Aspiring "Food Writers"

[Carrot Top]

Jennifer,

There's a topic on that subject somewhere here. . .I do not know the title, but *do* remember that jkonick started it. You can search for it by clicking onto her topics, perhaps, or even searching for "food writing" topics.

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As to the subject of not writing unless it's for money, well. That's the way many chefs feel about cooking.

[chow guy]

But while we're talking about writing for money, Fabby said over a year ago:

Hee hee.  I am almost about writing as I am about food:  If you don't pay me, I don't do it.  

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Samuel Johnson said it more archly:

"None but a blockhead ever wrote except for money."

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So where do we all think our blogging fits in with the not-writing-except-for-money theory?

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It was a great reason why I stopped blogging entirely (why should I generate information for others without compensation AND occasionally be plagiarized?) -- yet there are those who blog a lot and are published a lot so I guess it depends if you have already found your voice and your niche. There are those who began blogging to establish a voice and develop a following. Some have succeeded while others have failed miserably. I will tell you that it HAS made me jaded against those writers who blog to promote their published word...

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I'd never thought about it before, but your post reminded me that, I've never blogged. It would be a lot of work (especially since my writing takes way too much time) and it's hard to imagine not getting paid. I do alot of gratis cooking, for worthy causes, but somehow, blogging doesn't seem like a worthy cause.

[Busboy]

How important is it to have an 'education or degree' for food writing?

Are people not being published because they lack writing skills?

Our local newspaper food page is filled with AP articles, nothing from someone local.  If I were to start asking about doing some kind of local writing for the food page I have no backround in writing and don't know where to start. 

Jennifer

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I have a fairly thin food-writer resume -- but enough of one to have some credibility -- and I can't imagine anyone even asking whether you have a degree. It's what you put on paper that counts. This is both liberating and unnerving.

Summarizing my own experience and what I've heard from actual pros: if you want to write, start writing. If you don't have a background in writing, contribute to blogs. Write long letters to friends. Post on eGullet -- heck, I've gotten one good gig and maybe another based on my postings here and elsewhere. Write for the free weekly. Be mean to yourself: it takes time to get good. And remember that, early on, editors are going to be looking far more for your professionalism than your unique voice. Once you prove you can string together coherent sentances, hit deadlines and and handle editing without losing your cool or your confidence, you'll begin to get more leeway (and you can always take advantage of outlets like this to have more fun in the meantime).

Look at the local paper to see what style they're publishing. How may words? Fancy food or down home cooking? First-person experiences or third-person reporting? And then find out who the editor is and write an e-mail with two or three idea.

If you don't want to get rich, and can produce professional local articles, you might make your local editor very happy -- and get a chance to go beyond.

Good luck. And write!

[Carrot Top]

So where do we all think our blogging fits in with the not-writing-except-for-money theory?

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Blogging might be done for a variety of reasons by different people, don't you think. . with no one singular reason for all or any combination of reasons for the individual. One blogger might want to keep their name "out there" so that people could see their work easily. Another might be seriously trying to hook up or create something business-wise.The next one might be wishing to do (in a more formal way with the notion of "deadlines" somehow added to the task) the daily practice that good writing demands. Someone else might mostly be trying to get feedback from readers as to what works and what doesn't work quite as well. And then there could be people, who just as with those who cook each day, who might blog just for the love of sharing what they love themselves.

I might put you in that last category, Janet, if anyone were to ask me to try to guess.

.......................................................

(Though I did read a fascinating article in a nationally-distributed magazine a short while ago on how bloggers can make money, *real* money. Actually written by an eG member, too.)

Edited November 18, 2006 by Carrot Top (log)

[mizducky]

Who inspired you most in your decision to write of food?

--The Rombauer ladies. One of my favorite things about the old Joy of Cooking was Irma Rombauer's chatty, anecdote-laden writing style.

--The aggregate of on-line communities and blogs dedicated to food, which invited me to join the conversation and start putting out my own views and experiences.

What is it particularly that you write of within the wide-varied subject?

--Eating and cooking for real-world healthy weight management, including debunking certain dieting-industry myths and hype

--Exploring world cuisines, especially those of the Asian peoples.

--Cheap eats--mom 'n' pop joints, ethnic eateries, greasy spoons, diners, and other little indie alternatives to the fast-food chains that provide inexpensive and delicious nourishment to the everyday folk.

When did you take up the pen?

In general, I've been writing seriously--no joke--since grade school. And my first professional efforts started right out of college as a technical/marketing writer in the high tech industry. But my writing on food dates back only five or six years, all amateur--so far.

Where do you wish to publish your writings? Do you have any specific magazines/journals or publishers that you have an urge to present your work to for acceptance?

I have in recent years been doing much of my writing, including all my food writing, online, and have been looking for more formal online venues for my work. As a matter of fact ... well, I don't want to announce anything prematurely for fear of jinxing something, but Goddess willing and the creek don't rise, I may well have an announcement to make soon about having landed just such an on-line food writing gig.

Why do you wish to submit your work to these particular outlets?

--I have been a computer geek and online junkie since the dawn days of the late 1970s, when all we had were the Usenet Newsgroups on the ARPAnet. So writing stuff online has become second nature to me.

--I, and my admittedly peculiar writing style, thrive on the online-writing environment. While I am damn good at more formal writing if I do say so myself, most of the time I find doing that style of writing to be like pulling teeth. But the conversational styles common in blogging and forums like these are near effortless in comparison. And for a writer who has had her own struggles with writer's block, a writing form that's nigh effortless does tend to make you sit up and take notice.

--Conversely, whenever I have dabbled around the edges of more traditional paper-publishing markets, I have just found the whole rigamarole a huge turn-off all around. For this immediate-gratification grrl, the aggravation factor was just way too much--especially for the pittances offered to the entry-level writer. When offered the choice between a delayed-gratification, high-aggravation, teeth-pulling, ill-paying writing outlet, vs. an immediate-gratification, minimal-annoyance, almost effortless, and non-paying outlet ... well, effortless free-will pleasure won out over ill-paid aggravation, at least for now.

--While I don't think print media will vanish anytime soon, I'm convinced online publishing will only continue to grow as a major player in the publishing industry, particularly at the expense of many newspapers and periodicals. To be sure, I wouldn't mind a bit if some of my on-line writing eventually led to a print gig of some sort. But as long as I have a knack for the online stuff anyway, why the hell not play to my strength?

How do you hope to have your writings affect the world of food and people?

--In terms of my writing on healthy eating: I would love it if I could reach out to every bewildered, battle-scarred veteran of the dieting wars, reassure them that the fault is not in their willpower or whatever but in virtually all the wrong-headed "advice" handed them by the dieting industry and its thralls, and help inspire them to think for themselves and develop plans for healthy eating and living that work for their specific and unique needs.

--In terms of world cuisines: I cop to certain hippy-dippy convictions that the multi-cultural enjoyment of food can lead to greater cross-cultural understanding ... and maybe even a few additional baby steps towards world peace. (Hey, I warned you it was hippy-dippy...)

[srhcb]

Disclaimer: Let me state that I don't consider myself a food writer, or even a real writer for that matter. I'm more like a storyteller who has so many stories that, by default rather than design, a number of them include food. Thanks to this site and a couple others, many of them get written down.

Who inspired you most in your decision to write of food?

First, my Mother's (late) oldest sister, my Aunt Desa (ne: Desanka). She was a brilliant woman born at least one generation too soon. She had degrees from Carleton College, the University of Minnesota and the University of Chicago in Chemistry and Biology. Today she might have been a reknowed scientist or at least an MD, but nearing the end of the Great Depression she returned home and took a job teaching high school chemistry so that her family could afford to send her five younger siblings to college. My Mother, the youngest in the family, actually had her sister for a chemistry teacher, as did I, twenty-five years later.

Aunt Desa was the first person I knew who thought of food as more than just what we eat. She'd traveled to Europe in the early 1950's with some female colleagues, and visited her parents' birthplace in Croatia along with the ancestral homelands of her traveling companions, so she had an early appreciation of ethnic foods.

She knew the Latin name of every plant, and loved gardening to the point of trying to grow many edible and food producing plants not accustomed to the harsh climate of Nothern Minnesota. She was also secure enough in her botanical knowledge to pick and eat wild mushrooms.

She collected cook books just to read them, (unheard of at the time), and her experiments in the kitchen, although they didn't always produce edible results, proved to have inspired her nieces and nephews, (if not our somewhat skeptical parents), to be adventurous about cooking and eating. Whenever our family gathers, stories about Aunt Desa's cooking still end up dominating the food related conversation.

Secondly, Julia Child, in the actual practice of cooking, and MFK Fisher, in the emotional and philosophical aspects of food. Almost needless to say, watching and reading the two of them has always reminded me of my Aunt.

What is it particularly that you write of within the wide-varied subject?

I just pick out stories that have food in them, either as a principle element or just an aside.

When did you take up the pen?

I've written stories, and even self-published little folder paper books, for as long as I can remember.

Where do you wish to publish your writings? Do you have any specific magazines/journals or publishers that you have an urge to present your work to for acceptance?

I've had some work published, but nothing to do with food unless you count letters to the editor of several periodicals. Of these, I'm proudest of my contributions to the discussion of articles published in Gastronomica Magazine.

Why do you wish to submit your work to these particular outlets?

Submit work to Gastronomica! Yeah, I wish.

How do you hope to have your writings affect the world of food and people?

I hope to be occasionally instructive or educational, but, more importantly, entertaining or amusing. My favorite compliment in response to something I wrote is to have the reader tell me, "I laughed like hell".

SB (Food Eater, Story Writer)

PS: Thanks to mizducky for the preformatted format

[The Old Foodie]

So where do we all think our blogging fits in with the not-writing-except-for-money theory?

←

Blogging might be done for a variety of reasons by different people, don't you think. . with no one singular reason for all or any combination of reasons for the individual. One blogger might want to keep their name "out there" so that people could see their work easily. Another might be seriously trying to hook up or create something business-wise.The next one might be wishing to do (in a more formal way with the notion of "deadlines" somehow added to the task) the daily practice that good writing demands. Someone else might mostly be trying to get feedback from readers as to what works and what doesn't work quite as well. And then there could be people, who just as with those who cook each day, who might blog just for the love of sharing what they love themselves.

I might put you in that last category, Janet, if anyone were to ask me to try to guess.

.......................................................

(Though I did read a fascinating article in a nationally-distributed magazine a short while ago on how bloggers can make money, *real* money. Actually written by an eG member, too.)

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You got it pretty right there, Karen, although there are elements of a couple of the other reasons too, I guess. But I do also love words and writing, and wanted to see if I could write in a way that would be appealing and readable to "the general reader" (I know I can do a good job of curriculum material for medical students, which is an entirely different thing!). It seemed like a good challenge to combine both interests.

The discipline of writing 400-500 words every weekday on a food history topic started out as just that - a writing discipline. There is only so much improvement you can make when you agonise so long over every sentence that you only write seven sentences a week! Initially I was sending my little stories out to friends and family by email, but so many people sent them on to foodies that they knew, that I started to get feedback from complete strangers.

From the beginning my son nagged me to blog them - and I kept avoiding it (being technically fairly hopeless) but in the end I gave in to give it a try to prove that I couldn't even set up a blog, therefore he would get off my back. As you now know, that little strategy didn't work, and once I started it it took on a life of its own. I have to say that I love it - it has made me a lot of friends that I have never met (such as you, I hope, Karen!), it has brought me to e-Gullet, I have learned a lot more food history (and bought a lot more books), I am technically less inept (although only marginally so),and I hope I have improved my writing - I have certainly improved my writing efficiency. I have also most assuredly had a lot of fun, perhaps because, like shrcb, I think of it as story-telling. Perhaps that makes it less threatening?

If you love words and writing, why would you NOT blog? I can fully understand those writers who say they wont write unless they get paid, but there are an awful lot of good reasons why this doesn't or couldn't or wouldn't apply to every writer, all of the time. I can understand why a professional writer might also want to blog - for the sheer joy of writing what one wants, when one wants, without editorial or content constraints.

All of the experts seem to say - "If you want to write - write!", and that most "writers" (meaning wannabees I guess) do too much talking and thinking about writing, and not actually doing it. They say if you want to write, write something every day. I have to say that I think this is fantastic advice. Blogging is a great way to do this - and enables feedback, which is also enormously valuable.

The regularity of blogging (assuming you publicly commit to it) forces the discipline, and makes the "terror of the white page", or the bland computer screen fade. (Groan! I just realised I am giving writing advice here, which from an enthusiastic amateur is pretty funny. I await scathing feedback from "real" writers out there!).

Meanwhile, the next batch of Old Foodie stories are fidgeting to be written, so I must cease procrastinating with this post and get on with them ....

[Carrot Top]

I am often astonished at the breadth of knowledge and depth of research that blogs can contain, as well as being very impressed by the story-telling abilities that draw one in. To think that people do this daily floors me. I tried to do it once for about two weeks or so, and got so densely entangled in the entire thing that I decided to cut my losses and run.

And of course Steve, you are impressive in all ways whether you blog or not.

[miladyinsanity]

So where do we all think our blogging fits in with the not-writing-except-for-money theory?

←

Blogging might be done for a variety of reasons by different people, don't you think. . with no one singular reason for all or any combination of reasons for the individual. One blogger might want to keep their name "out there" so that people could see their work easily. Another might be seriously trying to hook up or create something business-wise.The next one might be wishing to do (in a more formal way with the notion of "deadlines" somehow added to the task) the daily practice that good writing demands. Someone else might mostly be trying to get feedback from readers as to what works and what doesn't work quite as well. And then there could be people, who just as with those who cook each day, who might blog just for the love of sharing what they love themselves.

I might put you in that last category, Janet, if anyone were to ask me to try to guess.

.......................................................

(Though I did read a fascinating article in a nationally-distributed magazine a short while ago on how bloggers can make money, *real* money. Actually written by an eG member, too.)

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Blogs can provide those of you who want to write books with platform and name-recognition.

It's not uncommon for an agent or publisher to reject an non-fiction author simply because she/he does not have platform, even though the work is as good as what's available in the bookstore today.

[misstenacity]

Wow, this *is* one of those "blast from the past" threads. 

I'm glad to read of your successes, Andrea. Congrats, and wishes for more to come! 

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Carrot Top - thank you! I've come a long way in my "foodabilities" in the last several years, and I'd like to continue to write about many topics, as I still feel I have a long way to go to get GOOD like of few of my idols:

Jason Sheehan

Bourdain

Bill Buford

Andrea

http://foodpart.com

[Carrot Top]

(Though I did read a fascinating article in a nationally-distributed magazine a short while ago on how bloggers can make money, *real* money.  Actually written by an eG member, too.)

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My batter wasn't entirely mixed when I wrote that.

Two articles, same magazine. One about blogging and money, one about other very fascinating food stuff. Two authors, different people. One eGullet member. As far as I know.

Can I blame my confusion on the fact that I was drinking coffee at Starbucks at the time?

(Blech)

I hope so.

Anyway, here is a link:

The important one, about food of course , is here. Written by Kara Newman aka alacarte in these parts. The other article is in the same magazine and probably can be accessed online.

Need to go continue trying to mix this batter. Not always easy.

[Carrot Top]

Why do you wish to submit your work to these particular outlets?

Submit work to Gastronomica!  Yeah, I wish.

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Really, I don't see why you would not try this.

I could find many many sayings and quotes to induce you to try.

Why not just pick a subject you think would work and start on it?

It would seem to me that your knowledge of Serbian specialties would be something that would work there. . .

(Take a look, at alacarte's successes in the past few years. Her article list is available from her website. Proof. It *can* be done. )

Of course if you did try to write an article to submit to Gastronomica, we might lack for adequate posts *here*, and I might get blamed for the subsequent loss of fun. Oops.

[srhcb]

Why do you wish to submit your work to these particular outlets?

Submit work to Gastronomica!   Yeah, I wish.

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Really, I don't see why you would not try this.

My aversion to footnotes has a lot to do with it.

Of course if you did try to write an article to submit to Gastronomica, we might lack for adequate posts *here*, and I might get blamed for the subsequent loss of fun. Oops. 

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Quite unlikely, not likely, and fat chance.

SB

[miladyinsanity]

Why do you wish to submit your work to these particular outlets?

Submit work to Gastronomica!  Yeah, I wish.

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Really, I don't see why you would not try this.

My aversion to footnotes has a lot to do with it.

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C'mon. The only surefire way to fail is to not try.

[Carrot Top]

One person who *did* try, who posted on this thread, just signed a book contract.

I wanted to share the news that Janet (The Old Foodie) has signed a contract for a book on pies - pies in both historic and cultural context, with illustrations and recipes.

She noted that her blog turned out to be a good way for the publisher to view her work.

Yaaaay, Janet!

I look forward to reading it!

[srhcb]

One person who *did* try, who posted on this thread, just signed a book contract. 

I wanted to share the news that Janet (The Old Foodie) has signed a contract for a book on pies - pies in both historic and cultural context, with illustrations and recipes.

She noted that her blog turned out to be a good way for the publisher to view her work.

Yaaaay, Janet! 

I look forward to reading it!

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BRAVO, O'Foodie!

Having viewed Janet's blog, I'm sure this book will prove to be a definitive work on the subject of pie.

SB (likes pie, will buy)

[The Old Foodie]

Thanks everyone! I am, needless to say, delighted. It has - in the end - all happened amazingly quickly.

Naturally, my son, who nagged me to blog my stories until I could stand the nagging no longer, has claimed the credit. There is no doubt that the blog helped in a number of ways - I now write absolutely regularly whether I feel like it or not (although I almost always do feel like it), I write more efficiently in terms of number of words in a given time, and a blog is certainly a very accessible 'portfolio' for a potential publisher to read and assess.

And last, but by no means least, is the enthusiasm and support from my eGullet friends which has helped with the confidence to go ahead. I hope one day to meet some of you in real time and space.

Janet

[Chufi]

Janet, congratulations. I love your blog and the amazing wealth of information on it, and how you present it with such enthusiasm and wit. Happy book-writing!

[MarketStEl]

Great news, Janet, and welcome to the ranks of the published!

I guess blogs aren't just shouting into the void after all. I need to regain the discipline you found in maintaining your blog.

[Mayhaw Man]

Congratulations. Nice work and good luck. According to my highly personalized and stilted market research, more than half of the Earth's population are likely buyers of this book.

Of course, when I succeed in my campaign for World Domination, that situation could change.

[Carrot Top]

Of course, when I succeed in my campaign for World Domination, that situation could change.

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Daresay if you sat down and wrote "The Cake and Okra Bible" that would succeed, too. Never saw a book like that before.

[The Old Foodie]

According to my highly personalized and stilted market research, more than half of the Earth's population are likely buyers of this book.

Of course, when I succeed in my campaign for World Domination, that situation could change.

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Would that be the half that prefer pie, and want their preference reinforced, or the half that prefer cake, to help them better understand and therefore fight the opposition?

One puzzling thing I expect some help on is the mystery of why the unqualified word pie, to you 'over there' means a dessert option, whereas here in Oz (and I suspect in the UK too) it means a meat pie.

Cake or Meat Pie kinda changes the discussion a bit, doesn't it?

[Carrot Top]

One puzzling thing I expect some help on is the mystery of why the unqualified word pie, to you 'over there' means a dessert option, whereas here in Oz (and I suspect in the UK too) it means a meat pie.

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I'm afraid that's classified information, Janet.

We don't talk about these things.

Not easily, anyway.

Goodness knows what might be unleashed.

(Shudder.)

[The Old Foodie]

One puzzling thing I expect some help on is the mystery of why the unqualified word pie, to you 'over there' means a dessert option, whereas here in Oz (and I suspect in the UK too) it means a meat pie.

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I'm afraid that's classified information, Janet.

We don't talk about these things.

Not easily, anyway.

Goodness knows what might be unleashed.

(Shudder.)

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Can you be bought? Or can I just pay for therapy for a few of you to enable you to talk freely and un-embarrassedly about what is clearly a sensitive issue?

Its all the fault of that cake/pie thread you know. It made everyone too anxious and threatened about their feelings on the topic.

[Carrot Top]

I'll go start a topic on it and we'll see what happens.