That Sweet Enemy

[Ptipois]

Suffice it to say that I'm getting tired of seeing "high-end cuisine" amalgamated with the term "cuisine". So much confusion springs from that. (Kiwichef, maybe you should read the feedback.)

We are still talking about haute cuisine, not regional idigenous cooking.

I think that even if we decide that "cuisine" is haute cuisine and "cooking" is what you call "regional indigenous cooking", and use that distinction to clarify the debate, that won't make it much clearer, because the confusion is built into the terms, lurks and pops out at the most inconvenient moments.

IMO this thread revolves around the fact that French haute cuisine has imposed itself to the rest of the world -rightly or wrongly- as the highest form of cuisine AND cooking too; that this situation based on a highly professional, codified and socially limited style has come to absorb the whole concept of French cooking, regardless of the complex, multifaceted, layered phenomenon that can be described as such. That, parallel to that, French cooking is said to beat all others regarding its "excellence from top to bottom", which I am questioning, not to bash that excellence but to insist on its relativity (first of all, France certainly has no monopoly on that, and this excellence can be totally lacking in many circumstances that distinguished diners and non-French gourmets happily have no access to).

So on one hand, we have those who claim that French haute cuisine is the best cuisine in the world, which I disagree with, and on the other hand, we have those (who can be the same) who claim that French indigenous cooking is also the best in the world, bringing up the "excellence from bottom to top" factor. I disagree with that too.

Again, not to say French cooking AND cuisine are inferior, but that there is no reason other than historical, political and financial, plus the power of habit, to declare them absolutely superior to all others.

What do you do when you visit France and seek for good food, with enough means to afford it and a bit of knowledge and contacts to make it easier? You're putting yourself in the right condition to avoid bad food. Well, I can find great food too in the US in the same conditions. That is exactly why I think generalizations like "this country's cooking is better than this other country's cooking" are doomed from the start.

I'm not going to address Kiwichef's post, as Busboy has alread done so far more eloquently than I could, except to ask - have you traveled extensively in the US?

I thought I had made myself clear on that one. I lived there, got married there, cooked there, worked in a restaurant there, and though I was too busy to travel as much as I would have liked, I got to see a few places (Midwest, California, Northern New England) and found nothing there to invalidate what I've written previously. Moreover, I learnt to really care about food in the US. Which proved extremely invaluable for me when I came back to France and, some years after, began working as a food writer. I can honestly say that my American experience was an advantage, for many reasons (and I have to add that it's not complete, and gets updated regularly).

Without it, I probably would still not be getting the whole picture and I might well not have a clear idea of French food's true worth and importance compared to the rest of the world, but I damn right would believe I do, like so many French people and, unfortunately, many non-French people as well.

Edited January 10, 2007 by Ptipois (log)

[hjshorter]

I'm not going to address Kiwichef's post, as Busboy has alread done so far more eloquently than I could, except to ask - have you traveled extensively in the US?

I thought I had made myself clear on that one.

I was addressing that to kiwichef. Sorry if I didn't make myself clear.

[Ptipois]

It took the Romans to really get the Hedonistic ball rolling, and of course we would probably not be discussing the superiority of French cuisine in any form without the Roman conquest/settlement of Gaul, would we?

←

Well, between the Roman conquest of Gaul and now, there's been a few messed-up periods for sure, but also quite a good stretch of well-spiced and subtly perfumed Middle Ages, an interesting Renaissance, a no less interesting Age of Enlightenment, a decided turn after the French Revolution, and so on. All periods with their own very special kinds of hedonism (and many foreign influences). And the Gauls did teach the Romans a few things, too. They were gourmets and stubborn. They shucked oysters, hung up the sausages to dry, grew green lentils in the Massif central, invented the wine barrel and made beer and honey wine long before Julius Caesar came over. Even if the Romans hadn't been there, I'm sure they'd have found a way to get the message to us through the ages.

Edited January 10, 2007 by Ptipois (log)

[hjshorter]

Amusing, and topical. I am headed to Charlotte, North Carolina this weekend and asked in the Southeast forum for some fine dining recommendations and here's what I got: old-school French, "American" heavily influenced by French and Italian techniques, "traditional" Italian, and a couple of tapas restaurants.

Looking at the listings, Spain seems to be on the ascendant there. Maybe in a couple of years we can all start complaining about the undue influence of the Spaniards.

Edited January 11, 2007 by hjshorter (log)

[Ptipois]

I'm not going to address Kiwichef's post, as Busboy has alread done so far more eloquently than I could, except to ask - have you traveled extensively in the US?

I thought I had made myself clear on that one.

I was addressing that to kiwichef. Sorry if I didn't make myself clear.

←

Ah, OK. Sorry!

[kiwichef]

I'm not going to address Kiwichef's post, as Busboy has alread done so far more eloquently than I could, except to ask - have you traveled extensively in the US?

I thought I had made myself clear on that one.

I was addressing that to kiwichef. Sorry if I didn't make myself clear.

←

Hi there,

I've read the feedback and respond as follows.

Firstly I've travelled extensively throughout the states, from east to west and north to south. My fondest food memories include, Chicago pizza, New York pastrami sandwiches, Chesapeake Bay crabs, and Texas BBQ spare ribs. I also enjoyed lots of great hamburgers, and magnificent ceasar salads. But if I were asked to define American Cuisine I would be left searching, and so it seems would others. Nice to see I provoked such vigorous debate.

As far as the comments from the fast food feminist. Why just women, don't men cook? But that's not the point is it. Food is life, to be enjoyed and savoured. Fast food is purchased at a sit on your ass drive through, scoffed in heavy traffic, and washed down with a Big Gulp of coke....a billion calories later, you feel just great right. Proud of fast food culture? No way Jose. I hate travelling around the world and seeing a dirty great M in the distance, for me its abhorrent. I remember going to Disneyworld and seeing these fat families all over the place, gorging at fast food joints, and I felt sick. So sad. So very sad. Whose taking responsilbilty.

Great to see the jibe about NZ cuisine too. Fair enough. For that writers information, New Zealand was colonised by the English, so alot of our food is English. Lately however it has a very asian/english mix, which has been touted as Fusion cuisine. The origins of which lie with Peter Gordon, a talented NZ chef with restaurants in Auckland, London and New York. But our culture is Maori, and through our indigenous roots we have a largely undiscovered cuisine, rich language, wicked music and history. Perhaps you might discover it one day.

Our lamb of course is exported to the world, as are our dairy products, and wine.

Talking wine, I saw another enlightened writer take a snide at our vinos and in particular our Savignon Blancs. But why just Savignon Blancs? He forgot our wonderful Merlots, Pinot Noirs, Pinot Gris, Chardonnay's, Syrahs and the list goes on. You must try them as well, dear writer.

Another critic asks if I've worked in a french kitchen. No I haven't. But I have been cursed and abused in the kitchen many a time, and I know the french kitchens are the same. But the French don't take that language to the public as Ramsey has. My point being the etiquette in a french kitchen, and its connection with french life and society, doesn't permit such public discourse. I suggest if it ever happened the chef concerned would be publicly lambasted, and chastised. Of course Ramsey enjoys the fruits of his language, and notereity through the English speaking media, where he's lauded, and good luck to him.

Which brings us back to the original article, and criticism. Why is french cuisine, haute or not, so widely respected. To my mind its due to there respect for chefs, for food, for history and language. The French embrace food, as life, and are somewhat arrogant about it. But don't we all love it?

Cheers

Rob

[Carrot Top]

As far as the comments from the fast food feminist. Why just women, don't men cook? But that's not the point is it.  Food is life, to be enjoyed and savoured. Fast food is purchased at a sit on your ass drive through, scoffed in heavy traffic, and washed down with a Big Gulp of coke....a billion calories later, you feel just great right. Proud of fast food culture? No way Jose. I hate travelling around the world and seeing a dirty great M in the distance, for me its abhorrent. I remember going to Disneyworld and seeing these fat families all over the place, gorging at fast food joints, and I felt sick. So sad. So very sad. Whose taking responsilbilty.

←

That's funny.

This "fast food feminist" is one who threw away her own mother's ardent feminism to marry twice, support one husband financially, then the other by cooking each day, fine meals for him to eat.

This fast food feminist also was an executive chef at one of the top five investment banks on Wall Street, feeding the partners of said place. . . who knew French food, five star restaurants all over world, and expected what they ate with their guests to be of a rather "haute" order. Then this fast food feminist became a VP in the operations division of that place, and had the task assigned of feeding the 3000 employees as manager of the subcontractor. Did the employees get to eat "haute" or "slow" each day? Did they even want to? Was it financially or operationally feasible to try to do this? If it were done, would they appreciate and applaud it?

I doubt it.

Oh, plus, I'm not fat at all.

Your reach and your grasp do not meet the extended size of your tongue.

You are young, perhaps. Perhaps in time your reach and grasp will grow.

Edited January 13, 2007 by Carrot Top (log)

[Carrot Top]

There are of course many other great cuisines of the world, which you might argue also have a long history.  Chinese cuisine leaps to mind. Of course this is true, it does have an enormous culinary history, but then China was along way from Europe in the 17th century, and wasn't discovered until some years later.

←

Great to see the jibe about NZ cuisine too. Fair enough. For that writers information, New Zealand was colonised by the English, so alot of our food is English. Lately however it has a very asian/english mix, which has been touted as Fusion cuisine. The origins of which lie with Peter Gordon, a  talented NZ chef with restaurants in Auckland, London and New York. But our culture is Maori, and through our indigenous roots we have a largely undiscovered cuisine, rich language, wicked music and history. Perhaps you might discover it one day.

←

One day, yes, maybe one day.

But then again, it took "some years" for Chinese food to be "discovered".

Goodness. Where was it all that time before "we" found it?! Was it there? Did it exist?

[kiwichef]

As far as the comments from the fast food feminist. Why just women, don't men cook? But that's not the point is it.  Food is life, to be enjoyed and savoured. Fast food is purchased at a sit on your ass drive through, scoffed in heavy traffic, and washed down with a Big Gulp of coke....a billion calories later, you feel just great right. Proud of fast food culture? No way Jose. I hate travelling around the world and seeing a dirty great M in the distance, for me its abhorrent. I remember going to Disneyworld and seeing these fat families all over the place, gorging at fast food joints, and I felt sick. So sad. So very sad. Whose taking responsilbilty.

←

That's funny.

This "fast food feminist" is one who threw away her own mother's ardent feminism to marry twice, support one husband financially, then the other by cooking each day, fine meals for him to eat.

This fast food feminist also was an executive chef at one of the top five investment banks on Wall Street, feeding the partners of said place. . . who knew French food, five star restaurants all over world, and expected what they ate with their guests to be of a rather "haute" order. Then this fast food feminist became a VP in the operations division of that place, and had the task assigned of feeding the 3000 employees as manager of the subcontractor. Did the employees get to eat "haute" or "slow" each day? Did they even want to? Was it financially or operationally feasible to try to do this? If it were done, would they appreciate and applaud it?

I doubt it.

Oh, plus, I'm not fat at all.

Your reach and your grasp do not meet the extended size of your tongue.

You are young, perhaps. Perhaps in time your reach and grasp will grow.

←

[/quo

Dear fast food feminist,

A better person than I once wrote something to the effect:

"one who has to espouse ones triumphs has none at all"

Young or old, this writer's comments are not aimed at you dear carrot, but fast food culture in general. I couldn't care less what your waist line looks like. Americans are the most OBESE nation in the world and the the protaganists of fast food globalisation, but it seems you missed this point, and went off on some other tangent about your past.

[Carrot Top]

Dear fast food feminist,

A better person than I once wrote something to the effect:

"one who has to espouse ones triumphs has none at all"

Young or old, this writer's comments are not aimed at you dear carrot, but fast food culture in general. I couldn't care less what your waist line looks like. Americans are the most OBESE nation in the world and the the protaganists of fast food globalisation, but it seems you missed this point, and went off on some other tangent about your past.

←

Nice quote you found, dear kiwi. I don't claim to have triumphs.* How about you?

There's been a bit of name calling in your posts. Factual evidence has been presented that there are other things here in the US, and other ways of thinking about things.

You might take a look at how you have spoken to and about people ("fast food feminist" - cute!) in your posts and see if you might wish to respond in some sort of defense if spoken to similarly.

Oh.

Cheers!

*I do claim to have a certain experience, that directly applied to your post. I am from the United States and have not only lived, eaten, and cooked here my whole life (except for travel, of course!) but have worked within our restaurant food culture. Moot?

P.S. Edited to add that I see you are posting, again. This time whatever you say will go in one of my ears and out the other. My horoscope warned there would be someone who wanted to argue around today. Must be you.

Edited January 13, 2007 by Carrot Top (log)

[kiwichef]

Dear fast food feminist,

A better person than I once wrote something to the effect:

"one who has to espouse ones triumphs has none at all"

Young or old, this writer's comments are not aimed at you dear carrot, but fast food culture in general. I couldn't care less what your waist line looks like. Americans are the most OBESE nation in the world and the the protaganists of fast food globalisation, but it seems you missed this point, and went off on some other tangent about your past.

←

Nice quote you found, dear kiwi. I don't claim to have triumphs. How about you?

There's been a bit of name calling in your posts. Factual evidence has been presented that there are other things here in the US, and other ways of thinking about things.

You might take a look at how you have spoken to and about people ("fast food feminist" - cute!) in your posts and see if you might wish to respond in some sort of defense if spoken to similarly.

Oh.

Cheers!

←

Dear Carrot,

My tone reflects that of others in feedback.

"can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen"

[Carrot Top]

[annecros]

Great to see the jibe about NZ cuisine too. Fair enough. For that writers information, New Zealand was colonised by the English, so alot of our food is English. Lately however it has a very asian/english mix, which has been touted as Fusion cuisine. The origins of which lie with Peter Gordon, a  talented NZ chef with restaurants in Auckland, London and New York. But our culture is Maori, and through our indigenous roots we have a largely undiscovered cuisine, rich language, wicked music and history. Perhaps you might discover it one day.

←

Rob,

Please take a moment and consider what you have written.

You are simply going to have to give "fusion" cuisine to the US. It was factually accomplished in the US several hundred years before Peter Gordon was born.

Our indigenous culture is Native American, and the US has not only incorporated the foods and cuisine of the Native American into our diet but the culture.

Edited January 13, 2007 by annecros (log)

[kiwichef]

Great to see the jibe about NZ cuisine too. Fair enough. For that writers information, New Zealand was colonised by the English, so alot of our food is English. Lately however it has a very asian/english mix, which has been touted as Fusion cuisine. The origins of which lie with Peter Gordon, a  talented NZ chef with restaurants in Auckland, London and New York. But our culture is Maori, and through our indigenous roots we have a largely undiscovered cuisine, rich language, wicked music and history. Perhaps you might discover it one day.

←

Rob,

Please take a moment and consider what you have written.

You are simply going to have to give "fusion" cuisine to the US. It was factually accomplished in the US several hundred years before Peter Gordon was born.

Our indigenous culture is Native American, and the US has not only incorporated the foods and cuisine of the Native American into our diet but the culture.

←

Hi

Fusion Cuisine as far as I know was invented sometime in the 70's, largely due to a mix of Californian and Japanese cuisines by Wolfgang Puck. However, NZ Fusion or Antipodean Fusion combines many different Asian flavours and Peter Gordon is often quoted as the leading light. 700 years ago? Don't think so.

[annecros]

Great to see the jibe about NZ cuisine too. Fair enough. For that writers information, New Zealand was colonised by the English, so alot of our food is English. Lately however it has a very asian/english mix, which has been touted as Fusion cuisine. The origins of which lie with Peter Gordon, a  talented NZ chef with restaurants in Auckland, London and New York. But our culture is Maori, and through our indigenous roots we have a largely undiscovered cuisine, rich language, wicked music and history. Perhaps you might discover it one day.

←

Rob,

Please take a moment and consider what you have written.

You are simply going to have to give "fusion" cuisine to the US. It was factually accomplished in the US several hundred years before Peter Gordon was born.

Our indigenous culture is Native American, and the US has not only incorporated the foods and cuisine of the Native American into our diet but the culture.

←

Hi

Fusion Cuisine as far as I know was invented sometime in the 70's, largely due to a mix of Californian and Japanese cuisines by Wolfgang Puck. However, NZ Fusion or Antipodean Fusion combines many different Asian flavours and Peter Gordon is often quoted as the leading light. 700 years ago? Don't think so.

←

I said several hundred years ago, and Wolfgang Puck just gave it a name. It was moving along quite healthily in the US in urban areas such as NY, Chicago, Atlanta, Texas and other areas.

In fact, it would be accurate to term all American cuisine since the "discovery" of the American continent as "fusion" because it is just that. If you insist on an Asian component, you will find that in the Carribbean in the 1600s. Before that, it was MesoAmerican.

Edited January 13, 2007 by annecros (log)

[kiwichef]

Great to see the jibe about NZ cuisine too. Fair enough. For that writers information, New Zealand was colonised by the English, so alot of our food is English. Lately however it has a very asian/english mix, which has been touted as Fusion cuisine. The origins of which lie with Peter Gordon, a  talented NZ chef with restaurants in Auckland, London and New York. But our culture is Maori, and through our indigenous roots we have a largely undiscovered cuisine, rich language, wicked music and history. Perhaps you might discover it one day.

←

Rob,

Please take a moment and consider what you have written.

You are simply going to have to give "fusion" cuisine to the US. It was factually accomplished in the US several hundred years before Peter Gordon was born.

Our indigenous culture is Native American, and the US has not only incorporated the foods and cuisine of the Native American into our diet but the culture.

←

Hi

Fusion Cuisine as far as I know was invented sometime in the 70's, largely due to a mix of Californian and Japanese cuisines by Wolfgang Puck. However, NZ Fusion or Antipodean Fusion combines many different Asian flavours and Peter Gordon is often quoted as the leading light. 700 years ago? Don't think so.

←

I said several hundred years ago, and Wolfgang Puck just gave it a name. It was moving along quite healthily in the US in urban areas such as NY, Chicago, Atlanta, Texas and other areas.

In fact, it would be accurate to term all American cuisine since the "discovery" of the American continent as "fusion" because it is just that. If you insist on an Asian component, you will find that in the Carribbean in the 1600s. Before that, it was MesoAmerican.

←

With respect Austalia and New Zealand are widely recognised as the proponents of "Fusion Cuisine"largely due to their proximity to South East Asia. With a little research I think you will quickly discover this. Sure, American cuisine may be a mix of cuisines, but it isn't recognised as Fusion. Fusion Cuisine geographically relates to South East Asia, not the Carribean, or MesoAmerica.

You say "it was factually accomplished" . Where?

You say"consider what you have written". With respect I may ask you to do the same.

[Busboy]

I'm not going to address Kiwichef's post, as Busboy has alread done so far more eloquently than I could, except to ask - have you traveled extensively in the US?

I thought I had made myself clear on that one.

I was addressing that to kiwichef. Sorry if I didn't make myself clear.

←

Hi there,

I've read the feedback and respond as follows.

Firstly I've travelled extensively throughout the states, from east to west and north to south. My fondest food memories include, Chicago pizza, New York pastrami sandwiches, Chesapeake Bay crabs, and Texas BBQ spare ribs. I also enjoyed lots of great hamburgers, and magnificent ceasar salads. But if I were asked to define American Cuisine I would be left searching, and so it seems would others. Nice to see I provoked such vigorous debate.

As far as the comments from the fast food feminist. Why just women, don't men cook? But that's not the point is it. Food is life, to be enjoyed and savoured. Fast food is purchased at a sit on your ass drive through, scoffed in heavy traffic, and washed down with a Big Gulp of coke....a billion calories later, you feel just great right. Proud of fast food culture? No way Jose. I hate travelling around the world and seeing a dirty great M in the distance, for me its abhorrent. I remember going to Disneyworld and seeing these fat families all over the place, gorging at fast food joints, and I felt sick. So sad. So very sad. Whose taking responsilbilty.

Great to see the jibe about NZ cuisine too. Fair enough. For that writers information, New Zealand was colonised by the English, so alot of our food is English. Lately however it has a very asian/english mix, which has been touted as Fusion cuisine. The origins of which lie with Peter Gordon, a talented NZ chef with restaurants in Auckland, London and New York. But our culture is Maori, and through our indigenous roots we have a largely undiscovered cuisine, rich language, wicked music and history. Perhaps you might discover it one day.

Our lamb of course is exported to the world, as are our dairy products, and wine.

Talking wine, I saw another enlightened writer take a snide at our vinos and in particular our Savignon Blancs. But why just Savignon Blancs? He forgot our wonderful Merlots, Pinot Noirs, Pinot Gris, Chardonnay's, Syrahs and the list goes on. You must try them as well, dear writer.

Cheers

Rob

←

I suppose that if you'd written this in the first place you might have sounded less twit-ish on your original post. However, the fact that you actually admit that there are fine bits of American cooking and still embrace the "fat American" and McDonalds "supersize me" stereotypes like a cheap hooker on a drunken payday suggests that your only agenda is a little slagging. Fair enough, but it weakens your case.

Regarding the SB's, the other wines (not to say that they aren't worthy) haven't really washed over our shores. I will keep an eye out.

Fusion, btw, has many fathers.

baaaaa

-Chas

PS. You should edit out the possesive apostrophe on "chardonnay's"

[annecros]

With respect Austalia and New Zealand are widely recognised as the proponents of "Fusion Cuisine"largely due to their proximity to South East Asia. With a little research I think you will quickly discover this.  Sure, American cuisine may be a mix of cuisines, but it isn't recognised as Fusion. Fusion Cuisine geographically relates to South East Asia, not the Carribean, or MesoAmerica.

You say "it was factually accomplished" . Where?

You say"consider what you have written". With respect I may ask you to do the same.

←

Dear, even if you want to use the contemporary definition, you simply have to give it to the US.

Here's your research:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fusion_cuisine

From the citation:

Fusion cuisine combines elements of various culinary traditions while not fitting specifically into any. The term generally refers to the innovations in many contemporary restaurant cuisines since the 1970s.

This type of restaurant's success depends on a number of factors. Among these are:

* Clientele's (or prospective clientele's) cultural diversity

* Clientele's travel patterns and experiences.

* Clientele's culinary sophistication and openness to new eating experiences.

These factors have made this type of cuisine accepted and popular in places like California and in large metropolitan areas. California Chef Wolfgang Puck is known as one of the pioneers of fusion cuisine. However, his restaurant "Chinois" was named after the term attributed to Richard Wing, who in the 1960s combined French and Chinese cooking at the former Imperial Dynasty restaurant in Hanford, California.

A menu sampling from menu of an American-European-Japanese restaurant in California might include the following items:

* Sake cocktails

* Salad with crisp nori topping, and a miso-cilantro vinaigrette dressing

* Rock shrimp dumplings

* Eel, lettuce and tomato sushi handroll

* Poached tofu

[edit] See also

* Tex-Mex cuisine

* California cuisine

[hjshorter]

But what does this have to do with the pernicious French influence?

Kiwichef, what you ate here is our cuisine. Taco trucks. Ethiopian restaurants. Bahn Mi counters. Chez Panisse. Sushi and schawarma. The French Laundry. Pizza joints and hot dog stands. Felafel and french fries. That's the real genius of the USA - that there is an infinite variety of ways to eat like an American.

You won't get any argument from me about the Golden Arches, or soda consumption.

As far as New Zealand wines goes...I've tried it, and I'll stick with French.

Edited January 13, 2007 by hjshorter (log)

[kiwichef]

With respect Austalia and New Zealand are widely recognised as the proponents of "Fusion Cuisine"largely due to their proximity to South East Asia. With a little research I think you will quickly discover this.  Sure, American cuisine may be a mix of cuisines, but it isn't recognised as Fusion. Fusion Cuisine geographically relates to South East Asia, not the Carribean, or MesoAmerica.

You say "it was factually accomplished" . Where?

You say"consider what you have written". With respect I may ask you to do the same.

←

Dear, even if you want to use the contemporary definition, you simply have to give it to the US.

Here's your research:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fusion_cuisine

From the citation:

Fusion cuisine combines elements of various culinary traditions while not fitting specifically into any. The term generally refers to the innovations in many contemporary restaurant cuisines since the 1970s.

This type of restaurant's success depends on a number of factors. Among these are:

* Clientele's (or prospective clientele's) cultural diversity

* Clientele's travel patterns and experiences.

* Clientele's culinary sophistication and openness to new eating experiences.

These factors have made this type of cuisine accepted and popular in places like California and in large metropolitan areas. California Chef Wolfgang Puck is known as one of the pioneers of fusion cuisine. However, his restaurant "Chinois" was named after the term attributed to Richard Wing, who in the 1960s combined French and Chinese cooking at the former Imperial Dynasty restaurant in Hanford, California.

A menu sampling from menu of an American-European-Japanese restaurant in California might include the following items:

* Sake cocktails

* Salad with crisp nori topping, and a miso-cilantro vinaigrette dressing

* Rock shrimp dumplings

* Eel, lettuce and tomato sushi handroll

* Poached tofu

[edit] See also

* Tex-Mex cuisine

* California cuisine

←

Okay...I accept the wikipedia definition however I'm not sure it's that contemporary. Below is a london restaurant website guide definition:

Fusion Food

A guide to fusion food, fusion cuisine and fusion restaurants in London

Fusion food sometimes gets bad press from critics who claim it is too complicated and pretentious and that many people don't know what it is.

Revolutionary Fusion Food

Fusion cooking has emanated from the desire to make food more diverse and interesting and to ignite excitement in new ingredients and fresh combinations of ingredients.

The kitchens of Australia and New Zealand are responsible for fusion cuisine. A combination of classically trained chefs, fresh local produce and close links with South East Asia led to the development of a new approach to cooking.

Innovative Fusion Restaurants

Striving to break away from the norm of European cuisine meant that the chefs focused rigorously on the rules for different combinations as they made flavour and excitement their main goal.

Fresh Ingredients

The main principle of fusion cooking is to rely on the freshest ingredients. The freshest fish and best organic meats and vegetables are crucial. In addition, rather than having to rely solely on local and European flavours, the fusion chef has a more extensive larder to draw on.

Fusion food ranges from Asian staples such as jasmine rice and udon noodles to rare spices like Szechuan peppercorns and galangal - variety is the spice of life for fusion restaurants.

Fusion Food in the UK

Peter Gordon is often hailed as the person who introduced fusion cooking to the UK. He grew up in New Zealand, learned his trade in Melbourne and spent the next few years travelling through Nepal, India and South East Asia. On his return he launched the Sugar Club restaurant in Wellington and in 1996 brought the idea to London, starting off in Notting Hill and subsequently moving to Soho in 1998.

Fusion food can be sampled not only at specific fusion restaurants across the capital, many London restaurants now include some fusion food on the menu even if it is not the overriding cuisine, such is its popularity.

[annecros]

Okay...I accept the wikipedia definition however I'm not sure it's that contemporary. Below is a london restaurant website guide definition:

Fusion Food

A guide to fusion food, fusion cuisine and fusion restaurants in London

*snippity snip a lot of good information concerning fusion*

Fusion Food in the UK

Peter Gordon is often hailed as the person who introduced fusion cooking to the UK. He grew up in New Zealand, learned his trade in Melbourne and spent the next few years travelling through Nepal, India and South East Asia. On his return he launched the Sugar Club restaurant in Wellington and in 1996 brought the idea to London, starting off in Notting Hill and subsequently moving to Soho in 1998.

Fusion food can be sampled not only at specific fusion restaurants across the capital, many London restaurants now include some fusion food on the menu even if it is not the overriding cuisine, such is its popularity.

←

Peter Gordon was born in 1981. Postdating "fusion" in the US that dates back a bit older than that.

That being said, it is understandable that you should be proud of Peter Gordon and his success.

I appreciate your gracious acceptance of the facts.

We do love you kiwichef. Especially when you can take a couple of lumps and still come out smiling.

Edited January 13, 2007 by annecros (log)

[kiwichef]

I'm not going to address Kiwichef's post, as Busboy has alread done so far more eloquently than I could, except to ask - have you traveled extensively in the US?

I thought I had made myself clear on that one.

I was addressing that to kiwichef. Sorry if I didn't make myself clear.

←

Hi there,

I've read the feedback and respond as follows.

Firstly I've travelled extensively throughout the states, from east to west and north to south. My fondest food memories include, Chicago pizza, New York pastrami sandwiches, Chesapeake Bay crabs, and Texas BBQ spare ribs. I also enjoyed lots of great hamburgers, and magnificent ceasar salads. But if I were asked to define American Cuisine I would be left searching, and so it seems would others. Nice to see I provoked such vigorous debate.

As far as the comments from the fast food feminist. Why just women, don't men cook? But that's not the point is it. Food is life, to be enjoyed and savoured. Fast food is purchased at a sit on your ass drive through, scoffed in heavy traffic, and washed down with a Big Gulp of coke....a billion calories later, you feel just great right. Proud of fast food culture? No way Jose. I hate travelling around the world and seeing a dirty great M in the distance, for me its abhorrent. I remember going to Disneyworld and seeing these fat families all over the place, gorging at fast food joints, and I felt sick. So sad. So very sad. Whose taking responsilbilty.

Great to see the jibe about NZ cuisine too. Fair enough. For that writers information, New Zealand was colonised by the English, so alot of our food is English. Lately however it has a very asian/english mix, which has been touted as Fusion cuisine. The origins of which lie with Peter Gordon, a talented NZ chef with restaurants in Auckland, London and New York. But our culture is Maori, and through our indigenous roots we have a largely undiscovered cuisine, rich language, wicked music and history. Perhaps you might discover it one day.

Our lamb of course is exported to the world, as are our dairy products, and wine.

Talking wine, I saw another enlightened writer take a snide at our vinos and in particular our Savignon Blancs. But why just Savignon Blancs? He forgot our wonderful Merlots, Pinot Noirs, Pinot Gris, Chardonnay's, Syrahs and the list goes on. You must try them as well, dear writer.

Cheers

Rob

←

I suppose that if you'd written this in the first place you might have sounded less twit-ish on your original post. However, the fact that you actually admit that there are fine bits of American cooking and still embrace the "fat American" and McDonalds "supersize me" stereotypes like a cheap hooker on a drunken payday suggests, however, that your only agenda is a little slagging. Fair enough, but it weakens your case.

Regarding the SB's, the other wines (not to say that they aren't worthy) haven't really washed over our shores. I will keep an eye out.

Fusion, btw, has many fathers.

baaaaa

-Chas

PS. You should edit out the possesive apostrophe on "chardonnay's"

←

Thanks for your comments Chas.

I was replying to feedback. I guess I am slagging American fastfood, yeah, and I will continue to do so. It's digusting. It doesn't reflect my opinion of food in America as I have had many a fine meal in the States. It is inextricabley attached to American culture however, so denying it doesn't resolve the issue.

I don't agree with your comments regarding Fusion. As outlined below with Annecross I firmly beleive that the Antipodes is the home of today's Fusion Cuisine. It's worthy of note that Wikipidia is made up of comments from users, so it is in no way definitive.

Lastly, apologies for the grammatical error.

Cheers

Rob

Possessive by the way has 4 s's. OOPs.

[kiwichef]

Okay...I accept the wikipedia definition however I'm not sure it's that contemporary. Below is a london restaurant website guide definition:

Fusion Food

A guide to fusion food, fusion cuisine and fusion restaurants in London

*snippity snip a lot of good information concerning fusion*

Fusion Food in the UK

Peter Gordon is often hailed as the person who introduced fusion cooking to the UK. He grew up in New Zealand, learned his trade in Melbourne and spent the next few years travelling through Nepal, India and South East Asia. On his return he launched the Sugar Club restaurant in Wellington and in 1996 brought the idea to London, starting off in Notting Hill and subsequently moving to Soho in 1998.

Fusion food can be sampled not only at specific fusion restaurants across the capital, many London restaurants now include some fusion food on the menu even if it is not the overriding cuisine, such is its popularity.

←

Peter Gordon was born in 1981. Postdating "fusion" in the US that dates back a bit older than that.

That being said, it is understandable that you should be proud of Peter Gordon and his success.

I appreciate your gracious acceptance of the facts.

We do love you kiwichef. Especially when you can take a couple of lumps and still come out smiling.

←

Peter Gordon wasn't born in 1981. He would be about 40 now so he was born sometime in the 60's. No-one can claim Fusion as their own, however New Zealand and Australia are recognised as the contemporary leaders, due to their proximity to South East Asia. If you go down-under you will encounter a myriad of restaurants combining Asian and European flavours.

I accept Wikipedia's opinion, but I'm not sure it's correct. After all Wikipedia is a subscriber based information source.

I note their is no mention of the Carribean or MesoAmerica.

Thanks Annecross. I enjoy a debate.

[hjshorter]

I was replying to feedback. I guess I am slagging American fastfood, yeah, and I will continue to do so. It's digusting. It doesn't reflect my opinion of food in America as I have had many a fine meal in the States. It is inextricabley attached to American culture however, so denying it doesn't resolve the issue.

What issue is that, exactly?

Is anyone else amused by the argument over "fusion," originally a combination of Asian and - you guessed it - French food?

Possessive by the way has 4 s's.  OOPs.

That's what editors are for.

[menon1971]

I'm not going to address Kiwichef's post, as Busboy has alread done so far more eloquently than I could, except to ask - have you traveled extensively in the US?

I thought I had made myself clear on that one.

I was addressing that to kiwichef. Sorry if I didn't make myself clear.

←

Hi there,

I've read the feedback and respond as follows.

Firstly I've travelled extensively throughout the states, from east to west and north to south. My fondest food memories include, Chicago pizza, New York pastrami sandwiches, Chesapeake Bay crabs, and Texas BBQ spare ribs. I also enjoyed lots of great hamburgers, and magnificent ceasar salads. But if I were asked to define American Cuisine I would be left searching, and so it seems would others. Nice to see I provoked such vigorous debate.

As far as the comments from the fast food feminist. Why just women, don't men cook? But that's not the point is it. Food is life, to be enjoyed and savoured. Fast food is purchased at a sit on your ass drive through, scoffed in heavy traffic, and washed down with a Big Gulp of coke....a billion calories later, you feel just great right. Proud of fast food culture? No way Jose. I hate travelling around the world and seeing a dirty great M in the distance, for me its abhorrent. I remember going to Disneyworld and seeing these fat families all over the place, gorging at fast food joints, and I felt sick. So sad. So very sad. Whose taking responsilbilty.

Great to see the jibe about NZ cuisine too. Fair enough. For that writers information, New Zealand was colonised by the English, so alot of our food is English. Lately however it has a very asian/english mix, which has been touted as Fusion cuisine. The origins of which lie with Peter Gordon, a talented NZ chef with restaurants in Auckland, London and New York. But our culture is Maori, and through our indigenous roots we have a largely undiscovered cuisine, rich language, wicked music and history. Perhaps you might discover it one day.

Our lamb of course is exported to the world, as are our dairy products, and wine.

Talking wine, I saw another enlightened writer take a snide at our vinos and in particular our Savignon Blancs. But why just Savignon Blancs? He forgot our wonderful Merlots, Pinot Noirs, Pinot Gris, Chardonnay's, Syrahs and the list goes on. You must try them as well, dear writer.

Cheers

Rob

←

I suppose that if you'd written this in the first place you might have sounded less twit-ish on your original post. However, the fact that you actually admit that there are fine bits of American cooking and still embrace the "fat American" and McDonalds "supersize me" stereotypes like a cheap hooker on a drunken payday suggests, however, that your only agenda is a little slagging. Fair enough, but it weakens your case.

Regarding the SB's, the other wines (not to say that they aren't worthy) haven't really washed over our shores. I will keep an eye out.

Fusion, btw, has many fathers.

baaaaa

-Chas

PS. You should edit out the possesive apostrophe on "chardonnay's"

←

Thanks for your comments Chas.

I was replying to feedback. I guess I am slagging American fastfood, yeah, and I will continue to do so. It's digusting. It doesn't reflect my opinion of food in America as I have had many a fine meal in the States. It is inextricabley attached to American culture however, so denying it doesn't resolve the issue.

I don't agree with your comments regarding Fusion. As outlined below with Annecross I firmly beleive that the Antipodes is the home of today's Fusion Cuisine. It's worthy of note that Wikipidia is made up of comments from users, so it is in no way definitive.

Lastly, apologies for the grammatical error.

Cheers

Rob

Possessive by the way has 4 s's. OOPs.

←

Americans are a people, America is a nation.

“due to there respect for chefs” - I assume you meant their not there.

The only famous Kiwi I can think of is Peter Jackson and he looks to be a member of the fast food nation.

I have had several bottles of NZ SB and one PN, and all were quite nice. NZ lamb is excellent, but so is our Colorado.

Is fusion always deliberate or is there variety that is organic in its assimilation? In other words do we call what this fellow in NZ is doing, or what Puck did here in the U.S., fusion and then in the same breath call Carribean food or that of southern Louisiana. Is this why French food endures, because of its development over time with myriad influences, by folks who took this development seriously.