certain combinations. It can be a challenge mixing in small enough quantities for home-sized batches.

I made a mix of 10g xantan, 10 g kappa carrageenan and 17 gr of guar gum. Used 5 gr of that mix in 1000gr mix, or 0.5% of stabilizer of which 0.14% is carrageenan, not counting the one in cream. Next time i was thinking to reduce stabilizer to 3 gr per kg. Do you know what should be the max % of carrageenan? I have precision scale so should be able to measure small quantities (0.1 gr) but I may need to redo my stabilizer mix.

[jjahorn]

Bojana - please do keep on reporting about your mix - and if you decide to change it.

As someone who is starting out on this line with ice creams, reading about your tests are helpful to let me plan how to do my own mix.

[Bojana]

Bojana - please do keep on reporting about your mix - and if you decide to change it.

As someone who is starting out on this line with ice creams, reading about your tests are helpful to let me plan how to do my own mix.

What may also help you is to know the exact formulations of my ice cream in which the stabilizer was used. Here is a screenshot from my excel:

I have steeped 5gr of green cardemom pods in hot water for 10 mins, then weighted 484 gr of that and mixed with cream, added powdered milk and dextrose to it and heated to 40C, then added a mix of sugar and stabilizer and heated it to 85C while mixing.

You see that my ice cream ended having higher fat % that Corvitto guideline but still lower than 10% of his upper limit. It is also slightly sweeter (fine for my taste) and the out of freezer texture was very scoopable. Where it failed was this elasticity in the mouth, for which I should reduce stabilizer next time. Worth mentioning that I am using powdered milk whihc is not fat free but has 28% fat - I could not find the fat free version.

[paulraphael]

The Migoya recipe I have specifies 0.35% stabilizers, made of 1 part xanthan, 1.75 parts lucust bean gum, 1.75 parts guar gum. This might work in lower quantities than your gums, since all three of these ingredients are synergetic (superadditive). But it might not!

I don't have enough experience with carrageenan to offer any real guidance. My references say it forms a "firm, brittle gel," while guar, lcb, and xanthan are merely "thickeners." It's possible that carageenan just has a more radical effect and needs to be used in smaller quanities to keep the textures from getting exaggerated. This is just a guess.

I think your inclination is probably right, to reduce the total stabilizers, or at least reduce the carrageenan.

[Bojana]

I have found some interesting data on the usage of gums in ice cream.

http://www.lucidcolloids.com/pdf/775854685_stabilizer.pdf

Next to using too much of it, it seems that my mix has too much xantan as well, which caused the elastic texture.

[Bojana]

Finally success! I made crema catalana ice cream (with 6 yolks in it!) over the weekend, using 2 gr of my stabiliser per 1000g mix and the texture is amazing. However, I rarely make ice cream using yolk so before declaring victory, I'll have to make my general, egg free version to be fully sure that I got this right. But no elastic texture problem at least.

[ericparkr]

That's right. In my ice cream I always use milk, a little less than half of fat cream, sugar, glucose syrup and egg yolks, I find that it works well in the right proportions.

[JoNorvelleWalker]

What do you guys mean when you say "readily scoop-able ? What I do when we want to eat ice cream is move ice from -30 freezer to -18 freezer for about 12-24 hours, then leave it outside 5-10 mins before serving.

New information. I've been reading Chris Clarke, The Science of Ice Cream 2nd Edition. Scoopability is the physical property yield stress (p 175).

[wannabechef]

I've been making ice cream for about 3 years now. Started out going through a lot of the recipes in the Lebovitz, Perfect Scoop book and was pretty happy. I then discovered the Jeni's Splendid ice cream book and was blown away. This is my second year making ice creams using her technique and I don't think I've made a bad batch yet. As she notes in her intro, the cream cheese is more there to impact the way the ice cream sits on your tounge after you take a bite (I forgot the technical term for this). The corn starch is there as a thickener, and I believe the corn syrup has something to do with the freezing point. In any case, her technique has been a home run for me. I haven't made a custard based ice cream since using her book and don't miss it at all.

Has anyone had or tried making Turkish maras dondurmasi? I want to try making this one day. This style of ice cream is actually stretchy and chewy. In Turkey the guys who sell it on the street do all sorts of tricks with it, stretching it, sticking it places, pulling it out of your hand as they give you the cone, etc. I did some research there and found that the way they get this consistency is by using something they call "salep" which is a flour made from the roots of an orchid plant. Its pretty expensive and hard to find the real stuff, but I picked up a packet last time I was there. Haven't attempted to make it yet though.

[Darienne]

Maras dondurmasi Learn something new everyday. Do report if you try making some.

Very good-natured young person buying the ice cream.

[alonsohdez90]

I am looking for good large batch ice cream recipes, something that could be used in restaurants. im completly open to any flavor and recipes that include professional stablizers and/or techninques. Thanks for the help!!!

[Tri2Cook]

In Migoya's Frozen Desserts, the recipes are based on 5 kg batches. You have to scale them down for smaller batches or home use.

[paulraphael]

Recipes scale easily enough. The challenge is hardening big batches quickly enough to keep the ice crystals small. Ice cream stores use a hardening cabinet ... basically a -40° flash freezer. There are smaller versions for restaurants.

The other issue is cooling custard-based recipes quickly enough to avoid health hazards. For big batches you have to use an ice water bath before aging the mix, which will get tedious.