Jump to content
  • Welcome to the eG Forums, a service of the eGullet Society for Culinary Arts & Letters. The Society is a 501(c)3 not-for-profit organization dedicated to the advancement of the culinary arts. These advertising-free forums are provided free of charge through donations from Society members. Anyone may read the forums, but to post you must create an account.

Recommended Posts

Looks good Bionut did you add spores or let natural ones take? How is the soy going now? Mine is still sunning away it seems to be getting darker, not sure will have to take a picture and compare to the one from awhile ago as I look at it daily. The sludge in mine is still fermenting slowly. Wish you luck and look forward to how it turns out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I did not added spores. My cookies aren't in brine yet, i had to dry them before that. I think that today i will make some brine and add the soy cookies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello and greetings from Indonesia,

Thank Goodness i found this forum.

I'm interested in making my own soy sauce, just buy some soy beans and still soak them for overnight before cook'em. As tropical country, sun and humidity is ideal to make soy sauce. Here we have our unique soy sauce called "Kecap" (just like ketchup pronounciation). There are two varieties, Sweet (Kecap Manis) and Salty (Kecap asin), basicly use black soy bean, palm sugar, garlic, cinnamon, star anniseed, etc. But unfortunately i don't have any relative who related with traditional kecap factory. i let you know when i get some information.

 

A lot of traditional kecap factory closed because of no more market, no next generation owner (commonly they are family business), losing market to modern huge factory, or lack of ingredient supplies.

I wish i can taste my own soy sauce later, and preserving cultural heritage? :raz:

 

I will update my progress. Wish me luck.

 

Thanks.

Daniel Kurniadi

Smokie Nduty Artisan Charcuterie

www.facebook.com/SmokieNduty


Edited by danielkurniadi (log)
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Daniel and welcome!  I can't wait to hear more about your soy sauce!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Welcome, Daniel.

If you can, please post pictures of your progress. I find it all fascinating.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My soy cake on 3rd day. i think Indonesia has the right climate / humidity for growing mold :raz: white powder is all purposed wheat flour, to prevent soycake stick on the bamboo.

OMChg89.jpg

 

Got error in first trial, it supposed to steam / cook first then blend, but i accidentaly blend first, then after half way, i realized that i haven't cook it yet. LOL. i boiled it, and have an extra pot of soy milk :laugh:

 

well, i'll soak some soy again tonight, making new one, with the right method.


Edited by danielkurniadi (log)
  • Like 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

After 5 days, my soy cake turns dry and hard, and the fungus looks terrible, more black fungus than the white one. am i failed? or the fungus dead? suggestion please?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Second batch, 3rd day.

the black mold still dominant, and white mold only seen on the top of the soy cake.

b6GNqVq.jpg?1

SDYbDRR.jpg?1

 

i sprayed  directly with water sprayer to keep them moist. top it with some newspaper to make  dark environment.

 

PS: the black mold maybe Mucor racemosus Fresenius, which involved in Tou Shi fermentation in Sechuan.


Edited by danielkurniadi (log)
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow, so EIGHT years after first posting on this thread, I finally decided to take the leap and make my own soy sauce. I used a mixture of organic whole wheat flour and white flour.  Combined with the really warm weather around here the mold has taken hold very quickly despite being only two or three days. Little bits of black, yellow and green mold, but mostly white mold, both the fluffy and spotty kind.  It already is very aromatic, very hard to describe...kind of bready and kind of "meaty". I guess all the baking and fermenting in my house has made it teeming with awesome cultures. I'll take a picture of the molded loaf slices after in a few days.  

 

After much research I've decided on a brine concentration of 18%. I think I will skip the drying process and just put the bean loaves directly into the brine


Edited by takadi (log)
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow, so EIGHT years after first posting on this thread, I finally decided to take the leap and make my own soy sauce. I used a mixture of organic whole wheat flour and white flour.  Combined with the really warm weather around here the mold has taken hold very quickly despite being only two or three days. Little bits of black, yellow and green mold, but mostly white mold, both the fluffy and spotty kind.  It already is very aromatic, very hard to describe...kind of bready and kind of "meaty". I guess all the baking and fermenting in my house has made it teeming with awesome cultures. I'll take a picture of the molded loaf slices after in a few days.  

 

After much research I've decided on a brine concentration of 18%. I think I will skip the drying process and just put the bean loaves directly into the brine

Hello Takadi, nice to meet you. My question to you: is the black mold really safe? Not poisonous?

My soycake contain white and black mold only. I'll take a picture soon :)

 

Soycakes day 5:

 

51zqN7a.jpg?1

 

Even mold grows on the back of bamboo tray :laugh:

 

GiEEIKZ.jpg?1

 

Are those soy cakes ready to put in brine? or need more days?

Thanks, Takadi.


Edited by danielkurniadi (log)
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

UPDATE:

 

Rest in peace soycake number 2. The wold is successful but i found a lot of maggots.  :shock: Discard right away! *sigh*

I suspect small flies around the bamboo tray.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh no!  Dang.  

 

Will you try again?  Hopefully takadi will come back and be able to answer your mold questions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Dan, I can not speak about mold species from an educated position. Other than brine strength I am taking a completely unscientific "artisan" approach to this. From what I've read, the goal is to destroy the microbes with the salt but not the enzymes that act on the proteins and sugars of the wheat and soy. So in theory the "bad" microbes that produce toxins will not survive past a certain brine percentage.

 

From the many many blogs I've scoured on the internet where people are taking on this home-made soy sauce venture, almost all of them have bits of black mold here and there but none of them have the black mold dominating. There are black colored koji molds but I am unsure if the ones in your culture are of the koji strain. Most koji i've seen is white or yellowish. I suspect maybe your molding environment is too moist, which is also probably why there were maggots. I simply covered my soy loaves with a single layer of wetted paper towels, one or two layers of newspaper, and some single sheets of cling wrap scattered on top. 


Edited by takadi (log)
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Shelby: yes i am! still soaking 1/2 Kg of soya bean again :biggrin:

 

Takadi: i think so, the weather now is quite hot and humid here in Indonesia. and i think maggots comes from fly eggs which laid down on the soy cake, maybe next time i'll put some "barrier" to prevent flies coming.

 

I have an idea using Korean method, which mean make "Meju". From pure soya bean, no other rice or grain like Chinese or Japanese method.

I watched on Youtube, here:

looks easier hehehe..

 

Thanks for your reply.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Here are my molded loaves! I couldn't wait any longer...I think they are ready for the brine don't you?

 

IMG_0868.JPG

 

IMG_0877.JPG

 

 

I think I finally know what that "meaty" smell is. It smells like natto and a little like blue cheese and tempeh. There's also a yeasty smell I recognize from making rice wine. Lots of funky stuff going on.

 

As was in Sambucken's case, you could definitely feel a heat emmanating off of it

 

I think I will be continuing to use sight and smell as my main metrics for this experiment.  To me a "fishy" smell or rotten/unpleasant smell will be a sign of failure as well as any sort of weird pest or microbial infestation. That will mean to me that the brine strength was too weak and/or the wrong microbial strains have taken hold.

 

Fortunately I will be the only test guinea pig in the taste tests so my friends and family can rest easy


Edited by takadi (log)
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the link Takadi.

My mom just told me about her childhood experience, my great grandmother made her own taucho (indonesian taushi?) Using ungrounded soy bean, steamed, combine with rice flour (not wheat, wheat doesn't grow in indonesia), add tempe yeast, and fermented in a ceramic jar. And she said that the mold should be white and yellowish. And now i persuade her to make an experiment on her own hahaha. She bought tempe, slice it thinly, put in an airy place, then when moldy she dried it under direct sunlight on a baking tray. I'll post the photo later :)


Edited by danielkurniadi (log)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Experiment number three: Meju Making.

 

500gr of dry soy beans.

 

 

Steamed for 2,5 hours!

 

dnKtWos.jpg?1

 

Mashed and put into a bowl, then pressed with hands. make air pocket as little as possible

9fXgJmc.jpg?1

 

Cheese anyone?

YEu2U12.jpg?1:raz:

 

OK, tomorrow must find a good plan to avoid flies.

 

Problem solved! :laugh:

 

opQhKuG.jpg?1

 

See you tomorrow! ^_^


Edited by danielkurniadi (log)
  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello again, this is 3rd batch experiments. changed the cover with a better one.

i just exposed the meju directly to the sun and moon for 3 days :biggrin:

 

7AZTtUb.jpg?1

CRo1bSX.jpg?1

 

and i realized it still wet inside but dry outside, and mold starting to grow. same white and black mold. but i hope this time without maggots :raz:

 

OK, will report more in few days.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

more update:

 

i dry the meju in direct sunlight at noon, and move it to dark and warm room at night, the result is good, when i move them in the morning, heat generated under the basket, feel warm.

 

black, white, and pinkish / orange mold. no maggots :raz: .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh god I think I made a mistake. I forgot to account for the weight of the actual soybeans and flour when calculating the salt percentage. 18 percent is supposed to be the *final* salt percentage of the soy sauce, not the initial brine. The soy sauce doesn't smell terrible but it's starting to form a pellicle on top which isn't a good sign.  I'll start over but I'll add more salt to this batch and let it continue to ferment in another batch to see where it goes. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am in! I have read and reread  … I have 2 Korean friends who  make soy sauce and miso but they buy the pre made cakes at the market ..when I mentioned that i was going to try to make the cakes I got an automatic revulsion over it and they directed me again to the market 

 

so I am going to read research and follow you folks …along  with the advice of my friends who fight over how they do it anyway iso this should be fun and they both make incredible sauce and miso ..

 

when I get a break and feel confident I am going to  make one with the home made cakes I will make one with the store bought cakes as well and see how different this is 

 

I absolutely ADORE home made Korean chunky dark miso it is the best thing I have ever eaten miso wise and I have so much trouble finding it that if takes making my own soy sauce to get it ? that is what I am doing 

 

please add any and all info you may think interesting because even if not posting ..many of us will be reading for sure 

thanks so much! I hope to reciprocate someday when I get to making it 

 

I live in the Puget Sound grow lights and a fan if we do not have another summer like we just had! 


Edited by hummingbirdkiss (log)
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Similar Content

    • By liuzhou
      Note: This follows on from the Munching with the Miao topic.
       
      The three-hour journey north from Miao territory ended up taking four, as the driver missed a turning and we had to drive on to the next exit and go back. But our hosts waited for us at the expressway exit and lead us up a winding road to our destination - Buyang 10,000 mu tea plantation (布央万亩茶园 bù yāng wàn mǔ chá yuán) The 'mu' is  a Chinese measurement of area equal to 0.07 of a hectare, but the 10,000 figure is just another Chinese way of saying "very large".
       
      We were in Sanjiang Dong Autonomous County, where 57% of the inhabitants are Dong.
       
      The Dong people (also known as the Kam) are noted for their tea, love of glutinous rice and their carpentry and architecture. And their hospitality. They tend to live at the foot of mountains, unlike the Miao who live in the mid-levels.
       
      By the time we arrived, it was lunch time, but first we had to have a sip of the local tea. This lady did the preparation duty.
       

       

       
      This was what we call black tea, but the Chinese more sensibly call 'red tea'. There is something special about drinking tea when you can see the bush it grew on just outside the window!
       
      Then into lunch:
       

       

      Chicken Soup
       

      The ubiquitous Egg and Tomato
       

      Dried fish with soy beans and chilli peppers. Delicious.
       

      Stir fried lotus root
       

      Daikon Radish
       

      Rice Paddy Fish Deep Fried in Camellia Oil - wonderful with a smoky flavour, but they are not smoked.
       

      Out of Focus Corn and mixed vegetable
       

      Fried Beans
       

      Steamed Pumpkin
       

      Chicken
       

      Beef with Bitter Melon
       

      Glutinous (Sticky) Rice
       

      Oranges
       

      The juiciest pomelo ever. The area is known  for the quality of its pomelos.
       
      AFter lunch we headed out to explore the tea plantation.
       

       

       

       

       
      Interspersed with the tea plants are these camellia trees, the seeds of which are used to make the Dong people's preferred cooking oil.
       

       
      As we climbed the terraces we could hear singing and then came across this group of women. They are the tea pickers. It isn't tea picking time, but they came out in their traditional costumes to welcome us with their call and response music. They do often sing when picking. They were clearly enjoying themselves.
       

       
      And here they are:
       
       
      After our seranade we headed off again, this time to the east and the most memorable meal of the trip. Coming soon.
       
       
    • By liuzhou
      Last week, Liuzhou government invited a number of diplomats from Laos, Malaysia, Indonesia, Myanmar/Burma, Poland, and Germany to visit the city and prefecture. They also invited me along. We spent Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday introducing the diplomats to the culture of the local ethnic groups and especially to their food culture.
       
      First off, we headed two hours north into the mountains of Rongshui Miao Autonomous County. The Miao people (苗族 miáo zú), who include the the Hmong, live in the mid-levels of mountains and are predominantly subsistence farmers. Our first port of call was the county town, also Rongshui (融水 róng shuǐ, literal meaning: Melt Water) where we were to have lunch. But before lunch we had to go meet some people and see their local crafts. These are people I know well from my frequent work trips to the area, but for the diplomats, it was all new.
       
      So, I had to wait for lunch, and I see no reason why you shouldn't either. Here are some of the people I live and work with.


       
      This lovely young woman is wearing the traditional costume of an unmarried girl. Many young women wear this every day, but most only on festive occasions.
       
      Her hat is made from silver (and is very heavy). Here is a closer look.
       

       
      Married women dispense with those gladrags and go for this look:
       

       
      As you can see she is weaving bamboo into a lantern cover.
       
      The men tend to go for this look, although I'm not sure that the Bluetooth earpiece for his cellphone is strictly traditional.
       

       
      The children don't get spared either
       

       
      This little girl is posing with the Malaysian Consul-General.
       
      After meeting these people we went on to visit a 芦笙 (lú shēng) workshop. The lusheng is a reed wind instrument and an important element in the Miao, Dong and Yao peoples' cultures.
       

       

       
      Then at last we headed to the restaurant, but as is their custom, in homes and restaurants, guests are barred from entering until they go through the ritual of the welcoming cup of home-brewed rice wine.
       


      The consular staff from Myanmar/Burma and Malaysia "unlock" the door.
       
      Then you have the ritual hand washing part.
       

       
      Having attended to your personal hygiene, but before  entering the dining room, there is one more ritual to go through. You arrive here and sit around this fire and wok full of some mysterious liquid on the boil.
       

       
      On a nearby table is this
       

       
      Puffed rice, soy beans, peanuts and scallion. These are ladled into bowls.
       

       
      with a little salt, and then drowned in the "tea" brewing in the wok.
       
      This is  油茶 (yóu chá) or Oil Yea. The tea is made from Tea Seed Oil which is made from the seeds of the camellia bush. This dish is used as a welcoming offering to guests in homes and restaurants. Proper etiquette suggests that three cups is a minimum, but they will keep refilling your cup until you stop drinking. First time I had it I really didn't like it, but I persevered and now look forward to it.
       

      L-R: Director of the Foreign Affairs Dept of Liuzhou government, consuls-general of Malaysia, Myanmar, Laos.
       
      Having partaken of the oil tea, finally we are allowed to enter the dining room, where two tables have been laid out for our use.
       

       
      Let the eating, finally, begin.
       
      In no particular order:
       

      Steamed corn, taro and sweet potato
       

      Bamboo Shoots
       

      Duck
       

      Banana leaf stuffed with sticky rice and mixed vegetables and steamed.
       

      Egg pancake with unidentified greenery
       

      Stir fried pork and beans
       

      Stir fried Chinese banana (Ensete lasiocarpum)
       

      Pig Ears
       

      This may not look like much, but was the star of the trip. Rice paddy fish, deep fried in camellia tree seed oil with wild mountain herbs.
      We ate this at every meal, cooked with slight variations, but never tired of it.
       

      Stir fried Greens
       
      Our meal was accompanied by the wait staff singing to us and serving home-made rice wine (sweetish and made from the local sticky rice).
       
       
       
       
      Everything we ate was grown or reared within half a kilometre of the restaurant and was all free-range, organic. And utterly delicious.
       
      Roll on dinner time.
       
      On the trip I was designated the unofficial official photographer and ended up taking 1227 photographs. I just got back last night and was busy today, so I will try to post the rest of the first day (and dinner) as soon as I can.
    • By liuzhou
      These have been mentioned a couple of times recently on different threads and I felt they deserved one of their own. After all, they did keep me alive when I lived in Xi'an.
       
      Rou jia mo (ròu jiá mò; literally "Meat Sandwich") are Chinese sandwiches which originated in Shaanxi Province, but can be found all over China. Away from their point of origin, they tend to be made with long stewed pork belly. However in Xi'an (capital of Shaanxi), there is a large Muslim population so the meat of choice is more usually beef. In nearby Gansu Province, lamb or mutton is more likely.
       
      When I was living in Xi'an in 1996-1997, I lived on these. I was living on campus in North-West University (西北大学) and right outside the school gate was a street lined with cheap food joints, most of which would serve you one. I had one favourite place which I still head to when I visit. First thing I do when I get off the train.
       
      What I eat is Cumin Beef Jia Mo (孜然牛肉夹馍 zī rán niú ròu jiá mò). The beef is stir fried or BBQd with cumin and mild green peppers. It is also given a bit of a kick with red chill flakes.
       
      Here is a recipe wrested from the owner of my Xi'an favourite. So simple, yet so delicious.
       

      Lean Beef
       
      Fairly lean beef is cut into slivers
       

      Chopped Beef (sorry about the picture quality - I don't know what happened)
       

      Chopped garlic
       
      I use this single clove garlic from Sichuan, but regular garlic does just fine.
       
      The beef and garlic are mixed in a bowl and generously sprinkled with ground cumin. This is then moistened with a little light soy sauce. You don't want to flood it. Set aside for as long as you can.
       

      Mild Green Chilli Pepper
       
      Take one or two mild green peppers and crush with the back of a knife, then slice roughly. You could de-seed if you prefer. I don't bother.
       

      Chopped Green Pepper
       
      Fire up the wok, add oil (I use rice bran oil) and stir fry the meat mixture until the meat is just done. 
       

      Frying Tonight
       
      Then add the green peppers and fry until they are as you prefer them. I tend to like them still with a bit of crunch, so slightly under-cook them
       

      In with the peppers
       
      You will, of course, have prepared the bread. The sandwiches are made with a type of flat bread known as 白吉饼 (bái jí bǐng; literally "white lucky cake-shape"). The ones here are store bought but I often make them. Recipe below.
       

      Bai Ji Bing
       
      Take one and split it. Test the seasoning of the filling, adding salt if necessary. It may not need it because of the soy sauce. 
       

      Nearly there
       
      Cover to make a sandwich  and enjoy. You will see that I have used a bunch of kitchen paper to hold the sandwich and to soak up any escaping juices. But it should be fairly dry.
       

      The final product.
       
      Note: I usually cook the meat and pepper in batches. Enough for one sandwich per person at a time. If we need another (and we usually do) I start the next batch. 
       
       
      Bread Recipe
       
       
      350g plain flour
      140ml water
      1/2 teaspoon instant yeast

      Mix the yeast with the flour and stir in the water. Continue stirring until a dough forms. Knead until smooth. Cover with a damp towel or plastic wrap and leave to rise by about one third. (maybe 30-40 minutes).
       
      Knead again to remove any air then roll the dough into a log shape around 5cm in diameter, then cut into six portions. Press these into a circle shape using a rolling pin. You want to end up with 1.5cm thick buns. 
       
      Preheat oven to 190C/370F.
       
      Dry fry the buns in a skillet until they take on some colour about a minute or less on each side, then finish in the oven for ten minutes. Allow to cool before using.
    • By Chris Hennes
      I just got a copy of Grace Young's "Stir-Frying to the Sky's Edge"—I enjoyed cooking from "Breath of a Wok" and wanted to continue on that path. Does anyone else have this book? Have you cooked anything from it?

      Here was dinner tonight:

      Spicy Dry-Fried Beef (p. 70)

      I undercooked the beef just a bit due to a waning propane supply (I use an outdoor propane-powered wok burner), but there's nothing to complain about here. It's a relatively mild dish that lets the flavors of the ingredients (and the wok) speak. Overall I liked it, at will probably make it again (hopefully with a full tank of gas).


    • By liuzhou
      We are all used to unami now. Maybe it's time to consider gan. Particularly found in teas, but also in other foods. An interesting article from a great magazine.
       
      Going, going gan
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×