The Atkins Diet Topic

[circeplum]

just read john whiting's 'diet of worms' thread with interest. i've also done a search on atkins diet and this was the only topic that came up. has anyone on the board actually tried atkins? have you had any success? the official site makes it sound miraculous, even loweing cholesterol levels.

can this be for real?

[Simon Majumdar]

I have banged on about this for a few other posts but I started Atkins in june 01 and now still keep off most carbs

REMEMBER: CARBS = DEATH

Anyway. My blood pressure reduced from borderline hypertensive to safe

My Cholesterol level dropped

and, most of all, I have now gone from 15st (210lbs) to 11st 3 ( 157lbs )

So yes, it works

The regime is a bit tough, but becomes natural after a while and I also put it with an exercise programme as well

I now treat myself to the occasional choccy or bit of wonderful bread, but cut out all the crappy stuff

Worth a try

S

[circeplum]

what's the stance on alcohol, simon? are you still indulging?

a life without booze ...

[Simon Majumdar]

what's the stance on alcohol, simon?  are you still indulging?

a life without booze ...

Has you seen me on Saturday, or indeed the state of me on Sunday morning after the Dim Sum outing, you would know the answer to that question!!

S

[John Whiting]

I'm scared of the pure Atkins diet -- any regime that takes you off fresh fruits and veggies and then sells you dietary supplements to make up for their absence is highly suspicious.

And more than one doctor I trust has told me that a prolonged very high fat diet of the sort that Atkins endorses is a pretty sure way to ruin your kidneys. The human body just isn't equipped to deal with extreme levels of saturated fat. Nor did our primitive ancestors have it available to them except in short spurts -- the animals they hunted were mostly as lean as themselves. (Don't know about the Inuits; that's another matter.)

I'm also careful to get lots of omega-3 oils to help the fat processing -- sardines in my salads several times a week. Fortunately I like them: my diet is based entirely on foods I actually enjoy, though some more than others.

As for carbs, the really dangerous ones are the processed ones: sugar, refined flour, polished rice etc. Anyone on a normal weight-maintenance diet who ate wholemeal bread, brown rice, wholemeal pasta etc. wouldn't be doing themselves any harm. Even Poilane's pain levain, though white, is made with unbleached stoneground flour. It certainly won't kill you.

I find that the biggest advantage of the no-carb rule is psychological: most of the snacks that it's so easy to pick up from fast-food joints between meals are refined carbohydrate-based, and so cutting them out removes a lot of just-this-once temptation. You can always drop into a grocery store and pick up a hunk of cheese, but you can get through just so much without any bread to dilute it.

I only plan to stay religiously on this diet until I've lost about thirty pounds, which will probably take me about a year. I don't necessarily stick with it when I eat out, but that doesn't happen all that often. This weekend I'll be at the Oxford Symposium, with lots of good food floating about. I'll weigh myself before I go and if I've put any on I'll fast until I'm back to where I was. Fortunately I can do that without any particular discomfort.

The bottom line is: If it weren't easy, and even fun, I wouldn't do it!

[J Acord]

Regarding this whole atkins diet thing, is it only meant to be for a short amount of time or is it a change people make for the long term?

While I am sure it might help you to lose weight I have a friend who has been on it for far too long IMHO and now looks positively skeletal. There is obviously some whole eating disorder thing going on there as well but I wonder what other dmage he might be doing to himself.

[Simon Majumdar]

I think it is about balance and John is right as being on Atkins does make you think about your eating habits in detail.

in the end, moderation in all things, except Mr Booze of course.

S

[Marlene]

I have to say that after trying all the "diets" Weight Watchers worked for me. Mostly because it's a life style change or a life long way of eating.

It's been five years now, and i lost 70 lbs and have kept them off. OF course, I find as I get older, I actually have to go to the gym as well. It's not enough anymore just to watch what I eat!

[Fat Guy]

Can somebody explain to me how alcoholic beverages fit into a low carb diet? I've noticed that many low carb adherents make this seemingly incongruous exception to the regimen.

[Marlene]

Can somebody explain to me how alcoholic beverages fit into a low carb diet? I've noticed that many low carb adherents make this seemingly incongruous exception to the regimen.

Alcoholic beverages don't really fall into any "diet" as an acceptable item, however, in the spirit of "all things in moderation" most "diets" or weight programs allow them, mostly because they know people are not likely to give them up.

As a point of reference, I lose more weight when I don't drink at all, following the same eating patterns that I do when I do drink. It tends to be a matter of making choices as are most things in life.

[Fat Guy]

I get the sense that many low carb people believe the carbohydrates in alcoholic beverages fall into a magical category that somehow doesn't count. I'm trying to figure out if there's good science behind this seemingly delusional belief, or if it's just a fancy form of denial.

[Rail Paul]

Ive been on it for a month, and have taken off about 20 pounds. As John suggests, a little moderation goes a long way toward effectiveness. This isn't Cistercian asceticism.

I added a modest amount of fresh spinach, kale, broccoli daily, and blend my own salad dressings. Typically grill extra chicken breasts, or sirloin, and reserve for a subsequent meal. Take a multi-vitamin. My target is to not exceed 40 grams of carb intake daily for the first two months.

Also, as noted, occasional vigorous exercise is recommended. Saturday, I chopped wood for two hours, producing about a half cord of split wood. Last Wednesday, I spent two hours clearing an overgown area toward the back of our property. Good, sweaty, achy work.

I expect to increase the carb total to about 70 in mid-October. That will allow for an occasional baguette, roll, pizza slice, etc.

[Marlene]

I get the sense that many low carb people believe the carbohydrates in alcoholic beverages fall into a magical category that somehow doesn't count. I'm trying to figure out if there's good science behind this seemingly delusional belief, or if it's just a fancy form of denial.

It's a fancy form of denial. IF there's one thing I know about now, it's weight loss. Every calorie counts no matter where it comes from. The problem with alcohol is that those calories are what is termed "empty calories" meaning they have no nutritional value. If one is following the point system on WW for example, and you are allotted say 30 points for the day, a 4 oz glass of wine will cost you 2 points. There are very few "free" calories other than raw veggies.

[Adam Balic]

I get the sense that many low carb people believe the carbohydrates in alcoholic beverages fall into a magical category that somehow doesn't count. I'm trying to figure out if there's good science behind this seemingly delusional belief, or if it's just a fancy form of denial.

FG - here is a link that indicates the calorific content of 200 popular (US) Beers.

http://brewery.org/brewery/library/AlClbinger.html

From what I have read the calories from the actual alcohol itself, don't seem to contribute to fat-bastardness. Plenty of recent medical publications on this. One thought is that requires more energy to break down the alcohol then the actual energy avalible to the body from the alcohol. Seems wrong some how I know.

Yes I am denial. Maybe we should set up a poll: Egullet weigh in?

[bigbear]

I remember using this diet about 30 years ago, when it was also touted as "the drinking man's diet." Alcohol's carbs were magically different. In short, it worked. But please, drink lots of water for your kidneys' sake.

[Charles Smith]

As someone who's lost 75+ pounds and kept it off, I am a firm believer is a balanced diet and exercise as the only way to be healthy. I worry about the Atkins diet's ability to keep you healthy, as opposed to just thin. Fiber and vitamins are so important in cancer prevention and long term health, and that's what you miss most in the Atkins approach. Losing weight is a simple formula- Use more calories than you consume. Being healthy is another matter. I also think that each person has to develop a diet mix that works- everyone's body deals with things differently- some will burn carbs more readily than protein, or vice versa.

Cheers,

Charles

[macrosan]

Allowing for that exceptional, tiny proportion of people with glandular and similar problems, the fact is remarkably simple. The more you eat, and the less you exercise, the more weight you will put on. And vice versa.

Anyone who loses weight via Weight Watchers or Atkins or Dr Shmo's Lowfat Diet or Granny Feigele's Eatasmuchasyoucan Diet could almost certainly have achieved the same results without spending a lot of money on these fancy diets. Because any diet relies above all else on a person's motivation and self-discipline, and if you have both of those then you can lose weight on your own (with a little bit of free education).

Each proprietary diet that comes on the market has to establish a Uniques Selling Proposition to make it "new" and "different" from its competitors, so we goet low-carbohydrate doets and high-carbohydrate diets, low-fat diets and high-fat diets, low-protein diets and high-protein diets. The obvious fact is they can't all be right except to the extent of what they have in common, and that is that under all of these diets you eat less than you used to.

I don't know if any of them is healthy long-term. I fall back on a common-sense position, which is that human beings are designed as, and have through several hundred thousand years of evolution existed as, omnivores, and until I see true scientific research that indicates otherwise, I shall eat what my body tells me it wants. In other words, whatever I enjoy eating, and as much as I enjoy eating

[StephenT]

Low carb diet is a useful way of training yourself not to eat too much that you don't need. If you eat enough vegetables and meat to meet your energy requirements then you get all sorts of useful things like vitamins and minerals with your calories (okay so you get some of that from carbohydrates too but it's probably outweighed by the large number of calories).

As macrosan wisely said, you need discipline. A low carb diet (not necessarily the rather OTT Atkins diet) is a good way to instill that and generally make you think about what you eat. After doing that for a while, you're better able to make choices about what to eat and what not to eat.

[John Whiting]

So far as the facts are concerned, Charles has got it right. Twenty years ago I lost about forty pounds and got down to a 28in waist following a totally conventional diet -- balance of proteins, carbs, fibre etc. but in extreme moderation. Back then the only motive I needed was vanity -- I just looked a hell of a lot better. Also I wasn't such a dedicated foodie, so it was easy to go without. The pleasure of looking in the mirror (not all the time ) outweighed the pleasure of a bit more food.

Now, when beauty is no longer a consideration , I need another motive (such as living longer in a condition in which I don't wish I were dead) coupled with a diet which is a positive pleasure rather than just a means to an end. If the long-term fat doesn't shift, then I'll fast a day a week to help it along. Anything rather than count calories (which for me makes eating about as much fun as making love against a stop watch).

I suspect that Weight Watchers works if one is a social type who welcomes or even requires social reenforcement. Fine. Excess eating, like alcoholism, tends to be a private vice and going public can help. But it's just not my scene.

[g.johnson]

The more you eat, and the less you exercise, the more weight you will put on. And vice versa.

This is what the mathematicians call trivially true. True but of little interest. The real question is why people eat more than they need. The body is perfectly good at maintaining other balances – temperature for example – why not weight?

If I understand the arguments correctly, Atkins proponents claim that eating carbohydrates causes an increase in insulin levels which in turn causes an increase in hunger. So you tend to consume more calories than you need. On the other hand, eating protein and fat causes satiety at a lower calorific intakes, so you automatically eat the right amount.

[circeplum]

the fact is remarkably simple. The more you eat, and the less you exercise, the more weight you will put on. And vice versa.

in any case, this is not what i want to hear.

[foodie52]

In the store where I work, I can always tell who is on the Atkins: their shopping carts contain : pork rinds, mayonnaise, cheese, beef, butter, Atkins shakes, Atkins baking mix, Atkins bars. One couple whose progress I have been casually following load up on the above. They've even taught a class on the low carb lifestyle.

Both are overweight. Neither appears to have lost very many pounds.

It's all very confusing...

[jhlurie]

I missed this little debate until now.

For years, since first reading about Adkins, I've been wary of it. It's a fallacy that the human body was made for a diet of nothing but Fat and Protien--just take a look at our teeth for a moment.

That said, we should always strive to take wisdom out of ignorance. We do eat too many carbs.

Time Magazine weighed in, just last week. Quite favorably towards Adkins, actually. But the real genesis of our weight problems may be hormonal--as in "hormonal imblance". Read the article.

The article also talks about the differences between simple and complex carbs. I was shocked to hear someone who I thought should know better tell me a few weeks ago that "a carb is a carb". Crapola. My 8th grade Biology class was enough to convince me that's not true, and that was a generation ago.

Also in Time, Adkins and Dean Ornish have a little fight...

BTW: I've lost 25 pounds in the past few months. How? Mostly by cutting total consumption... although I have ALSO cut out unneccesary carbs when possible.

Doubtless, I will eventually put it back on. But that's just a matter of my lack of discipline.

[Wilfrid]

This isn't Cistercian asceticism.

Although I was just reading about that last night, and it seems a sure-fire way to lose those extra pounds.

[Rail Paul]

This isn't Cistercian asceticism.

Although I was just reading about that last night, and it seems a sure-fire way to lose those extra pounds.

Agreed.

Although Atkins is likely to have few takers among the eGullet crowd, that number will exceed those in eGullet who aspire to Cistercian practices.