Expensive Sushi with Cheap Chopsticks?

[Daniel]

Despite the fact that it seems to be the norm, I still cant get over it.. How do these highend Japanese Restaurants get away with using these take out fast food chopsticks..

Tonight is a perfect example.. I am sitting at dinner, with Villeroy & Boch plates, gorgeous sake carafes and cups.. My omakase arrives, filled with beautiful fish just flown in from Japan, as boasted by the expensive to print menu.. Everything is so well thought out,so ornate, so lush.. But when it comes time to eat, you are handed these dinkey little splinters of wood.. How can the restaurant use a 30 dollar V&B little plate, but wont go passed three cents on the chopsticks?

I have heard every excuse from sanitary issues on... The bottom line is, even if the restaurant were to spend 25 cents per set of chopsticks and hand them out as momentos, it could be worked into the diners cost and no one would flinch.

Can someone explain this to me?

Edited November 19, 2005 by Daniel (log)

[WHT]

I do what people in Japan have done for generations, I have a personal pair.

[JasonTrue]

I don't think any excuse is required... I've almost never seen fancy chopsticks offered in a restaurant in Japan.

There's a long-established taboo in Japan about touching something that belongs to someone else. It explains quite a lot of things, from furoshiki wrapping of bento and gifts, to packaging, to ritual department store behavior.

Over time, waribashi are probably more expensive than reusable chopsticks because they are a consumable, rather than smallware. I don't think this is a question of cost, it's a question of cultural convention.

Usually even if I go to someone's home and they use lacquerware chopsticks for their family members, they will probably use waribashi for their guests. My friends can't imagine using their mother's, father's, or brother's chopsticks regardless of how clean they might appear.

If you were handed a pair of lacquered chopsticks in Japan, and they didn't belong to you, you'd be a bit surprised (and the cheap ones are more than 25 cents a piece). Plastic or metal are not really common in Japan, and Chinese-style untreated wood chopsticks (a la http://www.kwytzakraft.com/) as used in China aren't necessarily considered any higher in value than waribashi by Japanese.

Edited November 19, 2005 by JasonTrue (log)

[SuzySushi]

What Jason said... and the better Japanese restaurants here usually use disposable bamboo chopsticks rather than wood. It's chic in certain Japanese circles to carry a pair of personal chopsticks with you (in a special box or fabric envelope) to be environmentally correct and "save a tree."

[Daniel]

I don't think any excuse is required... I've almost never seen fancy chopsticks offered in a restaurant in Japan.

There's a long-established taboo in Japan about touching something that belongs to someone else. It explains quite a lot of things, from furoshiki wrapping of bento and gifts, to packaging, to ritual department store behavior.

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How do they handle glasses. Do they re-use drinking cups?

[WolfChef]

Jason your link does not work. At least for me.

[patti]

Jason your link does not work.  At least for me.

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WolfChef, you need to delete the parenthesis at the end of the URL and it should work fine.

[Kent Wang]

Usually even if I go to someone's home and they use lacquerware chopsticks for their family members, they will probably use waribashi for their guests. My friends can't imagine using their mother's, father's, or brother's chopsticks regardless of how clean they might appear.

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Intriguing, no such taboo exists in China. So does every member of the household have different-looking chopsticks so that they don't get mixed up?

Edited November 19, 2005 by Kent Wang (log)

[Daniel]

If you were handed a pair of lacquered chopsticks in Japan, and they didn't belong to you, you'd be a bit surprised (and the cheap ones are more than 25 cents a piece). Plastic or metal are not really common in Japan, and Chinese-style untreated wood chopsticks (a la http://www.kwytzakraft.com/) as used in China aren't necessarily considered any higher in value than waribashi by Japanese.

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I wouldnt be surprised at the price of chopsticks, I import from and manufactor things in China.. And I can tell you that a restaurant could have lackered or plastic chopsticks made very inexpensively.. Even for a normal consumer in New York, one could buy a 2 dozen pack of plastic chopsticks for $1.99..

Edited November 19, 2005 by Daniel (log)

[Susan in FL]

Good question, and good answers! Next time I go to my favorite sushi/Japanese restaurant, I am going to bring my own. I even have a nice looking "case" for them, and didn't know why.

[JasonTrue]

How do they handle glasses.  Do they re-use drinking cups?

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Yes, of course glassware and ceramicware are reused. But if you look for consistency in old taboos, you'll usually be disappointed, since the repeated behavior over several generations is deeply subconscious, and somewhat idiosyncratic unless you grew up in that environment.

For example, few would object to all dishes being washed together, but you'll find children all over Japan who would consider it distasteful if their father's clothing was washed together with their own. This is explained partially by taboos about touching other people's things, and partly by taboos about cleanliness. But if you look for a logical explanation, it won't happen.

Chopsticks also have a substantial role in Shinto ritual and connect people with the world of "kamisama" or gods. The taboos surrounding chopsticks are more tightly bound than with many other items. (If you don't believe me, start licking your chopsticks around an older Japanese person, or in front of anyone, stick your chopsticks into a rice bowl and leave them standing up. Not a good idea.).

If a particular teacup or glass becomes strongly identified with a member of a family, such as 夫婦茶碗 (husband-wife teacup pairs, which are slightly different in size) or the equivalent of "dad's favorite coffee mug," you will find the same kind of resistance to using the cup among family members who are not associated with that cup as you would with chopsticks. More anonymous teaware (such as typical 5-piece sets or restaurant ware) will not likely become subject to the taboo.

Restaurants with a lot of repeat customers may actually establish reserved sake cups to go along with the private bottle of sake or shochu that gets purchased by the bottle at the restaurant and kept behind the counter until the customer next comes in. If this happens, those cups won't likely touch any other customer's lips.

There are, of course, exceptions with the chopsticks behavior as well: namely, some families keep a few pair of lacquered "guest chopsticks". They are used pretty rarely and don't become strongly identified with a family member, but rather broadly with all outsiders to the home. And it is possible to hear an apology at a private home that they have no guest chopsticks other than waribashi.

Typically, the chopsticks in a private home are not only distinct in design but also in size (father's slightly larger than mother's, childrens' are smaller than both).

Real lacquered chopsticks will absolutely not be $1.99 for 6 pieces even at wholesale prices, but plastic or wood can certainly be found at those prices. At wholesale it may be possible to find a set of 5 pair of mass-produced lacquered chopsticks at $3-4, but mass produced lacquerware is a more recent phenomenon than mass-produced waribashi (which originated around 1870).

However, as I explained, I think it would take some serious marketing efforts in Japan to convince people that plastic chopsticks in restaurants are a good idea. Plastic pseudo-lacquered chopstics may work, but Japanese themselves will still find the experience odd, even if it seems upscale to a North American audience. It's simply not a question of cost, and focusing on cost will not produce any clarity.

There are also different grades of waribashi, and you might be able to convince restaurants to choose nicer bamboo waribashi, but I doubt that Japanese restaurants would be able to make the psychological leap to plastic or lacquerware.

Long term, the most likely argument for change is environmental. The aspen wood isn't a sustainable resource, and even lower impact materials like bamboo still cost a lot in terms of shipping and disposal. However, I suspect this will more likely happon on an individual level in Japan, with the "bring your own" phenomenon mentioned above.

Also, a shift in attitudes about what constitutes wastefulness would be necessary. Single-use lacquerware would clearly suffer from the "mottainai" perception, but for some reason waribashi do not suffer from this perception. In fact, the first use of waribashi was actually frugal, as it used up otherwise unusable wood scraps.

Edited November 19, 2005 by JasonTrue (log)

[SuzySushi]

Sanitation is, in fact, another concern.

Plastic chopsticks, like the ones used in Chinese restaurants, are not used in Japan, except for children's chopsticks. They're uncomfortably slippery and, in fact, most Chinese restaurants in Hawaii have a supply of Japanese disposable wood or bamboo chopsticks on hand for customers who request them.

Lacquer chopsticks must be washed by hand; even the "plastic lacquer" ones peel if placed in a dishwasher.

Thus, most Japanese prefer to use disposable wood or bamboo chopsticks in restaurants.

[JasonTrue]

Yes, I'm always irritated by plastic chopstics when I'm in Chinese restaurants because they are too slippery and unwieldy. I remember in Beijing my coworkers were making sport of picking up single fried peanuts out of a small bowl using plastic chopsticks, testing out the foreign visitors, but actually it turned out our Chinese colleagues were more frustrated than us. Even though I can make do, I'd rather have metal chopsticks like in Korea, or even reused bamboo chopsticks, sanitation risks and all.

Lacquerware doesn't like near-boiling water, which makes health department compliance more time consuming, but it isn't insurmountable, because the three sink method works reasonably well. But it just won't happen, for the reasons I've enumerated above.

Anyway, people should be eating sushi with their fingers, not chopsticks.

Sanitation is, in fact, another concern.

Plastic chopsticks, like the ones used in Chinese restaurants, are not used in Japan, except for children's chopsticks. They're uncomfortably slippery and, in fact, most Chinese restaurants in Hawaii have a supply of Japanese disposable wood or bamboo chopsticks on hand for customers who request them. 

Lacquer chopsticks must be washed by hand; even the "plastic lacquer" ones peel if placed in a dishwasher.

Thus, most Japanese prefer to use disposable wood or bamboo chopsticks in restaurants.

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[Daniel]

Thats funny Jason.. I think peanut contests are a rather popular game.. Anyway, I am aware of some of the customs and rules with chopstick use.. Lets get away from traditional places.. Lets take a fusion or Japanese Restaurant that isnt holding to tradition, that is dealing with an American Audience.. Are you going to say there isnt a better chopstick they could provide?

Edited November 19, 2005 by Daniel (log)

[JasonTrue]

If the owner or chef is Japanese, I think that they won't easily be able to escape these taboos. As both Suzy and I suggested, in fancier restaurants, I think they will likely use better waribashi, but waribashi nonetheless.

The ubiquity of chopsticks in U.S. Thai restaurants is a clear example of catering to local market conventions, authenticity be damned; clearly Thai people have no use for chopsticks except occasionally for noodle eating, but American restaurant goers somehow think chopsticks obligatory in all vaguely Asian restaurants.

If you're in an Asian fusion place run by non-Japanese, they may be more willing to entertain alternatives to waribashi. Chinese owners are not likely to be concerned with this taboo, and Koreans might entertain metal chopsticks since most of them can be easily washed.

I don't think, however, that many Japanese restaurateurs in the US would be comfortable making these kinds of leaps, because chopsticks are too tightly tied to religious taboos. Chinese and Korean restaurateurs seem willing to adopt waribashi, but not the other way around. Metal, plastic, and the long, untapered Chinese style wooden kwaitsa don't fit in with a Japanese vibe, among other problems. Lacquer is too personal for a restaurant. The remaining option is waribashi, either the ultra-cheap flat cutouts or the prettier round tapered ones.

The bizarrely non-Japanese sushi that are mostly obligatory in U.S. restaurants (California, spider, spicy tuna, etc.) are market concessions, so certainly some Japanese chefs are willing to dispense with certain preferences in favor of staying open. If faced with some kind of pressure, perhaps some conversion, kicking and screaming, might happen. But "better" is really subjective in such context: culture vs. market. Which matters more?

Thats funny Jason.. I think peanut contests a rather popular game.. Anyway, I am aware of some of the customs and rules with chopstick use..  Lets get away from traditional places.. Lets take a fusion or Japanese Restaurant that isnt holding to tradition, that is dealing with an American Audience..  Are you going to say there isnt a better chopstick they could serve?

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[SuzySushi]

Good, thoughtful responses, Jason. It's sometimes difficult to understand Asian cultural taboos -- and even more difficult to explain them to "outsiders." Many of the ones to do with chopsticks are deeply ingrained.

[torakris]

You know until I read this thread I never gave a thought to the kind of chopsticks I used in a restaurant before....

I actually had to really think about it before I realized that you are right and I don't think I have ever used "real" chopsticks in any Japanese restaurant in or outside of Japan.

In Chinese restaurants in Japan you will often be given the big, slippery plastic ones to use, in cheaper places you will even pick your own from a holder on the table.

Jason has pointed out all the points above and like he said I doubt any restaurants owned by Japanese will change.

When I married my (Japanese) husband the first thing my MIL did was take me to the nearest department store to buy me my own chopsticks, tea cup and rice bowl. She even bought new ones for my husband as well since he was entering a new phase of his life. 10 years later whenever we enjoy a meal at my in-laws house the chopsticks, rice bowl and tea cup are set out for us.

[torakris]

and if they all did switch to "real" chopsticks, then the art of chopstick wrapper origami would fade away.....

[Daniel]

This is all very interesting to learn.. Thank you guys for sharing your experiences..Would anyone be able to direct me to a website where I could buy my own set of chopsticks..

Edited November 20, 2005 by Daniel (log)

[SuzySushi]

This is all very interesting to learn.. Thank you guys for sharing your experiences..Would anyone be able to direct me to a website where I could buy my own set of chopsticks..

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Better than an online site, I'd suggest you shop in person at a Japanese store, such as Katagiri on East 59th Street or Mitsuwa Marketplace in Edgewater NJ (the latter has bus shuttle transportation from Manhattan).

[Susan in FL]

Thats funny Jason.. I think peanut contests are a rather popular game.. Anyway, I am aware of some of the customs and rules with chopstick use..  Lets get away from traditional places.. Lets take a fusion or Japanese Restaurant that isnt holding to tradition, that is dealing with an American Audience..  Are you going to say there isnt a better chopstick they could provide?

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My, you are persistent!

This is all very interesting to learn.. Thank you guys for sharing your experiences..Would anyone be able to direct me to a website where I could buy my own set of chopsticks..

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Do you have any Asian gift shop -type places where you live? I have so many chopsticks and need no more, but when I am browsing in stores that carry chop sticks and "sushi-wear," I just cannot resist and have to purchase.

[BarbaraY]

This is one site that I have in my favorites. Hope it helps.Chopsticks

[Daniel]

Thats funny Jason.. I think peanut contests are a rather popular game.. Anyway, I am aware of some of the customs and rules with chopstick use..  Lets get away from traditional places.. Lets take a fusion or Japanese Restaurant that isnt holding to tradition, that is dealing with an American Audience..  Are you going to say there isnt a better chopstick they could provide?

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My, you are persistent!

I really think its so great that e-gullet allows me to have all my questions answered..

Edited November 20, 2005 by Daniel (log)

[Kent Wang]

If you don't believe me, start licking your chopsticks around an older Japanese person, or in front of anyone, stick your chopsticks into a rice bowl and leave them standing up.

Could you explain the reasoning behind these taboos? We have the latter one in China, and the reasoning is that chopsticks standing in rice is only used for sacrifices to the dead. So leaving your chopsticks in your own rice, or worse, in someone else's rice bowl, implies that they will die.

[JasonTrue]

The funeral association in Shinto practice is the same as you describe. It's used when preparing ritual food sacrifices, presumably to help the dead person eat. Also, I believe due to association with funerals, it's not good to directly pass food from one pair of chopsticks to another.

As for licking one's chopsticks, this is called "namebashi" (舐め箸), and I don't have any detailed reasoning for why it's considered taboo. In Korea, I often saw people rest the tip of their chopsticks in their mouths for a moment just before actually eating, which was slightly surprising to me. In Japan, this is perhaps not a major insult, but it's certainly a minor faux pas.

If I'm a little bit distracted, I forget to point my chopsticks leftward when setting the table, and this is considered inappropriate because it's inconsiderate of the guest, who will likely pick up the chopsticks with his or her right hand. It's not as easy to pick up the chopsticks with the right hand if the top of the chopstick is on the left side, so that's not good.

In Gaku Homma's book, he also referred to a few other generally bad-taste taboos. Sashi bashi (刺し箸) or stabbing foods with chopsticks is bad partially because it's a bit childish. In contrast, though, it is permissable to cut things with chopsticks by repeatedly spreading the tips of chopsticks outward to tear an item apart. The latter is a slightly tricky skill to pick up.

When served a meal with rice, it's considered more delicate to eat a bit of rice between bites of different side dishes. While likely nobody will bat an eye if you neglect this convention, this error is called utsuri-bashi (移り箸).

Crowding your mouth with food without chewing in between is komi-bashi (込み箸). It's also considered bad to simultaneously pick up a bowl and chopsticks with the same hand, or using chopsticks to gesture while talking.

Usually in Japanese homes and in most non-teishoku restaurants, the table will have some shared dishes in addition to individual plates. When I first visit someone's home or an otherwise unfamiliar person, I reverse my chopsticks to pick up items from common plates. It's considered deferential, but it's also a little old-fashioned and perhaps overly formal. 95% of people, regardless of your relationship with them, will quickly insist that such formalities are unnecessary, because "it's just us."

If you don't believe me, start licking your chopsticks around an older Japanese person, or in front of anyone, stick your chopsticks into a rice bowl and leave them standing up.

Could you explain the reasoning behind these taboos? We have the latter one in China, and the reasoning is that chopsticks standing in rice is only used for sacrifices to the dead. So leaving your chopsticks in your own rice, or worse, in someone else's rice bowl, implies that they will die.

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