The concept of "pooling tips" in restaurants

[beans]

There are different issues being entered here.

1. I'd never work anywhere that makes us tip out back of the house. No matter how well the feed me. That is only an excuse for a restaurant owner not to pay the kitchen crew a decent and competitive hourly or salary and only exploits FOH.

2. I tip out, as a bartender, the food runners and barback. That is not pooling tips but a known amount (a straight percentage) of our tips we don't mind or quibble about. As a bartender, I get tipped out by servers for pouring their diningroom drinks. When I was a server I tipped out food runners, bussers and the bar I was assigned to call from. At a different restaurant, during my cross training and I worked the floor, I had to tip out the hostesses for seating my station.

3. Tipsharing is just wrong, IMHO.

Small staffs it may work out, but rarely does everyone feel it is a good thing. One can always go elsewhere and earn more and another can always pull a lazy shift (lax to their working sidework or upselling).

Looking back I suppose I did work under "tip sharing" terms when I worked for ClubCorp for a winter. Oddly, it was the bartender's responsibility to total up and submit all of the servers' checks from the day shift. (Thank heavens I only did this a mere four times). Want to know how many of those servers never wrote down what the guest drank? A whole diningroom of waters during a very busy lunch? The gratuity was systematically added to each of their check totals and billed as it was not a cash house. The gratuity was then divied up among the staff according to the hours they worked. These servers were a nightmare to work with as they were complacent and never did the extra effort because they were merely punching the clock. No wonder our executive chef demonstrated his loathing by providing crew meal as only wing dings for over 30 days in a row!

[/end rant]

[herbacidal]

I used to work at a place that pooled tips. Most Chinese restaurants do.

Actually, the only non-Chinese restaurant (American/Continental food) I've worked at also did.

I liked the idea, although I've always been lucky enough to work with good staff and relatively low turnover.

I think that all things considered, I like it better because it does create more of a team effort to take care of things.

It also means that the stronger waitstaff helps the weaker waitstaff along, and that management has to keep a better eye on things to prevent crappy staff from dragging the bunch down.

Also, management has to not be desperate and hire anyone that walks in the door. They have to figure out if someone can pull their own weight, which they should be able to do if they're observant during one training shift.

[SethG]

Actually it smacks of "union" -- an organised group of workers within the same profession.

It rewards the lazy.

←

I think the communist comparison was more apt, with the restaurant management taking the role of the politicians in charge of the centralized economy.

No self-respecting union would endorse a pooling system in which management collects all the tips and doles them out, with no check on how much was collected in total tips. This isn't to say it couldn't happen, but it certainly wouldn't be the goal of any organized group of workers.

There is power in a union!

(This poster is a card-carrying member of UAW Local 2325 (AFL-CIO).)

[Busboy]

I worked at two restaurants which pooled tips and never had or heard a complaint about it. In each case, tips were pooled only with other servers on the same shift, with a modest tip-out to the service bartender and the busboy.

At Le Pavillon, a formal French place, new waiters were gradually promoted to a full share in the tips, giving management and experienced servers time to bring the newbies up top speed as they passed from 25% to 50% to 75% to 100% share over 2-4 months. Most nights there were eight servers on the floor, four front-waiters and four back-waiters. At 100%, a server was expected to be able to captain a table, although, of course, not every "captain" worked the front every night.

At Nora, where there were seldom more than four servers on the floor, everyone pooled a full share once training was over. Management kept a close eye on whether each server was pulling his or her own weight and at least one server -- me -- was fired at least in part for not keeping up his end of the bargain (not that I was lazy, just inept).

In both cases the system worked because there were small staffs of experienced professionals who trusted each other's judgement and abilities. And, in both cases, the the system was in place because each server was expected to help other servers whenever it was appropriate. If you were in the kitchen and another server's order came up, you served it. You got drinks and cleared plates -- whatever it took - succeeding as a team and being rewarded as a team.

[Susan G]

In every place I've worked that pooled tips, even among equally talented servers, there was always poor morale about the safety of the "kitty": Rumors were flying about this server or that busser secretly taking cash out of the pool.

[herbacidal]

I think the communist comparison was more apt, with the restaurant management taking the role of the politicians in charge of the centralized economy.

No self-respecting union would endorse a pooling system in which management collects all the tips and doles them out, with no check on how much was collected in total tips.  This isn't to say it couldn't happen, but it certainly wouldn't be the goal of any organized group of workers.

There is power in a union!

(This poster is a card-carrying member of UAW Local 2325 (AFL-CIO).)

←

At the restaurants I worked at, the tips were collected and doled out by the waitstaff.

[srhcb]

I once worked at a very successful restaurant where the waitresses made more money than the owners. We asked them to just remember and give the kitchen staff a few bucks after every shift, or else leave some money at the to buy then a 12-pack of beer.

We found the kitchen workers appreciated the gesture, and everyone got along pretty well. The waitresses who were most generous got the special favors from the kitchen, and those who didn't hold up their end of the bargain got worse service, resulting in fewer tips for them to not share.

[beans]

I once worked at a very successful restaurant where the waitresses made more money than the owners.  We asked them to just remember and give the kitchen staff a few bucks after every shift, or else leave some money at the to buy then a 12-pack of beer.

We found the kitchen workers appreciated the gesture, and everyone got along pretty well.  The waitresses who were most generous got the special favors from the kitchen, and those who didn't hold up their end of the bargain got worse service, resulting in fewer tips for them to not share.

That's just plain exploitation.

I'd tell them to take a good look at my backside leaving through the front doors.

[LJC]

Just a couple of points:

For those of you who tip less when you are in a "pooled house" you should realize that when you tip less it is the server you are hurting. It is just an excuse for you to be cheap; if I were to follow your logic then I would think you should tip more not less.

It was also mentioned that there is an establishment that places a "service charge" right on the bill to avoid any tipping issues. Be aware that a "service charge" is a taxable sale where a gratuity is not. So you may prefer the clarity but you end up paying more and the servers get the money for the "service charge" after a sales tax deduction.

[Pan]

Tips are also taxable. What do you mean by a taxable sale?

[winesonoma]

Service charges are figured in when computing sales tax. Tips are added later.

[LJC]

Tips are also taxable. What do you mean by a taxable sale?

←

Not wages or income tax but sales tax; In NYS 8.65% just like your entree.

So if an establishment places a $10.00 "service charge" on a check the establishment would owe Uncle Sam $0.87 and the server would get $9.13 which he or she would then have to pay income tax on.

More likely would be that the $10 service charge would go into the subtotal and then be taxed. So, you the guest would pay $10.87 to "tip" a server $10.

Edited September 7, 2004 by LJC (log)

[Pan]

Thanks for the explanations. I get the difference now.

[LJC]

Thanks for the explanations. I get the difference now.

←

This is the reason that so many hotels use the term gratuity not service charge and in some cases both. For example many fine hotels will place a flat service charge on your room service order in addition to a mandatory %x gratuity. Some go even further and then leave a blank line for an additional gratuity.

[auntdot]

If Mr. and Mrs auntdot know that there are pooled tips, we tip in cash directly to the server.

Then it is up to the server to add some or all of it to the communal tip pool.

[herbacidal]

Just a couple of points:

For those of you who tip less when you are in a "pooled house" you should realize that when you tip less it is the server you are hurting.  It is just an excuse for you to be cheap; if I were to follow your logic then I would think you should tip more not less.

←

I wasn't aware anyone made that distinction when tipping. Tsk tsk.

I just tip based on performance and attitude.

Pooled vs. individual never matters to me, perhaps because I pretty much assume every place uses individual tips unless I know specifically otherwise.

[inventolux]

I think the entire staff should pool tips. Front and back of the house. Teamwork means the entire team.

[TheFoodTutor]

The servers in your town are earning just $2.13 and hour AND 20% of the restaurant sales and sales tax.  Very profitable brow sweat. 

I feel a need to point out that not everyone, or even a majority of everyone, tips 20%, much less tips 20% on the total after tax. Some people tip 15%. Some tip 10%. Some tip less than 10%. Some regularly tip 5%. Some think 50 cents a person is still a good tip.

And some people never ever tip anyone under any circumstances. That's just the way things are.

[jschyun]

L'Orangerie, in Los Angeles, was in a class action lawsuit due to problems with the pooled tips.

Lutz claimed in a deposition, which was backed up by declarations from two waiters, Jay Bergers and Michael Medico, that the maitre d' at L'Orangerie is a member of the management team and was illegally included in the tip pool. Lutz also claimed that L'Orangerie routinely docked the tip pool for servers' billing mistakes and that therefore L'Orangerie illegally interfered with the management of the servers' tip pool.

If you are subscribed to latimes.com, then you can see the actual article. I think you can find fake logons on the internet if you're interested but don't want to register.

latimes article

[stovetop]

A Server (waiter) is a professional sales person, they have knowledge of two product lists, the food menu and the liquor menu; they have knowledge of service, to be seen and not heard, or to be the entertainer, it all depends on the client, each customer has different needs, Waiters (male and female) work their buts off, if they are the one selling and serving the client they should get their just reward.

What they do with it is their decision, yes it should be taxed, it should all be accounted for and added to the waiter’s income.

chefs and Cooks should not be subsidized by the tips, pay us the money we deserve, we should get a slice of a tip if we do a incredible job for a client and the waiter gets a good tip, but it is always the discretion of the server, we can always developed good relationships with waiters but there is a thin line, favors!!

Be careful once you cross that line it can become a criminal offense, it is stealing and besides not very professional, if we in the food business want to become professional we have to act like ones.

[jetsie]

I once worked as a server in a restaurant that pooled tips. It was horrible, because the place was pretty large, there were a lot of lazy servers with seniority and family connections, and I never got back a fifth of my actual earned tips. I quickly escaped.

Otherwise, most of my server days were spent at places where service was set up in multiple small teams which consisted of some combination of a captain, front waiter, back waiter, and busperson, depending on how formal service needed to be. Each captain would divide up tips for his/her team, and also tip out to the bar and any food runners. This system worked well, encouraging good teamwork and service. Captains had to divide tips fairly or no one would work with them, but they could use some discretion in rewarding really good work.

I don't remember ever sharing tips with back of the house. They would have been offended, in a way, since they considered themselves creative professionals, while we were performing monkeys.

[stovetop]

I don't remember ever sharing tips with back of the house. They would have been offended, in a way, since they considered themselves creative professionals, while we were performing monkeys. 

[beans]

With all due respect invento, team work is team work. Heart of the house earns a salary. FOH earns $2.13 an hour and works their asses off to take home a decent percentage of tips.

Tipping BOH is just plain wrong.

I'm not working for them to be able to drink a few, or better, afterwork, I'm working to earn as much as I possibly can for myself.

There are better stations and better shifts. Those that are most capable and/or reliable find themselves with the money making shifts. That's life.

[frdagaa]

Not being in the business, I found this thread enlightening. Excuse my ignorance, but when tip sharing occurs, does everyone know what they AND THE OTHER WAITSTAFF are contributing and getting back? If that knowledge is shared, there would be incentive to not slack off, because everyone would know you keep taking out more than you're putting in. And as long as this is properly monitored and dealt with (exceedingly weak servers would presumably be let go), the better servers shouldn't have too much disincentive.

[Shelley G.]

what an interesting thread. In my restaurant, no one is paid minimum wage. The servers do tip out to the kitchen - it is such a tiny spot that it really is a team effort. Although I do pay much larger wages to the cooks (and both of them are happy with their wages), I do think that they deserve a tip from the servers, who do really well. In addition, all tips left on catering/take out orders are given directly to the kitchen, as they are the people who do all the work. I do not believe in owners grabbing servers' tips and doling them out as they see fit. One very popular restaurant in my area was nailed (rightly so) for doing this. Turned out that BOH staff were all related to owners, while FOH staff were university students. Those young women worked so hard - one of them, who came to work for me after leaving this place said that her week's tips averaged $400.00. She received $50.00 - the rest went to BOH . No wonder everyone left.