J Acord

Indeed, meat glue would simplify the whole process greatly - but welded meat may not have the same mouthfeel as a terrine

I would love to know as well. I have asked a few times and the butchers say that it is possible, but resturants tend to pre-order it (which ones I wonder, I have never seen any evidence of it). Oddly I was taking to a friend about this today he mentioned that he got his from a Turkish butcher. Sadly, this is in London. Good back-fat is also an issue. ← Adam, next time you're down I'll give you some caul. Having just found it for sale I'll now have to make some dishes to use it in (braised ox-tail with a mushroom farce wrapped in caul perhaps?) I have also used back-fat in the past (though I tried slicing it myself, quite difficult to do to get big enough peices to line the terrine) but usually end up using something like bacon or parma/serrano instead as it is just that bit easier to find/work with.

I'll play! My first couple of images are desserts that are based on one type of ingredient but presented in a number of ways (much like a chocolate sampler, etc.). First up is pears: Pear bavarian with a liquid raspberry couli core topped with poached pears set in a spiced jelly. Quenelle of pear sorbet with a dried pear chip garnish. Port reduction sauce. Sorry about the slightly blurred image, I later realised that there was a dirty great fingerprint on the camera lense! Next we have apples (even worse image, sorry ) A dome of poached red apple slices encasing a green apple mousse with a core of diced sauteed yellow apples. Topped with a puff pastry 'halo' and caramel apple sauce. I would usually further garnish this with a couple of hazelnuts dipped in caramel but I had a bit too much to drink before serving it and decided that dipping into hot sugar may not be the best idea!

The fun part though, is that if you add an acid (like citric acid found in fruit or acetic acid from vinegar) then the gel will liquify again... wonder how you could incorporate that into the dish (or does it then change from being a dish to being performance art? )

Oooh, I'm going to have to give this a try now! Still trying to figure out if the sodium alginate is present in high enough levels in the agar-agar for this to work... (Mad scientist cackling fades.....)

Alternatively you could try putting some vodka (or other high alcohol solution) into the freezer for a couple of hours and then dropping your warm jelly mixture into this, which should cause it to set up right away (obviously water can only go to 0 centigrade before becoming frozen, but alcohol can get lower than that and still remain in a liquid form).

Having just had a bbq last sunday for 25 people I had the same dilemma. Ended up making tropical fruit salad which you can then put into a big bowl and let everyone serve themselves, and also made spiced rhubarb cheesecake ('cause the rhubarb was nice and cheap, and I really like it but didn't want to do the normal rhubarb crumble). Was also going to mess around with a lemon tart, but decided to go out drinking on saturday night instead!

The Witchery is very atmospheric, but the food is strangely old fashioned and very expensive. For the kind of money that you will spend there, there are many other better restaurnats in Edinburgh. But for ambience it does get 9/10.

Hey Tarka As promised last night, here are my suggestions for Edinburgh (though of course, I take no responsibility if you don't like them ) Cocktails - Borough on Mayfield Road. Is actually a hotel but has a very good cocktail bar. You can also eat there, but we never have, so I don't know what it is like for that. Italian - Gennaro in the Grassmarket. A nice, cheap and cheerful italian restaurant. Don't stray from the pizza or pasta and you'll do fine. French - Petit Paris (I think) also in the grassmarket, basically two doors down from Gennaro's. Again very nice, actually run by french people, good authentic cuisine, be warned, it is quite samll and therefore doesn't require too many people to be packed. While in he grassmarket, go and see Isobel at the Cooks Book Shop (owned by Clarissa Dixson Wright, who occasionally is in residence). Say John sent you. Fantastic bookshop which I used to frequent very often. Kalpna always gave me wind (just be warned) None of the mexican restaurants are worth the money you pay for them Blue moon cafe does an excellent full breakfast (the gut-buster really lives up to its name) and also a good selection of lunchtime meals. Can also get very crowded, so get there early to get a table. Umm, thats about all I can think of right now, but if any more comes to me then I'll be sure to let you know. John

Dinner party time again! Starters. Just decided to go for quick snacks rather than a formal sit down starter as I didn't have much time to prepare and wanted to concentrate on a good main course and dessert. Ended up with home made bread sticks and marinated olives, and also cherry toatoes stuffed with goats cheese. Main course. Slamon mi cuit on a bed of braised cabbage with a horseradish sauce and beetroot foam. I LOVE MI CUIT! It isn't like cooking at all! Two short blasts of heat to get the oil up to 35-40 C and then just leave it for 40 min. I didn't have to run around keeping my eye on anything, making sure it wasn't burning, etc., just pop in evey 10 mins, stick the digital thermometer into the oil to check if it needed heating up again and that was it. Mi cuit gives you plenty of time to drink with your guests. Horseradish sauce was different from what I was expecting; was basically runny horseradish mashed potatos, good flavour though. Beetroot foam didn't foam enough. Made plenty of mess though. Dessert. Mango imperial cake with strawberry sorbet. Have had better luck with a green apple imperial cake, but decided to change the main ingredient for something a bit more summery. Don't think the mango had the right depth of flavour for this dessert though. The mangos themselves were really good, and when you got to the diced mango layer of the cake it was quite nice, but the mango mousse topping just wasn't up to scratch. Strawberry sorbet was good, but needed a bit more sugar (probably should have let it soften a bit more before I tried to form quenelles out of it as well). Sugar 'spider' decoration was a lot of fun though, guests had a great time seeing how many legs they could knock out before the dessert fell over.

Thanks everyone for your suggestions. It's always nice to have a place recommended, especially by discerning e-gulleteers, as it save me the hit and miss approach (which, while sometimes turning up gems, more often just turns up rubbish!) J

Hello everyone. Knowing what a knowledgeable bunch you lot are, I want to pick your brains on good italian restaurants in central London. I don't really want to spend mega-bucks on a meal, just looking for a place where you can get a nice meal when shopping up in town (hence the need for central). The boyfriend and I always end up doing chinese or thai but would love to find alternatives. Also, if anyone knows of any good Vietnamese restaurants (and I realise we may have to travel a bit further afield for that) I would also appreciate any information on that. Thanks! J

Yep, there was a review in the Metro, gave it a good write up actually.

Okay, okay, I know that this is supposed to be about what we cooked last night, but I have just got back from my America holiday where I threw a dinner party at the in-laws house, and since they have a snazzy little digital camera I took some pictures and just wanted to share them with y'all. Starter - deconstructed gazpacho (no picture). Clear tomato water with a stack of julienned tomato, yellow squash, zucchini, red pepper and jicama and a brunoise of apple, plum, red chili, advocado, tomato and cucumber. Also had a few cherry tomoato halves (both red and yellow) floating around in it. Looked very pretty and also tasted quite gazpacho like when a mouthful of the vegetables was taken with the tomato water. Main - Pepper crusted seared tuna, red wine sauce, caponata, and papperdelle coated with a rosemary infused cream sauce. Dessert - White chocolate mousse on a sponge base (fresh raspberries inside the mousse) topped with glazed raspberries and surrounded with a decorated dark chocolate band. Set on a sauce of creme anglaise and raspberry coulis. Was all good fun, and surprisingly, considering it was all cooked in someone elses kitchen, an un-stressful experience!

David and I are off to provincetown at the end of may, anyone have any suggestions of some 'must eat at' restaurants? Not really bothered if they are 'gay' or not (though I can't see how they would be anything but ) Suggestions please? John

Single - mainly thin - disturbingly (don't these people eat at the bloody restaurant!) neat - questionably (uber-fashionable might be more appropriate)

Mmmm, gay flavour...... wonder what that would taste like?

I have to agree with dallardice, the need for 'gay' restaurants in london is all but gone. Sure, there may be some restaurants where david and I feel more comfortable with PDA's (public displays of affection), but I don't think there are any restaurants where I would not feel comfortable going and being viewed as a gay couple. Christ, you can even dine as a couple in the badlands of southeast london nowadays without anyone batting an eyelid! Truth-be-told I think we even avoid the more scene-and-be-seen restaurants simply because I do not find the service to be nearly as good and the prices a little more expensive than at an equivalent 'not-so-gay' restaurant (yes the waiter may be cute, but if he can't get your order right or spends more time chatting with his friends than doing his job, I won't be going back).

Real person - Heinrich Cornelius Agrippa von Nettesheim, I really liked his works De occulta philosphia libri tres, a real renaissance man. Fictional - Cthulhu (from the works of H.P. Lovecraft) just to see how he would manage to eat politely with all those tentacles (then again he may just not care and end up eating the waiting staff instead )

If you want to hike your ass over to south east london they do pretty good sushi at sapporo ichiban in catford. The prices are also very reasonable. Only downside is what the hell else is there to see in catford? (Apart from the giant cat of course )

Okay, so there was a fundamental misunderstanding about what this thread was actually saying on my part. My bad Secondly I just need to point out, I am also a scientist (my cards are now on the table). I have written and re-written what I think I should say next a number of times, but have come to the conclusion that I am unable to answer this question. Science may well give examples where people have been tricked into tasting something different based on an items appearance (though I do think it is flawed to say that this doesn't happen in the restaurant setting, an example being some of the foodstuffs of Heston Blumenthal) suggesting that we eat with more than just the sense of taste. That is not to say that there are not people out there who can overcome this and can taste food purely based on the flavour alone. But for one group to deny the sensations of the other is ludicrous. I must say though Steve, and this I find quite ironic, the ability to sit at a meal, eat food, separate the flavours into their component parts and all the while shut out other influences (presentation, ambience, etc.) sounds like a very scientific skill to me Indiagirl, if you can suggest a name, you are most cordially invited!

I'm not sure whether I should laugh or cry....

I can't believe that this thread is still going on! (probably not helped by idiots like myself who insist on posting something and keeping it alive ) I left work yesterday at 5pm, and here at 10am the next day it is still top of the page! Anyhow, I just wonder if someone could post a quick resume of what the major arguments are right now. As far as I see it it falls into two classes: 1) Those who think presentation affects the way we taste food 2) Those who say that presentation doesn't affect the way we taste food. In both cases examples have been cited where specific groups of people can do one or another. For example we have heard about people whose palate is so well trained that they can taste food purely on its flavours alone, whithout being affected by other influences. We have also heard about examples where people have been fooled into thinking something tastes different based purely on its physical appearance. Now the part where I get confused is: are the two opposing factions saying that the way they taste things is more correct (bad grammar?) than the other? If so, this is an argument that will never be resolved as each persons experience is a totally personal thing. Citing the example of art (as has been done many times in this argument) if a 'conniseur' looks at a painting by his favourite artist, and a mother looks at a painting by her child, they may both see the most beautiful thing in the world, but not think a great deal of the others picture. Does this then mean theat either one of them is more correct? NO. For each person it is a personal experience and as such can only be truly appreciated by them. Therefore until we are all linked to a group mind and share exactly the same experiences when performing some action shouldn't we just enjoy the diversity that makes us individuals? For those of you who taste no difference regardless of presentation, I salute your ability to do this, but at the same time, I hope that a didning experience doesn't become on fo just tasting food, but enjying the whole package. For those of you whome presentation does affect the way you taste food (into which camp I do believe I fall) well come on over to my place for dinner as I do some wicked plating! and I always love a compliment. John

Maybe I should have made it a shekel. All together now: "A shekel for that! You must be mad!"

Screw it, I think I will chuck in my twopenneths worth! Going back to what I see as the original question, yes I think presentation is important in a meal. As to what percentage of importance, I don't know, but for me it ranks pretty highly. Does the presentation of the food change the actual food itself. Well obviously no. Does the presentation of the food change the way that I taste it, to some degree yes. Are there people out there who would taste exactly the same thing regardless of how it was presented? That I do not know. I don't think that it is entirely possible to separate the chemical process of tasting (i.e. molecules hitting receptors in the mouth) from the emotional aspect (i.e. lighting, music, aroma and also including presentation) as both of these aspects are combined in the mind to produce the final result which we interpret as taste. Since there is no way to take the final message (taste) from one person and transfer it to another who is to say that what one person percieves as taste is any more or less correct than another? Or to put it another way, maybe the person who says that it tastes the same regardless of presentation just has a different perception than the person who says that they can taste a difference. Does that make either person right or wrong or better or worse? No. As far as I am concerned, if I am going to be served fancy plated food, then there is a good chance that I am paying way over the odds for it, and so it better damn well taste nicer than if I was served it in a greasy spoon cafe! Anyhow, just my twopenneths worth.