Using Stock I for Stock II then Stock III rather than reducing

[FeChef]

of course you can. look into perpetual stock. If you dont want to reduce, then use less liquid. If the carcass is too large to cover with less liquid, break the carcass into pieces before adding to the PC. You can also just reduce after straining which makes it easier and faster.

[Heartsurgeon]

my sister coined this phrase about triple stock:

 

"too precious to use" 

 

that;s the one drawback to making it, you become convinced it must only be used for an extra-special occasion.

 

throughly brown the bones and bits before tossing in the Kuhn Rikon for 30 minutes on high. Repeat 3-4 times...oohhhh myyyy....too precious.

 

made lamb risotto using multi-stock that was insanely good. 

[Heartsurgeon]

Its possible to make instant gravy using multi-stock and wondra flour.

add salt, pepper, little squeeze of lemon, sliver of garlic, dash of cream, pat of butter. hit the mixture with a blitz stick, microwave until desired thickness.

 

best gravy ever in under 60 seconds.

Edited January 8, 2017 by Heartsurgeon
add info (log)

[FeChef]

18 minutes ago, Heartsurgeon said:

Its possible to make instant gravy using multi-stock and wondra flour.

add salt, pepper, little squeeze of lemon, sliver of garlic, dash of cream, pat of butter. hit the mixture with a blitz stick, microwave until desired thickness.

 

best gravy ever in under 60 seconds.

 

I cheat my turkey gravy by using a rich turkey stock that i make by using drippings from roasting the carcass and the neck, heart and giblets then place in the PC. Then to thicken the rich turkey stock i use those turkey gravy packets. They normally call for 1 cup of cold water but i use 2 cups of rich turkey stock and it has a nice texture and mouth feel. And since i dont add salt to my stocks, this balances it out very good.

[Okanagancook]

Yes!  It is all about the stocks and subsequent sauces.  I have had so many comments from guests about my sauces.

my SIL was visiting and I served sautéed green cabbage, Sausages and potatoes with a very rich broth and she was so blown away that she is now making her own rich stock on a regular basis.  She usually doesn't cook a lot but I think it is more from a lack of confidence more than anything else.  So when I showed her how easy it is to make a good stock she ran with it.  Nice to see.

[EatingBen]

I've been making my stocks sous vide, chicken wings with a carrot and stick of celery and half a white onion no salt. sous vide at 90 for 2 hours then dropped to 65 overnight. The stock is turning into jelly in the fridge. I have reduced this further but the taste actually becomes to intense if thats possible. 

 

I do similar with brown stocks it all gets roasted gently in the oven, beef bones and off cuts get coated in a little tomato paste then into the sous vide bath same deal 90c for 2 hours then 65 overnight 

 

I use the higher temp to cook the carrots onions and celery then leave it on lower to extract all the flavours out but not turn everything to mush. Its all become gelled on it's own and doesn't require much in the way of reduction.

[paulraphael]

It's so easy with a pressure cooker to get the same (or better) result in a fraction the time that I think it's an obsolete technique. 

Do a test and see for yourself. Make a triple stock, and then make a single stock with 3X higher ratio of solids to water.

 

You're doing the same thing—but simultaneously rather than sequentially. 

 

I don't stock up on classical glaces or anything similar anymore. It's so easy to make a superior equivalent (with a specific protein chosen for the sauce) that I'll just do it as needed. 

[JoNorvelleWalker]

I am a fan of stock in the pressure cooker -- that way the stock does not get cloudy.

 

[quiet1]

1 minute ago, paulraphael said:

It's so easy with a pressure cooker to get the same (or better) result in a fraction the time that I think it's an obsolete technique. 

Do a test and see for yourself. Make a triple stock, and then make a single stock with 3X higher ratio of solids to water.

 

You're doing the same thing—but simultaneously rather than sequentially. 

 

I don't stock up on classical glaces or anything similar anymore. It's so easy to make a superior equivalent (with a specific protein chosen for the sauce) that I'll just do it as needed. 

 

I like to have some stock in small amounts (ice cubes or similar) in the freezer so when I'm doing the 'what looks good, what can I make?' routine and making something up on the fly, I can toss some stock in without delaying the meal too much.

 

But the pressure cooker is my preferred method of making said stock, for sure.

[Okanagancook]

Well after my experiment with old school techniques for making stock and a glacé I have to agree with all who posted above that pressure cookery  of stocks is the best way to go.  I will try the sous vide method next.

[btbyrd]

SV offers no real advantages for meat-based stock. Pressure cookers are much better for that purpose. You can get some lovely, clear and aromatic vegetable stocks using SV though.

[Okanagancook]

Ok, that saves me some effort.  I have done the Modernist Cuisine veggie stock in the bath and I agree it is the best way to go.

 

[paulraphael]

12 hours ago, btbyrd said:

SV offers no real advantages for meat-based stock. Pressure cookers are much better for that purpose. You can get some lovely, clear and aromatic vegetable stocks using SV though.

 

Agreed ... I've tried it both ways and the pressure-cooked stocks are a bit better and much easier. 

 

I still use SV for veggie stocks, as BTB says, and it's sublime for fish stock. I use ziploc bags, which are close to the temperature limit when making stocks, so leaks are a concern. Sometimes I double-bag stocks, out of paranoia. The outer bag stays clean and is easy to reuse.

 

SV is also useful if you're doing Modernist Cuisine-style low-temperature "jus" kinds of stocks, where you're aiming for a red color and rare meat flavor

Edited January 9, 2017 by paulraphael (log)

[FeChef]

10 hours ago, Okanagancook said:

Ok, that saves me some effort.  I have done the Modernist Cuisine veggie stock in the bath and I agree it is the best way to go.

 

Don't even bother with veggies in the SV, just add the veggies to your meat of choice in the PC.

Edited January 9, 2017 by FeChef (log)

[paulraphael]

2 hours ago, FeChef said:

Don't even bother with veggies in the SV, just add the veggies to your meat of choice in the PC.

 

 

We were talking about using s.v. for veggie stock, not for the veggies in meat stock.

[FeChef]

1 hour ago, paulraphael said:

 

We were talking about using s.v. for veggie stock, not for the veggies in meat stock.

Im sorry. Are you vegetarian? Either way, i just don't see any application that would benefit making stock SV vs PC weather its veggies or meat.

[paulraphael]

8 hours ago, FeChef said:

Im sorry. Are you vegetarian? Either way, i just don't see any application that would benefit making stock SV vs PC weather its veggies or meat.

 

Try it and compare. The results are different. One extracts at 85°C, the other at 121°C. I find the differences especially noticeable with fish stock.

[btbyrd]

From MC@H:

 

Re: Vegetable stock: "Making stock sous vide is the best way to capture the subtle, nuanced flavors of the vegetables -- especially if you have time to infuse the liquid overnight in the refrigerator. When time is more pressing, however, we pressure-cook the stock, which produces a stronger flavor." I have found this to be true. SV stock is lighter and more headily aromatic. Making the same recipe in the PC doesn't have the same top notes, but is more powerful. Sometimes that's what you want; sometimes it isn't. 

 

Re: Fish stock: "Fish oils oxidize very easily, so to get the most flavor out of fish bones, you need to cook them gently in a sealed environment. Slow-cooking them sous vide produces excellent results." 

[rotuts]

over in the iPot section I made some stock from a two turkey carcasses  

 

 

Im posting here as I could not fine a Stick thread 

 

I tasted the gelled TS and was underwhelmed . there are reasons for this that me a lot of sense :

 

I did not use any salt , nor aromatics  nor vegetables :  Onion , carrot , celery sticks  (  )  just to see what's going on.

 

these were Freezer Turkey Breasts.

 

Ive made stock for gravy in the past when I used to do deconstructed turkey , a roast turkey method all who like turkey should look into ..

 

by first growing the carcass bones and then putting them in a pot with water and simmering them.  with carrot , onion and celery stalk  ( 2 only ! )

 

straining that , picking off the meat and saving that if it had flavor for the Giblet gravy.  Id add herbs and aromatics after the first step.

 

the stock I ended up with was massively underwhelming to me  note no flavorings were added.

 

it also had an unpleasant turkey fat flavor.  this can't be from freezer issues as Ive only worked w fz turkeys.   the turkey breast from these two birds

 

were fine ++

 

Ive added carrot , onion , and yes two celery ribs and put the jell in the iPot for one hour on HP.

 

Ill roast the bones next time.

 

so the question after all that is :  how to eliminate the turkey fat flavor , if possible.  Im guessing that what little TF was in the iPot Brew got

 

emulsified in the stock at the hight temps.    this has been discussed in many forums on making a clear , non cloudy stock for delicate work

 

ie at lower temps.  I understand that.

 

is there something else going on that Ive missed ?

 

many thanks