All About Bourbon Whiskey

[KD1191]

Hmmm, a little research and I realize that I've been making this "wrong" with Campari. I'll have to try it with Aperol. I believe Nonino is a milder amaro than Ramazzotti, so I'd expect a more delicate, less bold, drink. I also got the name wrong, so I'm going to continue to call the Campari version Paper Airplane, rather than Paper Plane. I also prefer it on the rocks. It mellows nicely as you drink it, changing in a pleasant way (unlike most other drinks which become a watery mess).

The Paper Airplane (the version with Campari) is a Toby Maloney tweak of Sam Ross's Paper Plane (with Aperol).

[KD1191]

Just did a variant with the new Tempus Fugit Gran Classico Bitter in place of Campari/Aperol & Black Maple Hill for the bourbon. I actually miss the Campari. The bitterness is not as sharp, which really hurts the dynamic of the drink that I find so interesting...the one that demands an immediate second sip.

On the earlier question of what to sub for Nonino, Ramazotti is closest of those mentioned. CioCiaro would be better, if available. Cynar is less than half the strength of Nonino (35%) and the artichoke wouldn't be friendly with the other flavors in the drink in my opinion.

[mkayahara]

Thanks to both EvergreenDan and KD1191 for your replies. It sounds like Ramazzotti is the way to go.

On the earlier question of what to sub for Nonino, Ramazotti is closest of those mentioned. CioCiaro would be better, if available.

I don't have CioCiaro - indeed, it's not even available from my local liquor monopoly. Nonino is, but I won't be able to convince my other half that I need to buy it. The other option I have is Boudreau's Amer Picon replica, which sounds like it would also be worth a try.

[KD1191]

I don't have CioCiaro - indeed, it's not even available from my local liquor monopoly. Nonino is, but I won't be able to convince my other half that I need to buy it. The other option I have is Boudreau's Amer Picon replica, which sounds like it would also be worth a try.

Well, I don't have any Amer Boudreau, but I just made a Paper Airplane with modern Amer Picon (36 proof) in place of the Nonino and, while it would not be my preferred embodiment, it is quite good. The gentian and orange are there where I'd normally expect a bit more spice, but the overall flavor profile is a pretty good representation of the original. I used Elijah Craig 12 year, which is my favorite bourbon for the drink.

[Corinna]

Favorite, best-value bourbons these days? It's for a gift, so I don't mind spending a little money, I just want it to be worth it. (Unfortunately, I cannot get any guidance out of the recipient or his wife, but I know he likes bourbon and will appreciate something good.)

I'd like to have a couple reliable options when I go into the store. Thanks in advance!

[gfweb]

Pappy Van Winkle

[thirtyoneknots]

The Van Winkle line certainly delivers well across the price spectrum. What's your upper limit, budget-wise?

[KD1191]

Best-value is still quite dependent on your budget, and prices are quite variable across regions, so what's a great value in Illinois might not be so great in New York or California. That said, here would be my choices.

Bargain Basement: Heaven Hill Gold Label Bonded (low teens), Weller 107 (high teens)

Everyday Value: Weller 12 year (mid-$20s), Evan Williams Single Barrel (high-$20s)

Mid-Range: Four Roses Single Barrel (~$40), Black Maple Hill (~$40)

Higher End: George T. Stagg ($70 - $100 or more, depending on vintage, availability), Van Winkle 15 Year (anywhere from $50 - $100).

[Sparafucile]

For my everyday bourbon, Evan Williams Black label @ $16.00 for 1 Liter (here in NJ)

[scubadoo97]

Some I think are good values are Wild Turkey 101 and Old Grand Dad 100 or 114 but the 114 is better for a few extra $. The OGD has a bit more rye spice in it. I personally find EW single barrel a little thin and light on flavor. If you like 4 roses the small batch is pretty good and still under $30 by me. The 4 roses Yellow label is a pretty good bourbon but it still is just under $20 where I shop. I will Jim would push the proof up a bit but he is determined to keep it just the way it is.

[Corinna]

Thanks for all your recommendations, folks! Unfortunately, I wasn't able to make it to one of the bigger liquor stores in the area, so my selections were seriously limited. I also should have mentioned I am in NY state, so prices tend to be on the higher side.

I ended up with a bottle of Bulleit, which cost me $30. I hope it's okay.

[EvergreenDan]

Corinna, I sure that bottle of Bulleit will be warmly received and enjoyed. It is a nice, rye-forward bourbon.

[Corinna]

Corinna, I sure that bottle of Bulleit will be warmly received and enjoyed. It is a nice, rye-forward bourbon.

Thanks, Dan. I remember there being a buzz on here about it.

[brinza]

I'd say that the Bulleit was a good choice. But then I would as it's my favorite Bourbon. If the recipient truly loves Bourbon and has never had it, he is likely to be pleased with it.

[FrogPrincesse]

I made a few of bourbon cocktails for my husband this week, all of them instant favorites for the warner weather.

I used Woodford bourbon which works well, although it's not my favorite in that price range for mixing - I find it lacking personality and prefer Buffalo Trace. Elijah Craig 12 years, a recent discovery for me, is also very good for mixing.

Bourbon smash (à la Dale DeGroff)

Bourbon, lemon wedges, simple syrup, mint, angostura bitters.

(from the Drinks thread)

Bourbon Shake

Bourbon, lime juice, simple syrup.

It's essentially a classic daiquiri with bourbon instead of rum. It's really tasty and the lime extracts a lot of great flavors from the bourbon.

Kentucky Breakfast (Jeffrey Morgenthaler)

This one has bourbon, lemon juice, rich simple syrup (I used demerara 2:1), apricot preserves, and egg white.

It is creamy and smooth, more subtle than the first two. It would obviously be an excellent choice for brunch.

[FrogPrincesse]

I resume posting on this thread with the Los Angeles Cocktail. By coincidence, it is quite similar to the Kentucky Breakfast. But this time, sweet vermouth is used as a modifier instead of apricot jam. I followed the ratios from the Bartender's Choice version for this cocktail which was originally published in the Savoy Cocktail Book - here is the original version. I made it during the holidays and it was enjoyed by all. I think I converted at least one person to egg-white cocktails thanks to this one.

Los Angeles Cocktail (Bartender's Choice version)

2 oz bourbon

3/4 oz lemon juice

3/4 oz simple syrup

1/4 oz sweet vermouth

egg white

[mkayahara]

Have any of you tried the High West American Prairie Reserve? It seems like the High West products are fairly well appreciated around here, and that's the only one my local liquor monopoly carries. And it doesn't come cheap. Is it worth the splurge?

[Adam George]

no.

[mkayahara]

Noted. Thank you!

[gfweb]

Noah's Mill is indeed worth the splurge.

 

And Buffalo Trace.

 

Pappy has gotten nuts thanks to A. Bourdain. Not worth it anymore, but still damn good.

[tanstaafl2]

American Prairie Reserve may be my least favorite HW product (although Son of Bourye is running a close second). Not bad but not particularly noteworthy.

 

Noah's Mill may well have once been worth the splurge when it was still age stated 15yo bourbon. But the age statement on current day Noah's Mill is long gone and now you have mystery whiskey of unknown age. If you find the old age stated 15yo Noah's Mill I would say go for it. Otherwise it is a crap shoot at best. A lot of other whiskey I would consider first in the $40-50 range (or even less than that). Elijah Craig 12yo Barrel Proof if you can find it springs to mind. The most recent batch (the 6th at 140.2 proof) was quite lovely and in the mid $40's here.

 

Pappy has indeed gone way past nuts but I am not sure we can load all of the blame for that on poor Tony's shoulders! He hasn't helped but he is a long way from being single handedly responsible.

[FrogPrincesse]

American Prairie Reserve may be my least favorite HW product (although Son of Bourye is running a close second). Not bad but not particularly noteworthy.

 

 

Really? Granted, I only got a sip, but thought it was a good value (I paid about $35). I think it will be great for mixing too. Tastes very much like a rye.

 

As a side note, I did not care hugely for the Son of Bourye. It was fine for mixing, but not my preference for sipping.

[tanstaafl2]

Really? Granted, I only got a sip, but thought it was a good value (I paid about $35). I think it will be great for mixing too. Tastes very much like a rye.

 

As a side note, I did not care hugely for the Son of Bourye. It was fine for mixing, but not my preference for sipping.

 

I have come to appreciate the American Prairie a bit more but still far from my favorite in the HW line. Still don't care for Son of Bourye (or "SOB"...) especially with a reintroduction of the newly formulated Bourye which, while expensive, I do like. Maybe even more than the original Bourye!

[scubadoo97]

Bruce have you tried the HW Rendezvous Rye stored in Quady port barrels? The port finish really cuts the dill pickle notes of the LDI rye. Quite tasty

[tanstaafl2]

Bruce have you tried the HW Rendezvous Rye stored in Quady port barrels? The port finish really cuts the dill pickle notes of the LDI rye. Quite tasty

 

Indeed I have tried it and quite like it. The "A Midwinter Nights Dram" is a big favorite of mine.

 

I had a chance to visit David Perkins at his new distillery a few months ago and really enjoyed it. He has played with a number of Quady barrels to include Vya and the orange and black muscat barrels. All are interesting and the Vya finish I thought was excellent (this was Double Rye not Rendezvous). I would love to have a bottle of that alone but it may all have been used in a blend with another finished whiskey to make the new Yippie Ki-yay.