Lets talk about Pie fillings

[Beanie]

I dug up a picture of an apple pie I did a few years ago. I can post my recipe if anyone wants it. The filling is cooked over the stovetop until the apples are softened, but not cooked all the way through. (Please excuse the ugly fluting job I did on the crust...haha. I hope I've improved a bit in the last few years.)

ETA: I re-worked my apple pie recipe many, many times a few years ago. I don't think I've made an apple pie in the last year...maybe it's time to try to improve on my recipe yet again.

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That looks delicious. Please post your recipe. Thanks!

[Ling]

You know what...I was mistaken. I did make an apple pie a few months ago. I hate peeling apples though, so I don't make apple pie very often anymore.

Filling:

4 Fuji apples

1 large Granny Smith apple

1/2 cup brown sugar

1/2 cup white sugar

2 tbsp. cornstarch

1 and 1/2 tablespoon cinnamon

1/4 tsp. fresh nutmeg

1/4 teaspoon salt

1 tablespoon lemon juice

1 tablespoon vanilla

¼ cup butter (for cooking the apple filling)

1 tablespoon flour (added just before you put the crust on)

Method

Peel the apples, then quarter them. Cut out the core, and then cut each quarter into 4 wedges (so each apple yields 16 wedges). Each wedge should be about ½ inch thick. Put the apple wedges in a large mixing bowl and cover with the remaining ingredients in the filling, except the butter and remaining 1 tbsp flour.

Toss everything to mix, making sure the dry ingredients coat the apple wedges evenly. In a large pan, melt the butter and add the apples. If the apples are firm, cook them on medium heat for approximately 7 minutes, so they are a little bit softened, but still essentially raw. The sugars should have melted with the butter and combined with the cornstarch to make a thick, brown syrupy sauce. (The sauce should be quick thick). If the apples are not very juicy and your sauce becomes as thick as liquid glue, you might have to add 1 or 2 tablespoons of water to the sauce to loosen it.

If the apples were not very firm to begin with (or if you are using apples with a slightly softer texture, like Golden Delicious, then only cook the mixture on medium heat for 5 minutes.)

Scoop the filling into the pie, and sprinkle with the remaining 1 tbsp. of flour before you put the top crust on.

Edited October 1, 2005 by Ling (log)

[Marlene]

Just a friendly reminder to put your recipes into RecipeGullet and post links to them in the threads. Thanks.

[amccomb]

Ok, I've ordered my leaf lard, and bought my apples, and plan on making one of the pre-cooked apple recipes, but I've been thinking about adding a little something extra - maybe pecans and dates? Does anyone have a recipe for something like that?

Any other interesting filling ideas, especially for fall? Maybe a pear (maybe with cardamom, or maple, or walnuts?) or a sweet potato filling? Or an interesting nut filling? Ooo, or my favorite - plums!

Edited October 2, 2005 by amccomb (log)

[Mottmott]

Yesterday I made a rectangular tart with some farmers market apples of varieties I'd never used before. I didn't know how much moisture they'd throw off. I took some of them and precooked them, filling them nearly to the top of the case, then I thinly sliced 4/5 (depends on size of apples) halves and slightly fanned them on top. These halves rise well above the top of the crust, which is quite pretty. And even though they shrink, they still give some dimensionality to the top. There is also the contrast of texture between the bottom apples which were like a thickened sauce and the top apples which were quite firm to the bite. At the end I glazed them with a fruit glaze after taking them from the oven. When I use an apple I know, like a Granny Smith, I find that I can simply dice and season the layer on the bottom without cooking them or using a thickening agent.

I've really come to prefer making (and eating) fruit tarts to pies. My personal preference is threefold. First, it halves the amount of fat I take in with each slice. No small consideration given how much butter I use. And second, I prefer having a greater fruit to crust ratio from a taste point of view. As the bottom crust in pies is too often not worth eating, I take special care with it by sealing it against moisture (a fruit glaze is my preferred method as it adds another flavor) and then I start off the tart on a pizza stone, finishing it on a top shelf. Lastly, I find I can pack a more intense flavor into a tart than a pie. It's as though having the fruit exposed to the heat directly makes the texture better, more baked than steamed. And the top glaze can be a additional flavor element. On this last tart I used quince.

I gotta get me one of them diggi-cams!

[amyknyc]

OK, my pie is finished! I used the extra flaky pie dough recipe and actually made it twice before I was happy with the consistency -- adding the water in the food processor definitely overmixes the dough (my first attempt). I also cooked down the fruit and added cinnimon and ginger. I had a slight problem with fluting, though, mainly that during baking the top slightly seperated from the fluted crust (btw, I found an excellent diagram of how to flute in the CI Baking Illustrated cookbook). I have some photos of the pie and the problem but can't for the life of me figure out how to post them... can someone explain this to me? (I've got them in an album on imagegullet but can't get them on this post). Thanks!

Edited October 3, 2005 by amyknyc (log)

[Patrick S]

I have some photos of the pie and the problem but can't for the life of me figure out how to post them... can someone explain this to me? (I've got them in an album on imagegullet but can't get them on this post). Thanks!

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This thread should answer all of your questions about ImageGullet, but here is the short answer:

First, view the picture in your album. Then click on 'Click for Actual URL. This will display a URL that looks something like:

What you want to do is copy that URL. If the URL is not blue/highlighted, double left-click on it to highlight it. Then rightclick on it, and select 'copy.'

Now you have the URL ready to use. To use it in a post, just add the first image tag, which looks like this:

[img]

Then right click next to the tag and select paste. Now you should have something that looks like this:

[img]http://forums.egullet.org/uploads/1094228968/gallery_18_2_1094281298.jpg

Now, just add the close image tag, so the complete tag looks like this

[img=http://forums.egullet.org/uploads/1094228968/gallery_18_2_1094281298.jpg]

When you post your post, this will display your image.

[amyknyc]

Thanks Patrick! That was the missing step I was looking for. So this first photo is my finished pie. I pre-cooked the apples in butter and sugar and they released a lot of water, so I scooped the apples out and reduced the liquid while adding my spices and about a tablespoon of corn starch. I put it all in the shell, put the top on, fluted the edges, cut some slits and put it in the freezer overnight. I pulled it out yesterday, egg washed the top, sprinkled on some sugar and baked it on the lower rack on top of a baking sheet for probably an hour and a half total. About a half hour in, my edges were pretty golden, so I covered them with some tin foil, which worked well. Anyways, here it it:

And here's the problem I encountered where some of the filling broke through the curst and pulled it away from the edge:

It's not a huge problem, but I'm not sure why this happened. I used a larger pyrex so I wonder if my crust was too thin. We're not eating it until tonight, so I have no idea what it tastes like...

BTW, I loved the result of baking in a glass pyrex to be able to see the bottom of the crust. Also, for the first time ever, my pie top didn't puff up and then collapse on top of the fruit -- I'm assuming this is because the apples were pre-cooked. One thing I did find out is that I'm really bad at rolling dough on top of a rolling pin and then putting it in a pie dish. Instead, I rolled it out on parchment paper, flipped it upside down into the dish and peeled off the paper. This worked really well for both the bottom and the top.

[Mottmott]

OK, my pie is finished! I used the extra flaky pie dough recipe and actually made it twice before I was happy with the consistency -- adding the water in the food processor definitely overmixes the dough (my first attempt). I also cooked down the fruit and added cinnimon and ginger. I had a slight problem with fluting, though, mainly that during baking the top slightly seperated from the fluted crust (btw, I found an excellent diagram of how to flute in the CI Baking Illustrated cookbook). I have some photos of the pie and the problem but can't for the life of me figure out how to post them... can someone explain this to me? (I've got them in an album on imagegullet but can't get them on this post). Thanks!

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Amy,

Your pie is beautifully browned. Did you use a wash on it or just bake it til it colored properly?

As for the processor: Persevere! It's worth developing your technique using the processor - it makes dough making so much easier. I use the processor all the time and have no trouble with overmixing. This last time my gd used the leftovers to make "cookies" topped with sugar and cinnamon. Those little suckers puffed up to 4 -5 times the thickness of the dough as nothing weighed them down. Partly that was because I didn't let her smoosh the dough together but showed her how to stack it in layers before rolling it out. And, as a matter of fact, sometimes when rolling it out for a tart I will fold the dough into an envelop and roll it again, much as one would for puff pastry. It makes more layers and there's no law that says you can't import a technique from one dough recipe to another.

First I use frozen butter, second, I cut it up into different sized pieces so that they do not all get cut down equally, then I add the butter in two batches, PULSING a only a couple times before adding the second and then pulsing a couple more time. (Open the processor to check the butter/flour meal and you should find a lot of little peas sized pieces, though the rest has become more like cornmeal. Lastly I dribble in the ice water to bring it together. My processor has a small opening, so I stick a funnel in it and am able to dribble the water towards the outer margin instead of having it all land at the center of the blade. I think this means it takes less time to bring the dough together.

I then dump the flour/butter mixture onto the middle of a piece of plastic wrap. At this point it is pretty loose, though if I pinch it together it does stick together well. I use the plastic to pull the dough together into a cohesive mass in a relatively thin rough approximation of the shape I will finally roll out (about 1" high). I also take advantage of the plastic to firm up the edge to eliminate that raggedy bit when you roll it out. When I finally roll it out after refrigerating, I can clearly see the little knots of butter in the dough. My hands hardly touch the dough itself before I begin rolling it.

This is very technique heavy when describing, but not complicated to do. It takes me longer to get the mis en place together than to actually form the dough. And much longer to refrigerate than anything else. Read - or reread - RLB on her techniques and notice how she has the dough refrigerated after every step. I found that doing this makes a big difference. I will, when I have the time pop the filled shell into the fridge for awhile before baking.

Lastly, I find that while baking this makes a big difference for me: I start off the tart/pie (I occasionally do make pies) on a sheet pan directly placed on a pizza stone to eliminate the mushy bottom. I leave it there 15-20 minutes, before raising it to the middle. And if it looks like it needs it, I'll raise the tart to the top at the end. If I'm making a thin rustic tart I may do the whole thing on the pizza stone.

Edited October 3, 2005 by Mottmott (log)

[amyknyc]

Thanks Mottmott -- I added an eggwhite wash to the top and sprinkled some sugar on it too.

OK, I'll give the food processor another chance, but pulling it out and mixing in the water by hand was actually much easier than I thought it would be. Thanks for the mixing tutorial!

[Beanie]

Lastly I dribble in the ice water to bring it together. My processor has a small opening, so I stick a funnel in it and am able to dribble the water towards the outer margin instead of having it all land at the center of the blade.  I think this means it takes less time to bring the dough together.

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Mottmott,

Is the processor running when you dribble water through the top? Whenever I've done this, the dough has been overprocessed. I find that dribbling the water over the flour and then pulsing a couple of times works better for me. I haven't used the processor for the last few pie crusts, but I may try again. I also like to form the dough with plastic wrap as you described.

[Beanie]

Amyknyc,

Your pie looks great! I love the fluting. I have such trouble getting the pointy edges; even when they look good before baking, they tend to disappear during baking. I guess I need to keep practicing. Let us know how it tastes. I bet it will be delicious.

[divalasvegas]

Here's my "all purpose" cream pie filling. It's written for lemon cream, but you can see the variations below. I try to bake low-fat whenever possible (not necessarily "low calorie." Consequently, I often use a nut-crumb crust instead of pastry.

Low-fat lemon cream pie filling:

Soften 1 tsp unflavored gelatin in juice of ½ lemon (about 3 Tbs) for 5 minutes. Don’t use the stuff in a green bottle—use water or your favorite liqueur if you don’t have fresh lemons. Warm for 20 sec in microwave until liquid and clear.

Beat together until smooth:

  • 1 8 oz pkg neufchatel cheese (or non- or low-fat cream cheese) at room temperature

  • ½ C non-fat sour cream

  • 1 14 oz can non-fat sweetened condensed milk (not evaporated skim milk)

  • ½ tsp almond extract

Beat in lemon juice/gelatin

Pour into a pre-baked pie or tart shell and top with sliced berries or other fruit*. Chill at least 2 hours.

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That sounds like a delicious recipe Jay. I've been looking for an easy lemon cream pie filling recipe and this sounds perfect. A couple of questions for you or anyone else here:

One of my favorite pies, if not the favorite is lemon meringue pie. What I was thinking of was a two-layer pie. The bottom layer would be your lemon cream recipe. On top of that would be the standard lemon curd type filling that one would find in a lemon meringue pie. Lastly, there would be the meringue on top.

1) Do you think that the bottom cream layer, once adquately chilled, would support the top two so that when cut you would see distinct layers and nothing "squished" on the bottom or have uneven layers?

2) Since this pie would have to be assembled in three stages, what would you do to ensure that the crust isn't ruined. When I say stages, I'm thinking that one would first prepare the lemon cream pie, chill, then top with the cooled lemon curd mixture and chill again, and then top with meringue and brown in a very hot oven.

3) Just for my own tastes, I would be more inclined to use regular cream cheese, sour cream, and sweetened condensed milk. Do you think proportions would need to be adjusted or more lemon juice added to cut the extra richness?

Thanks.

[JayBassin]

Here's my "all purpose" cream pie filling. It's written for lemon cream, but you can see the variations below. I try to bake low-fat whenever possible (not necessarily "low calorie." Consequently, I often use a nut-crumb crust instead of pastry.

Low-fat lemon cream pie filling:

Soften 1 tsp unflavored gelatin in juice of ½ lemon (about 3 Tbs) for 5 minutes. Don’t use the stuff in a green bottle—use water or your favorite liqueur if you don’t have fresh lemons. Warm for 20 sec in microwave until liquid and clear.

Beat together until smooth:

  • 1 8 oz pkg neufchatel cheese (or non- or low-fat cream cheese) at room temperature

  • ½ C non-fat sour cream

  • 1 14 oz can non-fat sweetened condensed milk (not evaporated skim milk)

  • ½ tsp almond extract

Beat in lemon juice/gelatin

Pour into a pre-baked pie or tart shell and top with sliced berries or other fruit*. Chill at least 2 hours.

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That sounds like a delicious recipe Jay. I've been looking for an easy lemon cream pie filling recipe and this sounds perfect. A couple of questions for you or anyone else here:

One of my favorite pies, if not the favorite is lemon meringue pie. What I was thinking of was a two-layer pie. The bottom layer would be your lemon cream recipe. On top of that would be the standard lemon curd type filling that one would find in a lemon meringue pie. Lastly, there would be the meringue on top.

1) Do you think that the bottom cream layer, once adquately chilled, would support the top two so that when cut you would see distinct layers and nothing "squished" on the bottom or have uneven layers?

2) Since this pie would have to be assembled in three stages, what would you do to ensure that the crust isn't ruined. When I say stages, I'm thinking that one would first prepare the lemon cream pie, chill, then top with the cooled lemon curd mixture and chill again, and then top with meringue and brown in a very hot oven.

3) Just for my own tastes, I would be more inclined to use regular cream cheese, sour cream, and sweetened condensed milk. Do you think proportions would need to be adjusted or more lemon juice added to cut the extra richness?

Thanks.

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1) Do you think that the bottom cream layer, once adquately chilled, would support the top two so that when cut you would see distinct layers and nothing "squished" on the bottom or have uneven layers?

It's a pretty soft filling, similar to a lemon curd. If it's served cold, I don't think it would be a problem. You may need to add gelatin, but if you add too much, it might get rubbery.

2) Since this pie would have to be assembled in three stages, what would you do to ensure that the crust isn't ruined.  When I say stages, I'm thinking that one would first prepare the lemon cream pie, chill, then top with the cooled lemon curd mixture and chill again, and then top with meringue and brown in a very hot oven.

I use a nut-crumb crust, which stays crunchy. If you want or need to use a pastry crust, consider a chocolate or white-chocolate lining before you pour in the lemon cream.

3) Just for my own tastes, I would be more inclined to use regular cream cheese, sour cream, and sweetened condensed milk.  Do you think proportions would need to be adjusted or more lemon juice added to cut the extra richness?

I don't think the proportions need to be changed; you may not even need the gelatin (except see my felling about question #1). Full-fat lemon custard will be rich. You could consider folding in some zest of lemon or lime for contrast with your lemon curd.

Let me know how it turns out.

[divalasvegas]

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1) Do you think that the bottom cream layer, once adquately chilled, would support the top two so that when cut you would see distinct layers and nothing "squished" on the bottom or have uneven layers?

It's a pretty soft filling, similar to a lemon curd. If it's served cold, I don't think it would be a problem. You may need to add gelatin, but if you add too much, it might get rubbery.

2) Since this pie would have to be assembled in three stages, what would you do to ensure that the crust isn't ruined.  When I say stages, I'm thinking that one would first prepare the lemon cream pie, chill, then top with the cooled lemon curd mixture and chill again, and then top with meringue and brown in a very hot oven.

I use a nut-crumb crust, which stays crunchy. If you want or need to use a pastry crust, consider a chocolate or white-chocolate lining before you pour in the lemon cream.

3) Just for my own tastes, I would be more inclined to use regular cream cheese, sour cream, and sweetened condensed milk.  Do you think proportions would need to be adjusted or more lemon juice added to cut the extra richness?

I don't think the proportions need to be changed; you may not even need the gelatin (except see my felling about question #1). Full-fat lemon custard will be rich. You could consider folding in some zest of lemon or lime for contrast with your lemon curd.

Let me know how it turns out.

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Thanks for all your help Jay. Regarding your responses:

1) I think your original recipe sounds perfect, including the gelatin. I'm looking for a texture somewhere between a lemon cream and a cheesecake, so if it's a little firm, it's okay. The only change I might make is to substitute vanilla extract for the almond extract.

2) I will definitely be using a pastry crust, so I think your idea for using the a white-chocolate lining will work great.

3) I agree; I was thinking of adding some zest to the bottom cream layer. As for the other layer, I'll be using a pretty standard recipe for the lemon layer of a lemon meringue pie which uses less butter and egg yolks than a lemon curd, but I'll be tasting and adjusting as I go along.

I guess it's no secret now that I really love lemons.

Again I appreciate all of your advice and I'll report back with the results.

[Beanie]

amyknyc,

One other thing... when the frozen pie is baked, it will thaw from the outside in. The pie crust will thaw and start to brown while the filling is just starting to thaw.  By the time the crust is done, the filling will be cooked, but not overcooked. Does this make sense? Maybe somebody else can correct me or explain better.

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Ah, that makes more sense. So you're basically reheating your filling while the crust bakes. OK, I'm giving it a shot this weekend, I'll let you know how it comes out!

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Yup. I'm also baking this weekend...apple pie and blueberry. I'll report back too.

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I promised to report back on the results of my apple and blueberry pies, so here it is.

Last Saturday, I baked two double crust apple pies and a blueberry pie with streussel topping, both from the frozen state. I baked them in a commercial convection oven at my shop, at 325 degrees for two hours, 15 minutes. I can't post photos because my digital camera is on the fritz, but the apple pies turned out looking very much like amynyc's beautiful pie -- except my fluting isn't as good. I was afraid the fillings may have been overcooked (the blueberry filling boiled over the top onto the baking sheet) but they weren't.

After cooling, I placed them on the front counter and sold them within two hours. I realize that selling three pies is not a big deal to you city folks, but in a rural location with low volume, it was a pleasant surprise. Even better, one of the customers came in today and told me the apple pie was delicious. He told me that he usually doesn't eat the edges of pie crusts because they are dry and tough, but this crust was fantastic and he ate every crumb. So, the main point of this post is to thank Wendy for her pie crust recipe and instructions, and everyone else for their support.

[Wendy DeBord]

.........to have actually helped someone..........makes everything feel better.........thanks.

[Siren]

I make this in the summer w/fresh maine blueberries--organic if we can get them--and both pies sell out that night. I've also found using peaches, nectarines, etc work nice in this... I'm going to experiment next summer w/pineapple and mango.

Blueberry Cream Pie

1 cup sour cream

2 tablespoons flour

3/4 cup sugar

1 teaspoon vanilla

1/4 teaspoon salt

1 egg, beaten

2 1/2 cups fresh blueberries

1 unbaked pastry shell 9"

3 tablespoons flour

1 1/2 tablespoons butter

3 tablespoons chopped pecan or walnuts

Combine sour cream, flour, sugar, vanilla, salt and egg; beat 5 minutes at medium speed of mixer or till smooth. Fold in blueberries.

Pour filling into pastry shell; bake at 400ºF for 25 minutes.

Remove from oven. Combine the flour, butter and chopped nuts, stirring well. Bake 10 more minutes.

Chill before serving.

Serves 8.

Best of Country Cooking

[Zucchini Mama]

I make this in the summer w/fresh maine blueberries--organic if we can get them--and both pies sell out that night.  I've also found using peaches, nectarines, etc work nice in this... I'm going to experiment next summer w/pineapple and mango.

Blueberry Cream Pie

1 cup sour cream

2 tablespoons flour

3/4 cup sugar

1 teaspoon vanilla

1/4 teaspoon salt

1 egg, beaten

2 1/2 cups fresh blueberries

1 unbaked pastry shell 9"

3 tablespoons flour

1 1/2 tablespoons butter

3 tablespoons chopped pecan or walnuts

Combine sour cream, flour, sugar, vanilla, salt and egg; beat 5 minutes at medium speed of mixer or till smooth. Fold in blueberries.

Pour filling into pastry shell; bake at 400ºF for 25 minutes.

Remove from oven. Combine the flour, butter and chopped nuts, stirring well. Bake 10 more minutes.

Chill before serving.

Serves 8.

Best of Country Cooking

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Siren, this pie sounds great. Does the nut mixture go on top like a streusal? I want to make a grape pie this weekend, and wonder if this recipe would work with seedles grapes cut in half?

I had such a good grape pie last fall, made with concords, (I think) and a streusal topping. The woman wouldn't share the recipe. So I'm going to experiment this weekend. Anyone have any updates on good recipes for grape pie?

Zuke

[ruthcooks]

I had such a good grape pie last fall, made with concords, (I think) and a streusal topping. The woman wouldn't share the recipe. So I'm going to experiment this weekend. Anyone have any updates on good recipes for grape pie?

Zuke

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Concord Grape Pie isn't any big secret, although I never had a grape pie with streusel topping. The technique is to "slip the skins" and cook the green pulp with seeds until it boils, then run the mixture through a sieve to remove seeds (the pulp liquifies so this is not a difficult task). Mix the pulp back with the skins, combine with the sugar and flour which have been combined.

My old (circa 1940s) Betty Crocker Cookbook, which is the recipe I've made in the past, uses the following ingredients for a 9" pie: 5 1/3 cups grapes, 1 1/3 C. sugar, 1/4 cup flour, 1 1/3 t. lemon juice, 1/4 t. salt, 1 1/2 T. butter. Rather strange fractions, I think. Bake at 425 degrees for 35-45 minutes for a non-frozen pie.

My all purpose pie streusel is 1/2 C. butter, 1/2 C. packed brown sugar and 3/4 C. flour, combined with a pastry cutter or combined in food processor. When I convert a 2-crust pie to a streusel, I omit some of the sugar and all of the flour and butter from the pie filling. In the case of grapes, however, I think the flour could be left in because of the pureed nature of the filling.

The grape filling is a rich purple and rather tart, like cherry or rhubarb, and goes well with ice cream.

Good luck with the green grapes, I've never made a pie with them.

[Zucchini Mama]

I had such a good grape pie last fall, made with concords, (I think) and a streusal topping. The woman wouldn't share the recipe. So I'm going to experiment this weekend. Anyone have any updates on good recipes for grape pie?

Zuke

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Concord Grape Pie isn't any big secret, although I never had a grape pie with streusel topping. The technique is to "slip the skins" and cook the green pulp with seeds until it boils, then run the mixture through a sieve to remove seeds (the pulp liquifies so this is not a difficult task). Mix the pulp back with the skins, combine with the sugar and flour which have been combined.

My old (circa 1940s) Betty Crocker Cookbook, which is the recipe I've made in the past, uses the following ingredients for a 9" pie: 5 1/3 cups grapes, 1 1/3 C. sugar, 1/4 cup flour, 1 1/3 t. lemon juice, 1/4 t. salt, 1 1/2 T. butter. Rather strange fractions, I think. Bake at 425 degrees for 35-45 minutes for a non-frozen pie.

My all purpose pie streusel is 1/2 C. butter, 1/2 C. packed brown sugar and 3/4 C. flour, combined with a pastry cutter or combined in food processor. When I convert a 2-crust pie to a streusel, I omit some of the sugar and all of the flour and butter from the pie filling. In the case of grapes, however, I think the flour could be left in because of the pureed nature of the filling.

The grape filling is a rich purple and rather tart, like cherry or rhubarb, and goes well with ice cream.

Good luck with the green grapes, I've never made a pie with them.

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Thanks for this recipe, Ruth. I will try a few experiments. The thing is, I could swear her concord grape pie had whole grapes in it, but of course, I must have been wrong. Although some people cut the grapes in half and flick out the seeds with a knife. If I did that, and mixed the grapes with the flour mixture would I really have to cook them on top of the stove before baking them? I may try a couple fo methods. Also, aren't there some seedless varieties of dark grapes now?

Zuke

[sazji]

One of the nicest pies I ever made was a blackberry merengue. Sorry I can't give specific measurements here because it was years ago, and I winged it every time. Seattle, where I lived for many years, is overgrown with Himalayan blackberries. I picked a couple quarts, put them in a big pot, mashed them, and then simmered them enough that they juiced very easily in a jelly bag. To this I added sugar and corn starch, cooked till thickened and then put that into the crust. Once I added cream cheese to it as well.

Here I make a "pudding" in the same way (with cream cheese and cream added) with tart morello cherries. They make an incredible normal cherry pie as well.

bob

[ruthcooks]

Zuke, sorry I didn't see your post to reply earlier. You must not be familiar with Concord grapes, or you would know it's impossible to separate out the seeds as it is with other types of grapes. There are, however, seedless black grapes on the market, and it could be that is what the lady used. They would taste completely different than Concords, which are the grapes that give grape jelly its flavor.

[Beanie]

I had a disastrous experience this weekend making a mixed berry pie and would appreciate comments. I based it on a successful blueberry pie that I made last week using 5 cups IQF wild blueberries (unthawed) tossed with sugar, spice, lemon juice and about 3 tbls. tapioca flour. Baked from frozen state; came out with a perfect balance of fruit and thickened juice.

This weekend I used IQF mixed berries -- a combo of strawberries, wild blueberries, red raspberries and blackberries -- and did the same thing. The pie looked beautiful from the outside -- nicely crimped crust (finally) , in a rich shade of brown, sparkling with turbinado sugar. I cut into it and found ... mixed berry soup . Clearly, the berry combo had alot more water than the blueberries alone. I'm not sure if I should have thawed and drained the fruit first, precooked it, added alot more thickener, or what. I wound up cutting the top crust off, scooping the berry soup into a pot, cooking it down with cornstarch, dumping it back in the crust, refrigerating. By this morning the inside had congealed into a sludgelike mass with no evidence of whole berries. I ate it for breakfast Any thoughts on how I should have prepared it? Thanks!

[Wendy DeBord]

You've got it. It contained more moisture then you had starch to thicken. Theres nothing I know of to fix it after the fact...........other then what you did.

You could have made a thickened sauce then added your berries to it precooking your filling. But with berries your going to turn it into puree if you double cook it.

I think the real answer was to have more thickener in your pie filling to start with. I agree with using the berries from a frozen state........but I'm not so sure about using tapioca flour. But thats because I don't use it, I'm more comfortable with cornstarch.

Blueberries contain natural thickeners, so they require less starch to set then other berries. That was your mistake.....you can't use the amount of thickener called for in a BB pie universally in other fruit pies.