Cooking with "Chocolates and Confections" by Peter Greweling (Part 1)

[choux]

To get the dregs out you can microwave the container to warm the glucose/corn syrup and it becomes much more liquid.

[Kerry Beal]

I scoop out my glucose into a couple of 1 litre plastic yogurt containers and with a wide mouth funnel I put some into a corn syrup squeeze bottle.  When I need large amounts I just let it pour from the yogurt container into the bowl or pot sitting on the scale.  I sort of turn the container to cut off the flow.  If I need 50 grams then I just squeeze it out of the corn syrup bottle.

That's a good idea - I usually only need small quantities (around 50 grams), so a squeeze bottle would be perfect. I wonder if you can get food safe refillable caulk tubes? That would help minimize waste, too. Do you have a problem getting it all out of the corn syrup bottle? It seems much more viscous than corn syrup, but maybe I've just never dealt with corn syrup in these quantities.

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I just turn it on it's lid and let it drip out in it's own time.

[Chris Hennes]

After stirring for a few minutes the seed fondant was completely melted and incorporated and the fondant looked like Elmer's glue---does that sound about right? But what then? Do I keep stirring until it is cool, or just pour it into a container? Does it also need to "ripen" overnight, or is it ready to use now? I just stopped stirring and poured it into a container, so hopefully I didn't just ruin it!

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Just pour it into a container as you did. Let it ripen overnight and see how it looks in the am.

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OK, so, several days later... it has solidified into a pretty firm mass. I can't make an impression in it pushing down (OK, maybe I'm just weak... ). Now what? I am used to thinking of fondant as a cake coating---is this just and entirely different beast, or do I need to scoop it out and kneed it, or did I actually manage to ruin an item with three ingredients?

Edited January 31, 2008 by Chris Hennes (log)

[Kerry Beal]

OK, so, several days later... it has solidified into a pretty firm mass. I can't make an impression in it pushing down (OK, maybe I'm just weak... ). Now what? I am used to thinking of fondant as a cake coating---is this just and entirely different beast, or do I need to scoop it out and kneed it, or did I actually manage to ruin an item with three ingredients? 

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Try the scoop it out and knead it. You can heat a little in the microwave first - just like you would to soften butter. You can also apply heat to melt it somewhat - add your flavourings, invertase - then mold in starch before dipping.

What are you going to use it for? If it is an ingredient in a center with butter, chocolate etc - I put it in the food processor with the room temperature butter - then add the melted and cooled chocolate once they are mixed.

At this point I tend to buy fondant - that's probably not what you want to hear.

[Chris Hennes]

What are you going to use it for?  If it is an ingredient in a center with butter, chocolate etc - I put it in the food processor with the room temperature butter - then add the melted and cooled chocolate once they are mixed.

At this point I tend to buy fondant - that's probably not what you want to hear.

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I've got a bunch of things I wanted to try, both using it as the sweetener in a butter ganache for the lemon logs and using it as the primary filling component, in the mints. I figured most people must buy it, but my pantry is already overflowing with confectionary ingredients---the last thing I need is yet another bucket of stuff! Plus, for me most of the pleasure of confectionary is the production: I give the vast majority of the chocolates away, since it turns out I don't have much of a sweet tooth. So making my own fondant is no big deal: just part of the fun!

[Kerry Beal]

I've got a bunch of things I wanted to try, both using it as the sweetener in a butter ganache for the lemon logs and using it as the primary filling component, in the mints. I figured most people must buy it, but my pantry is already overflowing with confectionary ingredients---the last thing I need is yet another bucket of stuff! Plus, for me most of the pleasure of confectionary is the production: I give the vast majority of the chocolates away, since it turns out I don't have much of a sweet tooth. So making my own fondant is no big deal: just part of the fun! 

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So the food processor should work for those recipes. Just have to chip it out of the container first.

I have this sneaking suspicion that while you are giving away chocolates now, it won't be long before we see you on the 'Starting a Chocolate Business' threads.

[Chris Hennes]

I have this sneaking suspicion that while you are giving away chocolates now, it won't be long before we see you on the 'Starting a Chocolate Business' threads.

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I think the health inspector would drive me mad... tempering machine under the hood!?! What?!?

Since the Superbowl is basically an all-day event I'm looking for a complicated project to do while it is on. I was thinking of doing the sleeping beauties: can these be done in one go, or do they need an overnight rest? Also, he calls for "pulverized dry milk": is this just dry milk powder? Do I need to "pulverize" it some more? I could take out some pent-up agression on it, maybe.

[Kerry Beal]

Since the Superbowl is basically an all-day event I'm looking for a complicated project to do while it is on. I was thinking of doing the sleeping beauties: can these be done in one go, or do they need an overnight rest? Also, he calls for "pulverized dry milk": is this just dry milk powder? Do I need to "pulverize" it some more? I could take out some pent-up agression on it, maybe. 

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I like to leave the ones that need cutting overnight myself, but try a little batch and see how soon they can be cut. (though I'm not sure how that recipe lends itself to a small batch)

I'd use dry milk powder.

[choux]

I put the dry milk powder through a seive, mine seemed to have big chunks and the seive worked great. I usually make this as a half batch to fit my 9x7 frames. I make the nougat as a 3/4 batch though, half batch makes a really small amount, it doesn't seem to get enough volume. I think there's just not enough in the mixer for it to whip effectively. Be careful with the caramel, I find if it goes a degree or 2 over it gets rock hard. Filling-pulling hard. These are one of my favourites from the book.

[Chris Hennes]

I put the dry milk powder through a seive, mine seemed to have big chunks and the seive worked great. I usually make this as a half batch to fit my 9x7 frames. I make the nougat as a 3/4 batch though, half batch makes a really small amount, it doesn't seem to get enough volume. I think there's just not enough in the mixer for it to whip effectively. Be careful with the caramel, I find if it goes a degree or 2 over it gets rock hard. Filling-pulling hard. These are one of my favourites from the book.

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Awesome, thanks a lot for the advice. Some of the earlier posts in this thread reported less-than-fully-successful attempts, but I'm up for a little challenge . I always make half batches of Greweling's recipes, too, though I go with a 9"x8" frame, so if you had a problem filling yours all the way I almost certainly will, too. The 3/4 batch is a good idea, since you just scrape off any extra anyway. When you made yours did you let it sit over night? I always have before, but I was hoping to do this one during the game Sunday, start-to-finish.

[choux]

I don't think I did... It's been a couple of months now. The caramel definitely needs a while to cool fully, but the nougat doesn't need long. I think I posted that when I first made these, when I cut them the edges sort of collapsed and they weren't very staight from top to bottom. There's a photo on this thread somewhere. Last time I made them I was pressed for time (because I overcooked the caramel!), and I think they turned out better without the nougat drying out. Not as much crumbling.

So in conclusion, I think you're OK to cut them when they are cool, maybe an hour or 2 to rest.

[tammylc]

I just finished the Gingerbread Squares, and I'm really happy with them. Of course, the perfectionist in me can see a million things to work on, but thanks to all the advice I've gotten here I'm definitely improving. Here they are (as usual, more photos at my website):

So, thank you all for your help with this new hobby: so far, so good! 

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Chris, i just checked out the latest set of pictures. Your enrobing sequence is amazing. I'm really impressed at your technique - I have to admit that my first reaction was "I ought to give up chocolate making right now - I'm still not that good, and I've been doing this for a lot longer than he has..."

But instead I'll try to think of you for inspiration tomorrow when i'm dipping 220 pieces...

What are you using to clean the bottom? Is it a bamboo skewer? Hard to tell from the picture.

[Chris Hennes]

Chris, i just checked out the latest set of pictures. Your enrobing sequence is amazing.  I'm really impressed at your technique - I have to admit that my first reaction was "I ought to give up chocolate making right now - I'm still not that good, and I've been doing this for a lot longer than he has..."

But instead I'll try to think of you for inspiration tomorrow when i'm dipping 220 pieces...

What are you using to clean the bottom? Is it a bamboo skewer? Hard to tell from the picture.

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Yeah, it's a bamboo skewer---actually, it didn't work very well because the chocolate liked to stay attached to it, and then drip down after it had hardened a bit, making keeping things in temper a bit more challenging. Next time I am going to string a taught piece of wire across the bowl, somehow.

Thank you for the compliments: remember when you look at the pictures that I cherry-picked the best sequence. Surely if I dipped 72 squares, one of them would turn out right? I learned so much from the demos and comments here---all of you have been a tremendous help. Good luck with your 220 pieces: I was ready to quit after 22, but made myself do all 70. Hand enrobing is a lot of work!

[Desiderio]

I think I was one of those that posted about the sleeping beauty, mine were a total disaster, I dont like his caramel recipe too much , and the nougat recipe I have, is much better than the one on the book ( in my opinion) I might try them again with different ingredient , because I hate to waste them.

[Chris Hennes]

I think I was one of those that posted about the sleeping beauty, mine were a total disaster, I dont like his caramel recipe too much , and the nougat recipe I have, is much better than the one on the book ( in my opinion) I might try them again with different ingredient , because I hate to waste them.

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Yes, yours was the post I was thinking of. I have a couple other recipes for caramel and nougat, but I try to go with the original recipe the first time I make anything. Fortunately, I'm only making a half batch, so if they turn out to be a disaster, I haven't wasted too much. Besides, my friends have low standards... that's why they hang out with me!

Greweling's recipes for each look pretty conventional: are you using recipes of your own devising, or are they from a cookbook? I've got Wybauw's first book as well as Shotts... maybe I will look through there.

[Desiderio]

I have random recipes that I got here and there.I have to say though that I didnt try the sleeping beauty after the first attempt , and I have a tendecy to not follow recipes :-P, so I am commiting to try them again today ( and all the other valentine's day chocolates :-) ) I will report and I promise to follow the recipe . Need to go stirr the caramel :-P

Edited February 3, 2008 by Desiderio (log)

[Desiderio]

Ok I finished the sleeping beauties last night, so it can be done in few hours .

The process its ok , I just find his recipes to contain too many ingredients that are not necessary :-P. Cutting the recipe in half its a little bit a pain , because the quantities are minimal for certain ingredients.The nougat in my KA was like invisible and really didint get too much volume, you would need more eggswhite and syrup , anyway , they came out ok and I might try it again with the full amount .I didnt use glucose syrup , because I have little left over and I didnt want to waste it ( in case the recipe didnt work for me ) so I used some organic corn syrup , that has some taste in it and gave the sleeping beauty a malty flavor , that I dont mind at all :-P

PS: the color in both the caramel and the nougat is darker due the organic corn syrup , is dark .Well now I know they work so next time i will do it with the glucose syrup.I like them but I find them little bit too sweet and chewy.I like the nougat I use because isnt that chewy.

Edited February 3, 2008 by Desiderio (log)

[Lior]

gorgeous!!!! Perfect!! Next week I will try to make them too!! Wow!

[Desiderio]

Thank you Lior.

I forgot to mention that to cut them I used a scraper ,it was easier because the edge are little sticky , but the scraper was easier.Also the dark chocolate cover make them less sweet ( I just had a piece ).

[lebowits]

I think I was one of those that posted about the sleeping beauty, mine were a total disaster, I dont like his caramel recipe too much , and the nougat recipe I have, is much better than the one on the book ( in my opinion) I might try them again with different ingredient , because I hate to waste them.

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Which of Greweling's caramel formulas did you use? I've tried all of them and have settled on the formula which uses sweetened condensed milk. I slab the caramel and enrobe it with dark (63% Esprit des Alpes) chocolate and decorate with sea salt.

I chose this particular formula for 2 reasons: 1) It doesn't take as long to cook since there is very little water in the formula vs. fresh dairy milk; and 2) the flavor and texture are very consistent and extremely popular.

Of the pieces I have made, this is by far the favorite at about 99%. Of course I like them too, but I like everything I make or I don't serve it to anyone else.

[Chris Hennes]

Thank you Lior.

I forgot to mention that to cut them I used a scraper ,it was easier because the edge are little sticky , but the scraper was easier.Also the dark chocolate cover make them less sweet ( I just had a piece  ).

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I'm glad yours went well... mine were a complete failure! It was like a comedy of errors. My first batch of caramel boiled over and made a mess of my stove and oven, when I poured my send batch of caramel into the mold it the bars just flowed with the caramel. I squeezed everything back into the original frame and made the nougat. I took all of your advice and made a full batch of nougat: even that seemed like very little nougat in my KA mixer. In addition, Greweling says it should take about 8 minutes to cool down to 120F: after 20 minutes I gave up waiting at 150F and added the rest of the ingredients, since the nougat was now seeming over-beaten and was losing volume. The nougat was much firmer than I expected, more like taffy: I tried to roll it out, but it was just too firm to work with reasonably, and was much too stiff to eat. So, I give up. What in the world did I do wrong?!?

[Desiderio]

For the caramel I have another recipe that use with salt , and its very popular as well ,I dont plan on using Greweling caramel for other things , I dont like the flavor or the consistency too much.I did use the caramel from the recipe for this ones though.

Chris , that seems the first time I made mine.The caramel tends to burns easy , I think because of the milk solid presents ( a lot ).The Nougat did turn much firmer for me as well and it did had the taffy consistency.I dont know what it was but I have the feeling that some of his recipes are kinda moody , I dont know how to explain it, but since I am a witch doctor when it comes to chocolates and pastry , some things dont make too much sense to me, I go with my senses more :-) maybe he is too much of a scientist and I am more of a witch

I suggest you move on the next experiment ( since you are doing wonderfully ) and then come back to the sleeping beauty like I did .

[Chris Hennes]

I suggest you move on the next experiment ( since you are doing wonderfully ) and then come back to the sleeping beauty like I did .

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That sounds like good advice to me! Maybe I'll make the Madras next to get my confidence back up .

[tammylc]

Chris, your problem with the caramel probably comes from the bars you are using. While hollow 1/4 inch bars are going to be fine for ganache, they don't have the weight to support hot caramel. Short of getting solid bars, you could try putting some weights behind the bars to help them stay in place.

I've never made any nougat, so I can't help you there.

[Chris Hennes]

Chris, your problem with the caramel probably comes from the bars you are using. While hollow 1/4 inch bars are going to be fine for ganache, they don't have the weight to support hot caramel. Short of getting solid bars, you could try putting some weights behind the bars to help them stay in place.

I've never made any nougat, so I can't help you there.

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I think the bars would have stayed put if I had not greased the Silpat . Greweling said to grease the parchment, so my thinking was, "wow, this caramel must be really sticky... I guess if he says to grease the parchment I should grease the Silpat." Note to self: don't grease Silpat. On the plus side, nothing stuck to it...