Pâte de Fruits (Fruit Paste/Fruit Jellies) (Part 2)

[Kerry Beal]

51 minutes ago, Rajala said:

Did anyone ever make a PDF made out of pomegranate? I'm thinking if I should add some other fruit/berry to the mixture. It's not listed in the old PDF (the real PDF haha) from Boiron that's been shared over the years.

I'd probably do two small experiments - one with a base of apricot or pear - the other with just juice and see if it has enough pectin of it's own to set

[Rajala]

15 minutes ago, Kerry Beal said:

I'd probably do two small experiments - one with a base of apricot or pear - the other with just juice and see if it has enough pectin of it's own to set

 

Yeah, sounds like a good approach. I do have pear in the freezer, but not apricot. So it's easy to pick what to test here.

[Jim D.]

14 hours ago, Rajala said:

Did anyone ever make a PDF made out of pomegranate? I'm thinking if I should add some other fruit/berry to the mixture. It's not listed in the old PDF (the real PDF haha) from Boiron that's been shared over the years.

 

Here are a couple of recipes that might be of interest: 

 

https://lucysfriendlyfoods.com/2020/12/19/pomegranate-and-grenadine-pate-de-fruits/

https://www.julescooking.com/single-post/how-to-make-pate-de-fruit-best-candy-ever

 

Neither recipe is exactly a "professional" Boiron-style recipe, but they are interesting because they don't use any other fruit.

[Rajala]

Thanks Jim! Doesn't have to be perfect, I'm going to mix it anyway in ordet to be able to pipe it

[Rajala]

Update for anyone curious: pomegranate puree is basically juice. I went with 100% pomegranate for a PDF, cooked it to 107°C. While it got a bit of texture, it really wasn't a PDF. But since I'm piping it, whatever. If you want a PDF you should probably reduce it by 30-40% and use pear puree as well. To really get that flavor, like the pomegranate syrups you can buy, which got a kick to it.

[GRiker]

@Elle Bee encouraged me to post my trials here.  Thanks

 

I was so nervous to even start I spent hours reading about it and eventually dived in tonight.

 

I used Perfect Puree Black Current and Boiron instructions.  I had about 500g left from another project. I should have used less so I could have tried more variations.

 

I used Modernist Pantry Slow Set Hi Methoxyl Pectin.  This is the pectin they say to use for jellies.

 

Things didn't got as I expected and in the end I forgot to add the citric acid!  This pectin is thermoirreversible, and requires acid to set.  I figured since it wasn't really set anyway because I forgot the citric acid, that I would dump it back it, heat it to above 149F (the stated gel temp) add the citric acid solution and pour it out again.  

 

It's been a couple hours already and does appear to be setting a little.

 

I'll see where it is in the morning.

 

A couple interesting things to note:

Black Currant Perfect Puree starting Brix was 33.7 as measured by my new Hanna Instruments refractometer.  (Boiron table says Brix from black currant is 24.  I'm guessing 24 means that's their standard)

 

I added the sugar/pectin mix, then the granulated sugar, then the glucose.  I microwaved the glucose for a few seconds to make it easier to pour, when I went back to the stove the mixture had thickened considerably.  Decided I should test the brix and temp.  I found the brix to already be at 80.7 (target was 75) and the temp was only about 185 or so, instead of the 225F target.  At this point I forgot what I was doing and decided I was finished and poured it out, forgetting to add the citric acid as mentioned above.

 

I just got a new aW meter off Aliexpress and decided I would use it to test the water activity of the finished product.  If I used it correctly, I ended with a measurement of 0.70. 

 

My goal is to add some fruit to a two layered bon bon.

 

I'm skeptical that this PDF will end up being firm enough to cut. But I'm not really after PDF that is cuttable.  

 

Since I'm wanting to put it in bon bon anyway, does it really matter if it sets or not?

I'm not sure what happened that the brix was already so high but the temp wasn't anywhere close to the target temp.  Any ideas about why that happened?

 

I'm out of black current but have a few others, I'll have to keep trying.

[Kerry Beal]

6 hours ago, GRiker said:

@Elle Bee encouraged me to post my trials here.  Thanks

 

I was so nervous to even start I spent hours reading about it and eventually dived in tonight.

 

I used Perfect Puree Black Current and Boiron instructions.  I had about 500g left from another project. I should have used less so I could have tried more variations.

 

I used Modernist Pantry Slow Set Hi Methoxyl Pectin.  This is the pectin they say to use for jellies.

 

Things didn't got as I expected and in the end I forgot to add the citric acid!  This pectin is thermoirreversible, and requires acid to set.  I figured since it wasn't really set anyway because I forgot the citric acid, that I would dump it back it, heat it to above 149F (the stated gel temp) add the citric acid solution and pour it out again.  

 

It's been a couple hours already and does appear to be setting a little.

 

I'll see where it is in the morning.

 

A couple interesting things to note:

Black Currant Perfect Puree starting Brix was 33.7 as measured by my new Hanna Instruments refractometer.  (Boiron table says Brix from black currant is 24.  I'm guessing 24 means that's their standard)

 

I added the sugar/pectin mix, then the granulated sugar, then the glucose.  I microwaved the glucose for a few seconds to make it easier to pour, when I went back to the stove the mixture had thickened considerably.  Decided I should test the brix and temp.  I found the brix to already be at 80.7 (target was 75) and the temp was only about 185 or so, instead of the 225F target.  At this point I forgot what I was doing and decided I was finished and poured it out, forgetting to add the citric acid as mentioned above.

 

I just got a new aW meter off Aliexpress and decided I would use it to test the water activity of the finished product.  If I used it correctly, I ended with a measurement of 0.70. 

 

My goal is to add some fruit to a two layered bon bon.

 

I'm skeptical that this PDF will end up being firm enough to cut. But I'm not really after PDF that is cuttable.  

 

Since I'm wanting to put it in bon bon anyway, does it really matter if it sets or not?

I'm not sure what happened that the brix was already so high but the temp wasn't anywhere close to the target temp.  Any ideas about why that happened?

 

I'm out of black current but have a few others, I'll have to keep trying.

What's it doing today?

[Alleguede]

7 hours ago, GRiker said:

@Elle Bee encouraged me to post my trials here.  Thanks

 

I was so nervous to even start I spent hours reading about it and eventually dived in tonight.

 

I used Perfect Puree Black Current and Boiron instructions.  I had about 500g left from another project. I should have used less so I could have tried more variations.

 

I used Modernist Pantry Slow Set Hi Methoxyl Pectin.  This is the pectin they say to use for jellies.

 

Things didn't got as I expected and in the end I forgot to add the citric acid!  This pectin is thermoirreversible, and requires acid to set.  I figured since it wasn't really set anyway because I forgot the citric acid, that I would dump it back it, heat it to above 149F (the stated gel temp) add the citric acid solution and pour it out again.  

 

It's been a couple hours already and does appear to be setting a little.

 

I'll see where it is in the morning.

 

A couple interesting things to note:

Black Currant Perfect Puree starting Brix was 33.7 as measured by my new Hanna Instruments refractometer.  (Boiron table says Brix from black currant is 24.  I'm guessing 24 means that's their standard)

 

I added the sugar/pectin mix, then the granulated sugar, then the glucose.  I microwaved the glucose for a few seconds to make it easier to pour, when I went back to the stove the mixture had thickened considerably.  Decided I should test the brix and temp.  I found the brix to already be at 80.7 (target was 75) and the temp was only about 185 or so, instead of the 225F target.  At this point I forgot what I was doing and decided I was finished and poured it out, forgetting to add the citric acid as mentioned above.

 

I just got a new aW meter off Aliexpress and decided I would use it to test the water activity of the finished product.  If I used it correctly, I ended with a measurement of 0.70. 

 

My goal is to add some fruit to a two layered bon bon.

 

I'm skeptical that this PDF will end up being firm enough to cut. But I'm not really after PDF that is cuttable.  

 

Since I'm wanting to put it in bon bon anyway, does it really matter if it sets or not?

I'm not sure what happened that the brix was already so high but the temp wasn't anywhere close to the target temp.  Any ideas about why that happened?

 

I'm out of black current but have a few others, I'll have to keep trying.

 

black currant/cassis is a very tricky purée it’s a berry with a big amount of fiber but also acidity. It dries out very rapidly and appears on the refractometer high but it doesn’t have the right gelifying power.

on a purée like that, maybe do 50% cassis and 50% apple juice. You may also want to check the pH of your liquids before mixing. Too much acidity prevents the gelifying of the pectine not enough as well.

 

if your pH are similar at the start then the recipe doesn’t really change through your flavours.

 

[Kerry Beal]

8 hours ago, GRiker said:

@Elle Bee encouraged me to post my trials here.  Thanks

 

I was so nervous to even start I spent hours reading about it and eventually dived in tonight.

 

I used Perfect Puree Black Current and Boiron instructions.  I had about 500g left from another project. I should have used less so I could have tried more variations.

 

I used Modernist Pantry Slow Set Hi Methoxyl Pectin.  This is the pectin they say to use for jellies.

 

Things didn't got as I expected and in the end I forgot to add the citric acid!  This pectin is thermoirreversible, and requires acid to set.  I figured since it wasn't really set anyway because I forgot the citric acid, that I would dump it back it, heat it to above 149F (the stated gel temp) add the citric acid solution and pour it out again.  

 

It's been a couple hours already and does appear to be setting a little.

 

I'll see where it is in the morning.

 

A couple interesting things to note:

Black Currant Perfect Puree starting Brix was 33.7 as measured by my new Hanna Instruments refractometer.  (Boiron table says Brix from black currant is 24.  I'm guessing 24 means that's their standard)

 

I added the sugar/pectin mix, then the granulated sugar, then the glucose.  I microwaved the glucose for a few seconds to make it easier to pour, when I went back to the stove the mixture had thickened considerably.  Decided I should test the brix and temp.  I found the brix to already be at 80.7 (target was 75) and the temp was only about 185 or so, instead of the 225F target.  At this point I forgot what I was doing and decided I was finished and poured it out, forgetting to add the citric acid as mentioned above.

 

I just got a new aW meter off Aliexpress and decided I would use it to test the water activity of the finished product.  If I used it correctly, I ended with a measurement of 0.70. 

 

My goal is to add some fruit to a two layered bon bon.

 

I'm skeptical that this PDF will end up being firm enough to cut. But I'm not really after PDF that is cuttable.  

 

Since I'm wanting to put it in bon bon anyway, does it really matter if it sets or not?

I'm not sure what happened that the brix was already so high but the temp wasn't anywhere close to the target temp.  Any ideas about why that happened?

 

I'm out of black current but have a few others, I'll have to keep trying.

Which Boiron instructions are you using? The ones I have posted in the past all use apple pectin 

[GRiker]

10 hours ago, Kerry Beal said:

What's it doing today?

It did set some I guess.  If I take some out I can roll it into a ball in my hand, but it's not a gel I wouldn't say.   I put it in my Chef Rubber silicone square molds and I thought I could just pop them out.  Nope.  Thought I might have to use a rubber scraper to get them out.  My son suggested I try the freezer to at least harden them enough to get them out.  That worked! I'm going to turn them out on some parchment.  

 

I did get the Boiron instructions here, may have been ones you posted.

 

I did read all kinds of posts about different pectins.  I might have to look even more into that as well.  I understand most people use apple pectin.  I thought apple pectin was a Slow Set High Methoxyl Pectin that would function the same. 

 

Thanks @Alleguede for the tips about working with Black Currant.  I've got several other purees I'll try before I circle back to Black Currant.  I used it all up the first try.  Next time I'm going to make smaller batches so I can experiment better. 

 

Does the pectin actually help decrease aW?  My end goal is not to have a cuttable pectin, but to have a fruit layer in a bon bon. Once the PDF were to gel, I'd just need to make it pipe-able anyway.  If my aW value is acceptable (below 0.8, trying to figure that out in a different thread) then is there any reason I want it to gel first?

[Jim D.]

1 hour ago, GRiker said:

If my aW value is acceptable (below 0.8, trying to figure that out in a different thread) then is there any reason I want it to gel first?

 

I'm not an expert, but I don't know of any reason it needs to be firm when you are going to pipe it.  As I have posted, I use Pomona's pectin and am very pleased with its relatively short cooking time.  I also add pulverized dried fruit (if one exists) to my PdFs, and that reduces their Aw dramatically: apple is 0.53, apricot is 0.65, cherry is 0.59, pear is 0.67.  I also add a pinch of sorbic acid, which, since these mixtures are on the acidic side, extends shelf life (sorbic works only when the item has a pH less than 7).  I am particularly nervous since I had a PdF develop mold once upon a time.