When Fast Food Chains Double Up

[Toliver]

It's an interesting phenomenon I first noticed here in Southern California when Carl's Jr. (Hardee's back east) began "sharing" their restaurants with The Green Burrito. Both restaurants had their names plastered on the outside of the one building. What's interesting is that even though it contains two restaurants (with basically full menus for both) the building is the same size as a regular Carl's Jr. restaurant.

Since then I've seen A&W and Long John Silver's sharing a building and A&W and Kentucky Fried Chicken also sharing a building. Here in my town, we also have a Taco Bell and a Pizza Hut in one building. Again, the restaurant isn't any larger in size than a normal Taco Bell. But now it's two restaurants in one place.

I'm starting this discussion because this weekend I saw a new El Pollo Loco and a Foster's Freeze combo restaurant so the trend seems to be spreading.

I'm going on the assumption that the restaurants sharing the building are owned by the same parent company (haven't Googled to confirm this). But the logistics of having two kitchens doesn't quite make sense. Although, putting pizza ovens in a Taco Bell should prove easy since they don't really cook anything in a Taco bell...they just sort of reheat stuff, don't they, so there are no existing ovens to displace.

Are there other well known Fast Food chains doubling up? Have you seen it in your area? Have you noticed if the quality of the food is any different when compared to the same single fast food chain in a restaurant/building?

[annecros]

I think Yum Brands is a pioneer with this. KFC, Long John Silvers, Pizza Hut, Taco Bell and A&W are commonly found sharing space.

The only one I remember doing it before then was Nathan's Famous that put Arthur Treacher's and Miami Subs in the same building. It seems there was/is some ice cream in those places as well. That was well over 10 years ago when they first started popping up.

Dunkin' Donuts and Baskin Robbins are cobranded and owned by the same parent. I think up north there is a sandwich shop that is fit into some facilities as well. Carvel and Cinnabon are now sharing space.

I've never noticed much of a difference, but haven't done any in depth studies.

[Busboy]

It's part of the Homer Simpsonization of America.

[rooftop1000]

We have a Taco Bell/KFC here in NJ.

Which means for $2.14 I can get a chicken snacker and an apple empanada.

Well I dont actually eat lunch anymore but that still sounds good.

tracey

[Fat Guy]

But the logistics of having two kitchens doesn't quite make sense.

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I'm not sure exactly what doesn't make sense to you about the kitchen arrangement, but overall it seems eminently sensible to have several fast-food restaurants sharing space. Real estate is the number one expense in the restaurant business. If you can put two, three or four restaurants in one space, you have no increase in real estate expenses yet you can, presumably, sell more food to more people.

This has been going on in New York since perhaps around the early 1990s. I remember near where I had one of my first jobs there was a place that had a number of fast-food restaurants sharing space. I think over time the business model has evolved a bit, though. Back when I first started seeing this, the restaurants were relatively segregated within the structure. Today, if you go to a co-branded Nathan's/Arthur Treacher's location, you'll order all the food from both brands from the same person, it comes from the same kitchen, etc.

[Toliver]

But the logistics of having two kitchens doesn't quite make sense.

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I'm not sure exactly what doesn't make sense to you about the kitchen arrangement, but overall it seems eminently sensible to have several fast-food restaurants sharing space.

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If you build from the ground up and design it for both restaurants, I can see that. But to have to retrofit a Taco Bell to now include pizza ovens and a pizza assembly line would create logistical problems not to mention training issues. Many fast food employees can barely get the order right working in a single business joint and now you want to add a second menu?

Two menus can also mean some kitchen equipment can't be shared so it has to be duplicated/redundant. The A&W can't cook their french fries in the same fat that Long John Silver's deep fries its fish in so you're talking about multiple fryers. Again, if the building is designed from scratch, it's not an issue but two of the places I've mentioned weren't new buildings. They were remodeled with the second kitchen equipment fitted in somehow.

If they have twice the return of a single-fast food place, then I guess it would make sense but I don't see these double chain joints carrying that kind of business. I'd be interested to see if the two-in-one restaurants can match the income of those same two restaurants each in their own buildings.

[VenerableBede]

I have run across a Baskin-Robbins/Dunkin Donuts/Togo's triple store before. . .the quality of the Togo's sandwich was substantially sub-par from what I remember growing up in the Bay Area. However, since coming back to California, it seems that it was not simply being part of this triple play, but more from being bought out by a larger company (for example, I remember Togo's having alot more options than what is available today; the 26 used to have 25 different sandwich combinations before it, now it has maybe 8, I can't remember off the top of my head). Course, I ran into this Togo's in Virginia. . .in March. . .so the avocados may not have been the best selection at the time (but the bread tasted differently in any event).

[Naftal]

I have run across a Baskin-Robbins/Dunkin Donuts/Togo's triple store before. . .the quality of the Togo's sandwich was substantially sub-par from what I remember growing up in the Bay Area.  However, since coming back to California, it seems that it was not simply being part of this triple play, but more from being bought out by a larger company (for example, I remember Togo's having alot more options than what is available today; the 26 used to have 25 different sandwich combinations before it, now it has maybe 8, I can't remember off the top of my head).  Course, I ran into this Togo's in Virginia. . .in March. . .so the avocados may not have been the best selection at the time (but the bread tasted differently in any event).

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We have a Baskin-Robbins/Dunkin Donuts double store in my area. I wonder if this is a common combination...

Edited July 23, 2007 by Naftal (log)

[Fat Guy]

But if you have a KFC and you build a Taco Bell up the road then you're paying rent on both establishments. If you put the Taco Bell in the same building as your existing KFC then you're still paying rent on one location. Your renovation expenses can't be nearly as much as it would cost to build a new store. There have to be some labor savings on a consolidated location. So you'd have to sell a lot of tacos to make the standalone Taco Bell more profitable than the Taco Bell add-on in the KFC location. You might have to double or triple your sales to make it work out in favor of the standalone Taco Bell.

[david coonce]

Also, I mean, let's face it - the entire fast-food model of food production relies on extreme standardization of everything from cup size to heating/cooking elements, with an emphasis on actually cooking things as little as possible. I don't know about all fast-food restaurants, but people I know who have worked in McDonalds tell me there are no knives, cutting boards, cooking pots or pans, etc. I would assume that, more or less, all these are the same. The kind of pizza oven a place like Pizza hut would use is a pretty minimal investment, and like FG says the savings in rent would more than cover it.

It's bad, cheap food that has been developed in a test kitchen to be prepared ably by even the least-qualified people possible. Why should it seem strange that two restaurants like that wouldn't go great together?

[rickster]

We have a Baskin-Robbins/Dunkin Donuts double store in my area. I wonder if this is a common combination...

They are both (as is Togo) owned by the same company. Not only do they spread the real estate costs across a couple of brands, in this case I suspect the company is trying to spread other costs since this combination of restaurants hits different meal occasions across the day, so you have your building more fully utilized. Could probably make the same arguement for Taco Bell (lunch) and Pizza Hut (evenings).

[munchymom]

Dunkin' Donuts is making a major entry into the Charlotte market right now, and all the new stores share space with Baskin Robbins. I've never been in one of the stores, but every time I see the dual-branded sign, I want to eat a donut topped with a scoop of ice cream and hot fudge.

[Fat Guy]

Another advantage of doubling up is that you're able to appeal to a car full of people with differing wants.

[Kent D]

My only problem with these co-branded stores, at least the one I stopped at in Estes Park, CO (hey, we'd been eating "camper food" for two days straight!), it was a KFC/Taco Bell (judging from the floor plan, it was a TB with a retro-fit), and it was an abbreviated menu for each. But the option of getting a taco AND a chicken snackwich is good for a family with divergent tastes.

[mrsadm]

It's part of the Homer Simpsonization of America.

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No, no - it's the "food-court-ization" of America!

[annecros]

The only downside I can see to the cobranding is what is going to happen when the big corporations inevitably do the brand selloffs and swaps?

Godfather's pizza is now in many BP service stations, along with a sub shop of some sort.

[Kent D]

The only downside I can see to the cobranding is what is going to happen when the big corporations inevitably do the brand selloffs and swaps?

Godfather's pizza is now in many BP service stations, along with a sub shop of some sort.

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Well, that would explain some of the drop-off in quality of Godfather's pizza around here. They've become gas-station pizza.

[slkinsey]

My main observation on doubling up is that, if one of the franchises has any further to sink, the doubled-up version will inevitably plumb new depths of suckiness. For instance, it is still possible in certain parts of the country to find a Pizza Hut that makes a palatable product. On the other hand, the drek they turn out at the Pizza Hut/KFC outposts in the name of "pizza" is invariably execrable.

I firet noticed this in airports, where the versions of chain foods are usually a notch or two below par already. In NYC, I first noticed doubling up in neighborhoods that are predominately African American, then in tourist areas.

[Susie Q]

I don't do mainstream fast food very often except for In-N-Out.

I once tried Long John Silver's fish from a KFC/LJS location. They fried the fish in the chicken oil and all I could taste was the 11 herbs and spices. It put me off combined places.

I'll stick with H.Salt.

[jesskidden]

In NJ (and possibly other neighboring states?). in the 60's and early 70's the most common place to purchase Kentucky Fried Chicken was at the Gino's hamburger chain (there were a few "stand alone" KFC's, as well). I think the "Colonel" made similar deals with other chains as well, so the concept's been around.

The only place I notice them here are at the "Service Areas" on the toll roads (NJ Turnpike, GS Parkway, PA Tpk, etc.) which I might stop in to use the rest rooms- can't say I've ever eaten at them since they seem even more depressing than a normal fast food joint.

Edited September 8, 2007 by jesskidden (log)

[Toliver]

Wendy's and Arby's have announced that they will be test-marketing double-branded restaurants.

The article: Will dual-branding work for Wendy's and Arby's?

Now that Wendy's and Arby's are under the same corporate umbrella, it wasn't that surprising when the company announced an international franchise agreement for 135 dual-branded restaurants in the Middle East and North Africa.

But it is surprising that the two brands would consider co-existing in U.S. stores.

...A U.S. test of three dual-branded stores, with the first to open in Atlanta by mid-2010

The article also mentioned that Tim Horton's and Cold Stone Creamery have some double-branded stores. Has anyone been to one? I'm curious as to how much the menus vary when compared to single-brand stores.

[Holly Moore]

Most stupid corporate move since Fed Ex decided to drop the Kinko's brand name in favor of Fed Ex Office - tarnishing the Wendy's image by incorporating Arby's.

Kind of like someone on the A list hanging out with D lister Kathy Griffin.

[Edward J]

There are quite a few Wendy's/Tim Hortons outlets here in Vancouver. I believe Wendy's owns Tim Ho's, so it comes as no surprise of the doubling up.

What I find amazing is the "kitchen" at a local mega-movie house. The movie theater chain has all the regular big name fast foods: Pizza, burgers, mexican food etc, each with the standard corporate decor and front, BUT all the kitchens are connected, a skelton staff of 2 or 3 could man the back of all 6 franchises with one employee each at the respective cash registers.

How much does Pepsi really own when you look at all the fast food franchises?......

[Moopheus]

We have a Baskin-Robbins/Dunkin Donuts double store in my area. I wonder if this is a common combination...

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Yeah, they're everywhere. Don't know if you can get a hot fudge donut sundae though.

[emilyr]

The one I do actually like the combination of is in the mall in Columbia, MO: Subway and Orange Julius. Neither one really needs to have even a full mall food court kitchen, so it makes sense.

I might actually like the Arby's/Wendy's combo. They're two chains that I really like. And the idea of getting a roast beef sandwich and a Frosty is very appealing.