Sous Vide: Recipes, Techniques & Equipment, 2011

[Chris Amirault]

I've been fiddling around with Maine shrimp for years, and the preparation I just used for tonight's shrimp and grits was very good and very easy: 250 g of peeled shrimp, in a single layer, with 20 g of bacon fat in each of two bags, 60C for 15 minutes. Tender, rich, a great way to cook these delicious shrimp.

[DaveKSA]

Chris, I am not familiar with Maine shrimp - none in South Africa - but with medium sized prawns I would have done in boiling water for 30 seconds. Do you think I would be ok with these sous vide as you cooked your shrimp. If I overcook prawns they tend to go mushy.

Dave Kennealy

Edited February 25, 2011 by DaveKSA (log)

[Chris Amirault]

Sure, give it a try. Only one way to find out!

[abooja]

I'm using my Sous Vide Supreme for the very first time today and have a couple of quick questions before I proceed.

How much stuff can I pack in there at one time, and how should I pack it? I've got a bit less than four pounds of chicken parts in four bags -- two pairs of bone-in breast halves and two pairs of bone-in thighs. The two bags with breast meat are thicker than those with thigh meat, but still fit in the rack. Should I fit the two larger bags at the ends of the unit, outside the rack, so there is some space in between the breasts and the thighs, or will this impede water circulation? I'm making a version of Ad Hoc's fried chicken, and am supposed to sous vide at 140F for at least an hour, before breading and frying. I will actually be chilling the bags first, and frying later, but that's a separate issue.

Another question: should both the breasts and the thighs be pulled at around the same time? The breasts are thicker, but I figure they cook more quickly anyway, even on the bone. I have no way of taking the internal temperature of the chicken before unsealing the bags at this point.

Many thanks.

[Merridith]

I'm using my Sous Vide Supreme for the very first time today and have a couple of quick questions before I proceed.

How much stuff can I pack in there at one time, and how should I pack it? I've got a bit less than four pounds of chicken parts in four bags -- two pairs of bone-in breast halves and two pairs of bone-in thighs. The two bags with breast meat are thicker than those with thigh meat, but still fit in the rack. Should I fit the two larger bags at the ends of the unit, outside the rack, so there is some space in between the breasts and the thighs, or will this impede water circulation? I'm making a version of Ad Hoc's fried chicken, and am supposed to sous vide at 140F for at least an hour, before breading and frying. I will actually be chilling the bags first, and frying later, but that's a separate issue.

Another question: should both the breasts and the thighs be pulled at around the same time? The breasts are thicker, but I figure they cook more quickly anyway, even on the bone. I have no way of taking the internal temperature of the chicken before unsealing the bags at this point.

Many thanks.

Hello abooja. I was formerly a user of the SVS and I think it is a great tool. However, I do not think that you can use the rack as the sole guide for how much you can put in the SVS at any one time. It is possible to stuff the bags in to the rack in a way that limits circulation between them and this is probably not a good thing to do. Actually, the purpose of the rack is to help things stay submerged but it is also to help you portion things out. Were you to stuff the machine so that there is little or no circulation around the contents, you would defeat the purpose. I would try to ensure that there is water between the packages and on the outside. Not using the rack is ok, too, so long as you use the perforated metal thingy on the bottom and, again, so long as you don't stuff it - keep things from touching the walls, as best as you can. That having been said, remember that the SVS uses the principles of physics to do its job - as water cools it becomes "heavier" and it flows to the bottom and the heated water rises to the top. Because of the design of the SVS, with the heat sources scattered throughout the walls of the machine, this natural circulation process keeps the temperature within an acceptable range of uniformity. Go up thread and read about how the SVS works and you will get a better explanation of this process. When that makes sense, you will understand how much product you should or should not use. Hope this helps!

Oh, by the way, dark meat poultry definitely cooks differently than white meat. It is not just a function of thickness but also a function of the muscle you are using. The leg and thigh, for instance, are parts of the animal that are exercised far more than the breast. They have more connective tissue and they are characteristically much tougher Hence, the cooking time and temp will be different, if you are cooking the chicken and planning on consuming it right out of the SVS. In that case, you will want to cook the dark meat at a different temp and for different times than you do the breast/white. I refer you to Dr. Baldwin's chart. However, since you are just par-cooking the chicken to prep it for going into the deep fryer, I am not sure if it really matters.

My best advice to all people new to SV cooking is that they should start thinking in terms of the purpose for which the animal used a particular muscle, in addition to other characteristics of their meat. A well exercised muscle will always be tougher and thus require different treatment than its less used counterpart. Good Luck.

[nickrey]

... I was formerly a user of the SVS...

What are you using now Merredith? Why did you swap/cease using it?

[abooja]

Thank you for that very detailed answer, Merredith.

My instinct told me not to stuff all four packages in the SVS at one time, but I held this childish hope that, maybe, I was wrong. It's no big deal, in this case, as the cooking time is relatively brief, but I will have to do a lot more planning ahead for larger quantities of long cooked items in the future.

I have seen many references on eG to SV chicken breasts, but none (that I could find) that specified bone-in breasts. I assume the cooking time is a bit longer. To add to my confusion, the Food & Wine version of the Keller fried chicken recipe doesn't even include a SV step, and the one that does uses leg meat.

I guess I'm going to SV the legs separately from the breasts, and at a time and temperature more suited to leg meat. I'll SV the breast meat for somewhat longer than I would boneless chicken breasts, and hope it all comes together in the deep fryer.

Thanks again.

[Merridith]

... I was formerly a user of the SVS...

What are you using now Merredith? Why did you swap/cease using it?

Hi Nick. I am now using the Sous Vide Professional (sold by Williams Sonoma). The SVS was a wonderful machine and I have NOTHING negative to say about it. However, I had several reasons for wanting to make the change.

For one, I like my beef rare and I would often find myself operating on the edge of the danger zone. The SVP has much tighter tolerances - I have found that it varies only by +/- one tenth of a degree centigrade, where as the SVS varied by +/- .5 degrees centigrade. For most people this is not a problem but I just wanted the higher accuracy.

Second, I really like the flexibility of the SVP - it is small enough to put away in a kitchen drawer and uses vessels that I already have and which are multi-purpose. I like that I can use it with a big Cambro or a 20 quart, 12 quart or a 7 quart stock pot.

Third, will be moving to a New York City apartment in about 15 months. Everytime I look around my life here in a rather large house in the suburban midwest, I think about what can be scaled down. When the SVP became reasonable money, I looked at the trading out of the SVS for the SVP to be a scale down. (I am especially nervous about my addiction to kitchen stuff.) Though the SVS is by no means terribly large, the SVP is way smaller.

Thanks for your interest.

PS: I was able to sell my SVS for enough to make it worth while.

Edited February 26, 2011 by Merridith (log)

[Anna N]

So the imminent arrival (don't I wish!) of Modernist Cuisine has re-ignited my interest in sous-vide cooking. I hauled my equipment out of the basement, dusted it off and am ready to dig in again. BUT I want to cook some shrimp and I am finding time/temperature recommendations ranging from 45C for 25 mins (Nathan M in the 2010 topic) to 60C for up to 2 hours! Can anyone give me something without such wide swings? I am using 21-25 count shrimp. Thank you.

[nathanm]

It depends on how done you like your shrimp. I like them at 45C for 25 min.

55C for 1.5 hours would be overdone to my taste, but has some food safety advantages. I think this is overcooked.

I think that 60C for 2 hours is WAY overcooked, but it is a matter of personal taste.

We also have a recipe in the the book where we use much hotter water for a short period of time - in that case we want the surface layers to be a bit firmer, while the interior is nearly raw. I don't have that time/temp handy at the moment.

[dcarch]

Unfortunately, nowadays (NYC) most of the shrimps from supermarkets are treated chemically.

dcarch

[Chris Hennes]

We also have a recipe in the the book where we use much hotter water for a short period of time - in that case we want the surface layers to be a bit firmer, while the interior is nearly raw. I don't have that time/temp handy at the moment.

Is that the shrimp cocktail recipe in volume 3? That one is 60°C for 7 minutes (for the size it says 8 tails should be about 200g).

[Anna N]

It depends on how done you like your shrimp. I like them at 45C for 25 min.

55C for 1.5 hours would be overdone to my taste, but has some food safety advantages. I think this is overcooked.

I think that 60C for 2 hours is WAY overcooked, but it is a matter of personal taste.

We also have a recipe in the the book where we use much hotter water for a short period of time - in that case we want the surface layers to be a bit firmer, while the interior is nearly raw. I don't have that time/temp handy at the moment.

Thank you, Nathan. I went with your 45C for 25 minutes but could not bring myself to eat them! Into the pan they went for a little more cooking! As you say, it's a matter of taste but I also think it might be a matter of safety so I will do a bit more reading and try to come up with a time/temp that I feel more comfortable with. Appreciate your fast response though.

[HannyHindi]

Hello all.

I've just started cooking sous vide for the first time, and had a question about preparing food in advance.

Over the weekend, along with trying few dishes to eat immediately, I vacuum sealed some chicken breasts (separately) in my Foodsaver with a little soy and grated ginger. I put them into the fridge uncooked, planning to use them for quick weeknight meals. The next day, I put one packet in at 141F for 90 minutes. Disaster: the first millimeter or so of the chicken had turned to sludge, and it was much drier than chicken I'd made over the weekend. Was this a result of leaving it vacuum sealed with salt (soy) overnight? In other words, had I overbrined it?

If I do want to prepare packets in advance, can I keep them raw? or should I bring them to temperature, cool them, and put them in the fridge to reheat later? Still new to SV, so it's hard to wrap my head around the concept that reheating meat won't result in the equivalent of microwaved leftovers.

Thanks in advance for the help,

HH

[stomsf]

Hello all.

I've just started cooking sous vide for the first time, and had a question about preparing food in advance.

Over the weekend, along with trying few dishes to eat immediately, I vacuum sealed some chicken breasts (separately) in my Foodsaver with a little soy and grated ginger. I put them into the fridge uncooked, planning to use them for quick weeknight meals. The next day, I put one packet in at 141F for 90 minutes. Disaster: the first millimeter or so of the chicken had turned to sludge, and it was much drier than chicken I'd made over the weekend. Was this a result of leaving it vacuum sealed with salt (soy) overnight? In other words, had I overbrined it?

If I do want to prepare packets in advance, can I keep them raw? or should I bring them to temperature, cool them, and put them in the fridge to reheat later? Still new to SV, so it's hard to wrap my head around the concept that reheating meat won't result in the equivalent of microwaved leftovers.

Thanks in advance for the help,

HH

Welcome to Sous Vide HH!

My guess is that yes, you probably overbrined the chicken. I've had great success cooking individual portions first then refrigerating -- either a quick dunk in a bath to reheat or in a real pinch I'll nuke them but only to warm -- of course finishing in a hot cast iron pan for a sear is great.

I've actually served chicken for a dinner party that had been cooked a month or so in advance (I had forgotten about it in the back of the fridge ) and it was great. Not that I'd recommend it, but it did keep quite well.

[therippa]

Just got an email from the SousVide Supreme people, they are now selling a chamber vacuum for $799 (still too pricey for me though )

http://www.sousvidesupreme.com/product.aspx?productid=54&deptid=1

[lstrelau]

You can buy the same chamber vacuum machine (without the Sous Vide Supreme label) from another company for $675.00 (probably other distributors for Vacmaster as well). Still not cheap but but beats $800.00

http://www.homesteadharvest.com/vacuumsealers.html

Prompt delivery, they also sell bags.

It is a great unit and the least expensive chamber machine I could find. Bit of a beast (I built a special deep drawer to tuck it away in) but it works very well and is robust. Nice additional feature is a vacuum port to use for sealing mason jars (with the accesory from FoodSaver or other manufacturers).

Llyn

[ShaneH]

I just bought the Williams-Sonoma SVP and online it's advertised to come with 2 bonus "gifts"; stock pot and a plastic tub. I went in to buy it and the lady looked it up and didn't have the stock pot, so I got 10% off my order and walked away with the circulator and plastic tub. I can't wait until I can start using it now!

[roygon]

My wife likes her steak Medium, maybe even Medium-well (I know, so sad) and I like it medium rare. We only have one SVS so what is the standard approach here? Can I cook both steaks at say 55C for the appropriate time and then take mine out, leave hers in and raise to 62C and cook longer? How long would it take for the 55C steak to reach 62C assuming it's a 1.5" ribeye? Is there a better way to do this? I've tried cutting her steaks thinner and searing a little longer but not the most elegant or precise way to deal with this problem.

rg

[mkayahara]

Wouldn't it work better the other way around? That is, cook her steak at 62C until it's done, then drop the temperature (i.e., add cold water), add the other steak and hold them both at 55C until the second one is done? The first steak won't become "uncooked" this way, but will stay warm. I'm not sure if there's a mushiness risk.

[roygon]

Wouldn't it work better the other way around? That is, cook her steak at 62C until it's done, then drop the temperature (i.e., add cold water), add the other steak and hold them both at 55C until the second one is done? The first steak won't become "uncooked" this way, but will stay warm. I'm not sure if there's a mushiness risk.

Main issue I can see with that approach is that it would double the total cooking time. Not the end of the world but I figured taking a steak from 55C to 62C would be pretty quick in comparison

rg

[LoftyNotions]

Another option might be to take her steak out early and sear it longer on the grill or pan.

[OliverB]

I'm curious which cuts of steak you prefer for SV cooking. I prefer to make the "perfect" steak over fire on high heat, but that's not always possible, so I've used my SV machine quite a bit lately.

Last night I made some very nice boneless ribeye steaks, the meat turned out absolutely perfect, but the fat (and there's quite some) turned into a very unappetizing glibber, which probably is not all that surprising. I guess the fatty cuts are for high heat cooking or very long low and slow in the smoker?

I'll try some lean grass fed cuts next, my guess being that they can't dry out in the machine and might turn out just utterly perfect, I might even convince myself to buy a fillet mignon, which I don't usually buy. Or cook a hanger steak for a really long time on low temp.

I always sear in a very hot cast iron pan before slicing and serving, though I might skip that sometime, see what kind of presentation I can create with just a block of med-rare cooked beef.

Short of cutting away most of the fat, do you use fattier parts SV, and if so - how?

[nickrey]

I'm curious which cuts of steak you prefer for SV cooking. I prefer to make the "perfect" steak over fire on high heat, but that's not always possible, so I've used my SV machine quite a bit lately.

Last night I made some very nice boneless ribeye steaks, the meat turned out absolutely perfect, but the fat (and there's quite some) turned into a very unappetizing glibber, which probably is not all that surprising. I guess the fatty cuts are for high heat cooking or very long low and slow in the smoker?

I'll try some lean grass fed cuts next, my guess being that they can't dry out in the machine and might turn out just utterly perfect, I might even convince myself to buy a fillet mignon, which I don't usually buy. Or cook a hanger steak for a really long time on low temp.

I always sear in a very hot cast iron pan before slicing and serving, though I might skip that sometime, see what kind of presentation I can create with just a block of med-rare cooked beef.

Short of cutting away most of the fat, do you use fattier parts SV, and if so - how?

I salt and brown steak on a very hot grill pan to give grill marks and some maillard effect (as if I were starting cooking from scratch). If there's fat, as for the cuts you described, I cook that in parallel with my high-strength butane blowtorch.

[ChristieO]

For this, I like to use Flank Steak. it doesn't have that fat. Flank steak typically has more flavor than some of the other cuts, but is tougher but when you do it Sous Vide style, it comes out really tender. It's one of my favorite cuts of beef for this.