Modernist Goulash

pep. · May 8, 2011

Since a large part of my freezer is currently filled with vacuumed beef for making goulash, I've been thinking of doing it with a modernist twist. Caveat: I haven't been able to get Modernist Cuisine yet (I've a standing order for the second printing via amazon.de, but I've got no clue if they will actually get any of the books. Ordering from amazon.com is too expensive because of transatlantic shipping, unfortunately).

Douglas Baldwin has a sous-vide goulash recipe in Sous vide for the home cook, but it's actually quite traditional using 80°C as the braising temperature. I was thinking more along the lines of cooking the meat at 54,5°C for 48 or 72 hours and making the onion sauce (traditional Viennese Saftgulasch contains 80 % onions for every 100 % beef) separately in the pressure cooker. Has anyone tried something like this before?

I would add the fat trimmings to the onions (either as large pieces to remove later or finely diced/ground) to give some substance and beef flavor to sauce. And instead of water, I'd probably add beef stock to compensate for the missing meat.

**Chris Hennes** · May 8, 2011

I haven't tried it, but can think of no reason why it wouldn't work just fine. I say go for it, and report back with the results!

OliverB · May 8, 2011

should work, but why the low and slow approach? I use that for short ribs, but those are eaten as a piece of meat, I have my doubts it would make much of a difference in a goulash. Just take a lot longer. Unless you use short ribs or similar tougher meat, but regular goulash stew meat should be just fine and tender at the higher temp.

I'd also be wondering about the flavors, you're basically creating a meat dish with some onion sauce on the side, you won't get the mix and mingle of flavors that develops when all is cooked in one pot for a long time.

That's not to say this might not be an interesting experiment, could be plated in a "deconstructed goulash" kind of way.

pep. · May 8, 2011

For goulash, you normally use shank meat. Unless I'm completely mistaken, that is one of the toughest cuts available. In restaurants were goulash is a "signature dish" of sorts, the meat cubes are usually quite large. In a typical portion, you get one or two large chunks of beef. At home, most people cut smaller cubes.

As for the plating, yes, I'm thinking in the direction of what you call "deconstructed goulash" in your post. Nothing terribly original, but a small puddle of sauce, the pink, fork-tender meat on top. Maybe a sous-vide egg and a gherkin consommé to make it a deconstructed Fiakergulasch (depending on context, a Fiaker is either a horse carriage or the coachman thereof - here the meaning is obviously the latter). It would be missing some kind of Vienna sausage, but I hate those.

OliverB · May 8, 2011

I would have used "stew meat" but I've never made it myself, my grandmother used to make a wonderful version though. She was from Sudetenland.

I'd say go ahead and try it! All this makes me think of Vienna for some reason, time to go back there, love that town :-)

ETA: I'd love a good goulash recipe, if you have one you could share or link me to! I have some, but have not made any yet, but my boy fell in love with Goulaschsuppe in Germany last year, I'd love to try my hands on it!

Edited May 8, 2011 by OliverB (log)

pep. · May 8, 2011

ETA: I'd love a good goulash recipe, if you have one you could share or link me to! I have some, but have not made any yet, but my boy fell in love with Goulaschsuppe in Germany last year, I'd love to try my hands on it!

A good goulash recipe? I've got a dozen here before me (well, three actual recipes and a bit more than dozen variations). All from Franz Maier-Bruck: Klassische Österreichische Küche:

Saftgulyás (goulash with lots of sauce)
Rindsgulyás (beef goulash)
Ungarisches Gulyás (Hungarian goulash)
Karlsbader Gulyás (goulash in the style of the city of Karlsbad/Karlovy Vary)
Debreziner Gulyás (goulash with a special sausage)
Serbisches Gulyás (Serbian goulash)
Fiakergulyás (coachman's goulash)
Herrengulyás (lords'/masters' goulash)
Andrássy-Gulyás (probably named after the Hungarian count Gyula Andrássy)
Bauerngulyás (peasant's goulash)
Bosnisches Gulyás (Bosnian goulash)
Esterházy-Gulyás (named after the Hungarian noble family Esterházy)
Gulyás auf Fiumer Art (goulash in the style of the city of Fiume/Rijeka)
Kaisergulasch (emperor's goulash)
Károly-Gulyás (Károly is "Carl", but I've got no idea which one it is named for)
Lungenbratengulyás (tenderloin goulash)
Maximiliangulyás (emperor Maximilian's goulash)
Palffy-Gulyás (another noble family)
Gulyás auf Pester Art (in the style of the city of Pest - no part of Budapest)
Gulyás auf Preßburger Art (in the style of the city of Preßburg/Bratislava)
Salongulyás (drawing room goulash)
Serbisches Gulyás (yes, we had that before - slightly different variation)
Gulyás auf Triester Art (in the style of the city of Trieste)
Zelny-Gulyás (Czech variant of Szegediner goulash which is not really related to "real" goulash)
Gulyás auf Znaimer Art (in the style of the city of Znojmo)

The recipe for Saftgulyás from Maier-Bruck's seminal book:

1 kg of sliced beef shank (each slice should weigh 30 to 40 g)
150 g lard
800 g sliced white onions
1 dash of vinegar in 1/16 l of water
40 to 50 g mild paprika
2 crushed cloves of garlic
1 tsp (dried) majoram
1 tsp crushed caraway
salt
optionally 1 Tsp tomato paste

Sauté onions in lard until they are golden/slightly brown. Stir in paprika and deglace immediately with vinegar/water. After a bit of simmering, add the meat, salt, and spices. While stewing, it shouldn't be covered completely. When the sauce is reduced to much, add a little bit of water (not too much, just so that it doesn't burn). This will have to be repeated until the meat is tender and the onions dissolve. At this point, add water to barely cover the meat and continue to simmer for another ten minutes. The sauce should be thick and fatty.

Edited May 8, 2011 by pep. (log)

johnmc · May 8, 2011

Ordering from amazon.com is too expensive because of transatlantic shipping, unfortunately).

I'm in Australia and shipping of the book to me from Amazon.com only cost $10.

John

pep. · May 8, 2011

Ordering from amazon.com is too expensive because of transatlantic shipping, unfortunately).
I'm in Australia and shipping of the book to me from Amazon.com only cost $10.

Yes, you are right. It is much cheaper than I imagined. However, I'd have to pay an additional EUR 12 fee for the postal service handling the customs inspection, as well as 10 % VAT on the combined merchandise and shipping costs. I'm not sure if there are any actual tariffs levied on books, but if there are, those would be on the total sum as well. On the other hand, the Dollar-to-Euro conversion is quite good. Mhm ...

DanM · May 8, 2011

IIRC, goulash is usually cooked low and slow to develop and meld flavors. Pressure cookers are great for increasing the cooking temperature, but at the sacrifice of a low slow cook. In cases like this, I like to "par cook" the stew in the pressure cooker to break down the connective tissue and then release the pressure and then simmer at regular temps until done.

Dan

PedroG · May 9, 2011

When you convert a traditional stew to sous vide, the sauce will lack the taste that comes from searing the meat. A workaround is sacrificing a small portion of the meat to give flavor to the sauce by grinding and searing, the rest of the meat may be cooked sous vide LTLT.

I did this method with Ossobuco sous vide.

**nickrey** · May 9, 2011

I've used a similar process with a number of casseroles and it works just fine. Although for Goulash I tend to prefer low and slow in my Staub enamelled cast iron pot.

As for Pedro's point about searing the meat to give flavour, why not pre-sear the meat before cooking it sous vide to achieve this? I tend to sear my meat and remove it before cooking the onions in the pot and this would mimic it.

With my Goulash, I use essentially the same recipe above with the modification of using equal weights of onions and meat (this proportion came from Austrian in-laws)and stock in place of the water for more flavour. I also use sweet, smoked, paprika in place of "normal" paprika.

I think traditionally it would be served with Spaetzle, but I'm sure pep. can correct me if I'm wrong.

As a non-traditional but tasty variant, serve it with some creme fraiche on top and some parsley sprinkled over.

pep. · May 9, 2011

IIRC, goulash is usually cooked low and slow to develop and meld flavors. Pressure cookers are great for increasing the cooking temperature, but at the sacrifice of a low slow cook. In cases like this, I like to "par cook" the stew in the pressure cooker to break down the connective tissue and then release the pressure and then simmer at regular temps until done.

Not really. Maier-Bruck specifically states that if you use meat other than shank, you should cook the onions first and add the meat later. This would mean that there are two reasons for the long and slow cooking: To tenderize the meat by changing the connective tissue to gelatine, and to dissolve the onions into the sauce. However, popular wisdom has it that goulash gets better as it is reheated. That would seem to indicate a mariage of the flavors improves the endresult. Then again, conventional wisdom also claims that burning the goulash slightly while reheating is also good for the flavor.

When you convert a traditional stew to sous vide, the sauce will lack the taste that comes from searing the meat. A workaround is sacrificing a small portion of the meat to give flavor to the sauce by grinding and searing, the rest of the meat may be cooked sous vide LTLT.
I did this method with Ossobuco sous vide.

Thank you, that was very interesting reading.

With my Goulash, I use essentially the same recipe above with the modification of using equal weights of onions and meat (this proportion came from Austrian in-laws)and stock in place of the water for more flavour. I also use sweet, smoked, paprika in place of "normal" paprika.
I think traditionally it would be served with Spaetzle, but I'm sure pep. can correct me if I'm wrong.
As a non-traditional but tasty variant, serve it with some creme fraiche on top and some parsley sprinkled over.

Yes, the 1:1 ratio for meat and onions is used very often. Maier-Bruck mentions it, but claims that it results in goulash that is slightly too sweet and recommends 1:0,8 as the best ratio. As for side dishes, the most basic one is white bread/rolls (Kaisersemmeln). Semmelknödel (bread dumplings) are also very common nowadays. But you can really eat anything starchy with goulash. With the Semmelknödel, you get Bauerngulasch, with Polenta it becomes Triester Gulasch. Real Spätzle come from the western regions of Austria and Germany so they are not a traditional side for goulash. However Haluška (Czech)/Galuska (Hungarian) may look similar to the uninitiated. Spätzle are made from a very liquid dough, through kind of sieve. The dough for Haluška is much firmer, more like pasta dough, and the individual pieces are torn off/formed by hand.

OliverB · May 9, 2011

wow, that's a lot of different recipes! I have to check that book out, the last one listed from Znaim would be especially interesting as that's where my mom is from (close to Znaim and her grandmother lived in Znaim if I recall correctly)

Thanks for the recipe too, I'm gonna have to make that soon. Noboy in my family except me likes bell peppers and some goulash has them in it, nice to see a recipe without.

Thanks again, off to Amazon to look at that book.

zemvpferreira · May 11, 2011

When you convert a traditional stew to sous vide, the sauce will lack the taste that comes from searing the meat. A workaround is sacrificing a small portion of the meat to give flavor to the sauce by grinding and searing, the rest of the meat may be cooked sous vide LTLT.
I did this method with Ossobuco sous vide

I have a different method: When I debag the meat, I empty the bag juices and scrape whatever clumps of protein are left into a bowl. I then microwave it on high until all the protein coagulates together. I strain the coagulated protein into the pan I'll build the sauce in and carefully sear it untill it all goes from grey goo to lovely maillardized protein.

It's a bit fidgety because you run the risk of charring the whole thing if you're not super cautious, but the results are impeccable. Plus, no waste.

MartinH · May 11, 2011

Another way would be to make the goulash broth first (maybe using some meat trimmings browned) and then add some of the broth to your sous vide bag.

I had absolutely no idea there were so many named variations on goulash!

pep. · May 12, 2011

Update: Yesterday, I put the shank into the waterbath at 55°C. At first I thought that I would be late as always (planning ahead for a meal is fine, actually doing it is another thing altogether , but the meal has been postponed to Sunday, so I should get 72 hours for the meat. Since I thought I was late, I put it in at 1 am, so I forsook trimming the fat and resealing and just used the frozen packages I made earlier.

This of course means that I had to buy another 500 g of "goulash meat" (not shank this time, it's non-specific junks of meat sold for stew) to use in the broth. I'll prepare everything according to the normal recipe, except that the meat is ground. Then I'll pressure cook the broth for one hour. I'll probably filter the solids out with a sieve or my passe-vite.

Addendum: My traditional goulash recipes do not include browning the meat, so I won't do that either.

Edited May 12, 2011 by pep. (log)

heidih · May 12, 2011

I had absolutely no idea there were so many named variations on goulash!

I think it is akin to beef stew with the paprika being a common denominator. Every region and then every family has its variation. Like a traditional beef stew in most parts of the world we used the cheaper , less tender, cuts of meat. More usually it was a cut up chicken.

pep. · May 14, 2011

I cooked the goulash broth on Thursday:

1.3 kg thinly sliced onions
550 g freshly ground beef
200 g lard
50 g paprika
4 small pressed cloves of garlic
1 tsp. majoram
1 tsp. crushed caraway
120 ml water mixed with approx. 10 ml of vinegar
500 ml water

I put the pressure cooker onto high heat and browned the onions in the lard. According to the traditional recipes, they should become yellow-golden (not too light), but not brown. Oh, and you should stir constantly. At this point I was sure that my humble 4.5 l pressure cooker would be too small for the amount of ingredients, but it worked out in the end. Barely. I certainly should get one of the bigger beasts.

Anyway, of course I got bored by stirring, so I set a kitchen timer to 4 minutes and went away to do something else. As can be expected, the onions on the bottom where far more browned than they should have been (but not yet burned). I decided that this was enough color and Maillard. I stirred in the paprika and immediately deglazed using the watered vinegar. Then I added the other spices (garlic, majoram, caraway, a small bit of black pepper, some salt) and the meat. I stirred everything and put the lid on the pot.

I waited until the second ring (high pressure, approximately 13 psi) was visible and turned down the heat. I let broth cook at high pressure for an hour. Then I turned off the heat and let it cool down for a few minutes. However, I got impatient and used the cold water in the sink method to relieve the pressure.

When I opened the pot, I was surprised that the overall volume seemed to have increased! The color was perfect and with some additional salt, the taste was great, too. Not all the onions had dissolved and of course there still was the ground meat in the broth. Of course, I could have kept it that way, but the texture of the ground meat is completely wrong for goulash. So ladled the stuff into my passe-vite and pureed it with the 1 mm disc. The left-over meat had the look and texture of used coffee grounds, every bit of moisture was pressed out into the broth.

As I misread a label in the supermarket (and clearly wasn't thinking straight), I bought 4 bags of onions at 1 kg each. While slicing, I was halfway into the second bag before I noticed :wink: What should I do with 2.8 kg onions? Make another batch of goulash broth, of course. This time I'd like to make the following adjustments:

beef 100 %
onions 200 %
lard/butter fat (I haven't got any lard left): 30 %
paprika 8 %
cayenne pepper 2 %
water 20 % + 2 % vinegar
water 100 %

I'll measure the spices when I do the second batch. I'd like to add some alcohol as well, as per the MC stock recipes. However, I haven't got the books so I wouldn't know how much the recipes in there recommend.

Greetings,

Peter

PS: I have some photos from the first batch, I but there is something wrong with my account and I can't upload them at the moment.

Edited May 14, 2011 by pep. (log)

pep. · May 14, 2011

As I misread a label in the supermarket (and clearly wasn't thinking straight), I bought 4 bags of onions at 1 kg each. While slicing, I was halfway into the second bag before I noticed What should I do with 2.8 kg onions? Make another batch of goulash broth, of course. This time I'd like to make the following adjustments:
beef 100 %
onions 200 %
lard/butter fat (I haven't got any lard left): 30 %
paprika 8 %
cayenne pepper 2 %
water 20 % + 2 % vinegar
water 100 %
I'll measure the spices when I do the second batch. I'd like to add some alcohol as well, as per the MC stock recipes. However, I haven't got the books so I wouldn't know how much the recipes in there recommend.

OK, I'll have to postpone the second batch until tomorrow, it's too late today. After actually eating a dish with the first batch of broth (instead of just tasting it), I've come to the conclusion that it is too diluted. I will have to reduce the first batch a bit, and for tomorrow's version I'll leave out the additional 100 % water. The onions should provide enough liquid in the pressure cooker.

**nickrey** · May 14, 2011

Hi Peter. Just wondering why after the discussion of ratios above you chose to scale the onions to 200% in the recipe rather than the 100% I use or the 80% you referred to?

Edited May 14, 2011 by nickrey (log)

pep. · May 14, 2011

Hi Peter. Just wondering why after the discussion of ratios above you chose to scale the onions to 200% in the recipe rather than the 100% I use or the 80% you referred to?

Because that's extra (ground) meat just for the broth. The 100 % meat/80 % onions ratio is for the traditional method of simmering the onions with the chunky meat on top. I will add the extra juice from the sous-vide bag when serving the goulash, so the total meat/onion ratio will be more like 100 %/66.6 %. I'm counting that the flavor extraction from the ground meat will be greater than in the traditional method.

**nickrey** · May 14, 2011

Thanks. That makes it clear.

pep. · May 15, 2011

Here are the promised pictures from batch 1 (strangely, I couldn't upload any photos yesterday):

The bagged shank waiting for the water bath.

Mise en place I: onions, lard, paprika ...

Mise en place II: ... garlic and spices.

Soon to be ground meat (miscellaneous stewing cuts).

My somewhat ancient grinder ("inherited" because my mother didn't actually use it anymore).

After grinding with the coarse plate.

Melting the lard before roasting the onions.

Still white ...

Onions deglazed and paprika added.

Here everything has already been included (meat, spices etc.) – the next step was pressure cooking for an hour.

This is what the broth looked like after relieving pressure using the "in the sink" method. Nice layer of fat on top!

On the left, the strained broth. The meat residue on the right looked a bit like used coffee grounds (unfortunately, you can't see how dry it was on the picture).

The passe-vite waiting for cleanup (the jars held the lard, also to be cleaned).

pep. · May 27, 2011

I just noticed that I didn't report back on my second batch. First off: it was big improvement on the first one, but not a complete success (at least not in the way I intended).

Here's the recipe I used:

Freshly ground beef: 100 %
Cubed onions: 200 %
Butter: 23,5 %
Bacon fat/rind: 6,5 %
Paprika (sweet): 8 %
Cayenne pepper: 2 %
Water: 50 %
Vinegar: 3 %
Garlic: 5 %
Majoram: 0,75 %
Caraway: 1 %
Vodka: 2 % (may have been 4 %, I apparently didn't write it down)
Salt: to taste

I wanted to add an additional 5 % tomate paste, but I forgot to do that. The overall yield wis 812 g ground beef as the baseline was a bit under 2,5 liters, or around 290 %. The sauce was very thick after putting it through the passe-vite (lots of tiny pieces of meat). In the traditional recipe, the broth is less viscous. Next time, I will pass it through a superbag to filter out the broken meat fibers.

The taste was very good. However, the whole mixture was very thick even before cooking (obviously) and barely fit into my pressure cooker. This resulted in scorched bottom. For goulash, this is OK as it adds a bit of smoky flavor and traditionally, slight scorching is considered good. However, it made cleaning the pan more time consuming and was not what I intended. I think I'd need to add an additional 50 % of water to prevent that next time.

The preparation itself was almost the same as last time: I roasted the onions (a but darker this time) in the fat, added the paprika and cayenne and immediately deglazed with the water/vinegar mixture. Then I added the rest of the (finely ground) spices and the meat and stirred. Just before closing the pressure cooker, I stirred in the vodka. I let the whole thing cook for one hour on high pressure, followed by natural depressurization. The resulting mass was almost solid and I pressed out the moisture with the passe-vite.

My guests really liked the different texture of the meat (much more tender than usual, intense meaty flavor (not cooked away as with traditional braising), pink color. Shank slices cooked 72 hours at 55°C. Pictures will follow in a seperate post.