Sous Vide: Recipes, Techniques & Equipment, 2011

[Twyst]

I'm going to make my first attempt at cooking short ribs sous vide for 72 hours this weekend. Looking on the web Ive seen the recommended temperature anywhere from 132 to 140. I'm sure lots of people here have experience with it, what temperature did you guys have the most success with?

[dcarch]

I am sure this may have been discussed. I couldn't find the topic searching here.

I don't understand the use of air bubblers. Don't they carry away a huge amount of heat and moisture? Besides, It just does not seem to me that bubbling circulates water as well as a pump.

dcarch

[paulpegg]

I'm going to make my first attempt at cooking short ribs sous vide for 72 hours this weekend. Looking on the web Ive seen the recommended temperature anywhere from 132 to 140. I'm sure lots of people here have experience with it, what temperature did you guys have the most success with?

I have done the Momofuku Short Ribs for 72 hours at 55C (131F) and they come out nothing short of fantastic! you can find a version of this recipe at Momofuku Ribs The recipe says 48 hours but 72 works fine also. I make a double batch of the marinade and use the second one to serve the ribs. Reduce it down to about 25% until it is thick and dark. It works a lot better than using the marinade from the bags.

You can serve it with just about anything you wish. I like it with pureed celery root and pea pods.

you will definitely return to this recipe many times.

[paulpegg]

I am sure this may have been discussed. I couldn't find the topic searching here.

I don't understand the use of air bubblers. Don't they carry away a huge amount of heat and moisture? Besides, It just does not seem to me that bubbling circulates water as well as a pump.

dcarch

You're right. An air bubbler will pump loads of energy out the top and accelerate evaporation as well. The little centrifugal pump I am using circulates 110 GPH and uses less than 2 amps @ 12v DC.

[dcarch]

I am sure this may have been discussed. I couldn't find the topic searching here.

I don't understand the use of air bubblers. Don't they carry away a huge amount of heat and moisture? Besides, It just does not seem to me that bubbling circulates water as well as a pump.

dcarch

You're right. An air bubbler will pump loads of energy out the top and accelerate evaporation as well. The little centrifugal pump I am using circulates 110 GPH and uses less than 2 amps @ 12v DC.

You can also get 110vac pumps. No adapter needed. The watts used by the pump is not wasted. One watt = 3.4 BTU to heat up the water.

dcarch

[dougal]

... I recently upgraded the pump to an external centrifugal pump with the ability to withstand up to 105C. The original pump didn't like 83.9C! ...

... The little centrifugal pump I am using circulates 110 GPH and uses less than 2 amps @ 12v DC. ...

One reason for the choice of aquarium bubblers to drive circulation has been the difficulty of finding a small (hopefully cheap) and easily available pump that will reliably withstand cooking temperatures.

Paul, could you document the pumps that worked (and didn't) for you, please?

A low voltage (rather than mains voltage) water pump makes a great deal of sense from the safety angle, and adjusting/controlling the speed of a DC pump motor is simply a matter of giving it a lower voltage, simply achieved by using a different power brick.

A bubbler does demand at minimum, (its advisable anyway) a decently fitting lid to prevent excessive evaporation. PedroG has posted on the subject in the past, and if I recall correctly, favoured covering the waterbath surface with things rather like table-tennis balls.

[dcarch]

"-----Paul, could you document the pumps that worked (and didn't) for you, please?

A low voltage (rather than mains voltage) water pump makes a great deal of sense from the safety angle, and adjusting/controlling the speed of a DC pump motor is simply a matter of giving it a lower voltage, simply achieved by using a different power brick.

---"

The aquarium pumps are made for wet use, I think they are very safe.

DC pump may be using solid state devices to drive a brushless rotor. Solid state devices are not very heat resistant.

AC motors are very simple induction type, nothing much to go wrong.

Most pumps have adjustable water flow ports. All motor pumps use centrifigal impellers. When the ports are blocked to restrick flow, the motor actually gets less load.

dcarch

[paulpegg]

... I recently upgraded the pump to an external centrifugal pump with the ability to withstand up to 105C. The original pump didn't like 83.9C! ...

... The little centrifugal pump I am using circulates 110 GPH and uses less than 2 amps @ 12v DC. ...

One reason for the choice of aquarium bubblers to drive circulation has been the difficulty of finding a small (hopefully cheap) and easily available pump that will reliably withstand cooking temperatures.

Paul, could you document the pumps that worked (and didn't) for you, please?

A low voltage (rather than mains voltage) water pump makes a great deal of sense from the safety angle, and adjusting/controlling the speed of a DC pump motor is simply a matter of giving it a lower voltage, simply achieved by using a different power brick.

Via-Agua VA-80

This pump http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=VIA+AQUA+VA-80%2F+ATAM+AT-301&x=0&y=0 did not hold up at all. it gave up the ghost at 70C.

This one is rated at ~80C but it also failed. The plastic just expanded and it froze solid. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260688654675&ssPageName=ADME:L:PMR:US:1123

The vendor for the above pump replaced it with this one Centrifugal Pump and it works great. I bought some silicone tubing and a sink nipple to finish the hook-up. I also needed a 2 amp 12v power supply that I bought on ebay for a few $. I cut the sink nipple in half, bent it into an L shape and just pushed the silicon tubing over the ends. At first I just put the tubing in the stock pot or cooler but the return would invariably find it's way out of the pot and empty all the water onto the floor. The sink nipple keeps them tubing in the pot and the problem has gone away. (I bought two of these pumps since they come from Hong Kong and it takes a long time for them to arrive. if there was interest i could buy in quantity and supply them to others on eGullet.)

Here is a picture of the final pump assembly.

[dcarch]

I would assume the pump will have to be below the water level. It does not look like it's a self-priming pump.

I have found that it's helpful to have a filter at the intake to prevent clogging.

dcarch

[PedroG]

I am sure this may have been discussed. I couldn't find the topic searching here.

I don't understand the use of air bubblers. Don't they carry away a huge amount of heat and moisture? Besides, It just does not seem to me that bubbling circulates water as well as a pump.

dcarch

When you use a bubbler, use the airstone as a weight only and cut a lateral hole in the silicone tube. This produces larger bubbles that rise faster resulting in more vigorous circulation, and thanks to the reduced surface relative to volume they carry away less heat and water vapor. In my experience a bubbler works equally well as a pump, and it can be used at temperatures above 58°C where many pumps fail. No forced circulation at all definitely results in poor temperature stability. Natural convection occurs during ramping up at full power but becomes almost nul at steady state, see http://egullet.org/p1750074 .

[lesliec]

I'm going to make my first attempt at cooking short ribs sous vide for 72 hours this weekend. Looking on the web Ive seen the recommended temperature anywhere from 132 to 140. I'm sure lots of people here have experience with it, what temperature did you guys have the most success with?

Hi Twyst.

I've been playing with short ribs recently. At 140°F/60°C fo 72 hours they're quite amazing - very tender but still pink inside. I really like them this way, but just for interest I'm going to pull my next lot at 48 hours, just to see the contrast.

[paulpegg]

I would assume the pump will have to be below the water level. It does not look like it's a self-priming pump.

I have found that it's helpful to have a filter at the intake to prevent clogging.

dcarch

It is not a self priming pump but it is easy to prime by sucking on the return side until it is full of water. Once it is full and running it can be above or below the water level. I haven't had any clogging problems since the water is clear and there is no floating or suspended material in the water. The end of the inlet pipe is cut at an angle on both sides to prevent it from sucking up against the wall or a bag. A small filter would probably be more effective.

[mcdiarmid]

I do tri tip at 59°C for 24 hrs and it comes out medium all the way through and fork tender, so I suspect that 60°C is a bit low. My next step up is 165°F for 24 hrs for turkey thighs but that is almost confit and probably too much. So 70°C for 24hrs might be a place to start. I will be interested in what others suggest.

Doc

I have just started a batch at 68˚C and will check at 24 and 48 hrs to test shredding. Elastic tissue should easily break down nicely at that temp and given that tenderness doesn't seem to improve above 70˚C (per baldwin's lit search), I think that will be my best bet. Will report back.

After 24 hrs I squished the meat through one of the bags and it felt like it was shreddable. So, I pulled out the 3 bags of beef and shock-chilled 2 of them and opened the 3rd. The meat was pretty good for shredding, but I think another 12 hours would have been "perfect". Didn't matter though since we made tacos and the taste was better than the crockpot method (which was already very good) since this meat was more juicy as I wanted. Was too hungry to take pics though.

[nickrey]

I wonder if this is indicative of a trend?

Recently I purchased a cookbook called Table By the River presenting cooking done by Dietmar Sawyere at his Sydney restaurant called Berowra Waters.

In the recipes containing some form of meat, almost twice as many were cooked sous vide as were cooked using other means.

Has anyone else come across an increase in sous-vide based recipes in generalist cookbooks as opposed to specialist sous vide titles?

[e_monster]

I am sure this may have been discussed. I couldn't find the topic searching here.

I don't understand the use of air bubblers. Don't they carry away a huge amount of heat and moisture? Besides, It just does not seem to me that bubbling circulates water as well as a pump.

dcarch

Cheap aquarium pumps are very cheap and circulate the water fine. As long as the cooker is covered, you have minimal moisture loss since it condenses on the lid and falls back into the cooker. I have done 72 hour cooks with no drop in the water level.

You don't need the added circulation of a water pump -- it really won't make a detectable improvement -- very little assistance is needed for the natural convection currents -- and as far as I know the cheapest water pumps that hold up to long-term use at non-aquarium temperatures are quite a bit more expensive than the $5 air pumps that many of us use.

[rotuts]

I use my bubbler in coleman coolers with the top shut. you cut away the side just enough to get the tubes out and insulate the top or cover it with a multilayer blanket.

72 hrs results in no water loss. the vast majority of the heat stays in the closed system and needs very little energy to maintain the target temp.

Im a big fan of this system. and in the summer time the kitchen doesnt get hot!

[FoodMan]

Sous Vide Systems IC

As far as I can tell through various searches here, we have not discussed this machine before (sorry if we I missed it). So, I might need a new IC or other rig soonish since I think my old eBay IC might be ready to choke. I sure hope not, because I promised my dear wife that no expensive crap will be bought this year since getting MC. Anyways, a little research couldn't hurt though. So, anyone has this particular model or heard anything about it? What do you guys think? Is it worth buying this and saving about $300 over a Polyscience model? It does bug me a bit that they only give me a 6 mth warranty. OTOH, I would not mind supporting a small mom and pop operation if it's a good product.

From their About page:

"Sous Vide Systems is a father and son team out of North Carolina. As a chef in training in several restaurants, I was taught ,and enjoyed ,working with sous vide. I wanted to prepare similar dishes for my wife on my days off, however I could not afford an immersion circulator. Not to be discouraged, I began buying, refurbishing and reselling used units. After several months, I could afford to keep one for my personal use. My co-workers were envious and began to borrow mine when they wanted to prepare special meals at home. I realized that if an affordable, reliable unit was available, anyone who wanted to experiment with sous vide cooking could do so. Through months of thought, design, and trials with my electronics engineer father, we developed the SousVide EZ. - By Chef Daniel Brock."

[nextguy]

Sous Vide Systems IC

As far as I can tell through various searches here, we have not discussed this machine before (sorry if we I missed it). So, I might need a new IC or other rig soonish since I think my old eBay IC might be ready to choke. I sure hope not, because I promised my dear wife that no expensive crap will be bought this year since getting MC. Anyways, a little research couldn't hurt though. So, anyone has this particular model or heard anything about it? What do you guys think? Is it worth buying this and saving about $300 over a Polyscience model? It does bug me a bit that they only give me a 6 mth warranty. OTOH, I would not mind supporting a small mom and pop operation if it's a good product.

I actually mentioned this new device back on page 10 of this thread. I contacted them and did not find their device satisfactory for my needs. In particular it only hold temperature to within 1 degree and no cage is available. There is also no way to switch between C and F which is not a big deal but still a nice convenience. Lastly a 6 month warranty is not long enough for a product like this.

[rotuts]

in terms of ready to go Ive been very happy with the Sous Vide Magic set up.

http://freshmealssolutions.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage-ask.tpl&product_id=39&category_id=15&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=31

you need to get a coleman cooler thats 32 qt for the heating element to fit in the bottom

then can make smaller set-ups using the controller.

Frank, the owner has superb support.

[Kerry Beal]

in terms of ready to go Ive been very happy with the Sous Vide Magic set up.

http://freshmealssolutions.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage-ask.tpl&product_id=39&category_id=15&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=31

you need to get a coleman cooler thats 32 qt for the heating element to fit in the bottom

then can make smaller set-ups using the controller.

Frank, the owner has superb support.

I'm with you on that. I picked mine up from Frank on Wednesday. It heats the water up very quickly and holds temperature beautifully.

Here's a picture -

I'm going to have fun with this one. I'm finally pulling the big things out of the freezer - the eye of round, the whole brisket - all those things that certainly didn't fit in my old set up with the slow cooker.

He was mentioning that his free shipping is world wide.

[rotuts]

that coleman cooler is probably 36 qts. the label fell off. its 17" x 19 1/2 " Inner dimensions.

[PedroG]

Hi Kerry,

when you pull the real big things out of your freezer, you might need a 100-quart cooler, or you can even heat your bath tub with your FMM.

Have fun!

[Kerry Beal]

Hi Kerry,

when you pull the real big things out of your freezer, you might need a 100-quart cooler, or you can even heat your bath tub with your FMM.

Have fun!

Frank had some really great stainless thermal pots in his basement - the biggest was 120 litres and had a spigot on the bottom to empty it. He mentioned that he sells them to restaurants and that the SVM unit is sufficient to heat them. He's modified them so the wiring can be led out and the lid closed on them.

I do like the bathtub idea though!

[PedroG]

Steady state consumption in the bath tub at 55°C was about 1060W, with Frank's 120L SS pot steady state consumption at 85°C (!) was only about 125W according to heating slope and cooling slope data Frank reported. Insulation and prevention of evaporation are the key. Who will report the data with a 100-quart cooler?

[dcarch]

Steady state consumption in the bath tub at 55°C was about 1060W, with Frank's 120L SS pot steady state consumption at 85°C (!) was only about 125W according to heating slope and cooling slope data Frank reported. Insulation and prevention of evaporation are the key. Who will report the data with a 100-quart cooler?

If you do that once-in-a-life-time bathtub long duration sous vide, how about pouring vegetable oil on the water to prevent evaporation?

You can recover all the oil later.

dcarch