Need soy sauce advice: Looking for Chinese take-out-style soy sauce

[FeChef]

I dont know why but love those chinese take-out soy sauce packets. I have tried all kinds of store bought brand names and i can not stand the smell and taste of them. Some even make my throat burn. Not like a spicy capcaisin or horseradish burn, but like this weird burn you would get if you swallowed salt water while swimming in the ocean. Sorry its the best way i can describe this feeling.

 

Anyway, I am hoping someone knows more about all the different types of soy sauce that could steer me in the right direction.

 

Just incase this gets mentioned....I do not find these soy sauces too salty. I actually add salt to some of my dishes if i run out of these soy sauce packets. And when im out of the packets and am forced to use the store bought bottles, i try to use less soy sauce and add salt instead. So being too salty is not the problem. Thanks.

 

And yes i am aware the salt water reference sounds contradicting, but i cant think of any other way to describe this sensation in my throat from these store bought brands.

Edited March 29, 2014 by FeChef (log)

[FeChef]

I did some google searching and it sounds like the burning in the throat could be an allergic reaction to soy. I dont know if im allergic though because the soy sauce packets contain soy and those dont effect me at all. They dont say fermented soy on them like the bottled stuff does so im wondering if that could be a factor.

[Lisa Shock]

You should try to visit the restaurant supply store that the packets come from. Save some packets, so you have something to show people. You'll need to do some sleuthing, make sure they aren't from Sysco or another purveyor that delivers. -If they are, you could try to get someone who owns a restaurant and is a Sysco customer to buy you a case of them. Shamrock, a local food company, here in AZ, will allow people to buy things directly from them with 3 days notice and loading dock pick-up only, no deliveries.

 

But, Restaurant Depot and undoubtedly many other wholesale shops sell the packets and 5 gallon tubs of various brands of soy sauce. If you are located in/near a large enough city, there may be some places that just sell Chinese foods to restaurants. You may need a friend with a restaurant business license to get in, but, you should be able to buy enough to last you a few years.

[liuzhou]

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by "chinese take-out soy sauce packets".

 

They dont say fermented soy on them like the bottled stuff does so im wondering if that could be a factor.

 

 

All soy sauce is fermented.

[FeChef]

Yes i realize i can try to buy the packets. I even considered asking the local chinese take-out's if they would sell me a box. But i really posted here to find out information on the differences. Mainly what are they using to cook with that doeesnt ruin the smell/taste of the food i buy from them. Are they even using soy sauce? When i make any asian dish at home, it always calls for soy sauce and its the same dishes i buy when i go chinese take-out. Im confused. I have tried narrowing down every ingredient i add and it all comes down to the soy sauce. Sometimes its another variant of soy sauce like stir fry sauce, teryiaki sauce, oyster sauce..ect..ect. All have fermented soy in the ingredient list, and all kikoman,la choy, and asian gourmet brands.

[liuzhou]

There are several different types of soy sauce (but oyster sauce isn't one of them). Kikkoman is Japanese, not Chinese.

I'm sorry, but I still can't quite work out what your question is.

Edited March 29, 2014 by liuzhou (log)

[FeChef]

There are several different types of soy sauce (but oyster sauce isn't one of them). Kikoman is Japanese, not Chinese.

I'm sorry, but I still can't quite work out what your question is.

Alot of dishes/recipes call for oyster sauce. All the bottles i have/have used have fermented soy in the ingredient list. If i reword chinese take-out to asian take-out would that make you feel better?

[jayt90]

You may have a preference for hydrolyzed soy, which is not used in most naturally fermented products like Kikkoman. I believe it allows a freshly made batch to be sold immediately without aging.

[liuzhou]

 

Does not say "fermented" on the ingredient list.

 

But it is. That is the very definition of soy sauce.

 

All soy sauce is fermented.

 

Fermentation isn't an ingredient. It's a process. If you don't ferment the soy beans you ain't going to have no soy sauce!

[FeChef]

You may have a preference for hydrolyzed soy, which is not used in most naturally fermented products like Kikkoman. I believe it allows a freshly made batch to be sold immediately without aging.

See this is the type of information i was asking help with. What makes this type soy sauce, and have that umami flavor?

 

Also, could it be that most "asian take-out" use this type , but just in large containers instead of packets?

Edited March 29, 2014 by FeChef (log)

[liuzhou]

I would strongly argue that the product you posted as a picture of the soy sauce you prefer isn't soy sauce, at all. It is a cheap substitute for soy sauce. 

 

If that is what you prefer, then that is what to look for. 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acid-hydrolyzed_vegetable_protein

 

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080319095952AAo64Ih

 

It is not something I've ever come across in China (or Japan).

 

I prefer naturally fermented soy. That's my choice.

 

By the way, I've just checked the ingredients list on the two bottles of oyster sauce I have in the cupboard. None contain fermented soy or any other kind of soy.

Edited March 29, 2014 by liuzhou (log)

[huiray]

...

 

When i make any asian dish at home, it always calls for soy sauce and its the same dishes i buy when i go chinese take-out.

 

...

 

Uh, say what?  An "Asian" dish (in your case I gather you mean "Chinese") requires soy sauce????  Um, NO.  I don't know what sort of things you have been cooking but I would say to you that what makes a dish "Chinese" does not require the use of soy sauce.

[huiray]

FeChef, what sort of soy sauces have you been getting from the stores? (Actual brand names)  Other than these "take-out" packages, that is.

 

I must say (in tandem with Liuzhou) that these soy sauce packages may not actually contain soy sauce (I don't know for sure).  Could it be that they simply have some sort of hydrolyzed stuff concocted to have a taste reminiscent of actual soy sauce?  I myself have never used these "soy sauce" packages when I did get them (on the rare occasions) with some take-out from some "Chinese" place or other (I'd just throw them out) so I can't even say what they really taste like...

 

But in your case it might be the best avenue for you to pursue Lisa Shock's suggestion to get what you like, in a quantity larger than a few packages.**

 

** In this context I once found myself in a situation where I asked a local Chinese "take out" shop for a couple of those fried wonton-skin crispy bits that they would hand out with regular orders.  I was charged 50 cents for each package of those fried strips, which I thought was utter usury, but I was in a situation where I needed them immediately for a particular dish. 

Edited March 29, 2014 by huiray (log)

[rotuts]

did you try to call kari-out and ask ?

 

http://www.kariout.com/product_list_details.php?id=13bb4c48d5c45b&productid=13bb4ca730e25b

[FeChef]

Uh, say what?  An "Asian" dish (in your case I gather you mean "Chinese") requires soy sauce????  Um, NO.  I don't know what sort of things you have been cooking but I would say to you that what makes a dish "Chinese" does not require the use of soy sauce.

The problem is that there are so many "asian dishes" that are on the menu at "chinese take-outs"in america. There is chinese,japanese,cantonese,thai...ect..ect. I have no idea what is what. I am not of any asian decent so when i search for a recipe for a favorite asian dish i must rely on the internet. And 9m out of 10 times all the recipes i find require soy sauce as the main flavor enhancer. Some dishes i have hard time finding recipes. An example is a dish called "meifun" it comes in a wide variety of ways. 3 main ones are shrimp, house special, and singapore.

 

I dont like the flavor of curry so did not like the singapore version, but the house special is my favorite that comes with pork, chicken,and shrimp in it. The seasoning they use is like no other flavor ive ever tasted. Its not very dark in color so a dark soy sauce is most likely not used. Its served on the dry side so i doubt they use a sauce. I have ordered this dish at many local chinese/asian  take-outs and they are all similair in taste.

 

Every recipe i find for meifun or maifun require either curry (singapore version) or soy sauce with no other stand out flavor besides chicken broth/stock.

[FeChef]

did you try to call kari-out and ask ?

 

http://www.kariout.com/product_list_details.php?id=13bb4c48d5c45b&productid=13bb4ca730e25b

I just used that image as a reference for Liuzhou since he/she never heard of soy sauce packets. I cant say i ever tried that brand.

[rotuts]

FC  I know exactly what you are talking about.  that soy  is soy-like-sauce

 

if you want to make maifun, look for a 'good' singapore noodle Rx and just dont add the curry powder.  some of the flavor comes from the Wok-ing of the pork and shimp and green onions etc

 

Im lucky I like the curry version and get it when I can in ChinaTown.  these S.Noodles are not available in Singapore !

[FeChef]

FeChef, what sort of soy sauces have you been getting from the stores? (Actual brand names)  Other than these "take-out" packages, that is.

Mostly "regular" and tamari kikoman brand. I have tried generic store name stuff aswell. The only one i ever found that was tolerable was Pearl river bridge mushroom flavor dark soy sauce. I cant find it anymore where i live and not really what i am after but it was better then everything else ive bought. There is not much choices in my area for asian ingredients. There is no asian markets anywhere. Every grocery store in 50 miles has probably 36 inches of shelf space to fill with asian ingredients that are either bottles of sauces or cans horrible asian veg that leave a funky metal taste in the food.

[FeChef]

FC  I know exactly what you are talking about.  that soy  is soy-like-sauce

 

if you want to make maifun, look for a 'good' singapore noodle Rx and just dont add the curry powder.  some of the flavor comes from the Wok-ing of the pork and shimp and green onions etc

 

Im lucky I like the curry version and get it when I can in ChinaTown.  these S.Noodles are not available in Singapore !

There is definitely another flavor besides the flavor from the pork, shrimp..ect. The flavor is cooked into the rice noodles. I am thinking maybe the oil they use has some flavor infused into it that i have not heard of or tasted in anything else.

[natasha1270]

I think you want to look for La Choy Soy Sauce. Here's a link to a picture of their label, the ingredients look similar to the Kari-Out packet: http://cdn.agilitycms.com/naturally-savvy/Images/Articles/La-Choy-pixlr.jpg

[FeChef]

I think you want to look for La Choy Soy Sauce. Here's a link to a picture of their label, the ingredients look similar to the Kari-Out packet: http://cdn.agilitycms.com/naturally-savvy/Images/Articles/La-Choy-pixlr.jpg

Thanks. I know i have tried a few of La Choy brand sauces. I cant say i liked the taste of those sauces, but it could have just been something else in the sauces that i didnt like. Hopefully i will like the soy sauce though. Its worth a shot, and i think i saw that brand soy sauce at one of the local grocery in my area.

 

Damn....not carried at my local walmart, and out of stock at another walmart 20 miles from me. Damn, not sure what grocery store i saw it at.

Edited March 29, 2014 by FeChef (log)

[rotuts]

I havent tasted your 'item'  but Im betting that the flavor you are tasting is Maillard'ed from the very hot wok they might use:

 

green onion, pork, shrimp etc

 

after all these places dont put the time and $$$ as say restaurants such as Daniel.

 

the better ones make great stuff.  doubt there in anything too complicated in what they do

 

that being said:: maybe they never clean the Wok  

 

 

get a hit of last years shrimp  ...   in every bite !

 

BTW  its perfectly fine to like your Take Out's Soy-ish-sauce

 

just either find the supplier and by a few gallons or buy some from the T.O.

 

Done.

Edited March 29, 2014 by rotuts (log)

[FeChef]

jayt90 sent me in the right direction pointing out hydrolyzed soy. After reading up on it, i found that they are able to extract the flavor without fermenting. Also that there is no smell, where naturally brewed fermented soy has a smell that is probably the smell i dont like. There is also a bitter-ish tangy-ness to the fermented soy that i dont like either.

 

I am almost certain now that every chinese take-out that ive eaten at and liked probably doesnt use fermented soy sauce in their cooking. They may have a bottle of kikoman at the table, but probably just there for show. Im sure they use the good hydrolyzed stuff in the back.

[OliverB]

they probably refill that bottle on the table with what ever bulk stuff they use in the back...

There are plenty places you can order just about any asian ingredient online, beginning with amazon, but there are sites that specialize on these things. Not sure they'll have what you look for, I'm sure any take out place uses the cheapest stuff they can get and that might only be sold to them directly. I'd ask them what they use in the kitchen and if they would sell you a bottle (or fill one if they buy it by the bucket). Buying boxes of the little packages seems a bit wasteful and cumbersome.

[FeChef]

they probably refill that bottle on the table with what ever bulk stuff they use in the back...

There are plenty places you can order just about any asian ingredient online, beginning with amazon, but there are sites that specialize on these things. Not sure they'll have what you look for, I'm sure any take out place uses the cheapest stuff they can get and that might only be sold to them directly. I'd ask them what they use in the kitchen and if they would sell you a bottle (or fill one if they buy it by the bucket). Buying boxes of the little packages seems a bit wasteful and cumbersome.

Yes i know the packets isnt the best way to go but untill today i did not know what hydrolyzed soy was. I only knew i liked the taste of the stuff in the packets.

 

Also, yes i could buy any asian ingredient online IF i knew what i am looking for. I have spent $$$ buying all kinds of asian ingredients and sauces at local grocery stores just to try them and see what they taste like. Sadly, they were probably bad examples of what "quality" asian ingredients should taste like. I have spent a good portion of today scouring the internet trying to find a recipe for mei fun that includes an asian ingredient i never heard of. Sadly, no dice yet.