Today's Courier - Vancouver's The Real Deal

[quattroporte]

I read with great interest Tim Pawsey's article (in today's Vancouver Courier) on deals in Vancouver. Overall, very well written, with mention given to West's prix-fixe deal, as well and Raincity Grill, and low and behold, our beloved Hamilton Street Grill.

Mr. Pawsey writes about an upcoming event at HSG offering pours from Cedar Creek paired with appies from none other than owner-chef Neal (sic) Wyles. The last sentence reads: "Book in advance - and maybe learn the egullet secret handshake before you go".

I thought we were just supposed to blurt it out to our waiter!

And I'm a little hurt that no one has taught me the handshake.....

[fud]

Wow congrats Vancouver Restaurantuers!

The secret handshake? I 'think' what you do is each grab the other person's ankle and lift it up so each person is on one foot and leaning to balance the other. Then you hop around in a circle chanting:

'duck fat' 'duck fat' 'duck fat'

Oh wait...no no that's the secret handshake for the royal order of the duck [fat].

[Ling]

^I vote you Head Geek of the forum.

[Memo]

And I'm a little hurt that no one has taught me the handshake.....

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I'm surprised you didn't get these instructions when you joined.

Here they are - now practice.

Memo

[*Deborah*]

*picturing the gesticulating at the Cedar Creek tasting next week*

[fud]

Now is that each person making those gestures on their own or is that one hand from one person and the other hand from the other?

Could make for an interesting sight.

And Ling, I'm going to take that as a compliment

Edited November 9, 2005 by fud (log)

[quattroporte]

And I'm a little hurt that no one has taught me the handshake.....

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I'm surprised you didn't get these instructions when you joined.

Here they are - now practice.

Memo

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Oh yes, now I see.....like this, then that.....I GOT IT!!

I suppose those instructions got lost in the mail............I am so super cool now!

[Memo]

Now is that each person making those gestures on their own or is that one hand from one person and  the other hand from the other?

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My mistake.

Since I draw with a pencil in my mouth - using my hands as models - I always end up drawing a left and right hand.

Try to imagine this being performed by two right hands (belonging to two different people).

Memo

[gerald]

anyone that gives the correct handshake between 5:00 and 5:00 and 30 seconds gets a free burger I figure it should take that long to get the hand position right.

[Daddy-A]

[host]

Does anybody have any comments on the ARTICLE???

A.

[/host]

[Andrew Morrison]

Does anybody have any comments on the ARTICLE???

Yeah. Quit lurking and post, Pawsey. We'd love to have you!

Edited November 10, 2005 by Andrew Morrison (log)

[gingerfreak]

[host]

Does anybody have any comments on the ARTICLE???

A.

[/host]

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*AHEM*

Thought it was a pretty good overview of dining deals. It's too easy to think that eating out has to = $$$. I especially appreciated the last point on tipping (no, I've never worked in the industry; I've just always believed you should treat the people who handle your food well ). I encountered the el-cheapo-ness Pawsey refers to during Taste of Yaletown, with an acquaintaince who insisted on nickel and diming the tip on what was an already great deal .

And since I'm new around these parts, I'd better get cracking on the EG handshake!

[~cayenne~]

Since DaddyA is gently admonishing us , maybe a link to the article in question will help focus us on the topic at hand

edited to say I meant the above in the kindest sense and tried to rectify it accordingly.

Edited November 10, 2005 by ~cayenne~ (log)

[Daddy-A]

Since DaddyA is admonishing us  , maybe a link to the article in question will help focus us on the topic at hand

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Consider it less admonishing and more gently coaxing. It's been a long day.

Thanks for the link ~cayenne~.

In North America, the last Zagat Survey rated our town as the continent's third least expensive in which to dine.

I thought this comment from the article was quite interesting. First of all, who's less expensive than we are???? Second, if Vancouver is so inexpensive, why do we need all these "deals"? Are we that cheap, or are there that many great choices?

I vote for the latter ... but what do others think?

A.

[Andrew Morrison]

Second, if Vancouver is so inexpensive, why do we need all these "deals"? Are we that cheap, or are there that many great choices?

A very good question, Arne. I've started writing a kind of Year in Review piece and I can't get away from the fact that 2005 was the Year of the Prix Fixe. After 5-10 restaurants kept their $30 menus up and running after Dine Out, it started to snow ball in the Spring. After a bit of a dip in the summer, they have returned with a vengeance all across the city. It's a smart idea, but an intriguing conceptual dogpile. Anyone care to venture an answer to the why?

Edited November 10, 2005 by Andrew Morrison (log)

[*Deborah*]

Because once we pay $1000/sq ft for our little tiny condos, we can't afford $30 mains?

[kontemporary]

Because once we pay $1000/sq ft for our little tiny condos, we can't afford $30 mains?

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But the irony in that is that restaurants in Vancouver are still dead-cheap while facing record-high rent prices.

[kurtisk]

Second, if Vancouver is so inexpensive, why do we need all these "deals"? Are we that cheap, or are there that many great choices?

A very good question, Arne. I've started writing a kind of Year in Review piece and I can't get away from the fact that 2005 was the Year of the Prix Fixe. After 5-10 restaurants kept their $30 menus up and running after Dine Out, it started to snow ball in the Spring. After a bit of a dip in the summer, they have returned with a vengeance all across the city. It's a smart idea, but an intriguing conceptual dogpile. Anyone care to venture an answer to the why?

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I've always figured it's because we have a glut of great restaurants in the city and only (x) amount of people to support them. This isn't the kind of town where people dine out only on weekends, so things have to be made accessible to encourage more returns and ventures. Also, the prix-fixe in many places isn't so much a 'cheap' menu, but more of a re-working of portion-to-price ratio. Generally, our food/liquor cost remain the same...

k

[Andrew Morrison]

Thanks, Kurtis. Using that logic, does it follow that we'll likely see more prix fixe menus rather than a reduction?

[~cayenne~]

Daddy-A,Nov 9 2005, 08:39 PM

In North America, the last Zagat Survey rated our town as the continent's third least expensive in which to dine.

I thought this comment from the article was quite interesting.  First of all, who's less expensive than we are????   Second, if Vancouver is so inexpensive, why do we need all these "deals"?  Are we that cheap, or are there that many great choices?

I vote for the latter ... but what do others think?

A.

I absolutely agree with you on your vote for the latter. It seems that we have been, almost all of a sudden, blessed with so many excellent dining choices. Some highlights of the recent past have beget and fostered many new startups, and subsequently the culinary choices have blossomed. Also, the media has been promoting them widely, in all formats and areas. A wider possible clientale has been enticed to try the different offerings, yet not all of them may have the same spending style, whether by learned habit or necessity. It seems that North America has much different spending styles than Europe, where for example, they will be willing to spend much more on dining out and vacationing, but don't spend as much on excess stuff/toys for the home. Space probably has a lot to do with it, and, the way the new condo's and such are going, I could see that happening here. But then again, a flat screen is one heck of a lot more expensive than a regular. But, I'd hazard a guess, that one of the the biggest things that eats up our pocket change which translates into tipping money for some presumably is taxes, and not just the tax when we eat out.

[fud]

Hmm I don't think I ever pulled the eG handshake for a 'deal' per se but more of a "hey cool, you're in 'the club!' then you sorta laugh and theres an awkward silence and then some good old chatting begins. How cool is it to dine somewhere where you feel like you know the people who work there.

Oh lordy I can hear the Cheer's theme song coming I better hide now.

[fud]

Prix Fixe also helps me narrow down my selections and have a little of everything. I'm terrible because I was brought up to sit down, order water and a main. If it weren't for dineout and taste of and prix fixe I would have not ventured into the really good stuff, the appies, the wine, the dessert. No wonder I used to always think the mains were never enough food. But they are enough if you tantalize your senses with the appy's and drinks...whats the opposite to apres ski? It's like the prequel to a good experience.

[*Deborah*]

Because once we pay $1000/sq ft for our little tiny condos, we can't afford $30 mains?

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But the irony in that is that restaurants in Vancouver are still dead-cheap while facing record-high rent prices.

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I'm just saying...While I realize our real estate prices are not particularly high on the whole, compared to other comparable cities, my understanding is that our average salaries are lower than they are in a city like Toronto, e.g. (I'm not talking about the rich real estate developers and software genius-types, or the brokers and whatnot, I'm talking about the rest of us...heaven knows there are plenty of rich people here, I dodge their $100K cars every day, but not everyone is of their number.)

The rationalization is that it's the cut we take in order to live in such a spectacular place, and we could earn X percent more to live back east or in the US. Where housing is cheaper (a girlfriend of mine in Philadelphia has a house twice as big as my condo, but it only cost her about 30% the price of my place--and her (tiny) mortgage interest is tax-deductible!). Restaurant prices are higher that's OK, she has disposable income out the wazoo, comparatively.

Unless my numbers come up, my tastes will always be far in advance of my income, I fear.

The prix-fixe menus have a double advantage for a restaurant: they end up selling the full meal rather than the main and the water, and I think I am not alone in ordering up my wine, if I get a deal on my food. Aren't margins on wine a little wider than they are on food, in general? so theoretically if I spend $10 less on food (except I'll pay the supplement for the foie gras ) but $10 more on wine (or in my case, more like $30 or $50 more on wine ) the restaurant will not lose on it...

Plus the all-important perception of providing a good deal or giving a break...even if the customer spends exactly as many dollars, he/she feels as though he's gotten something extra .

Edited November 10, 2005 by *Deborah* (log)

[chocomoo]

Oh lordy I can hear the Cheer's theme song coming I better hide now.

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For some reason when I read that the Family Ties theme song popped into my head, & now I can't get it out...

I love prix fixe menus! I almost went for the one at Feenie's ($35!) when I was there a couple weeks ago, but I didn't want any of the mains they offered (duck confit leg, which is good but I wasn't in the mood for; veal osso buco, which I did want but felt I shouldn't eat; and something else I forget). Luckily, they also offer those items a la carte, so I got the wild mushroom tart, which was...wow, just super good. I ended up getting the roast sablefish, mmm...

[Zucchini Mama]

Isn't the idea for prix fixe also just to get people eating out more often?

A few years back when I was in England every up and coming bistro had a prix fixe menu for lunch. It usually meant you got better food at a more reasonable price because it was made freshly with fresh ingredients. I'm imagining it's providence comes from places like Paris--I've heard legends that saleswomen in posh shops will have lunch at the same bistro almost every day. I love that idea. The woman from Hermes ordering the prix fixe for twenty years.

It makes dining a bit more of a casual flirt rather than a serious...well you know what I mean.

It's a good date meal. The early prix pixe menues are great for land rich cash poor parents on the babysitting meter.

Can I think of any more reasons to love it? I just love the way it sounds. Best two words you'll ever learn in French!

Zuke