Part-Time Vegetarians Become More Common

[Pan]

"There's so many reasons that people are vegetarians ... I find that nobody ever gives me a hard time when I say I usually eat vegetarian. But I really like sausage," Pugh said.

For the rest of the article, click here:

AP story via Yahoo! News

[sml311]

Thanks for posting that article, Pan.

Now, if I may step up on my soapbox and be opinionated and cussy for a minute...

This shit really pisses the hell out of me. I have a lot of respect for people who don't eat meat (or other foods) for religious reason and even though I disagree with them, I have a lot of respect for people who don't eat meat (and dairy and eggs and honey) for animal rights reasons. (But I better not catch you driving a car with a leather interior!)

If you still eat meat, seafood, white meat, whatever, YOU'RE NOT A VEGETARIAN!! Don't even bring in that term. Say you're making healthier choices or whatever, but you're not a vegetarian or a fishatarian or a flexatarian or whatever bullshit word du jour some person came up with.

It's like this pseduo-vegetarianism is a phase that every person (especially freakin' college students--don't even get me started there) must pass through. JUST STOP IT! Eat what you want and quit labeling it.

There are definitely a few meals a week during which I don't eat meat, but it's simply because there are a lot of good dishes without it. I'm not a fucking vegetarian.

Ugh...I'm not sure what pisses me off more, these people or the people who do eat meat but are all sqeamish about killing it or how it's killed. Those people really piss me off too. Just hand me the damn axe and I'll have that chicken's head off in 5 seconds.

Sorry, stepping down now.

SML

[John Whiting]

In most peasant agricultural societies, meat has been a flavoring agent rather than the bulk of the diet, and most often preserved meat. Carnivorous feasts are special occasions, not daily pigouts.

But this does not in itself prove that a semi-vegetarian diet is the healthiest; it only conforms to the local conditions imposed by the physical world. The nature that "knows best" gave the Innuit a diet consisting of fish and blubber. It also periodically obliterates life on earth with a passing asteroid.

[ingridsf]

I couldn't get the link to work but, hey, I kind of enjoyed that rant. I have to guard my bacon around a few self-described vegetarians. It's the same rationalization that you're not a smoker as long as you're just bumming someone else's cigarettes.

Part-time vegetarianism: the preferred diet of sort-of virgins everywhere.

[Katherine]

It's the same rationalization that you're not a smoker as long as you're just bumming someone else's cigarettes.

Hey, I know that guy!

Another advantage of this flexitarianism is that you can be santimonious about your dietary choices and tell other people what changes they should make in their diet, yet still be able to eat unlimited amounts of meat when it suits you. Like a boss I used to have always did. Grrrr...

[s'kat]

At school last night, I was talking with a girl who told me she was a vegetarian. Except when she eats, 'you know, chicken'.

I went through a phase when I ate heavily vegetarian, but certainly never called myself one. There's always a place at my table for pork products.

[cakewalk]

... flexitarianism ...

Great term, I like that.

College students can be forgiven their sanctimoniousness (or "earnestness"), that's what they're all about. I was a "veggie" for a while back in the day, but for me it was pure rebellion (my father was a butcher). One fine day I fainted. So I started eating meat again. Oh happy day.

[phaelon56]

This would be much like my daughter's college friends, most of whom describe themselves as vegetarians but they're not really foind of vegetables with limited exceptions. I happen to be proud of my daughter's stated position: "I eat vegetarian most of the time because it's easier and the meat in the dining hall is usually gross". She doesn't see to feel the need for a label.

Personally, I was not offended in any way by the articla but it seems that the author did some labeling of his own when describing the woma in NC who was discussed. He calls her a vegetarin who still eats meat. She describes herself as "eating mostly vegetarian but sometimes also eating meat".

I could give a whit - eating healthy is a good thign but eating food that has flavor is also high on my list. I do agree with those who are a bit irked by people who claim to eat vegeatrai or vegan because of animal rights issues but then don't really walk the talk. If it's a moral issue it had better go beyond what you ingest.... leather car seats, shoes, belts, glue with animal by-products

- it's tough to do but that kind of a public committment should be adhered to rigorously if one expects others to respect and appreciate the stated position.

[jariggs]

... flexitarianism ...

Great term, I like that.

When someone asks me if I am vegetarian or not, as a joke (but with a straight face) I sometimes say that I'm a porkitarian, or an ovo-lacto-baco vegetarian.

After college I went through a period like this though. I think it had a lot to do with my social group having serious veggie leanings. I still try to eat many veggies and eat meat in moderation but unashamedly eat it all now (except hot dogs). I think one reason people refer to themselves as vegetarians when they're not is that it is easier to tell people you don't eat meat rather than explain the minutiae of your dietary habits.

[sacre_bleu]

Half the year I eat a nearly vegan diet, for religious reasons. (No meat, fish, dairy).

The other half of the year, I don't. Me likee bacon, spare ribs and two-inch-thick sirloins.

I can tell you, it's really accelerated my exploration of different cuisines. Thai, Korean, Chinese all contribute to my table, and I wouldn't have had the impetus if I could always mangia whatever I wanted.

[Hest88]

If you still eat meat, seafood, white meat, whatever, YOU'RE NOT A VEGETARIAN!!

Hear, hear! This is one my pet peeves too. Grrr. It's as if they want the noble label of being a vegetarian without the real commitment.

Of course, another of my pet peeves are those college students who refuse to eat meat due to animal rights yet continue to wear leather.

[baw]

... for animal rights reasons. (But I better not catch you driving a car with a leather interior!)

I used to agree with sml's, phaelon56's and hest88's point of view on this, but my opinion has softened. I don't think its bad to choose to act on 'animal rights' 50% of the time vs 0% of the time, as long as you aren't preaching to me about what I should do. For animal/human treatment reasons (see Fast Food Nation for the human treatment side), I usually choose to not order non-fish meat when eating out if I don't know what the meat's source is (i.e. small farm, free range chicken vs Foster Farms chicken; I wouldnt even mention my ordering strategy to dining mates unless we are good friends.). That doesn't mean I never eat hot dogs at Grey's or eat FF chicken, and I dont think that inconsistency makes me a terrible person . I make it a point to order meat at restaurants that serves grass fed, organic and/or free roaming type animal products, and generally buy such products for my own home use but more often than not dont cook with meat. Much of my social circle follows the same sort of eating habits, albeit without label... I think we are the type of consumers the article is talking about. Following the "shouldn't wear leather" logic, I could be nailed for making eating choices based on animal/human treatment while wearing clothes that were made in sweatshops where human treatment is terrible, which I'm sure I do. I wont criticize someone for trying, as long as they dont preach to me, and I don't know anyone that does. Maybe you do, which is why it is more of a sore spot..

Just my 2 cents!

[Jinmyo]

baw, I understand and that seems reasonable.

But what is "FF chicken"?

French fried?

[baw]

ooops! .. FF = short for Foster Farms :)

[John Whiting]

From my essay on foie gras, "Life depends on the liver":

Food production, particularly on a massive scale, is not a comfortable topic. The perpetuation of life on earth is a process of mutual evisceration. Added to the indifference of nature is the cruelty of mankind: there’s hardly a vegetable—let alone a piece of meat, a glass of milk, or an egg—that we could face with a clear conscience if we were shown the conditions under which it was produced. We would then have to consider not only the animal suffering caused by factory-style meat, dairy and poultry production, but also the grinding poverty in which the tenders and harvesters of crops are often forced to work and live—not only in the Third World countries that grow a steadily increasing proportion of our produce, but even under our very noses.

    If you are a vegetarian or a vegan on humanitarian grounds, then you must buy organic produce, which has probably been grown and harvested by ethical methods. But if world demand continues to escalate, it will also be grown by unscrupulous speculators, who will obviate herbicides by pulling the weeds up one at a time with expendable armies of Third World slave labourers. So if you are really fastidious about such matters, you will ultimately have to grow your own—and pray that the moment never arrives when a scientist records the agony of a carrot yanked screaming from the soil.

[loper]

I was a vegetarian (enironmental/ecological reasons, not animal or human rights, thank you very much) for about 10 years. I did eat eggs, but I'm pro choice, so that's ok.

I now eat quite a bit of seafood, which I love to catch/collect myself, so I can tell you: seafood does not grow on trees or sprout from the ground when the sun comes out. I am, therefore, not a vegetarian.

Don't they use animal by-products in the manufacture of galvanized rubber? Next time you meet a vegan, ask if they ride on vegan tires.

[ingridsf]

Speaking of galvanized rubber...

The NYT reported last year that farmed salmon's pink color is derived from a dye -- which has been pretty well known -- that is derived from petrochemicals. Haven't heard of any research proving it's harmful to human health but find it hard to believe ingesting petrochemicals could be a good thing.

Stuff like this is why I get less worried about the health risks of eating bacon than I do about what may have been added to my food by the producer. So many hazards, so little time....

[Mudpuppie]

Okay, vegetarian speaking up here.

First off, let it be known that I don't preach to anyone about what they should or shouldn't eat. I have strong opinions on factory farming (especially of eggs), which I share with people in an attempt to educate, not browbeat them.

That said, in the end, I think all these choices are about taking responsibility for your place in the world, and developing a conscience that you can live with. Some people (me) have a conscience that's naturally guiltier than other people's consciences. I envy those other people.

I make my choices based on what effect I'm comfortable having on the world. This means that I don't buy or eat meat -- and I feel like that's a contribution that I need to make. Someone else might choose to eat red meat at every meal, but eschew the purchase of plastics. Hey -- I'm okay with that. I think we all need to consider the contributions we can make, and we should likewise consider which harms we personally want to avoid causing. What comes out of that consideration will (and should) be different for everyone. There's far too much to worry about and no one person can do it all. So, picking and choosing is, I think, necessary.

My only problem is with people who don't give these things ANY thought at all, but consume and consume and consume (whether corporally or economically) without even recognizing that there's a greater world out there than Self.

And, I have a pair of leather shoes. Does this make me feel guilty? Yes. But I can justify it in a way that makes it okay, for me. I've had them for ten years. It was one cow that made my shoes. That is something I can live with. Ten years worth of burger consumption would not be.

Most of us have a conscience, and most of us should listen to it. No two are alike. I don't want to be held to the standards of anyone else's conscience, and I'm sure no one else wants to be held to mine.

[Jim Dixon]

When my son Joe, who seems to have inherited my curmudgeonly qualities, was living in Eugene (Oregon), he used to rant about the freegans, vegans unless they find some bacon in the dumpster.

Jim

[jschyun]

I was a vegetarian, then vegan from Sept 30 '97 to Jan '03,(still drove though) but have gone far, far away from being vegan in recent years.

It may surprise you to know that I have no problem with to hear people call themselves "flexitarians". I think that's a great name for it. I may adopt it for myself! However, I stop short of calling them vegetarians.

The veggie products out there are starting to border on fantastic. When I'm in the mood for a processed McRib type sandwich, I can get the BocaBurger one, and it tastes just as processed as the original (with less fat and more fiber). okay, that may not be the best sales pitch, but I really think that it's so easy to eat conventional American foods without meat, that it's a shame more people don't take advantage of them. I love Morningstar's corn dogs. I mean, even my brothers like them and they hate veggie type stuff.

Please don't shoot me for the following, very personal opinion.

Incidentally, I think any diet where you are eating a lot of veggies is not a bad idea. Even some Atkins dieters are eating lots of veggies and are claiming to be healthy. See the Atkins thread for this. That said, a lot of vegetarians are unhealthy. They don't really take care of themselves, thinking that because they cut out meat, fish, etc, out of their diets, that they will be okay. You'd be surprised how many vegetarians don't eat veggies on a daily basis. I was one of these. I ate pasta, white rice, sodas, veggie burritos. When I was poor and had to cook, I started eating brown rice and veggies. My health was fantastic. Unfortunately, the siren call of meat wooed me and those healthy days are over. I am now fat and disgusting, but I get to eat prime rib and sushi now.

[Hest88]

That said, a lot of vegetarians are unhealthy. They don't really take care of themselves, thinking that because they cut out meat, fish, etc, out of their diets, that they will be okay.

I knew a lot of vegetarians in college who subsisted on chips, soda, and pizza. And then they wondered why they were getting sick all the time.

I think this is a trap that some militant vegetarians do fall into, since they are veggies for philosophical reasons and not health reasons.

[John Whiting]

I thought a Flexitarian was a Unitarian who sometimes believes in the Trinity.

[sml311]

That said, a lot of vegetarians are unhealthy. They don't really take care of themselves, thinking that because they cut out meat, fish, etc, out of their diets, that they will be okay.

I knew a lot of vegetarians in college who subsisted on chips, soda, and pizza. And then they wondered why they were getting sick all the time.

I think this is a trap that some militant vegetarians do fall into, since they are veggies for philosophical reasons and not health reasons.

I too have known a lot of these people and that's mainly who I was talking about with the "it's a college phase thing."

My whole thing is the silly, needless labeling. If you're a vegetarian or a vegan, sure say so if someone's making you dinner or you're deciding on a restaurant. If you eat meat occassionally, why do you feel the need to espouse this to people? I guess that's a lot of the problem I have with this. I hate that it's become this big fucking deal where I have 19 year old who haven't eaten meat in the last week lecturing me on lifestyle choices.

That being said, I do always appreciate a well articulated position, such as Mudpuppie's. And just as s/he (sorry I don't know your gender!!) has put a lot of thought into this decision, I've thought about hte fact that I'm comfortable eating meat. I know the farming and killing practices, I grew up in a beef cattle farming area, and I sleep just fine eating pretty much anything. But I completely realize that this isn't everyone's position.

Just eat what you enjoy and feel comfortable eating and don't push your views off on anyone in a belligerent, aggressive way. That's all I ask.

Also, John, I really enjoyed the article from which your excerpt came. It is true that just because a food is organic, etc. doesn't mean that the human labor used to cultivate it was conducted under the most ethical and humane circumstances. Interesting thing to think about.

SML

[babka]

Half the year I eat a nearly vegan diet, for religious reasons. (No meat, fish, dairy).

The other half of the year, I don't. Me likee bacon, spare ribs and two-inch-thick sirloins.

Sacre bleu, I'm scratchin' my head and feeling ignorant at not being able to figure it out....may I ask what your religion is?

[jschyun]

I too have known a lot of these people and that's mainly who I was talking about with the "it's a college phase thing."

I hate to bash college kids, but aren't some of them sanctimonious in general? I work on a college campus so believe me, I'm talking from experience.

What angers me more is the constant bashing of vegetarians on this board. Even people who I think should know better, think that PETA represents all vegetarians, and that every vegetarian has the time and inclination to lecture you on your daily habits. Also, vegetarians are apparently in a conspiracy to put subliminal messages in ads, blah blah. I have actually been on the receving end of vegetarian bashing by one of the writers on this board. And I'm not even a vegetarian! Being a vegetarian here is almost as bad as being Rick Bayless.

On top of this, even five years ago, it wasn't all that easy to be veggie. Your only options were salads and semi warm tofu dishes at the local health food market (at least in my area). I remember crying at one point. I don't know what happened, but today, being a vegetarian is actually easy. There are lots of options, and not all of them are day old salads.

You don't want vegetarians to push their views on you? Exactly how many vegetarians are coming up to you about eating meat?

What about the friggin Atkins folks? Low carb is everywhere! Atkins crazed friends bore me to tears with their daily diet chatter, though I applaud them for tyring to control their weight and diabetes. I am so sick of Atkins. The most ad coverage vegetarians got was that Superbowl at for Gardenburger.

--edit

When I say not all vegetarians are PETA people, that wasn't a bash on PETA, just to let you know that the two are not necessarily the same thing.

Edited March 18, 2004 by jschyun (log)