"Fast Food Nation" by journalist Eric Schlosser

[Gifted Gourmet]

article from the Star Press

Despite being a best seller, the book had no impact on the fast food industry, according to Schlosser. In fact, the conditions he wrote about - the childhood obesity epidemic, food safety, and the exploitation of slaughterhouse and fast-food workers - have worsened, he said .....critics of the "food police" say citizens don't need the government to dictate what is good for their children because they can simply turn off the television or choose not to buy unhealthy foods.

"We are talking about the children of America being targeted by these companies and developing habits that may lead to lifelong poor health," Schlosser said.

Have you read Fast Food Nation?

Is Schlosser correct?

Is his ability and right to speak openly being compromised?

Why do you suppose that there has been no significant impact on the fast food business? or has there?

Opinions please ...

[FathyrJack]

I have read the book and it has definitly had an affect on my eating habits. Since reading the book around a year ago, I have not eaten at a fast food restaurant of any kind. Except maybe a pizza parlor. I have also tried to explain to my two girls ages 7 and 10 , why places like McDonalds are not a good thing.

Why it hasn`t had a major influence on more individuals, I think that most people don`t change their habits drastically unless it hits home on a personel level. It`s one thing reading in the paper about a food recall at a local food store and it`s another thing for your child too get violently sick from it. I think to many people have to be hit in the head with a hammer before taking preventative measures.

About a month after reading Fast food Nation, there was a story in the paper about a beef recall being done. This article basically repeated verbatim what Schlosser had said. That there was no need to worry and that a small amount of meat might have gotten infected, I was amazed how quckly the article switched from a bad meat recall to the praising of the high quality and safety standards of the meat plant. How they use the most advanced technology available to keep your food safe from disease That article alone made me realize in an instant that most of what the book said was probably true.

Edited November 20, 2004 by FathyrJack (log)

[NulloModo]

I haven't read this book, but I am generally wary of anyone who takes the 'Big evil corporations vs. the good of the Nation' approach.

I am a huge proponent of personal responsibility, and of parents raising children to make educated decisions. In my opinion this includes being able to filter out truth from fiction in advertising, and showing them that fast food really isn't that good to begin with, and that with a modest bit of effort far more tasty dishes can be prepared at home.

[DonRocks]

article from the Star Press

Is Schlosser correct?

Why do you suppose that there has been no significant impact on the fast food business? or has there?

←

This was a book with an agenda. Nevertheless, Schlosser is largely correct, and he has sown the seeds of impact with this seminal work, even though that might not be evident at this point in time.

Cheers,

Rocks.

[therese]

An interesting and well-written book, pretty much spot on accurate insofar as facts go (a friend of mine's one of the sources, actually), and I agree with his conclusions as well.

I haven't read this book, but I am generally wary of anyone who takes the 'Big evil corporations vs. the good of the Nation' approach. 

I am a huge proponent of personal responsibility, and of parents raising children to make educated decisions.  In my opinion this includes being able to filter out truth from fiction in advertising, and showing them that fast food really isn't that good to begin with, and that with a modest bit of effort far more tasty dishes can be prepared at home.

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You should read the book, NulloModo. It's not just about fast food, but about how food production practices in this country are pretty much depriving everybody but the best educated and diligent of even the semblance of choice when it comes to food.

[bentherebfor]

I read the book, and did certainly did have an effect on me. However, I felt the recent movie Super Size Me was more effective when it came to shock appeal.

[Gifted Gourmet]

Interesting since one was the inspiration for the other apparently!!

[ghostrider]

How many people read books any more? When was the last time that a book not dealing with a low-carb diet had any effect on widespread behavior? I wouldn't expect a book like Schlosser's to have an immediate impact on our national eating habits.

Nonetheless the hopeful idealist in me concurs with DonRocks above.

[Gifted Gourmet]

Please don't be so very quick to dismiss Schlosser and his writing ...At the time that Schlosser's book came out, some 3 or 4 years ago, it received some startlingly good reviews .. from some notable publications, at that:

New York Times - "Here is another side of the unfettered money culture that has been celebrated as an exciting orgy of entrepreneurialism and opportunity."

San Francisco Chronicle - Eric Schlosser's "Fast Food Nation" is a good old-fashioned muckraking expose in the tradition of "Th American Way of Death" that's as disturbing as it is irresistible ..."

The Washington Post - "Schlosser is part essayist, part investigative journalist. His eye is sharp, his profiles perceptive, his prose thoughtful but spare;..."

Salon - Schlosser never comes off as a "sky is falling" street-corner raver or bullheaded finger-pointer. His fury is evident, but his voice is measured and his methods are subtle." 

[Busboy]

I haven't read this book, but I am generally wary of anyone who takes the 'Big evil corporations vs. the good of the Nation' approach. 

I am a huge proponent of personal responsibility, and of parents raising children to make educated decisions.  In my opinion this includes being able to filter out truth from fiction in advertising, and showing them that fast food really isn't that good to begin with, and that with a modest bit of effort far more tasty dishes can be prepared at home.

←

I'm curious, do you have kids? Personal responsibility is very big in my book, too. But, as a parent, you're fighting multinational corporations with nine-figure advertising budgets being disbursed by people who have spent decades learning how to manipulate their target audience -- it's a bit of a struggle for, say, the overworked parent of a four-year-old.

By the way, the wholesome stuff you prepare at home doesn't always appeal to children. Just as they prefer cartoons to Joyce, they often prefer hot dogs to steamed vegetables.

I'd suggest you cut mom and dad a little slack.

[handmc]

I don't know if Schlosser's book is being dismissed. I would tend to disagree with some the reviewers however; he had a pretty pronounced corporate greed vs. the little guy approach.

As for the food horror show message the filth etc., the topic is often a non starter. While folks are quickly appalled at some of the tails associated with a breakdown of food safety practices, most do not want to spend a whole lot of time discussing the issue. Here’s an example: would you eat mussels that were grown 5 miles from a sewerage pumping plant with a history of leaks and spills of up to 40,000 gallons of sewerage and the shell fish area is also targeted for remediation because recreational boaters dump their holding tanks in the area (these are some facts of a case I am handling)? I love mussels! But now I think twice before digging into a bowl of them. It ticks me off in one sense because it is too much information. I still love mussels dam it! White wine garlic, lemon grass, thyme, shallots, bird peppers…..I just have to be sensitive where to get them from.

When the Schlosser’s book first came out it was heralded by some “food safers” as something that will start “real change”, the passage of laws, yada, yada. Little if anything has happened. In fact the agencies have pulled back and in many respects are doing less in regards to enforcement issues. While some say the Bush administration is the reason, the major food regulatory agencies where not doing much under Clinton either.

I represented a number of people sickened, and some seriously injured in the Cyclospora outbreaks only to learn that many of the importers did not carry insurance and where uncollectible, assuming the countries they were located would let you attempt to collect on a judgment. I think at a least if you are going to bring product into the country you should have to carry insurance if the product you sell makes someone sick or kills someone.

That’s right, I handle serious food product liability cases, cases where people, children (in most instances because their immune system are not fully developed) are killed or end up on dialysis or the ICU, because of bad food. I don’t handle belly ache cases, the cases are expensive to prosecute and in many instances you cannot decipher what they were eating vs. what made them sick. In most serious cases the cause of the problem is bad ingredients, contaminated with e-coli, listeria, hepatitis A, etc., and/or the bug is not killed through proper cooking or good food unfortunately is contaminated by cross contamination or unwashed hands.

After the above paragraph I anticipate I get a bunch of flaming letters. Hopefully those who may bash me will continue to read before they get all too hostile.

I have worked in the industry. I am currently a certified food handler. I have taken the courses and tests. I cook for all the food events at my church where we serve a large number of people usually over a 4-5 hours period so it is like being slammed from the minute you walk in until serving time is over. High Stress, High Volume. I don’t claim to be able to step into a real restaurant and keep up, but then again it is not like I am clueless what it is like to turn out a large volume of decent food under pressure.

My experience both cooking at the country club I worked at in my twenties, occasional food service work in college and law school and the church functions over the past ten years, we do about one a month, is that most people are cooking clean and doing it right. I have also run across some real pigs. At the church, I have the luxury of running the less than diligent out of the kitchen immediately, one of the benefits of a volunteer organization. However my experience commercially is that it is more difficulty to get rid of the careless and the piggy. The pigs, the careless ones for the most part, cause the problem everyone else gets stuck dealing with later.

Sometimes, however it is the ingredients themselves that are the culprit. You can be the cleanest chef in the world you will never wash Cyclospora, a most pesky parasite, off a raspberry and it will make people very sick, seven to ten days later.

What the heck does this have to do with Schlosser's book? His book, apart from the food factoids and corporate greed angle was about this very topic. The topic about food safety abuses is one which people who truly enjoy food [who view it as more that fuel for a carbon based life form] do not necessarily wish to discuss, read or think about. Many of the people who eat at the retail fast food locations may simply not be all that concerned about how their food is made.

Many of Schlosser's assertions are true. I have thousands of pages of meat and poultry suppliers (PDR’s) process deficiency records, N.R.’s noncompliance records, and plant management responses which would make the stoutest person want to vomit. However, when (society) shut down the local butcher who kept a spotless shop and took pride in his product and went to production line processing based on volume, we gave up a lot for lower prices. I’m not saying the choice was right or wrong, the choice simply had some very serious consequences.

Schlosser's book for people who love to eat is depressing. Particularly if they like stinky runny cheese, oysters, steak tar tare, sushi, medium rare cheeseburgers or all of the other food items and lovely things I could not live without.

Sorry for being long winded. Someone tossed a soap box in my path.

[robyn]

I represented a number of people sickened, and some seriously injured in the Cyclospora outbreaks only to learn that many of the importers did not carry insurance and where uncollectible, assuming the countries they were located would let you attempt to collect on a judgment. I think at a least if you are going to bring product into the country you should have to carry insurance if the product you sell makes someone sick or kills someone...

←

Another alternative is having the person who sells directly to the consumer (the retailer or restaurant) being strictly liable for any defects in the food (that's pretty much what we have in Florida). The retailer or restaurant can seek indemnity from the supplier - but it bears the risk of an uncollectible judgment. Robyn

[Gifted Gourmet]

I handle serious food product liability cases, cases where people, children (in most instances because their immune system are not fully developed) are killed or end up on dialysis or the ICU, because of bad food.

Many of Schlosser's assertions are true.

Schlosser's book for people who love to eat is depressing.

Sorry for being long winded.

←

Not long winded at all, handmc ... quite to the contrary .. you know exactly what you are talking about and I, for one, am truly in awe of your knowledge.

Thank you for joining in on this thread! and, more importantly, for allowing us a glimpse of reality ...

[robyn]

Thank you for joining in on this thread! and, more importantly, for allowing us a glimpse of reality ...

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Actually- the reality is that except for the very young - the very old - and the immuno-compromised - our GI systems are remarkably tough - and will stand up to a lot of of abuse. Which is why thousands of people don't die every Thanksgiving from poor food handling practices at home. Robyn

[NulloModo]

I haven't read this book, but I am generally wary of anyone who takes the 'Big evil corporations vs. the good of the Nation' approach. 

I am a huge proponent of personal responsibility, and of parents raising children to make educated decisions.  In my opinion this includes being able to filter out truth from fiction in advertising, and showing them that fast food really isn't that good to begin with, and that with a modest bit of effort far more tasty dishes can be prepared at home.

←

I'm curious, do you have kids? Personal responsibility is very big in my book, too. But, as a parent, you're fighting multinational corporations with nine-figure advertising budgets being disbursed by people who have spent decades learning how to manipulate their target audience -- it's a bit of a struggle for, say, the overworked parent of a four-year-old.

By the way, the wholesome stuff you prepare at home doesn't always appeal to children. Just as they prefer cartoons to Joyce, they often prefer hot dogs to steamed vegetables.

I'd suggest you cut mom and dad a little slack.

←

I didn't mean to come off as digging on parents.

No, I do not have children of my own. However, I work as a teacher, grades 5 - 8, and due to my subject I see those students all year for all four years. This is only my second year in the position, but I have already gotten to know a lot of them very well, and I do understand the difficulty in reasoning with/educating kids. The personal responsibility rant partially comes from this, there is a lot of junk I end up dealing with that should be handled at home IMO, but I dig right into it anyway, just because I won't get anything done otherwise. This is a big reason I am in no hurry to have children of my own, I know it is a major undertaking, and I honestly don't think I am ready yet.

However, when I do, I plan on raising them on wholesome home-cooked food from the very beginning. I have a feeling I have gotten into this before on eG, but as it pertains to this thread, I hope that if they are raised on the good stuff from a very young age, they will know better than to crave the fast-food junk as sustenance. I have a feeling it is far more difficult to wean kids already addicted to that slop off of it than it is to just keep them away from it from the get-go.

Of course, when it comes to that the pervasive advertising could definately present a challenge, but then again I have issue with unsupervised mass-media contact for many hours a day at a young age anyway (that is a whole other rant). I am not trying to come off as condescending or elitist here, I just feel that too much blame is placed on corporations for essentially doing what it is they are in existance to do: sell a product. Our entire economic system is based on free market capatilism (well, close enough) and if we start forcing companies to take a fuzzy-bunny wholesome approach to advertising it could lead our economy even further into the crapper than it already is. Given the options, I will just expend the extra effort and educate my kids from the get-go, even if that means moving to Montana and cutting off the TV feed.

[DonRocks]

However, when I do, I plan on raising them on wholesome home-cooked food from the very beginning...  I hope that if they are raised on the good stuff from a very young age, they will know better than to crave the fast-food junk as sustenance.  I have a feeling it is far more difficult to wean kids already addicted to that slop off of it than it is to just keep them away from it from the get-go.

...  Given the options, I will just expend the extra effort and educate my kids from the get-go, even if that means moving to Montana and cutting off the TV feed.

←

Just wait until it's 6 PM and you're exhausted and don't feel like chopping carrots.

You'll remember I said this,

Rocks.

[NulloModo]

However, when I do, I plan on raising them on wholesome home-cooked food from the very beginning...  I hope that if they are raised on the good stuff from a very young age, they will know better than to crave the fast-food junk as sustenance.  I have a feeling it is far more difficult to wean kids already addicted to that slop off of it than it is to just keep them away from it from the get-go.

...  Given the options, I will just expend the extra effort and educate my kids from the get-go, even if that means moving to Montana and cutting off the TV feed.

←

Just wait until it's 6 PM and you're exhausted and don't feel like chopping carrots.

You'll remember I said this,

Rocks.

←

Hehe, I am not going to argue against the convenience, but even in the world of dining and convenience food there are healthy and unhealthy options.

Instead of heading off to McDonalds or Burger King why not go to Subway that has an entire array of salads and subs that can be made fairly healthy (and pretty decent for fast food), or head out to whatever ethnic places you have in the area, build up pallates for different taste profiles from a young age that way too.

[robyn]

However, when I do, I plan on raising them on wholesome home-cooked food from the very beginning...  I hope that if they are raised on the good stuff from a very young age, they will know better than to crave the fast-food junk as sustenance.  I have a feeling it is far more difficult to wean kids already addicted to that slop off of it than it is to just keep them away from it from the get-go.

...  Given the options, I will just expend the extra effort and educate my kids from the get-go, even if that means moving to Montana and cutting off the TV feed.

←

Just wait until it's 6 PM and you're exhausted and don't feel like chopping carrots.

You'll remember I said this,

Rocks.

←

You're right - and it's not only true if you have kids. There are lots of other things in life that are exhausting.

But there is that vast middle ground between home delivery pizza and everything made from scratch dinner. It could be a take out roasted chicken (believe it or not - they were 2 for 1 for $5 this week at my local market). With some frozen veggies. Could be salmon salad or egg salad with salad things like tomatoes and cucumbers. Could be pasta with a jar of sauce and a quick side salad. Or a simple soup and sandwich. Or scrambled eggs (we like to eat breakfast for dinner). There are dozens of things you can make that won't get you a blurb in Gourmet magazine - but they won't be totally lousy for you or your kids either.

Was just thinking of the soup and sandwich. You know that Campbell's soup is in trouble because people wouldn't take the time to open a can of soup with a can opener - put it in a pot with a can of water - and heat it. So now there are pop-off tops - and soups you don't have to add water to - and soups you can put in the microwave - but cripes - how hard is it to make a can of condensed soup?

BTW - if your kids want to eat total junk - don't let them. There are more difficult things in life than telling a 4 year old how to eat (like telling a 60 year old who's bigger than you are how to eat ). And a decent diet begins in the grocery store (if it's not in the house when you're eating at home - you can't eat it). Robyn

[Raquel]

However, when I do, I plan on raising them on wholesome home-cooked food from the very beginning...  I hope that if they are raised on the good stuff from a very young age, they will know better than to crave the fast-food junk as sustenance.  I have a feeling it is far more difficult to wean kids already addicted to that slop off of it than it is to just keep them away from it from the get-go.

...  Given the options, I will just expend the extra effort and educate my kids from the get-go, even if that means moving to Montana and cutting off the TV feed.

←

Just wait until it's 6 PM and you're exhausted and don't feel like chopping carrots.

You'll remember I said this,

Rocks.

←

Hehe, I am not going to argue against the convenience, but even in the world of dining and convenience food there are healthy and unhealthy options.

Instead of heading off to McDonalds or Burger King why not go to Subway that has an entire array of salads and subs that can be made fairly healthy (and pretty decent for fast food), or head out to whatever ethnic places you have in the area, build up pallates for different taste profiles from a young age that way too.

←

Yup. It's all about choices. And as a parent of a 5 and 7 yr. old, I've made choices on both ends of the spectrum.

We haven't brought the kids to a McDonald's for a couple years now, but I remember being on road trips stuck out in the middle of nowhere with hungry screaming kids... and the only thing on the horizon was a pair of golden arches. Life isn't black and white. You're going to hit a gray patch every now and then.

For the most part, we eat organic. Robyn, you were right to say that healthy eating begins at the grocery store... or in our case... outside of the grocery store. We started shopping at smaller places like Trader Joes and the local farmers markets. We try to buy all organic now. From milk and juices down to all our meats. If all you have in the fridge is healthy food, then that's what you're going to eat.

[Busboy]

However, when I do, I plan on raising them on wholesome home-cooked food from the very beginning...  I hope that if they are raised on the good stuff from a very young age, they will know better than to crave the fast-food junk as sustenance.  I have a feeling it is far more difficult to wean kids already addicted to that slop off of it than it is to just keep them away from it from the get-go.

...  Given the options, I will just expend the extra effort and educate my kids from the get-go, even if that means moving to Montana and cutting off the TV feed.

←

Just wait until it's 6 PM and you're exhausted and don't feel like chopping carrots.

You'll remember I said this,

Rocks.

←

Hehe, I am not going to argue against the convenience, but even in the world of dining and convenience food there are healthy and unhealthy options.

Instead of heading off to McDonalds or Burger King why not go to Subway that has an entire array of salads and subs that can be made fairly healthy (and pretty decent for fast food), or head out to whatever ethnic places you have in the area, build up pallates for different taste profiles from a young age that way too.

←

Yeah, there's a moral victory. Subway instead of McDonalds.

And my kids ate damn near every ethnic food there is before they were three. They retain an affection for Ethiopian to this day. But, you know what? They still like fast food. The idea that children are somehow pre-disposed to eat wholesome food is not rooted in reality. If "uneducated" palates didn't love Big Macs and Domino's, they wouldn't have locations at every major intersection in America. And no palate is less educated, and no mind more open, than that of a child.

[docsconz]

The timing of this thread is interesting for me. This evening I watched Supersize Me on DVD which also had an interview with Schlosser. I can't say that either the movie or the book have affected my or my family's eating habits since I just saw the movie and haven't read the book. The movie and by extension the book have given support to our habits though. We try to minimize our contact with the major fast food chains and try to buy locally and from known producers as much as possible. My influence has been more from the Slow Food Movement, although they co-relate. In the movie, the villainous emphasis was placed on the fats consumed, although mention of the sugars and sodas were made. It is the latter agents that I believe are the major culprits of the physiologic turmopil induced.

I watched the movie with one of my sons. It was good to see our views and practices reinforced. I must make viewing for the rest of my family and our principle child-care provider mandatory, who will occassionally bring our five year old to McD's.

[bloviatrix]

I haven't had a chance to read Fast Food Nation but I've had the opportunity to hear Schlosser speak on the subject. For me, the book that really opened my eyes to the problems with our food industry was a novel called My Year of Meats by Ruth Ozeki.

[ghostrider]

However, when I do, I plan on raising them on wholesome home-cooked food from the very beginning.  I have a feeling I have gotten into this before on eG, but as it pertains to this thread, I hope that if they are raised on the good stuff from a very young age, they will know better than to crave the fast-food junk as sustenance.  I have a feeling it is far more difficult to wean kids already addicted to that slop off of it than it is to just keep them away from it from the get-go.

....Given the options, I will just expend the extra effort and educate my kids from the get-go, even if that means moving to Montana and cutting off the TV feed.

←

Speaking from my personal experience, I encourage you in both of these efforts.

I was raised on the good stuff from day one, unlike most of my peers, and it stuck. It wasn't until I hit my late 20s that I realized the importance & the uniqueness of the diet I had at home (my dad had the only backyard vegetable garden for miles around) & how lucky I was.

I was also raised without TV, we didn't have one in the house till I was 17. That made me a real oddball, & made it very difficult to socialize, since I didn't understand much of what my peers were talking about. That experience gave me an interesting perspective on our culture, though, I frequently felt like I was viewing it as an outsider.

It also left me with an unfortunate TV addiction that took hold in my 20s & never really let go. You can't win 'em all I guess. At least I fancy that I watch the box with a critical eye. And I've resisted the urge to get cable, for better or worse. I guess I'm still an oddball.

Well I guess I'm not that odd, I just read thru all the posts after Nullo Modo & saw how many folks quoted the exact same bits that I did, even down to that edit of the final paragraph. That's a hoot! I guess I'm somewhat less of an oddball in the context of eGullet than I am in the world at large.

Now I'm seeing that actually DonRocks was the one to quote as I did & the rest just quoted him. Oh well.

[Gifted Gourmet]

Now I'm seeing that actually DonRocks was the one to quote as I did & the rest just quoted him.  Oh well. 

←

Don Rocks is on eG's payroll in the job category of "Oracle in Residence"

and you have "outed" him ...

[robyn]

Yup.  It's all about choices.  And as a parent of a 5 and 7 yr. old, I've made choices on both ends of the spectrum.

We haven't brought the kids to a McDonald's for a couple years now, but I remember being on road trips stuck out in the middle of nowhere with hungry screaming kids... and the only thing on the horizon was a pair of golden arches.  Life isn't black and white.  You're going to hit a gray patch every now and then.

For the most part, we eat organic.  Robyn, you were right to say that healthy eating begins at the grocery store... or in our case... outside of the grocery store.  We started shopping at smaller places like Trader Joes and the local farmers markets.  We try to buy all organic now.  From milk and juices down to all our meats.  If all you have in the fridge is healthy food, then that's what you're going to eat.

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Agree that it isn't all black and white. Heck - "gourmet" meals are probably a heck of a lot worse for adults than a Big Mac - but most people don't eat like that day in day out. The most important thing is what you eat most of the time - not what you eat once in a blue moon.

I've never been a stickler in terms of eating ingredients that are "organic" - as opposed to simply healthy. I'm not sure if there's a big difference between organic carrots and regular carrots - but it certainly doesn't bother me if someone wants to buy "organic". Robyn