Croissant Troubleshooting

[sweetiegirl]

Thanks for your reply...The top layer of the croissant brakes off. We use very little or almost no flour to roll are croissants out.

[Alleguede]

How many turns do you give your croissants? Is the dough sticky? Do you egg wash them?

[jmacnaughtan]

Sounds like you're proving them too fast. Give them two long, slow proofs - one for the un-folded dough, one for the finished croissant - and they'll hold their shape better. It's a good idea to egg-wash them twice as well, just after rolling and just before baking.

[sweetiegirl]

We do two turns, but each turn has five folds (8# dough). How does egg washing them twice help them? my dough is not sticky

Does anyone no the % of butter that goes into a laminate? We put 3 pounds butter for every 8 pounds of dough.

[Matthew Kirshner]

Normally I tend to stay with 25% butter into lamination. 3# butter into 8# dough seems to be a little too much, that's is closer to 38%?? Are you rolling these croissants out by hand or sheeter?, if you are using a sheeting what are the thickness you are sheeting to, both folds and make-up.

In the past I have notice the thicker the sheeting the problems you have describe has happen.

[sweetiegirl]

When laminating we try to go down between 4 to 5 on the sheeter. When sheeting down to cut we go to 3 3/4. your boys are very cute....

[Matthew Kirshner]

Try this next time around if you can make an extra dough to laminate:

Laminate to 10-9mm for the folds(one double, one single. or 3 single)

Make up: 3 1/2 -3

reduce butter to 25%(if you are adding flour to the butter pats, only add 4oz per dough)

I think another problem is the butter when you laminate is getting too thin into the dough causing it to crack. Remember the butter is also a steam leavening for laminating dough's.

Thank you for the comment on the kids, I need to update the photo, I have a daughter in the mix.

[jmacnaughtan]

We do two turns, but each turn has five folds (8# dough). How does egg washing them twice help them? my dough is not sticky

Does anyone no the % of butter that goes into a laminate? We put 3 pounds butter for every 8 pounds of dough.

Egg wash them twice to make them look better and stop the layers separating in the oven. I don't think it's necessary to reduce the butter content that much: I've always had good results with 31%.

The problem might be your folds. 2 x 5 folds might make the dough too thin, maybe try the standard 3 x 3?

[sweetiegirl]

We do two turns, but each turn has five folds (8# dough). How does egg washing them twice help them? my dough is not sticky

Does anyone no the % of butter that goes into a laminate? We put 3 pounds butter for every 8 pounds of dough.

Egg wash them twice to make them look better and stop the layers separating in the oven. I don't think it's necessary to reduce the butter content that much: I've always had good results with 31%.

The problem might be your folds. 2 x 5 folds might make the dough too thin, maybe try the standard 3 x 3?

Thanks I will try this

[sweetiegirl]

How many of you put flour in with your butter blocks before laminating I have never tried this? If so how much flour do you put in.

[Matthew Kirshner]

I normally do not put flour in the butter pats, but some people do. I have the norm 4oz bread flour per dough mix with the butter in the mixer. example: 4 croissant dough's...16oz flour for the pats

[sweetiegirl]

Thanks to everyone for helping out my croissant problem they have been fixed for now. By changing the butter to 25% my flaps stopped unrolling. I also froze my croissant for a few hours after rolling them which helped control yeast growth.

[greystripe]

Hi!  zombie post time.  I made a second attempt at croissants recently and ran into trouble with the proofing phase.  As you can see, the layers are present, but nothing puffed!  I tried rolling the croissants looser and got a bit more air inside, but not nearly enough.  I proofed these ones for 24 hours in a room temperature oven.

 

 

I used the recipe from Baker & Spice (with less yeast than some other recipes, but also a preferment.  I can post the details), and the method from Sarabeth's Bakery: From my Hands to Yours.  The lamination process went fine, but the initial detrempe dough was dry and I needed to add more water, maybe overkneading it in the process?  

 

Ok, here's the recipe:

 

1 sachet fast-action yeast (7 grams is what I used)

500 g strong white flour (I used all-purpose but that should have only made the dough more moist?)

110 ml warm bottled water (20 C)

110 ml cold milk (10 C)

20 g Maldon salt

70 g fine sugar

250 g unsalted butter

 

 

 

[Lisa Shock]

You shouldn't proof that long, what's room temperature where you are? (here in Phoenix, when summer hits, my kitchen is often 85°F -almost warm enough to proof, but not quite.

 

Did you refrigerate between turns to retard yeast development? If so, for how long?

[tcd212121]

Hi everyone. I've recently made croissants for the first time and they came out really well with good flavour and texture. I used Michel Roux's recipe; my only comment is that they needed a touch more sugar than the recipe suggests for my taste and larger triangles probably would have improved the shape relative to the dough thickness. I probably also should have gone with the double egg wash method to give a more even colour after rising. Pictures provided!

 

I made a large batch, cooking half and freezing the rest unprooved as the recipe suggests. I defrosted a few overnight the week later and they came out fine. I did the same again a few weeks later and they were a complete disaster as they didn't rise at all.

 

Can anyone suggest what might have gone wrong here? From what I remember the room temp would have been similar. I admit the recipe does say they will only last in the freezer for a couple of weeks. Does the yeast die over time when frozen?

 

What experience do people have with freezing croissants? The way I see it there are three viable points; pre-risen, post-risen or post-cooked. I can imagine the first two would give the best results. Could the second get around my problem in lack of rising?

 

Many thanks!

[shain]

1 hour ago, tcd212121 said:

 

What experience do people have with freezing croissants? The way I see it there are three viable points; pre-risen, post-risen or post-cooked

 

For any baked good that you plan to serve warm (as I assume you are going to do with croissants) I prefer to freeze after baking.
Freezing always causes some damage, before bake it will hurt rising, after bake, it will cause some staling (though still much better then keeping them standing for days).

If you give them a short re-baking (straight from the freezer, don't bother thawing), to get them warm and crisp, you will revert the staleness anyway.

 

The other options should also be OK, just more risky IMO.

 

Lovely croissants by the way  

[chromedome]

20 hours ago, shain said:

Lovely croissants by the way  

Agreed, those came out spectacularly well for a first attempt. The lamination is beautiful, you were clearly meticulous in your layering.  

 

Re: first batch vs. second batch...were they in the same bag, or did you separate them by batch and freeze them that way? I've noticed in the past that when I have a quantity in one large bag, and take from them as needed, the later ones aren't usually as good. I don't know whether that's because of air/moisture (I'm in a coastal climate) getting into the bag, or just because they're older. If they're bagged separately, I suppose one bag might potentially have been sealed better than the other.

Unless your yeast was brand new, that might have been the issue as well. Less-vigorous yeast might fade more quickly in the freezer, performing well enough initially but then dying away. Lots of variables at play is the bottom line. You'll probably need to repeat the experiment a few times to know for sure. 

 

As for the size of the triangles, did you cut a nock into the middle of the flat end before you began rolling? Most recipes mention this, and it helps them stretch. As you roll up the croissant you gently stretch it by easing your hands apart, as if rolling a breadstick (though not quite as vigorously). Once you get the knack of it, you can make the finished croissant quite significantly wider and thinner, giving it a prettier shape once proofed and baked. 

[greystripe]

On 3/21/2017 at 3:33 AM, Lisa Shock said:

You shouldn't proof that long, what's room temperature where you are? (here in Phoenix, when summer hits, my kitchen is often 85°F -almost warm enough to proof, but not quite.

 

Did you refrigerate between turns to retard yeast development? If so, for how long?

 

Room temperature around here is cool, so I kept the oven actually a little higher - around 78℉.  But you're saying you use a higher temperature than that?  How high do you find works for you?

 

I definitely chilled between turns, about 20 - 30 minutes each time.  I was happy with the lamination...

 

But no puff.  My yeast isn't super fresh, but it works fine for breads and things.

 

Like Tcd212121, I also froze my finished pâte for about a week before defrosting, rolling out and cutting.  Would that make a significant difference?  

 

I'm wondering if the low moisture in the dough made me overwork it and turn it a bit tough?  It wasn't easy at all to roll out, I had to let it rest a lot.

 

 

 

 

Edited March 27, 2017 by greystripe (log)

[tcd212121]

On 26/03/2017 at 0:41 PM, chromedome said:

Re: first batch vs. second batch...were they in the same bag, or did you separate them by batch and freeze them that way?

Unless your yeast was brand new, that might have been the issue as well.

 

As for the size of the triangles, did you cut a nock into the middle of the flat end before you began rolling?

 

Meticulous indeed, bordering on obsessively neat They were all in the same bag, so would have been opened and closed. The recipe called for fresh yeast which was what I used, I think in good date at the time of making the dough but can't be exactly sure, or how well it was stored previously. I will certainly try again, perhaps this time with dried yeast however as this is what I'm most used to. Triangles had the nock cut in which I found very helpful!

[Eric Srikandan]

Making croissant had been bugging me for a while so on Thursday I got started so we could have some for breakfast today. Absolutely delighted with the results and whilst the folding and rolling was a bit boring, it wasn't too challenging.